▶ 0:13:48The committee on homeland security subcommittee on border security and enforcement will come to order. Without objection, the chair is authorized to declare the committee in recess at any point. The purpose of this hearing is to examine the actions that gave rise to the historic border crisis we witnessed over the last four years. And more importantly, this hearing will enable Congress to explore potential legislative solutions to ensure that the United States does not endure another such crisis.
▶ 0:14:19I now recognize myself for an opening statement. Good morning and welcome to the subcommittee on border security and enforcement hearing on how the Biden Harris administration's failed border policies fueled a historic crisis at our southwest border which the Trump administration is now addressing with bold long-awaited action.
▶ 0:14:42First, I want to say it is an honor to serve as chairman of this subcommittee and I look forward to working with my colleagues on both sides of the aisle, especially with the ranking member, the gentleman from the great state of California, Representative Koreah, as we seek to address the critical challenges facing our nation's border security. Just over four years ago, on January 2021, President Biden was sworn into office.
▶ 0:15:13And on that very same day, with the stroke of a pen, he issued executive orders dismantling years of robust border security measures implemented by the first Trump administration. The results can only be described as a colossal failure.
▶ 0:15:32We have often heard the phrase, "Those who don't know history are doomed to repeat it." So to be clear, this hearing is not about looking back just for the sake of looking back, but instead is about learning from past failures so that Congress can work together to pass meaningful and lasting solutions to secure our border. The policies we put in place today will shape the future and ensure the failures of the past will never be repeated.
▶ 0:16:02Over the course of four years, the Biden Harris administration introduced sweeping policy changes that prioritized rapid processing and release over enforcement, thereby dismantling border security policies meant to deter illegal immigrants, excuse me, meant to deter illegal immigration and protect Americans from foreign threats abroad.
▶ 0:16:26The consequences were devastating as we saw record levels of illegal immigration, a surge in crime committed by transnational criminal organizations, and a weakening of national security.
▶ 0:16:41The administration also ended key deterrent measures such as remain in Mexico and safe third country asylum It expanded the CBP1 app and created mass parole programs to facilitate the illegal entry of inadmissible aliens into the United States. As a result, every state in America has now become a border state.
▶ 0:17:10Violent criminal gangs infiltrated American communities and carried out heinous crimes. Crimes such as murder, assault, robbery, and rape. these crimes which jeopardize the safety of all American citizens. When President Trump took office in January, he and his administration wasted no time in reversing the failed policies of the Biden Harris administration.
▶ 0:17:37His administration immediately declared a national emergency at the southwest border and took aggressive actions such as deploying troops to assist and support VHS to regain operational control. The president also resumed border wall construction, ended bid era mass parole programs, and terminated the failed catch and release policy. The results were seen almost immediately.
▶ 0:18:03By the end of February, customs and border protection data revealed record low numbers of apprehension at the southwest border. Illegal entries between ports of entry plummeted 94% compared to February of 2024. Meanwhile, at the same time, Immigrations and Customs Enforcement ramped up its enforcement efforts and increased arrest of public safety threats by 627%.
▶ 0:18:32I would like to close with a quote from one of our witnesses. The bottom line is this did not have to happen and we need to prevent it from again. We must do all we can to learn from the past to protect the safety and security of all American people and to ensure that the failures of the past will not be repeated.
▶ 0:19:04This time I would now recognize the ranking member for the subcommittee on border security and enforcement the gentleman from California Mr. Koreah for his opening statement. Thank you chairman guest and I concur with you. Um thank you for being chair of this committee. I look forward to working with you on border security. Border security in my opinion is not just border security. It's national security.
▶ 0:19:30And this is not an issue of Democrats or Republicans, but rather it's an issue that addresses all taxpayers, all citizens in this great nation. Today's our first subcommittee hearing, 119th Congress. This topic selected by you, Mr. Chairman, we're looking at the past.
▶ 0:19:55Yet, I'd like to look at the future and what the challenges are for us at the border in this nation. We're not looking at conducting oversight and how the Trump administration is ripping away legal statuses, legal rights work permits from immigrants lawfully within this country. ending parole for Ukrainian war refugees or Venezuelans or Cubans.
▶ 0:20:24In addition to ending status for Afghan refugees who fought alongside American troops in Afghanistan, we have to keep our moral obligation to those that have fought next to our American troops, for those that had the back of our American troops We don't want to talk about ICE agents questioning and arresting American citizens, US citizens, Mr.
▶ 0:20:52Chairman, or efforts to deport US veterans, immigrant veterans that have been essentially fighting for this country or US citizen children with brain cancer. We need to address these issues. Mr.
▶ 0:21:12Chairman, I recently met with frontline CBP officers who expressed frustration with this new administration and how they're addressing efficiency initiatives. Yet today, we won't be discussing those issues. Instead, we're looking at the past. Let's be clear.
▶ 0:21:35The B administration left President Trump with declining border crossing, record number of fentinel seizures, despite my colleagues not wanting to admit it, and sadly for me, I hate to admit it, a higher daily rate of deportations than we've seen in a very long time. When President Trump first left office, unauthorized border crossings were at a rise.
▶ 0:22:06Gotaways were on a rise and synthetic opioid deaths were also on the rise. In fact, in those days, they were already calling it a crisis. And that was in the President Trump's first watch. Now that he's back in office, I was hoping, Mr. chairman that we focus on oversight of what's happening now at border.
▶ 0:22:32Yet, it's hard to fix things when the administration, today's administration, refuses to tell our staff what's happening at the border. And I hope we'll have the administration here to answer some questions as we begin to address and continue to address security. Mr. Chair, President Biden is gone and let's focus today on the nuts and bolts of border security.
▶ 0:22:57For example, fixing severe staffing shortages at our ports of entry, stopping cartels from getting weapons. Those are the issues we need to focus on. Yet today, the new administration is doubling down on cutting the federal workforce and gutting DHS in the name of efficiency and cost savings.
▶ 0:23:22Yet, we're looking completely overlooking the fact that Secretary Gnome just spent $200 million $200 million on TV ads praising the new president. We're also overlooking the fact that the administration spent $16 million to fly 300 detained immigrants to Guantanamo Bay in Cuba just to send them back to the United States.
▶ 0:23:53And it's also my understanding that this new administration also directed our soldiers to construct tents and hold in tain immigrants in Guantanamo at a cost of $3 million. New tents in Guantanamo for $3 million, but they weren't even built to DHS standards, so they were not even used. How's that for cost savings, Mr. Chairman?
▶ 0:24:21Another example, in one facility in Texas, we're spending thousands of dollars to detain a working family and their six and eight year old children. And I guess this is what America, safer America looks like today.
▶ 0:24:44Let's not forget with all the law enforcement agents like DEA, FBI, ATF, they're being forced to become deportation officers away from their investigations of drug cartels, money laundering, child sex trafficking. Sadly, some of these cases may be going unsolved and will become cold cases.
▶ 0:25:13This administration's push to inflate ICE arrests and deportations, DHS ended up rounding up Venezuelan American families whose citizen children were recovering from brain cancer. That's right. A 10-year-old American with brain cancer was deported by this administration. Again, an American citizen, 10 years old.
▶ 0:25:37And by the way, parents had no criminal record and had been here for quite quite some time. Again, is this what makes America look safer or America safe again? Mr.
▶ 0:25:52Chairman, I look forward to working with you on future hearings to focus on what makes our border stronger, safer, what keeps our neighborhood safe, what keeps fentinel, other narcotics off streets as well as bad people from entering this country and of course while improving international trade that is good for America. Mr. Chairman, thank you very much for holding this hearing.
▶ 0:26:20And with that, I Uh, thank you, Mr. Craig. At this time, I would now recognize the ranking member for the entire committee, the gentleman from Mississippi, Mr. Thompson, for his opening statement. Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman, and uh I look forward to uh working with you as another Mississippian uh on this committee. Uh, I welcome our panel of witnesses and look forward to their testimony also today.
▶ 0:26:51But more than two months into the Trump administration, Americans want to know why administration officials aren't here to answer the questions. Why haven't Republicans held a single hearing with administration witnesses this whole Congress? Why don't Trump administration officials answer to this committee for their immigration policies?
▶ 0:27:16And are they afraid of answering our questions about why they've rounded up and detained US citizens, even deported US citizens with no due process. And you have already heard about the 10-year-old American girl who was deported battling brain cancer.
▶ 0:27:36Don't they want to explain why they've disappeared people with no criminal record or evidence of wrongdoing from this country without so much as a hearing in defiance of a federal judge's order? Or why they've pulled law enforcement off cases targeting child abusers, traffickers, and smugglers to carry out immigration raids against people with no criminal history.
▶ 0:28:04And that's just what we know from the media reports. We've received next to no information from DHS on what's happening despite our inquiries. Administration officials want to go on Fox News and pose for photo ops, but they don't want to be held accountable by Congress, and congressional Republicans are complicit in helping them evade oversight.
▶ 0:28:31Today, my Republican colleagues want to talk about the Biden administration yet again rather than the bad policies and abuses of the Trump administration. I guess it's to be expected. I understand many of my Republican colleagues are hiding from their own constituents, having been directed by their leadership not to hold town halls or to hear from constituents who are upset at Trump's policies.
▶ 0:29:01We should be focusing on the issues affecting our communities today. This administration, with the help of unelected billionaire Elon Musk, is ignoring laws passed by Congress. They are making Americans less safe while increasing prices for everyday goods.
▶ 0:29:21This committee should be providing oversight on the Trump administration as they sentenced people with no criminal record to hard labor in a notorious prison in El Salvador.
▶ 0:29:35This committee should be examining how ordering thousands of special agents to assist ICE with immigration enforcement hurts the government's ability to conduct criminal investigation into child exploitation, human trafficking, drug smuggling, arm smuggling, and tax fraud. or worse yet to assign FBI agents to investigate Tesla damage as an act of domestic terrorism.
▶ 0:30:06President Trump has even suggested convicted criminals of these crimes, including US citizens, should be sent to the notorious mega prison in El Salvador, the very same place he is disappearing migrants under the Alien Enemies Act.
▶ 0:30:25It doesn't make us safer when the administration pauses serious criminal investigation so that special agents can help ICE arrest people in communities who pose no harm. This committee should be conducting oversight of the Trump administration squandering millions in taxpayers money to house migrants in inhumane conditions in Guantanamo.
▶ 0:30:53Trump said that the worst of the worst would be held there, but many of the detainees had no criminal records at all. One migrant sent there was riding his bike on the wrong side of the road. That certainly doesn't sound like the worst of the worst. We've also heard of US citizens being detained and questioned by ICE. CBP has detained and effectively deported US citizens. That's not who we are as people.
▶ 0:31:24There are real threats to this country that we need to focus on. While the Trump administration is fixated on creating sound bites and photo ops, Democrats will remain focused on doing what's best for the American people. The Trump administration should be here to answer our questions. I thank the witnesses for being here today and I yield back. Thank you uh Chairman Thompson or Ranking Member Thompson for that opening statement.
▶ 0:31:53Other members of the committee are reminded that opening statements may be submitted for the record. I am pleased to welcome our distinguished panel of witnesses and I ask that our witnesses please raise their right hand and please rise.
▶ 0:32:12Do you so solemnly swear that the testimony you give before the committee on homeland security of the United States House of Representatives will be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth. So help you God. I'll let the record reflect that the witnesses have answered in the affirmative. Thank you. And you may be seated. I would now like to formally introduce our witnesses. First, I'd like to start with Miss Laura Ree.
▶ 0:32:40She is the director of the border security and immigration center at the Heritage Foundation. She has nearly 30 years experience in the immigration and homeland security arena. She twice worked at the Department of Homeland Security on management and immigration policy and operations issues, most recently as the acting deputy chief of staff.
▶ 0:33:03Previously, she worked in the legislative branch as counsel for the United States House of Representatives Judiciary Committee subcommittee on immigration and claims. Our second witness is Mr. Aman Blair. He is a senior fellow at the Texas Public Policy Foundation Secure and Sovereign Texas Initiative. Blair has over 10 years of experience as a US Border Patrol agent serving in the Rio Grand Valley sector.
▶ 0:33:32He is also a 20 plus year US Army veteran serving both as an enlisted soldier and commissioned officer in various leadership and staff roles including as an infantry platoon leader on Operation Lonear. Our third witness is Mr. John Anerson. He serves as the executive vice president of the National Border Patrol Council, the labor union, representing over 16,000 Border Patrol agents and support staff.
▶ 0:34:03In addition to his national role, he is the president of the local chapter, which covers the Del Rio, Texas area. He has been assigned as a border patrol agent for over 18 years. Throughout his career, he has been assigned to the Del Rio sector in Texas, where he has served in various capacities, including several years in the prosecution unit and two years as a liaison to the US Attorney's Office in Del Rio. Our fourth witness is Mr. Aaron Reichlin Milik.
▶ 0:34:34He is currently a senior fellow at the American Immigration Council. He previously served as policy director and senior policy council for the organization. Prior to the American Immigration Council, he was a staff attorney in the Immigration Law Unit for the Legal Aid Society of New York City. I would like to personally thank all of our witnesses for being here today. The witnesses full statements will appear for the record.
▶ 0:35:02I re now recognize Miss Ree for five minutes to summarize her opening statement. Good morning, chairman, guest, ranking members Thompson and Kaha, and members of the subcommittee. Thank you for the opportunity to testify today. The views I express in this testimony are my own and do not represent any official position of the Heritage Foundation.
▶ 0:35:23When trying to solve the mass illegal immigration that this country experienced the past four years, it is important to ask how did we get here to avoid repeating it in the future. The last administration used a number of policy tools that fueled the border crisis and facilitated mass illegal immigration to the US. In so doing, the Biden administration gave aliens coming illegally here the five things that they want.
▶ 0:35:49When coming to the US, illegal aliens generally want to enter our country, remain here, work here, send money home, and bring or have here. Policies that permit those five things generate and facilitate more illegal immigration, whereas policies that prevent those five things prevent illegal immigration. Here are some examples from the last administration.
▶ 0:36:12For entry, the Biden administration encouraged millions to come and apply for asylum, going back to a 2020 presidential primary debate when Joe Biden encouraged aliens to quote immediately surge the border unquote and claim asylum. During the past four years, the left and media referred to all coming here illegally as quote asylum seekers unquote to both encourage people to apply for the benefit and to generate American empathy for the masses who were coming here.
▶ 0:36:40The reality was before the Biden administration, the vast majority of asylum applicants were denied asylum because they were not Knowing many were coming here for economic reasons, not because they were fleeing persecution, meant the administration was encouraging asylum fraud.
▶ 0:36:57Then Homeland securities Secretary Alejandro Mayorcis also encouraged unaccompanied alien children border crossings by saying publicly multiple times, "If you come as an unaccompanied child, you will not to be turned back." The result, US Customs and Border Protection encountered a historic 550,000 unaccompanied children during the last four years.
▶ 0:37:21Biden's Department of Health and Human Services, which is responsible for providing shelter for unaccompanied children, turned them over to unvetted sponsors. Unsurprisingly, children ended up in sex trafficking, child labor, and HHS lost track of at least 300,000 of them. The Biden administration also paid tens of billions of dollars to non-governmental organizations or NOS to build an infrastructure for mass migration from as far south as at least Panama to and throughout the US.
▶ 0:37:52These NOS's arranged transportation, shelter, health care, documentation, legal services, and other quote wraparound services for the aliens. The money sent to these NOS's went out through DHS, the State Department, HHS, USAD, the Justice Department, and more. We, the US taxpayers, were paying for our own national destruction.
▶ 0:38:13To bring in additional tens of thousands of inadmissible aliens each month, Secretary Mayorcis went around the legal visa process, around the US refugee admissions program, and instead issued mass parole based mostly on nationality and in violation of the immigration To allow the masses of aliens to remain in the US, the Biden administration severely restricted immigration enforcement, gave billions of dollars to sanctuary jurisdictions in conjunction with the NOS's to shield in admissible aliens and provide
▶ 0:38:43them benefits. The administration also increased and extended numerous designations of temporary protected status, used prosecutorial discretion to not seek aliens removals, and administratively closed other removal cases, thereby giving deportable aliens more time here until they could become eligible for another immigration benefit. As for working in the US, Secretary Mayorcis issued employment authorization documents as a default.
▶ 0:39:11If the underlying immigration benefit, like merely filing an asylum application, already provided work authorization, Secretary Mayorcis accelerated it. If Congress never authorized work for an immigration benefit, like parole, Mayorcus issued work cards anyway. The Biden administration abused our immigration system, resulting in a historic 11 million CBP encounters in just four years.
▶ 0:39:36These bad policies brought unsustainable numbers of people to our communities along with national insecurity, fentanyl, violent gang members, and other issues. With the new Trump administration, we have already seen border numbers plummet because President Trump immediately put policies into place that prevent illegal entry and other benefits for inadmissible and deportable aliens. This concludes my testimony and I look forward to your questions. Thank you. Uh thank you, M. Ree. I now recognize Mr.
▶ 0:40:04Blair for five minutes to summarize his opening statement. Dear Chairman, guest, ranking member Korea, and distinguished members of the subcommittee. Good morning and thank you for inviting me to testify before you. Over the last four years, the United States has endured a deliberately orchestrated invasion through weaponized mass migration. Millions of illegal illegal aliens from over 170 countries have been funneled, often with cartel facilitation, into Texas and other border states, overwhelming state and local resources. This is not just a border crisis.
▶ 0:40:34It is a fullsp spectrum national security failure manufactured by the B administration through the active subversion of US immigration law, the construction of an illegal parallel immigration regime, and the forcible repurposing of our homeland security apparatus to serve for nationals rather than American people.
▶ 0:40:52Federal agencies once tasked with homeland security were repurposed into logistical arms for mass migration, tasked with processing migrant care and releasing millions of unvetted foreign nationals into the into US communities. This myopic focus on the importation of foreign nationals left us blind to the current state of Mexico and the national security threats emanating from the border. Mexico is not a distant concern.
▶ 0:41:17It is the most strategically consequential no uh nation to US homeland security and yet it remains one of the most underestimated and politically ignored threats in the American national security apparatus. While our defense establishment focused on the borders and sovereignty of foreign nations ac excuse me across the globe, Mexico devolved into a narco state on our doorstep exporting violence, criminal governance and de destabilization directly into US territory.
▶ 0:41:46Yet, despite the clear and expanding threat, the B administration ignored Mexico as a national security priority, treating the border crisis as a humanitarian management challenge rather than the grreyzone conflict it has become. This deliberate misframing paralyzed the federal response and allowed Mexico to become a sanctuary state for enemies of the United States.
▶ 0:42:06Mexico today is more accurately described as a state where federal, state, and local governance has collapsed in key regions uh and foreign terrorist organizations dominate political and economic life. Much like Afghanistan, these cartels function as hybrid threats closely resembling their Middle Eastern counterparts. They employ terror as a political weapon, control territory, corrupt or co-opt institutions, and use violence strategically to shape governance outcomes. Their war is not against a rival state.
▶ 0:42:35It is against the very concept of law, sovereignty, and national borders. Therefore, the security environment along the US Mexico border cannot be understood through the outdated framework of criminality alone. What exists is an intolerable strategic alliance between the Mexican state at the national and subnational level and the cartels, a relationship that has evolved into a coordinated aligned partnership with direct consequences for US national security.
▶ 0:43:02The Biden administration's failure to acknowledge or confront Mexico's authoritarian backsliding effectively green lit a regime that tolerates naroterrorism as a cost of just doing business. By continuing to treat Mexico as a diplomatic peer rather than a strategic liability, the B administration insulated a failing state from accountability while exposing American communities to escalating violence.
▶ 0:43:26Now, while Mexico has engaged in a non- international armed conflict, where cartels openly battle for the state for control of territory and population, the spillover into the United States has taken a far more insidious form. Cartels do not seek to provoke a direct armed response from the US military or federal government. Nor does the Mexican state want to risk exposure as a complicit or tacitly uh cooperative actor.
▶ 0:43:49Instead, Mexican cartels have adopted their methods to achieve the same objective, territorial control through covert grreyzone tactics that replicate their domination of Mexican society within US border communities. In this model, operational control does not require military confrontation. It is secured through the system systematic erosion of institutional integrity and the strategic compromise of US governance at every level.
▶ 0:44:12Cartels act as deacto foreign intelligence services targeting federal, state, and local law enforcement, national guard elements in the legal system itself. Corruption, bribery, coercion, and espionage are tools of influence not just within enforcement ranks, but among prosecutors, judges, and elected officials. A recent study found that the Mexican cartels are now the fifth largest employer in Mexico. That same model of parallel governance and economic capture is being exported across the border.
▶ 0:44:38In rural Texas border counties, cartel activity activity is so deeply woven into daily life that the state is rapidly losing functional sovereignty in these zones without a single shot being fired. The communities along our southern border were witnessing in real time their subordination not just to the surge of illegal aliens or the ambitions of a progressive elite, but to the strategic designs of foreign nations, foreign terrorist organizations and their vast transnational criminal threats. This is no longer a border issue. It is a national one.
▶ 0:45:11Uh thank you uh Mr. Blair. I now recognize Mr. Anfinson for five minutes to summarize his opening statement. Chairman, guest, Ranking Member Korea, Ranking Member Thompson, uh distinguished members of the subcommittee, thank you for inviting me to testify here today. Uh President Biden's executive actions and inactions during his term resulted in an unprecedented security and humanitarian crisis along our borders. It didn't have to be this way. uh and we have to do whatever we can to prevent it from happening again.
▶ 0:45:39Not only was the entire world encouraged to essentially illegally cross our borders, primarily uh with the goal of abusing the asylum system, but it caused our agents to be sidelined uh left unable to do their jobs. Our job shifted from that of law enforcement uh to that of processing asylum claims uh since sitting behind computers on a virtual assembly line while illegal aliens disappeared into the country because we weren't there to do it.
▶ 0:46:05And a lot of these folks were only discovered later uh after being arrested for all sorts of crimes. Some of them minor and some of them horrific. To put this in context, during the 12 years of uh Presidents Obama and uh Trump, there were approximately 1.6 million gotaways across all 12 years. During President Biden's four years, there were over 2 million. Uh now, this surge overwhelmed our resources and it led to tragic consequences.
▶ 0:46:29During President Biden's tenure, we saw an average of 690 deaths at the border per year with FY22 being the worst and there were over 900 deaths of people trying to cross the border. You compare that to an average of 370 deaths per year under President Obama and 280 under President Trump. And now all of these deaths are unfortunate, but it gives you an idea of how out of control things were or became over the past four years.
▶ 0:46:53I remember one incident in particular in Eagle Pass, Texas, uh in August 2022, uh where an a toddler and an infant, they were siblings, had gone under the water uh when a family crossed the river. Agents on the boat patrol unit uh pulled the siblings out of the water. They performed CPR on them, doing whatever they could to save them. Uh the toddler passed away right there at the scene, and the infant was taken to the hospital and died a few days later.
▶ 0:47:17Uh, the agents did their best to save them and then they spent the rest of the day dealing with questions from CBP's Office of Professional Responsibility with questions like, "How long did you do CPR? Who told you to stop CPR? Did you use an AED?" Among others and they asked this because Congress requires OPR to investigate in custody deaths and deaths of people that we encounter uh so that they can provide a report to Congress within 72 hours.
▶ 0:47:41So that means agents who have dealt with traumatic events have to relive those events over and over right away so that OPR can figure out if they even need to report this death to Congress. Uh the month after these two siblings drowned, eight people died in one drowning incident just up river as and they were swept away. And this just kept happening over and over. And the crisis strained local resources as well uh with places like Maverick County, Texas, one of the areas that I cover.
▶ 0:48:07uh they had to bring in refrigerator trucks to store the unidentified bodies of people who died trying to cross the border. Uh our agents uh including those who were trained as EMTs in the field were often diverted from those field operations to process asylum seekers uh which left non-EM agents uh to do their best to handle rescue and recovery efforts. And this loss of life has taken a significant toll on our agents mental health and and morale. Since FY 2015, CBP has had 101 employee suicides.
▶ 0:48:37And in 2022, at what is probably the peak of the border crisis, uh there was a 50% increase in employee suicides compared to the previous 7-year average. And while the reasons for committing suicide are typically unknown, we do know that having to deal with objectively terrible and sad things at work day in and day out without relief does nothing to help anyone's mental health. Adding to these challenges, our agents faced unprecedented attacks and demonization.
▶ 0:49:03A prime example was the mischaracterization of an incident involving our horse patrol unit uh in Del Rio, Texas uh during the Haitian migrant crisis in September 2021. Uh there were 30,000 or so pe Haitians that crossed the border illegally and these horse patrol agents were accused of using whips on some of them and they were called racists. Uh President Biden promised the agents would quote pay for what they supposedly did.
▶ 0:49:26And even though they were ultimately cleared of misconduct allegations, this media frenzy and the administration's premature condemnation superior severely impacted the agents involved and the entire agency. And these factors and others have made it difficult to recruit and retain agents. We currently have about 19,500 border patrol agents. 2500 of them could retire today. Another 4,000 become eligible within the next four years. And if all that weren't enough, some of our basic resources are also strained. As of the end of FY24, over 50% of our vehicle fleet is also retirement eligible.
▶ 0:49:56It takes an average of 403 days for a new vehicle to be ordered and delivered, leading to increased costs, and on and on. President Trump has some ideas for this manpower issue by proposing to increase Border Patrol pay, offer retention bonuses, add recruitment bonuses to bring in an additional 10,000 agents. We can only hope that there are enough people who still want to do this job. The bottom line is that the border crisis under the Biden administration severely impacted our ability to secure the border and strained our workforce to the breaking point. Thank you for your time. I look forward to your questions. Uh, thank you, Mr. Aerson.
▶ 0:50:25I now recognize Mr. Reichlin Melnik for five minutes to summarize his opening statement. Chairman, guest, ranking member Koreah, and distinguished members of the subcommittee. My name is Aaron Reichlin Melnik and I am senior fellow at the American Immigration Council, a nonpartisan nonprofit organization which envisions a nation where immigrants are embraced, American communities are enriched, and justice prevails for all. There is no doubt that President Biden's border record at the border was mixed.
▶ 0:50:52As we have argued, Biden made measurable progress at restoring the asylum system while failing to lead on a national level to respond to the unprecedented rise in migration. True, the administration eventually settled on a strategy in 2024 that produced results, including a drop in border apprehensions of 80%. But the legality and long-term viability of the strategy was questionable, and it was ultimately too little too late. However, Joe Biden is no longer president.
▶ 0:51:18And while President Biden ordered DHS to focus on immigrants who are recent entrance or public safety threats, President Trump is focused on arresting and deporting all removable immigrants, including longtime residents, those with no criminal records, families, children, and undocumented workers. Trump has made immigration enforcement the top priority of federal law enforcement, above fentanyl trafficking, above terrorism, and even above protecting our children from predators.
▶ 0:51:45This obsession with draconian immigration enforcement will make us all less safe if continued over the next four years. It may also impoverish us as a climate of fear and large-scale removals cause the economy to shrink and Americans to lose their Over the last two months, the Trump administration has reassigned thousands of federal law enforcement officers away from their normal duties to instead carry out low-level civil immigration enforcement arrests and prosecutions, including against many people with no
▶ 0:52:15criminal record. This has diverted resources away from serious public safety threats. According to Reuters at Homeland Security Investigations, which over the last two years reported saving 3,000 children from predators, scores of agents who specialize in child sexual exploitation have been reassigned to immigration enforcement. Rather than protecting kids, these special agents are staking out immigrant workers homes and taking down license plates.
▶ 0:52:43At the Department of Justice, Attorney General Bondi declared on her first day that immigration enforcement is the top priority of the agency above nearly everything else. Even the FBI's joint terrorism task force has been directed to assist in the execution of President Trump's immigration initiatives. But it doesn't stop there. 25% of the DEA's workforce has been reassigned to immigration enforcement.
▶ 0:53:08Rather than tracking down drug traffickers, DEA agents are combing through old files to find cases where prosecutors can add illegal entry or re-entry charges years later. At the ATF, a full 80% of agents have been reassigned to immigration. Even the IRS isn't immune with special agents trained in financial crimes being made to go after random immigrants instead.
▶ 0:53:31In a world of limited resources, diverting federal law enforcement to the mass deportation agenda will have an obvious effect. When HSI agents tracking online pedophiles are forced to stake out undocumented workers, our children are not safer. When DEA agents investigating drug rings are told to find immigrant families who missed court dates, our communities are not safer.
▶ 0:53:55And when FBI agents tracking terrorists are told to focus on immigration arrests instead, our nation is not safer. These concerns are not hypothetical. In 2018, under the zero tolerance policy, border prosecutors were ordered to charge all migrants with illegal entry. The result was clear.
▶ 0:54:14There was a large drop in drug trafficking cases bought brought by federal prosecutors because prosecutors were spending night and day focused on migrant parents instead of going after the drug traffickers. This administration's priorities are backwards. While Trump is spending billions of dollars on detaining ever greater numbers of immigrants, his administration is slashing services for Americans.
▶ 0:54:36Money is pouring into the pockets of private prison companies at the same time as USDA is ending contracts giving children access to fresh local food and social security is closing offices nationwide. Rather than a single-minded focus on mass deportation, this administration and Congress should pursue common sense policies that help American communities. We need a system that can resolve cases quickly while also maintaining fairness, due process, and meaningful accountability for all actors.
▶ 0:55:05That includes a path to permanent legal status for undocumented immigrants who have resided in this country for decades without breaking other laws. This would build American prosperity, encourage the rule of law, and break the power of unscrupulous employers who exploit workers in an option between self-defeating mass deportations and a prosperity building path to legal status. The choice is clear. Thank you, and I look forward to your questions. Uh to all of our witnesses, uh thank you for summarizing your opening statements.
▶ 0:55:35Uh members will be recognized by order of seniority for their five minutes of questioning. An additional round of questioning may be called after all members have been recognized. I now recognize myself for five minutes of questioning. Um Miss Ree, uh when I grew up, I history was one of my favorite subjects in school. Uh I had a teacher in high school who would often use these words.
▶ 0:56:02He would say those who don't know history are doomed to repeat it. Uh and I feel that as we as a Congress move forward as a body to try to encapsulate what the Trump administration is doing that it's important that we also look back.
▶ 0:56:22I think you did a great job in your opening statement kind of talking about many of the actions that you described of the prior administration that you said unleashed an open border agenda. You mentioned the stopping of the construction of the border wall, the ending remain in Mexico, uh the mass parole by the use of the CBP1 act. You talk about NOS's and how the prior administration built an infrastructure that facilitated illegal immigration.
▶ 0:56:53And so I would ask if just for a moment if you would talk about these policies and the other failed policies of the administration uh and the impact that it has had on all law-abiding American Yes, thank you. Um, I'd say the the Biden administration used a few particular tools to carry this out.
▶ 0:57:17Um, I talked a little bit about asylum, asylum fraud, encouraging people to come here and apply for asylum even though we knew that so many people aren't ultimately eligible for it. Um, as well as as parole. Uh, parole is something that is in the immigration statute. But it pre the Biden administration it was very rarely used.
▶ 0:57:42And the point of it is if someone doesn't have time to go through the visa process or the refugee program uh but need to come here temporarily on a case-byase basis uh for urgent humanitarian need or in the significant public interest. The classic example is uh someone coming from surgery who doesn't have time to get a visa.
▶ 0:58:05Um and for that reason I believe that is why Congress did not authorize work authorization for parole and yet secretary Mayorcus uh granted work authorization for the paroleies.
▶ 0:58:19Um we talked about the uh use of the NOS's truly an arm of the government to carry this out and Doge has revealed the billions of dollars that have gone out through various departments um to to execute this. M let me let me ask you did the did the combination of the policies of the Biden administration did it make America more safe or less safe? Less safe. Uh Mr.
▶ 0:58:49I want to ask you a couple questions. First, thank you for your service. I had a chance to visit with you a few minutes before the hearing uh you actually shared with me uh a story uh that in the sector that you are assigned to, Del Rio, that back in September of 2021 uh that there will actually on one given day in a single sector there were 15,000 encounters that day. More than the entire month of February along the entire southwest border.
▶ 0:59:17We've seen with the policies implemented by the Trump administration, just over 11,000 total encounters on the southwest border. You were telling me that you had 15,000 encounters on a given day just in a single sector along the southwest border. Is that correct? That's correct. We had uh what's been deemed the Haitian migrant crisis in Del Rio.
▶ 0:59:38essentially almost 30,000 people crossed over the span of about a week and a half and the high water mark the for one day was uh about 15,000 people below the Del Rio port of entry and in the the brush to the left and right of it. So it was uh this we've never seen anything like that before. Let me ask you about current morale. There was a statement issued in one of the opening statements uh and I don't recall by Mr. Cra or Mr. Thompson that the morale of the Border Patrol agents uh was low.
▶ 1:00:06Uh, how would you contrast the morale of the Border Patrol agents today versus the morale under the Biden administration? Complete 100 degree 180 degree change. Uh, we're able to do our job again. Uh, that's the we want to work with all there's a lot of people uh bashing federal employees these days. We want to work. It's a very difficult job and we want to be out there and we're finally able to do it. Uh and one final question and I'll ask each of the uh uh witnesses just to answer yes or no because uh my time is quickly expiring.
▶ 1:00:37Um it's been reported that there are roughly 1.5 million individuals who have final orders of removal uh that are currently at large within the United States. So that means that they've been through the process, their claims have been denied, and that a magistrate or a judge has issued a final order of removal for those individuals.
▶ 1:01:03And so my question is, should we be enforcing those orders of removal? Miss Ree? Yes. Mr. Blair? Yes, sir. Mr. Anthony? Yes, sir. And Mr. Reichlin Milnik. It depends on the individual circumstances. So if a judge orders a person to be removed, we should not enforce the judge's order. Is that your testimony? Many of those orders were issued in absentia against people who did not receive government notice. In fact, 20% of inabsentia orders are later successfully overturned.
▶ 1:01:33So I think each individual case is different. All right. So I'm going to take that as a no. With that, uh I uh will now recognize Mr. Koreah for his five minutes of questioning. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I do hope we have additional opportunity to delve into these issues. Uh Mr.
▶ 1:01:50Afinson, I've had the opportunity to travel from Texas to California, visit most of the ports of entry and areas between ports of entry, talked to a lot of your agents, most of the employees right now at the border, green and blue uniforms, came on board after 911. So, you're right. We've got a massive wave of retirements coming any day now.
▶ 1:02:18Um, low morale pay. You pay a person at Santoro the same that you pay somebody in New Mexico. Mandatory overtime. Do we have mand mandatory overtime? That's correct. So, you got an agent who's got to go home and take care of the kids, a single parent. What does he say when he's popped with a 16-hour turn to work? Sorry, head at best. How does that help morale? That's right. Okay. Suicides.
▶ 1:02:48Absolutely. And I hope, Mr. Chairman, moving forward, let's let's look at these issues. That's breadandbut stuff. Recruitment. The reason you can't bring in more people is because of the security background check. It's tougher than even the FBI's background check. These are the issues we got to look at. that we've been talking about for years now. Mr. Blair, you talked about the narcos. Yes, sir. You did. You're absolutely right. Very powerful.
▶ 1:03:17Then the Mexico people are scared to death to walk on those streets. Who finances those Uh they finance themselves through their illicit commodities. The abund the sale of drugs to our taxpayers, our constituents. Those are American dollars are going to Mexico to finance the narcos. Is that correct? Yes or no? Uh yes sir. We are one of their largest So you're you're witnessing right now the biggest transfer of wealth in recent history.
▶ 1:03:46American consumers financing narcos that are killing people in other countries. Yes. No. Yes. As well as all the other 65. Thank you very much. Love to talk to you a little bit more but I got a couple of minutes left. Maybe one of my colleagues here can indulge a little bit more. But Mr. Reich Melnik, let's talk about that a little bit.
▶ 1:04:10Trump administration pulling thousands of agents to the border, pulling FBI, DEA, ATF from investigating child abuses, sex traffickers, gangs, drugs. If you want to go after these issue, wouldn't you go after the pocketbook? Wouldn't you go after and investigate where these dollars are flowing, where they're coming from? I think so. Yes. So, how does this shift in personnel help the situation or not? I don't think it does.
▶ 1:04:40Um, I think trained law enforcement that are focusing on very serious crimes like child sexual exploitation should stay on the job doing those jobs. I mean, if you want to punch a drug cartel, you want to go after their pocketbook. Correct. So, when you pull somebody from ATF, DEA, FBI, from that investigation, what are we doing? I don't see how that helps.
▶ 1:05:06Let me come back to the issue of deporting individuals that don't have a criminal I'm from California. We're land of the nuts and fruits, many say. We're also the fifth largest economy in the world. We're also the biggest a state in the United States, account for 60% of the nation's capital.
▶ 1:05:34We have more inventions, Valley. We've been able to fix our human resource, our workforce issues. by integrating documented and undocumented workers. Most of the workers in the fields are probably undocumented. Is that a good bet for economy for lowering the prices of food? Yeah, certainly undocumented workers contribute significantly to the United States. Many of them are taxpayers.
▶ 1:06:02About half of undocumented immigrants pay taxes as well and putting billions of dollars into lot of them pay into the social security system. We'll never see a dime off that system. And Mr. Chairman, I've got half a minute left here, but I'd love to delve with you into these issues. Nobody nobody wants a murder or rapists in our neighborhoods because by the time they're actually reported to the police, they ravage through our ethnic communities first and we don't want that to happen.
▶ 1:06:33At the same time, we recognize the fact that we have a workforce shortage in this country and that we need legal pathways to work in this country. Look forward, Mr. Attorney, to addressing the real issues. And by the way, we didn't even talk about the fact that a lot of these crossings, illegal crossings, undocumented crossings at the border are also a result of CO. That's another issue. Mr. Chairman, thank you for indulging me.
▶ 1:07:00And if I can before I give you the mic, I'd like to submit for the record like to ask for unanimous consent to submit an article from Reuters dated to March 22nd of this year entitled, "Thousands of agents diverted to Trump immigration crackdown that describes how special agents from HSI, FBI, ATF have been forced to put their investigations on hold in order to do immigration enforcement." Mr. Chairman, without objection, it'll be admitted into the record.
▶ 1:07:30The chair now recognizes the gentleman from the great state of Texas, Mr. Gonzalez, for five minutes. Uh, thank you, Chairman Guest. Appreciate your leadership on this. Thank you everybody for testifying before us. It's good to see you, John. I didn't even know you owned a suit. It's great to see you up here and not in the field. U, you know, I represent twothirds of the Texas Mexico border. A lot of the places that people talk about, we live it. Uh, Del Rio with the Haitians under the bridge. We live that. Eagle Pass, thousands of people.
▶ 1:07:57We live that when they rush the when these IAS rushed the the bridge in El Paso also in the district. Uh but I want to start with one thing in particular that I don't think gets enough coverage and I want to start with Miss Ree and this is a very simple question. Where are the children? There are reports of hundreds of thousands of children that are missing regardless of their legal status. Where are the children?
▶ 1:08:25Well, that's a valid question because 550,000 came in unaccompanied during the last administration and HHS was so overwhelmed um treated them basically like widgets on an assembly line and turned them over to unvetted sponsors. And so then HHS lost track of so many of them um and unfortunately some were subjected to sex trafficking, child labor and and god knows what else, but they need to be found.
▶ 1:08:53I I agree with you and I think this is an area that uh that the president working with Congress, we're going to have to work really hard to find these children to no one else is going to advocate for them. Uh I I I saw during the last administration as their policies were eroded where they would at one time would vet everyone in the household before they would turn a child over uh to now they were just turning children over as quickly as they possibly could just because of the sheer numbers.
▶ 1:09:21I think that is an area that we absolutely uh need to focus on. I'm sure you you're you're going to gain uh you're going to have the level of support for from this committee. Uh my next question is is to uh to Mr. Blair. Um how how can the president how can President Trump and Congress uh best tackle rounding up and deporting the hundreds of thousands of convicted criminal illegal aliens loose in our country? Uh thank you sir. That's a great question.
▶ 1:09:49And the best way to do so is working as a multi-jurisdictional, multi- agency plan through your local, state, and county law enforcement. Uh it's those law enforcement agents uh or officers that are in the communities. They know the communities, they know the criminality or the criminal elements within their communities.
▶ 1:10:04So, the only way that uh President Trump and also Tom Hman are going to be able to uh go after all those hundreds of thousands that are currently on the non-disclosed docket for ICE um that have criminal records is by going through a multi- agency, multi-jurisdictional plan led by the federal government. The federal government is just not big enough. Uh federal agencies are not large enough and so they're going to have to go through that all the way down to the local level. Spot on. I couldn't agree with you more.
▶ 1:10:32Uh last year I I sent a letter to ICE asking how many convicted criminal illegal aliens are in our country that you one I was shocked I got a response back but even more shocking was the fact that it was 662,000 that is a large number and to your point the only way we're going to accomplish this is if we all are in the same boat paddling in the same direction local state federal all coming together I just held a round table last week in San Antonio with that with my sheriffs with my police chiefs with
▶ 1:11:02uh we had FBI there, we had HSI, we had DEA, uh you had all these different partnerships and you've already seen some of the successes that President Trump has been able to and his administration has been able to accomplish in Houston and throughout the country. But to your point, I think you're spot on. We have to do more. And that the only way we do this is if we all pull our resources together to get these these Once again, I'm not talking about somebody that is here waiting their court case.
▶ 1:11:29I'm talking someone that's a convicted criminal illegal alien to the tune of 600,000. My next question is is to you, John. Uh it's pretty simple. I mean, you're on the you're in the you're on the ground. You're in the you're in the field. What what is the pulse of uh of the Border Patrol agents on the ground uh after President Trump has initiated these policy changes? Uh well, they're doing the job that they were trained to do. So, obviously, they're they're happy about that.
▶ 1:11:57Uh there are a lot of different policies that are being challenged in court. So we're day-to-day things are changing in terms of what rules are supposed to be followed. So that's been a little confusing, but ultimately they're glad to be back to work doing the job that we were doing uh at least during the the first Trump administration. So uh it's it's completely different than what it was in the last four years. Yeah, I agree with you. I mean uh I've been at since the president has taken um taken office, I've been at the border six different times, various different sectors. I have four different border patrol sectors.
▶ 1:12:27It is a breath of fresh air on the ground. One thing that I would add though, I'm seeing a lot of agents, new agents that have been in the force less than four years that really don't know what their job is supposed to be. So, I think a large part of it is how do we train our agents to get back to doing the jobs that they need to do. Thank you everybody again and thank you chairman for uh for this commit for this hearing. Uh thank you. I now recognize the gentle lady from Illinois, Mr. Ramirez for her five minutes of questioning. Thank you, chairman.
▶ 1:12:56We spend a lot of time in this committee um subcommittee. Obviously, it's the border subcommittee, but the entire full committee talking about the border, but I really think that for us to understand the border, we also have to understand history and context. Two things incompatible with Trump's administration of authoritarianism, white supremacism, and this white man's good old days. So I want to spend some time doing a little bit of history here. Let's consider Cuba, Haiti, Nicaragua, and Venezuela.
▶ 1:13:26Why do these countries get humanitarian parole? Because each faced a humanitarian crisis. High numbers of asylum seekers cross the border fleeing political, social, and economic instability that the youth play the US played a role in creating.
▶ 1:13:42But last week, the Trump administration announced that individuals from Cuba, from Haiti, from Nicaragua, and Venezuela must leave the United States in the next month, not because a humanitarian crisis has passed, but because this administration is committed to an authoritarian agenda and consequences be damned. So, let's clear some things together here. Uh, Mr. Rakelin, I want to uh Melnik, I want to ask you a couple of yes or no questions.
▶ 1:14:08First, let me start with were any taxpayer funds used to bring these migrants into the United States? Absolutely not. Thank you. Can you explain how many people may lose their legal status under the Trump administration? Uh, you know, when just the CHMV parole program, which the administration announced uh would be terminated earlier uh last week, we're looking at hundreds of thousands of people and so far with temporary protected status, 800,000 combined with another 300,000 likely in the fall.
▶ 1:14:36And very briefly, what types of jobs are people in the CHNV program and temporary protective status filling in our communities? They're filling all kinds of jobs in communities like Springfield, Ohio, where they were helping rebuild the manufacturing base. And in places like Florida and Texas and California, they're working legally. They're filling jobs that are open to any person in the country who's able to work legally. And without them, the economy will suffer. Thank you for your for your response. I want to talk about Guantanamo Bay. Mr.
▶ 1:15:06Melnik, let's just be clear again. Yes or no? Did detaining migrants of Guantanamo Bay improve our border security? Absolutely not. And yes or no? To your knowledge, did they send only criminals to Guantanamo? No. Yes or no? Does the administration have the ability to hold the quote worst of the worst here in the United States? Absolutely they do. And yes or no? Did they need Guantanamo to achieve that end? They did not. And quickly, what other problems did you see with this administration's use of Guantanamo Bay?
▶ 1:15:34Uh beyond uh there's there was the treatment of people at those facilities in facilities that were clearly did not meet ICE standards where people were held in solitary confinement, even people again with no criminal record. It was also extraordinarily expensive. So I want to talk now about Salvador. President Trump recently invoked the Alien Enemies Act. The last time this law was used was during a dark period in American history. Some of us just talked about if we don't know history, we're damned to repeat it again.
▶ 1:16:03And it was used to detain more than 100,000 Japanese Americans being in intermittent camps following the attack on Pearl Harbor. Trump has invoked it to target the Trenagua gang, he says, and recently deported more than 100 individuals they allege are connected to this gang. These individuals were disappeared to a mega prison in El Salvador. Mr. Renick Malik, can you explain some of the problems with President Trump's use of the Alien Enemies Act?
▶ 1:16:31The number one problem is the lack of due process. The administration is asserting an unprecedented authority to point at any person and say you're a member of Trenagua. You don't get any right to say that you're not. We're going to stick you on a plane. We don't even have to tell you first. At a court hearing yesterday, the Department of Justice said people do not even have a right to be told they're going to be subject to this law before they're put on a plane. That's right. And do we know who some of the individuals sent to El Salvador are? We do.
▶ 1:16:59And we know that many of them allege that they are not members of the gang, including Andre, a Venezuelan gay barber who is seeking asylum, a makeup artist who has said repeatedly he has been sent there by mistake. And has the Trump administration provided any evidence of gang ties? None whatsoever. So, let me ask you this last question. Why should American citizens, permanent residents, lawabiding legal immigrants fear President's Trump invocation of the Alien Enemies Act?
▶ 1:17:29This country was founded on the rule of law, on the idea that no person could be held to account by the government without an opportunity to understand the charges brought against them and an opportunity to respond. That is not happening here. That's right. And I will say history does in fact repeat itself. And some of the worst parts of our past started with eroding people's right and making them the enemy.
▶ 1:17:50We can't let this administration continue to criminalize immigrants in order to be able to criminalize any descent, which is exactly why I think Secretary Gnome needs to come before this body and answer questions. I demand that. And with that, I yield back. Thank you. I now recognize the gentleman from Arizona, Mr. Crane, for five minutes. Thank you, Mr. Mr. Chairman for holding this hearing today. I want to thank you all for joining us on this important subcommittee hearing.
▶ 1:18:18I only have five minutes, so I ask you to please keep your answers brief. I also have a service of unanimous consent request that I'll be entering into the record after my questioning. Mr. Antiffson, on January 27th, 2024, President Biden said a new broader bill would grant him new emergency authority to shut down the border when it becomes overwhelmed. Additionally, on January 30th, 2024, President Biden said, "When asked about his actions on the border, "I've done all I can do.
▶ 1:18:49Give me the Border Patrol. Give me the people who can stop this and make it work right." My question to you, sir, did President Biden lie to the American people about his actions and authority at the southern border? He claimed there was nothing else he could do and then he did more that summer with the executive order. So, clearly, he wasn't telling the truth. Thank you. DHS and CBP fall under the executive branch meeting. Biden always had the authority. He chose to operate the border in the way he did. Would you agree with that, sir? Yes.
▶ 1:19:20Mr. Blair, US Customs and Border Patrol protection data released February 18, 2025. According to US Customs and Border Patrol Protection, from January 21st through January 31st, 2025, the number of US Border Patrol apprehensions along the southwest border dropped 85% from the same period in 2024.
▶ 1:19:42The number of inadmissible aliens encountered by CBP's Office of Field Operation at ports of entry along the southwest border dropped 93% in the 11 days after January 20th, compared with the 11 days prior. And the list goes on and on. My question is, and please answer yes or no, sir. Would you agree CBP data suggests that President Trump's first 30 days in office was more effective at stopping illegal immigration than four years of Joe Biden? Yes, sir.
▶ 1:20:11Thank you, Miss Rise. My question is, briefly explain what liberal states stand to gain from mass illegal immigration and uncheck parole. Part of its headcount. um they're counted in the census even though uh non-citizens can't vote not and are not supposed to vote and then those numbers are used for districtricting uh in Congress and then in turn those same numbers are also used for the presidential electoral college votes.
▶ 1:20:41Would you agree ma'am that redistricting is a major political outcome for Democrats welcoming migrant caravans into their local communities? Yes. It gives them more headcount and therefore more districts. Would you agree ille illegal immigration for redistricting is not what the founders intended art under article 1 section 2 clause one of the constitution regarding congressional districtricting. I agree.
▶ 1:21:07I'd like to play a 20 second recording of a former homeland security committee member. Can we go ahead and play that? From Brooklyn, New York. We have a diaspora that that can absorb a significant number of these migrants.
▶ 1:21:27And I that you know when I hear uh colleagues talk about uh you know the the the the doors of the in being closed um no room in the end I I'm saying you know I I need more people in my district but just for redistricting purposes and those members could could clearly uh fit here. I'm from Brooklyn, New York. We have a diaspora that that can absorb a significant number of these migrants.
▶ 1:21:54And I that you know when I hear uh colleagues talk about uh you know the the the the doors of the Thank you. That was Rep. Yeette Clark, a Democrat from New York from January 8th, 2024. Her words outlined Biden's failed plans for illegal immigration to gain political influence. Miss Rice, you wrote on this issue for Heritage Foundation in February of 2024.
▶ 1:22:19The article was titled, "Stop allowing non-citizens to determine congressional and presidential representation." It was a great piece and I plan to introduce the article into congressional record at the conclusion of my five minutes. The last thing I want to say to Mr. Reichlin Meleneck is I find it interesting as I sit here and listen to you blame President Trump and attack President Trump, you know, for saying to the American people that he was going to protect the American people.
▶ 1:22:49He was going to put them first and he was going to implement policies to fix the mess created by the Biden administration. And I just find it rich that you're attacking President Trump for doing exactly what the American people wanted, not the individual who caused this problem. And uh sadly, if you guys don't figure this issue out, you're going to lose the next election as well. Thank you. I yield back. Mr. Chairman, are you intending to enter something in the record? Yep. I've got several.
▶ 1:23:19Uh if you'll just give us a brief descriptions so that we can do that at this point. Yep. So, this is an article. Biden promises to shut down the border if given the authority in a partisan bill. Without objection, be entered into the record. Number two, Biden has the power to end the border crisis. He doesn't want to. Without objection, be entered into the record. Number three, CBP releases January 20, 25th monthly update. Without objection, be entered into the record.
▶ 1:23:46Stop allowing non-citizens to determine congressional and presidential representation by Miss Rice. without objection be entered into the record. And the last one, Brooklyn Congresswoman wants migrants to fill up her district. And without objection, that will also be entered into the record. At this time, the chair would recognize the gentleman from Tennessee, Mr. Ogles, for his five minutes of questioning. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and to the witnesses. You, my colleague, invoked history, and so let's start there.
▶ 1:24:14Article 2, section one, the executive power shall be vested in a president of the United States. Section three, the president shall take care that the laws be faithfully executed. The take care clause uh allows the president to issue directives and executive orders.
▶ 1:24:30And so as we look at how President Trump is addressing the issue of illegal immigration, uh whether or not he chooses to grant or deny u parole or amnesty uh or uh you know sanctuary is his prerogative per the constitution. And staying on the idea of history for a moment, let's not forget all of those folks that entered in this country did so illegally.
▶ 1:24:59That is their first act is an illegal act. It should al also be noted and if there's one takeaway from my questions or testimony in this community is that they should be deported. There should be no pathway. There should be no amnesty. This is our country. We get to decide who comes in and we get to decide who leaves. It's that simple.
▶ 1:25:24If my friend and colleague from Arizona and I want to travel overseas, we'd have to do so on a visa. We'd have to do so legally. And if we entered a country, whether it's in the Middle East or Europe, illegally, it would kick our out. I don't think anyone can deny that fact.
▶ 1:25:43And yet we try to hold ourselves to some higher standard and we point to other issues or complaints about well it's stressing the FBI or it's stressing the you know the long laundry list of moaning and groaning and we're forgetting the very fact that they entered this country illegally. And if we choose to send their butts home, again, pardon me for saying that, have children. That's our prerogative.
▶ 1:26:12It's just our prerogative. You mentioned, ma'am, in your article the what I would say a very motivation for why the Biden administration so recklessly allowed our country to be invaded. And that was the presidential election in the next census. Because you see in the blue, states that are having population flight are disproportionately being flooded.
▶ 1:26:43You see in the future in the next census where states like Tennessee, my home state, Ohio, the Carolinas, Florida, maybe Texas will pick up additional House seats that will forever change the House of Representatives to be quite frankly Republican.
▶ 1:26:59The Democratic Party, I believe, and this is my opinion, flooded our country to try to stem the inevitable that this country is sick and tired of the woke nonsense and the invasion that's taking place under watch. You have blue mayors, Democratic mayors and blue cities under the Biden administration that were screaming for assistance. Please stop.
▶ 1:27:27we can't take anymore. I went to the border under the Biden administration. I traveled to Tucson. I went south, hit the border, and I went to a section that wasn't controlled by the United States government, but rather the cartel. And while we were there in this very remote area on one of the hardest hottest days of the summer, had over a hundred people turned themselves into myself and the special operators that we went down with.
▶ 1:27:55I went down with went down unannounced, by the way. And before Border Patrol would come and pick those individuals up through different pods, they sent choppers up in the air to fly for over half an hour because they would not come into the area until they had completely surveiled and made sure the cartel wasn't in the area. some of those gaps in those fence.
▶ 1:28:18And by the way, I crossed into Mexico, walked in about a hundred yards, and as I walked in, a cartel sniper crossed over the ridge and put eyes on me. This is the United States border. I would argue that a sovereign nation should have three things.
▶ 1:28:41a secure border, fair, open, and honest elections, and obviously a powerful military. The Biden administration failed at all three of those. And President Trump is working to fix the record. I support the president and again, I'll emphasize, no amnesty. It's time to start mass deportations. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I yield back. Thank you.
▶ 1:29:07At this time, the chair recognizes the gentle lady from South Carolina, Miss Biggs. Thank you, Chairman Guest. Um, border security is a priority for my district, and I'm grateful to you for holding this hearing, and thank you to our witnesses for being here today and giving us your input.
▶ 1:29:27The Biden administration border crisis inflicted historic damage on our nation, and I think that is relevant to Under his failed leadership, illegal crossings reached record highs with over 300,000 in December 2023 alone and more than 9 million over Biden's four years as president. The illegal population is now estimated to exceed 15 million.
▶ 1:29:58Meanwhile, American families like those in the third district of South Carolina were left behind. After Hurricane Helen, our community struggled to pick up the pieces while illegal immigrants were placed in luxury hotels. Mr. Chairman, I would like to enter into record um this article entitled Clawed Back.
▶ 1:30:25DHS Chief Gnome secures I eyepopping sum sent to New York for migrant hotels. Uh, your statement will be entered into the record without objection. Thank you.
▶ 1:30:44This article demonstrates how the Biden administration abandoned the American people in favor of spending 59 million in taxpayer money on illegal immigrants in New York City. In New York City, that's just unfair and it's unamerican. Under President Trump's leadership, we are already seeing a return to law and order and national sovereignty.
▶ 1:31:11In just one month back in office, border encounters dropped to just a dropped to just 11,000, proving that strong leadership, not luck, solves crisis. So my question is to Miss Ree. We've talked about a lot here today, but what impact did this have on average American families?
▶ 1:31:38And I'm talking about like housing cost or strained school systems, longer wait times for health care. Um when the last administration put illegal immigrants ahead of our US citizens, well communities were very strained and they weren't notified in advance uh that large populations were coming to their communities. So they didn't have time to prepare for more teachers um or expanded classrooms.
▶ 1:32:06So schools were overcrowded, hospital rooms, emergency rooms were overcrowded. Uh not enough shelter. So the h the prices of housing went up and that is why this was a number one issue for Americans voting last fall. Okay.
▶ 1:32:21Um and the second part of that question um now that we're back under strong leadership, how do we ensure that future administrations never repeat the failures of the Biden era era and always put America first? Well, this is where Congress needs to um step in and codify many of the changes that are necessary. Um we can't we shouldn't be going back and forth president to president via executive order.
▶ 1:32:52Um we need to shut down the the benefit fraud, particularly asylum fraud. Um make sure there's enough resources not just for CBP, but also for ICE and the interior, which is so important right now in the reconciliation bill. Thank you. Thank you. And with that, I yield back. Uh, gentle lady yields back. At this time, I recognize the gentleman from North Carolina, Mr. KN, for his five minutes of questioning. Thank you, Mr. Chair. Uh, witnesses, it's great to, uh, hear what you had to say.
▶ 1:33:21I'm sorry that I've been back and forth. I was able to hear most of your opening statements and thank you for your opinions. Thank you for the work that you all have achieved to get here and to provide such valuable uh, information. And from my background, I agree with most of what was said. And uh my personal belief is that the the border crisis of the last four years was an intentional act inflicted upon the American people.
▶ 1:33:48Uh there were mechanisms that were used and procedures that were implemented that had never been used before. And as a prosecutor in the Department of Justice, I saw internally how they made it more difficult than it had ever been in my career to prosecute illegal criminals.
▶ 1:34:07And whether it was the temporary protective status, whether it was the refusal for uh permission, whether it was change of policy, whatever it was, the nerve center of Washington DC again made it more difficult for people in the United States to protect themselves against illegal immigrant crime or just the overflow of people who came into our communities. And uh Mr. Melnik, I do want to talk to you.
▶ 1:34:34I I heard your opening statement and again from my perspective labeling the Biden Harris um record on immigration as mixed I think is sort of a a a gross misstatement and just on a on a on a basic level. Would you be willing to admit that the Biden Harris administration was willing to incentivize illegal immigration? No, I don't think that's accurate and I'm be happy to explain more if you like.
▶ 1:35:01Well, would you uh admit that there were obviously motivations beyond just asylum seekers that propelled people into the United States? Yeah, there was a mixed flow. There were a genuine legitimate asylum seekers, tens of thousands of which who have won their cases every year, and there were economic migrants. Absolutely. And uh in the United States, uh taxpayers foot the bill for health care for illegal immigrants. Isn't that correct? Um it really depends on the circumstance. We know I'm Dr. I I'll I'll play favorable.
▶ 1:35:30In some instances, taxpayers foot the bill for health care for illegal immigrants. Correct. And Tala requires emergency rooms treat every person regardless of status. Yes. Well, in some states there are programs where you don't have to be here legally and you can get access to Medicaid. Correct. Uh I believe some states have allow emergency Medicaid for pregnant women. Yes. And in some instances taxpayers foot the bill for housing for illegal immigrants. Is that correct? Um, again, in some circumstances, some communities have uh opened up status uh programs to people regardless of immigration.
▶ 1:36:00Taxpayers foot the bill for healthcare, housing. There's also transportation costs that are inflicted on the taxpayers. Correct. Um, I'm unaware of what you're referring to there. Well, people were flown into the country illegally. Once they were here illegally, they were bust all over the country. They arrived in New York City, California, North Carolina, Texas, Illinois at the taxpayers's expense. Correct. Yes. Governor Abbott uh chose to run that program. And well, he's not the only person that wrote that that ran that program. Correct. Uh I bet there are there are dollars far beyond Texas that put illegal immigrants all over this country.
▶ 1:36:31Uh other states and communities offered up travel vouchers to some individuals uh who wanted to travel to other countries. And in some instances, uh upon arrival, illegal immigrants can get driver's licenses. Isn't that correct? Um in some states, driver's licenses are available to any resident regardless of immigration. And even in some municipalities, people who are here outside the permission of the law can even vote. Isn't that correct? Uh, I am unfamiliar with any who allow that. There are some states that allow non-citizens to vote.
▶ 1:36:58I'm unsure whether that applies to people who are here in violation of immigration law. So, just so we're clear, there was the there was the program that allows healthcare, housing, transportation, food, driver's licenses, and even the right to vote. And the advocates for the Biden Harris administration say there were not incentives for illegal immigrants to come here. Hypothetically, let me ask you this. illegal immigrants are counted in the census. Correct. Uh that's correct.
▶ 1:37:23The So if if California loses 1 million American citizens, 1 million taxpayers because of the overregulation, the high cost of living, whatever it may be, and 1 million illegal immigrants are sent to California, they don't lose one electoral vote. Isn't that correct? Um it's basic math. Isn't that correct? It depends on the other populations actually because if other states grow higher, the formula is actually quite complicated. They don't they're not penalized by driving 1 million American taxpayers out of their state. Isn't that correct?
▶ 1:37:52If they've refilled those seats with 1 million illegal immigrants, it depends on population growth and changes elsewhere. The formula is quite complicated. A state can maintain a stable population and still gain or lose representation. But they they are able to maintain their electoral clout as if no one had left their state. Correct. Again, it it this is a complicated formula depends on other states and the overall population growth. Maintaining a stable level of population does not necessarily lead to the same level of representatives.
▶ 1:38:18Well, gaining 1 million illegal immigrants at minimum at minimum maintains electoral clout. Correct. It would maintain population certainly. And that's counted in the electoral college. Yes. That's counted in the House of Representatives representation. Correct. Yes. Though I'll of course know Texas and Florida are the second and third highest level of undocumented immigrants in the country. That's not the question. But I I appreciate the point. Illegal immigrants are afforded representation at the expense of citizens in states wherever they are.
▶ 1:38:46I would not say at the expense we don't have to you're advocating for Biden and Harris. It's my time. You are advocating for Biden Harris's immigration record which again I think is a gross is a gross overcomplimentary uh position. Miss Ree, Mr. Knot, I'm sorry but your time is expired. We'll talk soon. Thank you At this point, the chair would recognize the gentle lady from Texas, Miss Johnson, for five minutes. Thank you so much, Mr. Chairman.
▶ 1:39:13It's an honor to be on this subcommittee with everyone here. Um, being in Texas, I have a frontline view of our border situation, and we can all agree it is a mess. Our agents are significantly underresourced and our agencies are woefully underfunded. But we would all be fooling ourselves if we said this was all on the administration.
▶ 1:39:40This is our immigration failures has been multi-administration long over decades. George Bush tried to first this. Obama tried to solve this. Multiple presidents have tried to solve this, but it has been routinely stopped in the Congress. Republicans like to brag about border security.
▶ 1:40:07We're pumping our chest today trying to attack the Biden administration. But where was everybody last Congress when there was a bill on the table to fix it? There was a bipartisan bill worked on by members of both parties to have an agreement to put much needed emphasis on solving our border crisis to give much needed resources to the border.
▶ 1:40:36One of the problems is that we it takes people like five years to get an appointment just an appointment to determine if they're here. And this is a crisis that needs to be fixed. But President Trump didn't want this border security bill under the Biden administration because he didn't want Biden to have a win.
▶ 1:41:03He was willing to compromise the ongoing safety and security of our border for politics, to have a campaign issue. and Republicans in this Congress silently complied despite w work and months and months of work to come up with a comprehensive agreed to bill.
▶ 1:41:27That just doesn't happen in this building when people can come to it on both sides and agree. The reality of it is President Biden had an aggressive asylum reduction program that worked. Right, Mr. Reli? It worked. Significant people a drop. There was a significant decrease in people coming to our border by the end of the Biden administration. Isn't that true? Yes.
▶ 1:41:54Uh border apprehensions dropped 80% from December 2023 to January 2025. And so here we are, if we're talking about people coming to the border, it worked under President Biden's leadership. And what didn't work was passing a bill under Republican leadership in this building because they cowtailed to President Trump who wanted a campaign issue.
▶ 1:42:21And now what we have is we're not going after violent criminals. We are going after kids with cancer. We're going after people who want to come here and build houses. We're not pursuing criminals. We're not pursuing drug dealers. We're pursuing chefs and cooks and people who want to pave our roads and work as floor nurses in our country.
▶ 1:42:45We're rounding up people who are here contributing to our economy, paying taxes so that we can have some photo op in Guantanamo of nonviolent criminals.
▶ 1:42:57One of the things that you said earlier that was really struck me in your comments, sir, was how we are diverting our various agency personnel from drug enforcement, from terrorist investigation, making our communities less safe to round up illegally people who are just here working, taking care of their families. Isn't that right?
▶ 1:43:27That's right. I'm very worried about that. I mean, if this commit and then also, where are the outcries if we're talking about security of this country? Where are the outcries of the outrageous irresponsible recklessness of the Secretary of Defense of putting national security secrets on a damn signal chat? Where is that outcry?
▶ 1:43:54I mean, what there should be, regardless of party, uniform outrage demanding that these folks on this signal chat come and testify to Congress so that we can uncover the gross violations of our national security that was engaged in the Trump administration. But again, crickets, I yield back. The gen general lady yields. We will now go into a second round of questioning. Uh we will then allow Mr. not to start us off. Mr.
▶ 1:44:24Kn, you have five minutes for the next round of questioning. Thank you, Mr. Gas. And just to follow up with where we left off again, I think that any uh summary or analysis of the Biden administration's immigration performance other than it was an abysmal failure for the country is far too rosy and candidly far too partisan. And I say that with respect. I understand that we can disagree.
▶ 1:44:45Uh but when you look at the overall uh toll and the cost that it made um most Americans feel and pay anything other than an outright failure uh is far too rosy of a picture. And again, I'm familiar with your organization, Mr. Melnik. Uh it does not seem to be very uh bipartisan. It seems to be very very uh open-ended in terms of just there there is no number that would be too high.
▶ 1:45:11there's no cost that would be too high for the um for the American people to take. And again, I'll go back to Miss Ree, in regards to what we uh were discussing earlier, Mr. Melnik. Um you made some some very compelling points in so far as it was an unsustainable influx for the country. and whether it's healthcare, whether it was law enforcement, whether it was educational quality, whether it was just basic infrastructure.
▶ 1:45:36Can you please flesh out very concisely how illegal immigration, especially over the last four years, has been an unsustainable burden on the country? Well, starting uh tens of billions of dollars went out the door to NOS's to build a very secretive infrastructure to bring in millions of people. So, we have that sunk cost.
▶ 1:45:57Um then we have overwhelmed communities, overcrowded schools, emergency rooms, jails, law enforcement, uh lack of housing, etc. And the communities have spent hundreds of millions of dollars, in some cases billions of dollars. the New York may New York City mayor testified the billions of dollars New York City has spent on the back end to provide these services to um illegal aliens.
▶ 1:46:24That doesn't even account for the deaths, the violence, etc., which is incalculable. Yes. And in regards to the incentives that we were talking about, there was no acknowledgement that there were incentives for illegal immigrants to come here illegally. I'm curious as to your opinion. The way I see it, there was innumerable incentives for people to come here illegally as evidenced by the fact that they did to the tune of 10 plus million crossings. What incentives were you familiar with?
▶ 1:46:52Uh the open border, the fact that they were released into the country, the fact that they could work here, continue to send money home, bring family here, have children here, etc. Yeah. Uh Mr. Anderson, if I could uh get your take. You're familiar obviously with Border Patrol and the morale.
▶ 1:47:10Uh isn't it true, sir, that whether it was prosecutions of illegal re-entries or the policies that came from the top at Border Patrol, the ability to enforce the border was compromised intentionally over the last four years. It was very difficult to seek prosecution. There were very uh specific and high criteria, very high bar to get prosecutions, certainly compared to previous years. And uh there was a lot of uh kurfuffle that was mentioned earlier that we can't fight terrorists.
▶ 1:47:37We cannot fight drug traffickers based off of the policies that the Trump administration is putting into place. Again, I find that grossly offensive. Can you fight terrorists? Can you fight drug traffickers with the open border policies that we saw over the last four years? You can't do anything with open borders policies but let people in except welcome them in. So again, this narrative that we cannot fight criminals with with tough immigration enforcement, uh, I find to be fundamentally contrary to reality.
▶ 1:48:05In regards to the border bill that they said that President Trump torpedo, did you have an opinion about that bill? As an organization, we were in favor of it to a degree. I I call it sort of like a Stockholm syndrome. At that point, we had been used and abused for so long that anything seemed good, but in the long run, it had a sunset clause. It was going to go away and then it wasn't going to change anything in the long run. And there were obviously portions of that bill that were that were that would have codified in terms of tools that you had.
▶ 1:48:32It would it would have made it more difficult in some respects to enforce the border ultimately. Yes, sir. Mr. Blair, in regards to your experience, are you familiar with the way that that bill that was referenced by my colleague on the other side of the aisle would have hurt the ability to enforce the border? Yes, sir. It would have codified illegal immigration to the sum of a few thousand. Yep. And uh it would have it would before the border was closed, it would have welcomed roughly two million in before it was an automatic closure. Correct. Yes, sir. And uh in regards to uh the exact language, it legalized codified catch and release.
▶ 1:49:02Correct. Uh yes, sir. It did. Um I'm again running short on time. Mr. Chairman, I will yield back the balance. Again, I thank the witnesses for their testimony and uh we could we appreciate any any commentary on how to make immigration work for the American people. Thank you. Uh, thank you, Mr. Nod. It's amazing how quickly five minutes goes by, is it not? At this time, I yield to the gentleman from California, Mr. Koreah, for his five minutes of questioning. Thank you very much, Mr. Milnik.
▶ 1:49:31I'm going to quick questions and answers. Have US citizens illegal permanent residents been caught up president's Trump immigration rates? Yes. Have veterans who've served honorably did and have been discharged honorably, have they been affected? Have they been deported? Yeah, a a veteran in Newark was arrested, but of course, veterans have been deported for years. Um, in fact, we've long called on Congress to provide. Has due process been afforded to individuals detained?
▶ 1:49:59Um, we have serious concerns about the processes going on, including multiple allegations of violations of settlements and and violations of detention standards. Mr. Chairman, I got to tell you, great issues here and and Miss Ree, I heard you talk about census, redistricting, little bit of my my political history.
▶ 1:50:19I started out trying to represent an area whose voter registered voters, US citizen voter registration participation was very low, heavily immigrant community, never wanted to vote. It's called voter suppression. They would get letters saying anybody who's not eligible legally registered to vote, you are subject to a felony.
▶ 1:50:46When you get a letter like that at home, guess what people do? They say, "Hell no, I'm not voting. I don't care if I'm registered, I'm legally registered, or I'm not going to vote because I want to stay away from that process." In the last census, President Trump put out an edict. Do not count them people. Who are those people? All the above. California lost one seat, congressional seat. Texas should have gained three seats.
▶ 1:51:16But in Texas, unlike California, they didn't encourage people to be signed up, to be counted, citizens, non-citizens, legal, and undocumented. There's a lot of issues here. Love to sit down and talk to you, Mr. Milnik, what's the value of nearshoring? We're talking about bringing back manufacturing from China to the USA.
▶ 1:51:41Southern California today is the manufacturing center of the United States. Guess who those employees are that are working making widgets? I I think immigrant workers tend to have a very within without documents cuz they have those employers saying, "Lou, help me. My workers need to be legalized." They're not. So what's the value of nearshore? And we talk about the cost but not the benefits. National defense.
▶ 1:52:10What's the value of national defense? And this is one of the reasons that we think that a path to legal status can help push back against the unscrupulous employers that are exploiting people this country. Let's talk about an incentive to come to the US. Let's talk about incentive to come to the US. my trip to Guatemala. They were telling me, Guatemala officials, that it cost $20,000 to make the trip from Guatemala to the border.
▶ 1:52:39You get two shots at crossing the border. After that, you're done. 80% of the women who undertake that trip north are raped or sexually abused. Mr. Raffinson, you know that as well. What is the incentive for these people? A welfare check? Is that going to get raped so I can get a welfare check? It's going to cost me $20,000 cash. What's the incentive? It's the American dream. Hunger.
▶ 1:53:09Something for my children in the future and my kids are being recruited to go into gangs. This is the bigger issue here we have to address. It's not Biden. It's not Trump. It's public policy. You know, Kelly, General Kelly, former Homeland Security chairman would say, "Border security does not begin or end at the border.
▶ 1:53:37It's all of the above." And love to work with all of you in big public policy. Immigration to this country a lot lately. Record number lately. When was the last time we had such record numbers? Early 1900s. Yes. Yeah.
▶ 1:53:53and 1990s in the 1900s what was their policy you walked in through Ellis Island and what was the policy deport you or you just had to show up at the US border as long as you could show that you didn't have a disease or any serious infement uh was the laws they would let you in 1990s today what's the policy uh we've got a significantly more restrictive policy in fact we haven't updated our immigration laws since November 199 1990.
▶ 1:54:23It's been 35 years. What I'm trying to say, ladies and gentlemen, this is a multi- challenging issue. Immigration, border security, US economic policy, foreign public policy, trade, public policy, all symptoms of the same issue, which is American security. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Love to continue the discussion, but I think I'm out of time. I yield. Thank you. At this time, uh, I recognize myself. Uh, Mr.
▶ 1:54:53Melnik, in your opening written statement, uh, you say that over 18% of individuals held in ICE detention who were arrested by the interior by ICE had no criminal record. Uh, so putting that into perspective, uh, 82% of those individuals arrested by were at least charged, if not convicted, with crime. Is that correct? That's correct.
▶ 1:55:19We know from ICE data the majority of those are um immigration offenses and low-level offenses. Uh in fact only 12% of people currently held in ICE detention are categorized as the most serious offenders. And then in previous questions I asked you a little bit about final orders of removal.
▶ 1:55:36Uh, and I think you said, and if I'm I'm not trying to misstate, so if I get this wrong, please feel free to correct me, that you believe that roughly 20% of the final orders of removals should not be enforced uh because the individuals claiming asylum, they failed to appear at their court proceedings. Is that accurate? Uh, no. I didn't say they should not be enforced. I wanted to emphasize each individual case has to be assessed individually. Some people have a final order due to no fault of their own.
▶ 1:56:03the government didn't send the notice to appear to the right address for example. So that's why each case has to be looked at individually. I don't want to do a categorical statement. Every person with a final order should be removed because some of them were removed in error or ordered removed in error and they have a right to go back to the court and say I'd like you to fix this. There was a mistake done. And so it seems to me and maybe I'm mistaken that you would like to establish what's known in the legal law and as you know as a bright line test.
▶ 1:56:31Is it a are you trying to say that the bright line test of this administration should be that no individual who has not been charged with a crime should be removed from the country? No. But in a world of limited resources where we have nearly 4 million people in immigration court, it is important to focus on those with the most serious offenses first, not just take a scattershot approach to everybody. All right.
▶ 1:56:54And to the Trump administration's credit, over eight out of every 10 of the individuals that they have apprehended have been charged with some crime. Now, we can argue whether or not we think that crime is serious enough that they should uh be apprehended or not, but over 80% have been charged with crime. And so, there's not this roundup where we're out there uh seeking to bring in large numbers of people that have not been charged with crimes. You've not seen that, have you? Uh we have seen a significant increase of arrested people with no criminal convictions.
▶ 1:57:25And we've also seen a significant increase of those arrested that have criminal convictions. Yes. Overall and overall numbers overall numbers have grown over 600% from the the same numbers a year ago. And so if your numbers are growing by 600%, you're going to see a larger increase of those with criminal convictions than those without. But then when you look at the overall percentages, we're still talking that 82% of the individuals arrested by ICE that they are seeking to deport have some sort of criminal convictions.
▶ 1:57:55And then you throw into addition to that those that we talked about order earlier with final orders of removal. And so I think it is unfair for you to characterize the fact that this administration is outgoing seeking to just round up anyone that they can find on the street because that is not supported by the documents is not supported by the numerical information that you've provided. Well, I think the ratio has changed.
▶ 1:58:20When President Trump took office, about 6% of people in ICE detention arrested by ICE had no criminal record. So it's 18% now. It's tripled. So certainly arrests overall are going up, but the portion of those arrests that are people with no criminal record is rising faster than the portion of the arrest of those people with a criminal record. Uh thank you. Uh to close on a high note, Mr. Anderson, I want to ask you if you would do myself and Representative Koreah a favor.
▶ 1:58:47Uh when you return back to the men and women that you serve with, uh please tell them that we thank them for their service. Uh we thank them for their sacrifice. Uh I pledge to you that myself and ranking member Koreah that we will do everything within our authority uh to make sure that the men and women who serve our country have the resources that they need, that you have the number of agents that you need to perform your duties.
▶ 1:59:16uh and then also that you have the pay that you need uh so that those individuals can support their families uh and that those individuals can be compensated uh for uh the work that they do. Uh so with that I would like to thank all of our witnesses uh for being here today. Uh we had a distinguished panel. Uh I believe that while we had a very robust discussion at times I believe that it was an important discussion.
▶ 1:59:41Uh again we appreciate uh you giving of your time uh to enlighten uh us and other members of this committee uh on the important decisions uh that we have facing us. Uh and with that uh the hearing will be adjourned. Thank you.