▶ 0:10:28e e
▶ 0:11:28spe for
▶ 0:12:50himself uh for a five minute opening statement good morning everyone and thank you to our Witnesses for being here we really do appreciate it very much I'm really excited to hold this hearing today on the evolving landscape of name image likeness uh commonly known as nil and its impact on College athletes in just a few years College athletics has fundamentally reshaped
▶ 0:13:20the lives of student athletes who can now benefit from their nil before 2021 athletes were barred from profiting off of their own nil but in response to Legal challenges and the Supreme Court decision the NCAA ended those restrictions finally giving our student athletes their much deserved ability to earn compensation for their brand and their god-given
▶ 0:13:52however however the absence of a preemptive uniform standard has led to the wild west most would agree with that uh a wild west environment where sadly our student athletes are put in vulnerable positions where they can easily be exploited by those who do not have their best interests in mind I've heard awful stories of student athletes signing deals without having
▶ 0:14:22been given full explanations for how their deal would impact their long-term finances livelihood this lack of structure has also allowed nil collectives who are often affiliated with universities but operating independently to turn nil into a pay forplay system instead of being used for legitimate business purposes nil deals are
▶ 0:14:52frequently given out as recruiting inducements with little transparency or site we have to fix that folks I'm also concerned about the transfer order all of us want to make sure student athletes have the freedom to make the best Collegiate and educational decisions after all that's why they go to college to get a good education but educational decisions for themselves and for their future but this
▶ 0:15:23current system is not workable as athletes are entering the portal and an un unprecedented rate sometimes multiple times in their careers with a hope but not a guarantee for something better I'm sure we have all heard the stories of student athletes being encouraged to transfer schools based on Promises of nil money that never
▶ 0:15:53materializes others transfer expecting better playing time only to to find themselves in a worse situation this revolving door system has created instability for both athletes and the programs they leave behind with many student athletes ending up without a clear academic or athletic path we often focus on n on the business side of College athletics but we must remember
▶ 0:16:23that these are still student athletes young men and women who are supposed to be receiving an education that prepares them for a life beyond Sports yet too many are making life altering financial and academic decisions without the proper guidance some are signing nil deals without understanding tax and legal implications and you can't blame them these the most
▶ 0:16:53of these well they're 18y olds in some cases but some are even uh so uh they're going to need some guidance folks others are transferring from school to school without receiving the academic support they need to graduate if we are serious about protecting student athletes and I hope we are we need to ensure that they have the resources and education necessary to navigate this
▶ 0:17:23new era successfully that's why I'm so glad to have Emily and and Anthony with us here today thank you for sharing your stories we really appreciate as student athletes and how you were able to Traverse this complex environment it gives us all student athletes the chance gives all the student athletes a chance to learn and better themselves that brings me to a point I really want to drive
▶ 0:17:53home we are working on this issue not to put one school over another although I am a Florida Gator and I'd like to see a national championship or another National Championship sometime soon uh but again not one school over another okay we've got to protect the small schools as well okay we have division one but we have to look out for the mediumsized and small schools as well
▶ 0:18:24so no we're doing this for the student athletes and that's what we're doing it for we must protect these student athletes folks we have a responsibility to do so uh Unfortunately they haven't been protected in the past so Congress has to intervene with the preemption in my opinion so we I'll say it again we are doing this for the student athletes for the young men and women who advance to college so they can continue playing the sport they
▶ 0:18:54love and use that experience to help them succeed throughout their lives it could be a wonderful experience so it is crucial it is crucial we establish a preemptive s standard as I said that Pro protects student athletes but also doesn't endanger the many sports programs that we don't see on ESPN or that bring in billions of dollars I know I'm over aren't I
▶ 0:19:24yeah well let me just finish uh here uh and I'll give you the the opportunity uh ranking member to go over if you if you'd like again uh folks we must protect the student athletes um and and we must protect the Olympic sports and the sports the non Revenue Sports as well so this is too important of an issue to get wrong I think you know that so I look forward to a thoughtful discussion
▶ 0:19:55and working towards solutions that support both student student athletes and the long-term future of college sports with that I'll yoke back and I will recognize the the the ranking member the ranking member of the subcommittee my good friend Miss chowski for five minutes for her opening statement thank you Mr chairman I certainly agree that we want to make sure that the health and and safety
▶ 0:20:25um of our athletes is always protected that has been my view and action um ever since we've been talking about uh student athletes um and that's important and so I want to work with you on that but I want to say there's actually a bigger issue right now um we F we find that um there are other items which
▶ 0:20:55include the fact that the Trump administr ation has cut the uh research funding for our uh you know for our universities for our places of the that that have to conduct the things for the the athletes and that's even more important because if there is not money for the uh
▶ 0:21:26institutions to have then there's not going to be able to be student athletes and that's why this is not enough we have to do much more and uh with that I want to uh call on congresswoman Robin Kelly to talk further about this larger problem that we are facing and I yield to uh Robin Kelly thank you chair Bill
▶ 0:21:56rockus and ranking member chowski and thanks all the witnesses for their participation one thing I hope we can all agree on is that college athletes deserve a system that protects their well-being and interest however while the rapid evolution of college athletes benefiting from their name in image and likeness rights may feel chaotic to the NCAA the conferences and the universities it has provided enormous benefits to college athletes by contrast universities are now navigating a truly unpredictable environment
▶ 0:22:26when it comes to funding for vital academic and research programs I am deeply concerned about the potential impact of proposed cuts to funding for the NIH that's one of the real crisis that this committee should be focused on last month the Trump Administration issued an executive order that would drastically lower the agency's funding for major research institutions across the country the policy currently blocked by a federal court would limit NIH research funding for indirect costs to 15%
▶ 0:22:57Which is far below what most universities receive and what they need to support their programs across the entire country including historically black colleges Min minority serving institutions as well as Hispanic serving institutions small universities and large division one schools the misconception that NH funds only benefit top chair universities overlooks the critical support these funds provide to a wide range of institutions in both Republican
▶ 0:23:28and Democratic districts for example HBCU msis and hsis receive hundreds of millions of dollars in 2024 to support vital medical research these funds are essential for maintaining research buildings and Labs covering administrative costs purchasing supplies and equipment and paying support staff NIH grants a Lifeline for many universities ensuring that research and education can thrive in institutions of all sizes and backgrounds the reduction
▶ 0:23:58in NIH funding is a financial earthquake and would directly affect College athletes as well research in sports medicine head injury prevention and athletic performance relies on federal funding much of which comes from the NIH if this funding is reduced or eliminated it will only create more challenges for college athletes and hinder the development of critical programs that protect their health and safety of course the impact extends far beyond athletic injuries ni funding of
▶ 0:24:28clinical trials and other medical research is vital in ensuring that all populations are represented in our nation's bio medical research for medical breakthroughs to occur and be truly effective they must include diverse participants reflecting a range of racial ethnic and gender identities therefore the need for inclusive research is not only a matter of fairness but of Public Health we simply cannot afford to have the well-being of our students whether in the classroom in a research lab or on the field be
▶ 0:24:58compromised by unnecessary funding cuts by the Trump Administration we must continue to support our universities including their research initiatives to ensure that they remain centers of excellence for all students I have an article from The Washington Post that I'd ask unanimous consent to enter into the record tired hiring freezes fewer grads funding uncertainty hits colleges I urge my colleagues to remain mindful of the larger funding issues that could jeopardize the future of both Education
▶ 0:25:28and Research in this country thank you and I yell back to ranking member chikowski I yeld back okay thank you very much uh and I look forward to working on some of these healthc care issues in the healthcare subcommittee and the full committee as well now I recognize uh uh chairman Guthrie for five minutes for his opening statement thank you Mr chair thanks for yielding and I appreciate it it's nice sitting next to my loyal Gamecock here and and he's proud to have his team represented here at this
▶ 0:25:59uh hearing today and I really appreciate you being here and and bringing uh an opportunity to be here I know it can be a long trip and can sometimes be intimidating sitting at the witness stand and it means a lot that you're here to represent your sport your sports and because today College athletics is a multi-billion dollar industry filled by the dedication of talent and dedication and talent of student athletes uh so some of you here today know how hard you work to get where you are for decades student athletes were prohibited from earning money from their own
▶ 0:26:29name image and likeness even as Sports brought significant Revenue to universities conferences in the NCAA that change in 2021 as the NCAA undergoing mounting pressure from state laws lawsuits and Supreme Court ruling lifted its restrictions as a result student athletes could finally profit from their own name image and likeness and rightfully so this was a long overdue step finally allowing student athletes the opportunity to benefit financially from their talent hard work and public
▶ 0:26:59personas but the rapid roll out of nil has introduced new complexities and challenges the absence of a uniform National framework has allowed a patchwork of state laws and institutional policies to grow creating disparities and confusion among student athletes and universities alike so far 33 states in the District of Columbia passed nil laws often times focusing on creating a competitive Advantage for their states and state universities instead of prioritizing good policy
▶ 0:27:29as this committee subcommittee knows well a patchwork of state laws lead to uncertainty inconsistency and confusion one of the more concerning developments is the rise of what we have now the pay forplay system thirdparty groups have blurred and in some cases fully wiped away the lines between legitimate nil opportunities and outright recruiting inducements without clear rules or transparent practices some student athletes are being misled by bad Act and are pressured into signing
▶ 0:27:59unfair contracts that may not serve their best interests adding to this transformation the preliminary NCAA settlement could permanently alter the financial model of College athletics it finalized a $2.8 billion deal and back damages that would be distributed to current and former student athletes while institutions beginning in the next school year will be allowed to share Revenue directly with student athletes a move that will fundamentally change the the way college sports operate
▶ 0:28:30while the NCAA settlement could bring much needed structure and stability to the current landscape it may not be sufficient to address the opportunities and challenges posed by nil as we examine this issue our goal is to consider the implications of the NCAA settlement assess the current state of Nal policies and explore legislative solutions that serve student athletes educational institutions and conferences they compete in like many of you my family and I have cherished memories
▶ 0:29:01of cheering our favorite teams on campus coill Toppers uh watching it we watch Young athletes grow into leaders both on and off the field I know my colleagues agree with me that we must preserve the spirit and virtue of college Collegiate Athletics and ensure non-revenue generating programs are protected I am grateful that our Witnesses are willing to be here today I know you volunteered to be here today to help us better understand the opportunity and the challenges that nil presents
▶ 0:29:31I look forward to an informative discussion on how our committee can help shape a sustainable and transparent nil system I appreciate you all being here and I'll just say I talked with my friend um end of last year the way you guys were playing at the end of the year if y'all had gotten in the playoffs y'all might have g a long way you really put that team together in a in an impressive way and and uh those of us who are from other SEC schools uh fans and um it's it's always good to have every every body successful so and my good friend here so I will yield
▶ 0:30:01back thank you very much the the chairman yields back and now I recognize the ranking member of the for committee Mr palom for his five minutes thank you Mr chairman last Congress at two hearings on College athletics we heard widespread agreement from witnesses that finally allowing College athletes to profit from their name image and likeness is a good thing and represents a long overdue change in college sports but today if we want to focus on the real crisis impacting our colleges and universities
▶ 0:30:32we should be focusing on the financial disaster that they're facing at the hand of President Trump and his complicit Republican Congress Trump has cut funding from the National Institutes of Health to our colleges and University and froze their ability to access current grant funding and apply for future funding colleges and universities are now scrambling to figure out how they're going to proceed with their research programs and the cuts threaten their ability to conduct critical clinical trials for cancer heart disease Children's Health and a lot more
▶ 0:31:02and this is a major crisis yet Republicans are ignoring it and would rather talk about college sports and talk about misplaced priorities I'd like to yield two minutes now to each of uh two of our representative Democratic Representatives first two minutes to trayon well I thank the ranking member for yielding uh as a former D1 college volleyball player the topic of today's hearing hits home but I want to begin by echoing the ranking members concerns about the biggest threats facing colleges and universities
▶ 0:31:33today after all I wasn't just an athlete at Georgetown I was a student I was the first in my family to graduate from college and I saw the transformative impact of higher ed and I'm deeply troubled that the actions by the Trump Administration will jeopardize higher education and strip future generations of the opportunity we as athletes were afforded as this committee has heard in previous hearings athletes must be centered in any debates that will affect the future of college sports since I came to Congress
▶ 0:32:03my work in this area has been Guided by that simple principle putting athletes first however I'm concerned that the majority will put forward legislation that will roll back progress and restrict athletes limiting their financial opportunity denying them health and safety benefits and failing to close the rampant tan title n loopholes robbing thousands of women across the country from athletic opportunities instead I implore my Republican colleagues to work with me on the legislative proposals I've put forward
▶ 0:32:34when I wrote the fair play for women act I did so with the knowledge that schools were systematically taking advantage of Title 9 loopholes that deprive women athletes of roster spots when I introduced the college athletic economic freedom act to establish a federal right for athletes to pursue nil opportunities I had in mind countless stories of athletes unable to fly their parents and to watch them play or going to to bed hungry all because they couldn't make money off their own name and their schedules were too demanding to get a second job
▶ 0:33:05as this committee and our colleagues in the Senate look to pass Federal standards on nil Revenue sharing or athletes employment rights we must meet this moment and prioritize the athletes as opposed to enshrining the power structures that have limited their opportunities for decades otherwise we risk jeopardizing the tremendous gains in recent years with one-sided proposals that provide much less than our nation's athletes deserve thank you ranking member I yield back thank you and I yield now to
▶ 0:33:35the biggest champion for the University of Michigan Miss Dingle go Blue um thank you ranking member palone before I dive in I want to Echo the ranking members earlier comments National Institute of Health funding is vital I've heard from countless researchers in my district who are terrified about what this means for the future of biomedical research in the United States this action by the Trump Administration threatens to undo the progress our nation's Premier Research universities have made
▶ 0:34:05and will stunt future scientific breakthroughs I'm hopeful my colleagues will join us uh to fight for colleges and universities to receive adequate funding from NIH to support their vital research missions but with today's hearings on Nal I want to turn to college sports college sports are the lifeblood of so many communities across the country country as someone who represents a significant college athlet athletic population at schools big and small
▶ 0:34:36I'm committed to crafting Federal legislation that ensures all college athletes are heard protected and prioritized I'm lucky to have both the University of Michigan and Eastern Michigan University two very different schools we've got to protect for their phenomenal College athletic programs and their uh expertise I want to thank the chair for holding this hearing with everything happening in college sports since the last time we convened on this topic I think it's important to start these conversations
▶ 0:35:06early this Congress member schakowski the other my colleague uh Miss Tran and other members of this committee on federal legislation that both protects and empowers college athletes this isn't just about the top athletes on the top 40 football and basketball teams we need to get this right for more than 500,000 th College athletes Nationwide and with that I yield back gentle lady yields back and uh now I'm going to introduce
▶ 0:35:37our Witnesses I really appreciate y'all being here uh I know that it's could be intimidating and and sometimes you give your views in public and become a little contro uh controversial and uh you know you're here representing yourselves more than your University but you know I get a lot lot of opinions from uh athletes and coaches but they don't want to come and testify uh so I I I just give you so much credit
▶ 0:36:07for doing this so hopefully we'll learn we need to hear from you we need to rather than us talking we need to hear from you so we get a good bill uh we need a good bill and we have to work in a bipar and fashion to get a good bill so uh without further Ado I want introduce the witnesses uh miss Emily Cole All-American track athlete Duke University class 2024 thank you for being here we appreciate you
▶ 0:36:37so much uh Mr Justin fanelli uh he's a former College athlete Clemson University so you're representing the ACC and vice president of the college football players welcome Mr Anthony Eggo a football abalene Christian University class of 2024 thanks for being here Anthony uh and then we have Mr Josh Whitman
▶ 0:37:07who's the athletic director at the University of Illinois GOI and we've got a university we've got an Illinois member Congress here our ranking member so she'll be happy about that and then we want to introduce I'm going to yield to uh to representative Fry on this introduction but but uh but a great coach an outstanding individual uh and comes from a a great family uh so I I really appreciate
▶ 0:37:38you being here sir representing your yourself but you also representing to a certain extent the SEC so thank you very much I'm going to yield uh to uh representative fry to introduce Our Guest thank you Mr chairman I'm H honored to introduce the head football coach of the South County game Shane Beamer good to see you sir uh since taking over as head coach of the University of South Carolina in December of 2020 coach Beamer has led the program to Historic success securing the most
▶ 0:38:08wins through four seasons of any coach in the Carolina football history this past season coach Beamer was uh was most his most successful yet guiding the Gamecock to nine wins including a win over Clemson University I'm sorry sir uh and earning the SEC Coach of the Year honors from both the Associated Press and the USA you know had to do this right uh as the son of uh legendary Coach Frank Beamer Shane has been immersed in college athletics his entire life which I think is really important uh to guide us in this discussion
▶ 0:38:38today uh bringing a deep understanding of the game and the evolving landscape of college sports this fall he would open up the 2025 season against Virginia Tech his Alma Moder um and uh and the program that his father built uh where I fully expect that he will put on full display the SEC dominance uh in this non-conference matchup coach Beamer is uniquely positioned to navigate the challenges of nil uh and the everchanging world of College athletics ensuring that his players are prepared for Success both on and off
▶ 0:39:08the field and I will say because uh all coaches seem to be players coaches uh coach Beamer has has made it a Hallmark of his uh coaching career uh to be really focused on the players and so I think that vantage point is really important today I want to thank him for his time today uh and look forward to his testimony and with that Mr chairman I yield back thank you gentlemen yields back now we'll recognize uh Miss Cole you recognize for five minutes uh for your testimony again thank you for being
▶ 0:39:39here perfect thank you so much I'm honored to be here chairman Guthrie ranking member palone chairman bakas ranking member schakowski and distinguished members of the subcommittee on Commerce manufacturing and trade thank you for the opportunity to testify before you today on the important topic of how name image and likeness nil is reshaping College athletics and happy marra some of you might know me as the Duke Runner who went viral for documenting my week-long journey
▶ 0:40:09getting a knot out of my hair after running in the rain while this moment may have been light-hearted it highlights the immense reach of College athletics reach that was once largely limited to sports like men's football and basketball but has now extended to female and non-revenue sports thanks largely to the power of social media when I arrived at Duke in 2019 I was eager to pursue both my academic and athletic goals but just as my journey was beginning the world came to a standstill during my freshman
▶ 0:40:40year the pandemic hit after spending months at home unsure if we would have a cross country season or even return to campus I decided to take a gap semester to pursue a two-year-long project that fall I began writing my first book The Players plate an unorthodox guide to Sports Nutrition which was inspired by my experience falling into a two-day coma at 17 years old due to overhydration and a lack of sodium conveniently its publication
▶ 0:41:10aligned with my new with the new nil laws officially making me the first NCAA athlete to write and profit from a book using my nil at the same time my athletic career was taking off I qualified for the NCAA championships for the first time earned All-American honors and qualified to compete in the US track and field championships where I had the opportunity to race against my Idols these experiences allowed me to build a personal brand rooted in my passions
▶ 0:41:41and positioned me at the Forefront of how Olympic and female athletes could benefit from the new nil policies while much of the nil conversation centered around football and basketball my journey demonstrated how athletes in sports without large TV advertising contracts who had long been overlooked in these discussions could also leverage their brand in impactful ways today I have over 700,000 followers across platforms and I strive to use my position to inspire young athletes to
▶ 0:42:11fuel their bodies well chase their dreams and build the confidence they need to pursue their goals in sport education and life while I initially negotiated all my brand deals on my own I quickly realized this was not sustainable amid my academic and Sport responsibilities that's when I connected with an agency who already had experience with college athletes and I have worked with them ever since I am incredibly grateful for the many ways they have helped me navigate this evolving industry with their support
▶ 0:42:41I have secured multiple five figure deals with Brands such as theab body Dick Sporting Goods Marriott Hotels Gatorade and H&R Block ensuring that future athletes are protected in these Partnerships is essential to guaranteeing that they have the same positive experience that I did I was also fortunate to be a part of the inaugural NCAA and meta nil Empower program which provides education and resources to female athletes on how to build a brand and maximize
▶ 0:43:11their nil opportunities since then I have continued to serve as a mentor for the program helping ensure the next generation of female athletes is equipped with the knowledge and support they need to confidently navigate this new era the value of nil is undeniable and its impact on College athletics has only begun to be understood thoughtful implementation is key to ensuring that all athletes are protected have equal access to Opportunities and continue to receive the education
▶ 0:43:42that will serve them long after their playing careers it is essential to establish uniform rules for all student athletes as opposed to the current Patchwork of state laws at the same time we must protect Olympic and non-revenue sports from unintended consequences that could threaten their future while nil has created incredible opportunities classifying College athletes as employees is not the right path forward doing so could put non-revenue Sports women's sports and smaller Universities
▶ 0:44:12at risk due to constraints instead we must find solutions that allow athletes to benefit from their nil while preserving the integrity and accessibility of College athletics furthermore the minimum number of sports required for division one status must remain unchanged reducing this requirement would lead to widespread Cuts in non-revenue sports eliminating countless scholarships and stripping athletes like myself of the opportunity to pursue a college education
▶ 0:44:42through their sport in May 2024 I graduated from duke with a degree in computer science and a minor in economics since then I have continued my brand Partnerships while also taking on a part-time role as an assoc associate at Aventure Capital firm where I combin my expertise in brand building Health Tech and women's sports to drive Innovation and investment in these spaces I will forever be grateful for all that the new nil laws have made possible for me and I am excited to see how they
▶ 0:45:13continue to evolve with the help of Congress thank you again for allowing me to share my story with you all today thank you very much now I recognize Mr fanell for your five minutes of testimony thank you chairman bill Ras ranking member schakowski and members of the subcommittee on Commerce manufacturing and trade I appreciate the opportunity to testify here today on behalf of the college football players Association or cfbp my name is Justin fenelli and I the institution's vice president I
▶ 0:45:43joined the cfpa in the fall of 2021 as its first alumni member and I've spent the past four years working to build an independent voluntary nonpartisan member-driven Players Association that brings together past present and future college football players from all levels of play I played college football at Clemson University from 2014 to 2018 I was a two-year starter First Team all ACC Center two-time college football playoff national champion and recipient of Clemson's Top Male scholar athlete award additionally
▶ 0:46:13I completed my masters of Business Administration in 2018 in the middle of my final season and never lost to South Carolina we are of course going to talk about many important topics today nil the house settlement of which I am a class member Revenue sharing the possibility of athlete employment collectives collective bargaining the transfer portal and much much more as a former athlete who competed at the highest level athletically and academically who and who has spent the past four years speaking with current college football players and
▶ 0:46:43helping to educate them on these very topics I am prepared to answer all questions you may have about these important issues in general at the cfpa our position is that the problems of college football are not so large that they cannot be solved by those within the industry namely administrators coaches and players collectively through Players associations a collectively bargained model for College athletics would be protected from legal challenges and create the sustainable solution needed by all within the industry most importantly collective bargaining
▶ 0:47:13and enforcement of a collective bargaining agreement by the cfpa would allow us to solve the festering health and safety problems which continue to plague the sport of college football I'm going to focus on two such issues for the remainder of my testimony and I hope the subcommittee will give these important issues the weight they deserve in the question and answer portion of our hearing issues of compensation and player free agency are important but I would submit that they are not more important than the health and safety and Welfare of college athletes the NCAA was created over a
▶ 0:47:43hundred years ago with the primary focus of protecting the health safety and Welfare of college football players after a season in which over 30 college football players died playing the game such a problem among others in the the health and safety realm still exists today despite the NFL only experiencing one player death this Century roughly two NCAA football players have died per year this Century all but one of these deaths occurred in offseason practices research shows
▶ 0:48:14how simple practice reforms would end such deaths in the future the NCA has largely ignored this issue and where it has put in place safety guidelines it has abdicated the enforcement of those same guidelines as such only a truly independent Players Association could bring about real enforcement to make players safer in practice another area I hope we can focus on today is the need for independent medical care for college football players Nationwide almost every College athlete at almost every institution knows somebody or
▶ 0:48:44has experienced themselves inadequate Medical Care many athletes have been pushed to return to play before their body or mind has fully healed by compromised medical providers within their athletic departments a 2019 report by the national athletic trainers Association indicated that 36% of athletic trainers reported that coaches influenced the hiring and firing process for sports medicine staff in their athletic department this is done so a coach can secure a medical staff which will yield yield to their decisions regarding Medical
▶ 0:49:14Care this often means rushing guys back to play or downplaying the severity of injuries to players we saw a tangible example of this recently in the court case of our adviser Dr Scott Lynch a Pennsylvania jury awarded Dr Lynch $5 million after finding that he had been fired as head team doctor for Penn State football in retaliation for complaining about head football coach James Franklin interfering with medical treatment and return to play decisions to this day the NCAA and Big 10 have remained silent on the jur verdict jury
▶ 0:49:44verdict and damage against damages against their member institution Penn State you do not often hear these stories as players do not want to risk their playing time their scholarships their pro career or their future coaching careers by speaking out against institutions for the vast majority of college athletes these are the truly pressing issues that are affect our ability to compete and shape the quality of Our Lives after competition has ended given that the NCAA seems uninterested
▶ 0:50:14in policing its member institutions it is necessary for new organizations to step into the void negotiate collectively bargained rules and then enforce those rules for coaches and athletic directors who want to do the right thing we want to work with you to empower and protect your athletes and negotiate a more Equitable and sustainable future for College athletics you thank you just in time appreciate it very much uh Mr egbo you're recognized for five minutes welcome
▶ 0:50:45morning chair chairman ranking member and distinguished subcommittee members my name is Anthony Eggo Jr a former football student athlete at abing University I came to the front doors of ACU's football facility on my own accord as a 57 145lb defensive back walk on hopeful half a decade later my life is changed still short but that hope eventually turned
▶ 0:51:15into a full- rde scholarship becoming a two-year starter team captain FCS defensive scholar of the year two degrees including my NBA multiple job offers and a robust Network portfolio during my time as a student athlete I had the opportunity to immerse myself in student athlete advocacy serving as an officer of vice president president of my institution student athlete advisory committee eventually serving as a division representative for the Western Athletic Conference all which all of which culminated in me being voted
▶ 0:51:45by my peers as the vice chair of the NCAA division 1 national student athlete advisory committee my story is one of opportunity the kind that defines College athletics for hundred of thousands of student athletes like me I know this hearing is about nil so I'd like to briefly share how I've benefited from my name image and likeness I've had multiple nil agreements with businesses in and around my community one of my favorites was actually a deal with the local bakery who made the egg bow sandwich
▶ 0:52:15it was a sandwich named after me and yes it had egg in it it was marketed throughout my senior year and in all my games my biggest deal though was with First Financial Bank I became their National brand ambassador appearing in commercials photo shoots and even appearing in stakeholder meetings the professional development and compensation I earned from those deals embodies everything nil is supposed to be about nil is a beautiful tool but unfortunately the reality right now is that nil is the wild west with more than
▶ 0:52:4530 State nil laws and litigation different states and schools within those states are operating on different fields to put it simply everyone is not playing by the same rule book as the vice chair of division one sack I've had the opportunity to talk to a wide range of student athletes from different division one schools across country if I could sum up two main priorities I heard over and over again in my conversations it would be this first student athletes want uniform nil rules and Clarity
▶ 0:53:15without a clear and consistent set of rules a lot of student athletes are offending for themselves I've heard of student athletes getting taken advantage of due to large gray areas from the lack of clear and enforceable rules uniform rules and Clarity are needed to ensure that nil fulfills its intended purposes and it's not harmful to the ones who was created benefit secondly student athletes want to remain student athletes not employees employment has the serious potential to evaporate opportunity
▶ 0:53:46and access to college sports outside of the top 5% of programs my conversations I have not talked to a student athlete who is anti- getting paid but they overwhelmingly say they do not want to be o employees of their schools I'm not here to testify because I was an All-American Big Time SEC football player I'm here because I'm the opposite I'm here before you today to represent guys like me the women who cons compete at schools like mine
▶ 0:54:16those who play in non-revenue generating Sports those who compete at historically black colleges and universities those who play Olympic sports and those who are at places that are offering Athletics at a deficit to the university this is the majority this is really what most division one sports programs are made up of I'm hopeful that we can work together to ensure CL Spirits are fair and continue to open the door to opportunities for countless young people like me I'm hopeful and actively working
▶ 0:54:46on the ways that we can enhance the student athlete voice and decision-making influence inside the structure that we are familiar with I'm hopeful that opportunities continue to flourish for the student athletes of the future thank you again for the opportunity to testify incredibly appreciative of your commitment to shaping policies that will positively impact the next generation of student athletes and I look forward to the future with optimism well let me just say this uh very well
▶ 0:55:17done and we really appreciate your contribution and I'd like to meet with you maybe uh you know some other time so we can expand on on on these issues uh so we really appreciate your input thank you all right next we have the uh athle director uh from the University of Illinois you're recognized for five minutes sir good morning chairman Bill rockus ranking member chowski other distinguished members of the committee thank you very much for the opportunity
▶ 0:55:47to be with you today my name is Josh whitmann I recently began my 10th year as the Director of Athletics at my alma mater the University of Illinois which is a founding member of both the Big 10 conference and the NCAA at Illinois I'm responsible for all facets of an Athletics program that supports nearly 500 student athletes competing in 21 Varsity Sports as an undergraduate business student at Illinois I was an academic All-American football player and played Four Seasons in the NFL after attending
▶ 0:56:18law school I clerked on the United States court of appeals and worked briefly here as an attorney in Washington DC before returning to Ill I spent almost six years as the Athletics director at two division 3 institutions for the last 20 years I've dedicated my career to working at the intersection of school and Sport for thousands of student athletes Sports open doors to a life-changing experience in education I'm a proud product of this system and I'm driven to
▶ 0:56:48continue making these same experiences available to today's student athletes Today college sports is experiencing a period of int intense change that is unlike anything in its history efforts underway to reform and modernize College athletics are in many ways overdue as the NCAA has not always moved with needed urgency nonetheless progress made in the last 20 years is indisputable division one schools now administer the student athlete opportunity fund
▶ 0:57:18which provides millions of dollars in direct support to student athletes and their families in addition schools can now Grant nearly annually to student athletes as incentives for academic progress and graduation and in 2021 NCAA rules changed to allow student athletes to monetize use of their own name image and likeness with hundreds of millions of dollars now flowing through the system and into the hands of our student athletes for almost a decade
▶ 0:57:48autonomy for institutions have offered additional protections for student athletes protections that recently became mandated across all of division one schools cannot reduce or cancel scholarships based on injury or performance and institutions must fund Athletics related medical care for at least two years following conclusion of a student athletes collegiate career but the biggest changes are yet to come in April we are hoping for final judicial approval of what would be a historic settlement
▶ 0:58:19three class action lawsuits commonly referred to as the house settlement under its terms schools will have the the option to distribute more than $2 million annually to student athletes resulting in tens of billions of dollars flowing directly to student athletes over the next decade the challenge we face today is the environment in which these changes are occurring highlighted by increasingly active state legislators and outside entities advancing their own agendas
▶ 0:58:49we now have an expanding Patchwork of state laws that are frequently being adopted to create competitive advantage for their Hometown institutions at the same time the efforts to recast student athletes as institutional employees would be catastrophic for the vast majority of NC of the ncaa's membership likely resulting in Lost opportunities for thousands of student athletes to preserve the American Collegiate sports model that has benefited millions of students families
▶ 0:59:20and communities for Generations we need help from Congress to pass comprehensive bipartisan legislation one that codifies various benefits and protections for student athletes two that establishes a national nil and revenue sharing framework largely in line with what is contemplated by the house settlement three that preempts state laws that have increasingly become weaponized to provide competitive advantages to institutions
▶ 0:59:50four that provides a limited antitrust Safe Harbor that will allow us needed flexibility to create a reasonable and enforcable Regulatory framework governing such things that are as basic as eligibility rules in five it clarifies that the relationship between student athletes and their institutions is not that of an employer and an employee when needed in the past Congress has helped Advance the interests of the college athletics Enterprise an institution that is uniquely
▶ 1:00:20and proudly American we again need your help to provide us the tools needed to modernize our ecosystem while at the same time protecting our student athletes in the pillars that are Central to our model I'm eager to continue working with you to achieve these Noble objectives thank you look forward to answering your questions thank you very much excellent testimony I appreciate it very much and uh now we'll recognize coach Beamer congratulations on a great season
▶ 1:00:51coach and thanks for being here appreciate it you five minutes appreciate you saying uh good morning my name is Shane Beamer and I am the head football coach at the University of South Carolina it's a privilege and absolute honor to be here with you this morning to speak to you about the future of college sports I'm going into my 26th year in coaching and outside of my family developing college football student athletes has been my life's
▶ 1:01:21work as Mr Fry alluded to my father was the head football coach at Virginia Virginia Tech for 29 years I myself played High School football and baseball and went on to play football at the Collegiate level competing for a football national championship alongside my father the experiences that I've had as both a student athlete and a coach have fundamentally shaped me into the man that I am today we are at a critical Crossroads in
▶ 1:01:51college athletics and quite simply we need your help the system is long overdue change the current situation is unsustainable a national bipartisan federal law will provide equal opportunity for all student athletes to benefit from nil and create a uniform standard to ensure we're all playing by the same rules I believe we can all agree that the college student athlete experience is worth preserving a college education
▶ 1:02:22is invaluable especially given the reality that less than 2% % of college student athletes advance to professional sports careers a federal law codifying the settlement will maintain an education-based model for college sports while ensuring the opportunity for student athletes to earn a degree and the tools necessary to be successful in life after Sports Action by this Congress will also provide much-needed stability essential
▶ 1:02:52to college sports and expand current benefits enjoyed by many student athletes free tuition room and board educational grants academic support and tutoring medical and mental health support nutritional support life skills development Superior coaching and training and extended medical coverage if you don't act college sports will be destroyed by never ending litigation and conflicting state
▶ 1:03:22laws and designating designating student athletes as employees is not the right path because an employment model will drastically reduce the number of sports a school is able to offer in contrast to federal law will guarantee the future of Olympic sports that help develop future Olympians for our country in some college sports is at an impass and we need your help the stakes are high and the future of our nation student athletes will be decided in the near
▶ 1:03:52future thank you for your time and your consideration of a topic that is personally so important to me and hundreds of thousands of student athletes thank you very much coach I appreciate it very much I think we're going to get some consensus this year I really do uh and uh I know that time is of the essence so I appreciate that very much I'll recognize myself for uh for five minutes of questioning uh coach Beamer the transfer
▶ 1:04:23portal has drastically affected College a Athletics especially football as you know of course in your experience how has the transfer portal impacted your team from a planning and competitive standpoint but also your student athletes ability to get a robust education and how do you see the new Revenue sharing model changing the current transfer portal Dynamics
▶ 1:04:54thank you we've uh we've certainly benefited from the transfer portal I won't sit here today and say that we haven't now have we lost players in the portal that we did not want to lose absolutely uh but we've benefited from the portal uh without a doubt so it's been a benefit for us in so many ways there's areas of the portal that certainly can be improved I don't necessarily like what it uh maybe teaches young men and women at this stage of
▶ 1:05:24their lives and don't like some of the impacts that the transfer portal has on their academic progress frankly so many uh male and female student athletes when they transfer to another College they lose academic credits credits potentially going from school to school which will impact their ability to graduate and ultimately this is about education and since I've been the head football coach since spring of 2021 80
▶ 1:05:54young men that have graduated from from our football program since I became the head coach in December of 20 from the spring semester on so it's still about education there's so many great things about the transfer portal but not if it affects their opportunity to graduate uh and get an education and in regards to the new Revenue sharing model I think it's a a fantastic thing because one it will provide opportunities for all student athletes as well it will uh level the playing field if you will in a lot of ways and it will allow
▶ 1:06:24all student athletes to capitalize on their name image and likeness through Revenue sharing and and having a piece of uh uh what they deserve because of what they bring to universities thank you very much I appreciate it uh M Cole you are a prime example of how an athlet in non-revenue generating sport can successfully uh take advantage of n opportunities when the rules Chang in 2021
▶ 1:06:55what challenges did you approach when you navigated the nil landscape and I know if you can elaborate a little bit because I think you you covered it uh to a certain extent in your testimony yes absolutely thank you so much chairman vas so whenever I like first started having to navigate the new world I the timing as I mentioned landed really well with my book having just published and so I did a lot of the initial
▶ 1:07:25negoti iations on my own and I would you know kind of have my parents look over contracts and make sure that there weren't any terms in there that I didn't want to have happen um but after my platforms grew for over the next year um I ended up working with this agency and they really helped me navigate the space because it was I mean everyone that I interacted with whether they were at a huge corporation or with universities a lot of times they were asking me questions about the nil space because it was
▶ 1:07:55also so new and everyone was just trying to figure it out as we went so I think that was probably the biggest challenge was just that it was so ill defined that we were all kind of trying to figure it out as we went you said that an agency you contacted an agency was that a collective no so I I have an agent that represents me in all of my nil deals and I got connected to them and they already had experience working with other college athletes so I
▶ 1:08:25had a conversation with them and like really felt that I could trust them and then had a lot of conversations with the athletes they had represented in the past um and felt very comfortable working with them to represent me in in all of the negotiations with companies for my Nal deals thank you very much appreciate it uh Mr Whitman I know I don't have a lot of time but I want to ask this question Mr Whitman the last thing we want is for non-revenue generating Sports to be affected by the ever evolving
▶ 1:08:56n landscape how is the University of Illinois anticipating the changes uh like roster limits and revenue sh sharing to ensure these programs are protected so we want to protect the uh the Olympic sports the gymnastics the wrestling uh what have please thank you chairman uh at Illinois we have no plans to eliminate any of our Varsity Sport programs as I mentioned we sponsor 21 Sports
▶ 1:09:26roughly 500 student athletes in fact we intend to invest more heavily into the experience of our student athletes every one of our Sports will see increased scholarship opportunities it's one of the byproducts of the new house settlement is the chance to provide additional scholarships above and beyond what NCAA rules currently permit we intend to take full advantage of that chance and in each of the 21 sports that we sponsor we also intend to see more widespread use of nil throughout program we have student athletes
▶ 1:09:57and more Sports uh receiving more nil opportunities in the new paradigm than they do Under the current uh nil regime it's important at the University of Illinois that we continue to advance the interest of all of our sport programs with very proud history across the board with our student athletes uh last uh Olympics we were really proud to see six former Ali competing on the Olympic stage brought home two medals and and certainly that's a tradition that's unique to American College athletics
▶ 1:10:27and one that we want to continue to Champion in champion arbana thank you very much I appreciate it and now I yield uh uh to the the ranking member of the subcommittee michowski fellow eleno uh not me but the but the ad uh my chief of staff is from Illinois as well but anyway I'll yield back I'll yield uh the time to uh to the ranking member you recognized thank you I wanted to ask a question of
▶ 1:10:57Mr uh Falcon Elli is that kind of right yeah yeah okay of the way I said it um and uh very proud to be an Alum of the University of uh of Illinois as well um I I wanted to ask you um we're we're talking about the um what the what sports needs and how we can make it safer and better but I wanted
▶ 1:11:28to follow up on what I asked in the beginning and uh congresswoman Kelly mentioned as well the fact that there are Cuts in the amount of money that is going to universities and I'm wondering if you have thought about that and how that will impact the what we're thinking today making sure that there's me correct I'm sorry I apologize for interrupting
▶ 1:11:59I can't yeah um so I know my Clemson would be looking at a pretty large hit Clemson is a pretty renowned uh research University so uh they had $25 million in funding in 2024 from NIH so that would be a pretty impactful hit to their wallet at the same time that they are dealing with uh the outcomes of the house settlement and even for little old Clemson which has $150 million a year in athletics Revenue uh they're trying to reconcile a lot right now and for schools
▶ 1:12:29without the Good Fortune to have that sizable athetics budget uh we believe in for all levels of play that collective bargaining is the answer for them to find the solution that's going to best fit their fiscal realities the house settlement clearly lays out that any collective bargaining agreement negotiated with the athletes can ignore the rules set forth by the settlement so to any institutions out there that are concerned with all the NIH Cuts as well as the impacts of the house settlement we ask you to negotiate with your athletes and work out
▶ 1:12:59the situation that best fits you are you concerned though that there's going to be enough money to really have robust student athletes um if money is really taken off of the um universities oh absolutely and potentially the universities could look into using athletic revenues to help compensate for some of these losses in research funding and that's something
▶ 1:13:29you'd be able to negotiate through collective bargaining uh athletes understand and often take part in Majors that are doing this research um it would be important to them to be able to continue to do so and what I'm sure will love to see that on the negotiating table what's the next one what is the uh what do you think the most important thing that is important important for uh student athletes in terms of Reform
▶ 1:14:00yeah as I said in my testimony it's something near and dear to me is health and safety uh athletes are often afraid to speak out on the issue because they are at they're beholden to the will of their coaches their University and can risk their playing time their Pro careers their scholarships their medical care um their potential future in the sport if they want to go on to coach your most likely Avenue to do so is at the institution you played at and so
▶ 1:14:30in these issues where trainers are pushing players back to play too soon or being dishonest about the severity of your injury you have no one to turn to to advocate for you to help push the team doctor to get you the M MRI that you need to diagnose your injury um players are without representation and this is why we so strongly believe in the deed for independent players players associations where players can have a rep who is not subject to the extreme pressures of College
▶ 1:15:00athletics who is there solely for their best best interest that can represent them and enforce the rules that are negotiated in a CBA and hold institutions accountable well I think it is very very important are are you present on campus in your work uh we're presentent at institutions around the country and are actively doing on the ground organizing okay thank you very much and I Y back General Lee yelds back now recognize
▶ 1:15:31the chairman of the full committee Mr Guthrie and I appreciate you making this a priority well thank you we need to make it a priority because we AB a lot of work to do and I appreciate it um I guess getting to to my colleague's previous question said we uh Cuts ni and overhead going to universities and I think you quoted a number going coming from Clemson I think y'all prepared for this meeting B meeting Instead at nivl but will that hurt Athletics I think that if we're sending money to
▶ 1:16:01NIH in the overhead is going to universities and somehow getting the Athletics if that's what the nature of that question was then we're absolutely should be taking a look at this you know Harvard has $50 billion endowment get 70% facilities and uh Administration and some of the grants I mean that that it's we should want grants to go to saving Childhood Cancer childhood all these other things is moving forward and hopefully some of the overheads not going I hope you didn't intend that to say this going to
▶ 1:16:31athletes and sports because it absolutely shouldn't be so Mr bamer the qu the answer to the question just before coach um players being put into the precarious positions when they're injured do do you or do you know of any of your colleagues that have ever that I know you love your players have you ever looked at a play I think you probably sometimes try to prevent players from going into the to the field do you know of any instance where player knowingly a coach knowingly puts a player in a bad position uh first of all thank you for your comments
▶ 1:17:02earlier as well and before my dad was the head football coach at Virginia Tech he was a Murray State racer so you said go Hill Toppers and go Racers we love the racers too right back at you um no sir uh I do not I can't speak for other programs that I haven't been a part of but I can say as the head football coach at the University of South Carolina uh I truly love and care for the players that I coach uh to the point where I haven't let guys go back and play when they have been cleared
▶ 1:17:32by a trainer in some instances uh I've never once directed our trainer to put a player out there before he's ready to play uh when the trainers say he's cleared and ready uh we put him back out there and again I can't speak for other schools but not to my knowledge well thanks so uh I being fans of all all conferences you know Kentucky has ACC and SEC schools so and and others as we just mentioned in the great traditions of college football how do you how do we coach how do we find a balance between preserving what we know college football
▶ 1:18:02to be but also allowing our athletes to have the opportunity to earn money with their name image and likeness absolutely I think everyone in here can agree that Sports bring both sides together and unites both sides as well and I believe that we're all passionate about that as well and certainly every player on our team would tell you that I'm an advocate for them being able to maximize and capitalize on every opportunity they have as student
▶ 1:18:32athletes at the University of South Carolina we're in the capital city of South Carolina where we are the only show in town in the city of Columbia so we have a great following that presents so many opportunities for all of our student athletes not just football but uh women's basketball with Don Staley and on and on and on so there's fantastic opportunities for our student athletes to be able to capitalize on their name image and likeness but at the same time education has still got to be at the Forefront
▶ 1:19:02without a doubt where all of our student athletes leave the University of South Carolina with a degree I mentioned in my opening statement the number of uh student athletes that go on to play pro sports and and that's uh critical for us going forward I'll use the example of Lenor sers he's our starting quarterback he will be a Heisman Trophy camp candidate next season he will have an opportunity to play in the NFL he is currently compensated very
▶ 1:19:33well from a name image and likeness standpoint but on his own he's already reached out to companies in the city of Columbia about doing a summer internship with them I'm but know it's to me but here's a young man that understands that football is not going to last forever and wants to do everything in his power to take advantage of the educational experience in Columbia also okay thank you thanks coach so Mr Eggo cousin went to abene Christian so um so what are your thoughts I know now it's going to be Revenue shared schools are going to help create the collective
▶ 1:20:03we're probably going to have to have some exemption if they're not going to be employees to say that because obviously if you're getting paid from the gate that that is so what's your view of the employee relationship with the University versus being a student at the University yeah thank you for that question um I think it's uh it's a question that's really um at the heart of a lot of student athlet Minds right now um you know being at an institution in an FCS football institution like my my own
▶ 1:20:34um how do I say this it's it's hard to to Fathom how that would look at an institution like ours speaking specifically to the coach player relationship and the employer employee relationship um those that play ball know that inherently a coach is a role model they're they're a mentor they're somebody that invest um that's not inherently what a employer is employer is is more focused on performance a coach inherently is somebody that you look up
▶ 1:21:04to somebody that can pour to you somebody that can help you become the best 35y old version of yourself and so at the core of it that's what sports is also doing it's molding young men and women to be Future Leaders to um be the best fathers husbands wives um Future Leaders in this country and I think that's in principle what is has a opportunity to be shaken is that Foundation um with an employer employee relationship besides that it's just not
▶ 1:21:34sustainable from a from a university standpoint and I've done a lot of work um as far as engaging in conversation about this specifically I've had a multitude of conversations with my president um in different University Administration on hey what would this look like for institutions like ours and is it just not sustainable besides the principle my time I'm going over my time so I appreciate that and I will y back I appreciate your answer I'll y back thank you very much the gentleman yields back and we recognize uh my friend from the great state of
▶ 1:22:05Florida uh fellow Floridian but we didn't go to the same school sorry you didn't go to Florida Kathy uh Kathy C please you're recognized well thank you Mr chairman um there's nothing like college sports there it's beloved in America it builds cohesion among the community and alumni and students and great pride in your institution you you admire the skill of all the student athletes and then the care and concern of the coaches
▶ 1:22:35and support staff but it's also big business I think right now college sports generates um over $18 billion dollar all told but it wasn't until that 2021 uh US Supreme Court case where um they granted student athletes the rights to their own name image and likeness um so this is still new and it uh the courts universities athletes and Congress were really trying to figure out how to navigate
▶ 1:23:05the landscape um so this hearing comes as we await another uh Court decision on the multi-billion dollar settlement between the NCAA the power five conferences and the student athletes and that settlement uh is going to resolve multiple lawsuits and better set the rules of the game going for forward and uh chair bar lakis I know that you care and you you've been talking to to me and other members about trying to bring some um some guard rails and I'm interested in working with you on
▶ 1:23:35that but I just do not think we can ignore the bigger picture right now what is happening in higher education with the illegal shutdown of federal funds of Grant monies that flow to students and Educators uh the wrench thrown into uh research search at higher uh highered institutions by Elon Musk at the direction of the president I fear for the Fallout for all students uh at and at the University
▶ 1:24:06of Florida and at the University of South Florida and FSU and at UCF research funding and then the slashing of student aid um Student Financial Aid I think this um we're going to be in a contra quandra here and I just couldn't let this moment pass without speaking up about this um nil is very important but there is a bigger picture here and it goes right to the heart of the economic security of all
▶ 1:24:36students and all of our institutions of Higher Learning um that said um Miss Cole I think I am so impressed with uh your pathway in life you were a student at one of the nation's top research universities and yes they're crying out about the NIH and and scientific uh funding um quandry but let's put this in context you can you discuss your research um experience and that of you and
▶ 1:25:06your classmates U that you were able to have at the collegate level and what that has done for your professional growth yes absolutely thank you so much for the question congresswoman I honestly I did do some research with the more um lower level education communities in North Carolina helping to provide more culturally relevant curriculum within computer science so I know how important
▶ 1:25:36it is I've witnessed um how important it is but I am I am prepared here to speak on the future of nil and College athletics so okay then let me ask you more about that but but let me say the folks in the Research Triangle in North Carolina and at all the research institutions the colleges large and small are crying out for uh for help and fortunately the courts have weighed in on these illegal shutdowns of federal funding and and we brace ourselves for
▶ 1:26:06for the Republican budget that is going to come and and really take a hatchet to student a financial aid and pal grants uh but back on on this topic I'm very concerned with Title 9 uh and what what nil is doing to build an equities we've worked so hard over the years to ensure there is equity between uh female and male um athletes what you said that you really see this as an opportunity for
▶ 1:26:36students to uh when it comes to uh the the non-revenue sports small colleges Olympic sports but what's the solution when it comes to parity for between men and women I mean obviously parity between men's and women's sports is parent Paramount um and seeing the exponential growth that has happened especially in the past year I mean having the national women's basketball game have more viewership than the men's and then finally achieving uh gender parity
▶ 1:27:07in the Olympics I think it's extremely important but um I'm not able to speak on the actual implementation of the laws of how that would happen so that's up to us Mr chairman to ensure that that uh nil doesn't warp all of the hard work that we've made to to build opportunities for for men and women alike in sports so I'll you'll back thank you very much thank you so very much and now we recognize the vice chairman of the full committee uh and uh you're
▶ 1:27:37uniquely qualified to to ask these questions uh being from Boise State thank you very much Mr amazing appreciate the time Mr Whitman has on yeah I appreciate the time Mr women has on it's boy State Bronco colors we glad to see that but also Florida colors if I got that right so and probably Illinois is in there somewhere I'm guessing yeah okay question for Mr Eggo um as mentioned I'm uh uh boy State University Alam they're in my in my
▶ 1:28:07district as well as University of Idaho Idaho State University but uh they in in the football and basketball arena been very competitive but uh they are not of the same size and scope of the large schools and so I I'd like to get your take on this the under the house case the revenue sharing cap is up to $2.5 million well that's more than the entire budget for for boisey state or or University of Idaho or Idaho state or
▶ 1:28:37I am assuming I Believe Christian University and so just in terms of scope how is this how's this going to work is this going to be can this be fairly applied uh can the smaller schools maintain their competitiveness with the larger schools under this Revenue share cap system if I could uh get this answer right I'll probably get a raise for my ad so
▶ 1:29:07um but I think um I think the first thing is is having clear rules I think the first step is leveling the playing field as far as what is permissible what is not what is the standard um everybody being on the same page so that schools like schools you mentioned in our school can sit down and say okay this is the standard across the board and this is what we can kind of build and strategize for how we can compete in this new age but I think with the gray areas that are implemented right now it's
▶ 1:29:38very hard to start that strategic process thank you Mr Eggo and Mr Beamer I'd like to go to you if you have a comment on that I would I would ask for your comment on that same question but I'd also like to follow up I'm going to give you a two-part here and let you run realizing that the objective of nil is to rec recognize and reward some of the student athletes for their contributions do you see unintended consequences and if
▶ 1:30:09so what bothers you the most about possible unintended consequences of what we're trying to do thank you for the question um I think nil as it was initially implemented in well 2021 the way it was uh meant to be I think is very good I think in a lot of ways what name image and likeness has turned into in so many situations is is uh pay for play and that's very much
▶ 1:30:39because of the fact that it's uh not as regulated in my mind as it should be there's an issue of uh agents in the nil world that that's another issue in regards to uh how it's regulated and is everything on the up and up that's an unintended consequence that I think has come certainly from uh niil without a doubt thank you for that I'd like to go to Mr Whitman I just got about a little over a minute left but
▶ 1:31:09i' like to talk with you and get your feedback on uh Federal preemptive standards I've heard from from the Idaho schools that uh the concerns over enforcement burdens when it comes to the patchwork of some of the state and in DC nil laws and the need for federal preemption without a federal preemptive standards I could see a situation arising where state law conflicts with the terms of the settlement which is still pending approval but how would an institution have to adjust its
▶ 1:31:40strategy if this was the case thank you for the question I think you're thinking about exactly right there there is that possibility where States will pass legislation that conflicts with the terms of the settlement in an effort to create competitive advantage and again that's what we've started to see with more frequency across the country is a race for states to find ways to give their Hometown schools an edge we've seen that in States like Missouri
▶ 1:32:10and Arkansas where they now allow nil payments to high school athletes who have signed letters of intent to compete at instate institutions we've seen it uh at states where they have offered state tax breaks for for a student athlete nil income we've seen it in certain states where they've provided caps on how much money agents can make from student athletes which then disincentivizes the best Agents from working in those States and ultimately what we are here to discuss
▶ 1:32:41is the role that Congress can play in trying to create that Level Playing Field and and avoid uh putting schools in situations where they have to choose between complying with uh a federal court order and ultimately with a state law and and we understand that uh in this environment that conflict can arise and and ultimately only one body has the the power and the authority to solve that for us and and and that's Congress great thank you Mr chairman I do have some follow-up questions I'll do that in writing
▶ 1:33:11thank you for the time my y back much appreciate it very good uh Mr soer you're recognized for five minutes thank you Mr chairman coming from Florida College football is about as popular as sunshine and low taxes right uh at the risk of uh alienating you a little bit Mr chairman I'm going to start out with an FSU story so so but you you recognize that Florida is the the free state is that correct absolutely so when I was in the state senate
▶ 1:33:41uh FSU was heading towards a a college championship and uh you know a shocking story had happened Jus Winston who was on his way to become a Heisman Trophy winner and Lead his team uh to the championship was uh accused and arrested of a of a small theft and people thought how could this possibly be happening when you look further into it you see this huge gap that happened back in the day between some of these star athletes versus the schools and the boosters and
▶ 1:34:11even a lot of the students and uh that is one thing that name image likeness has help balance out a little bit we don't see some of these student athletes living in poverty while they're helping entertain millions of people of course that is not uniform throughout and and we know that I'm proud to represent Central Florida uh go Knights uh space you uh we we're going to work on the football program a little more Mr chairman much like what UFO we're we're all working on
▶ 1:34:41that stuff um but we see big programs getting bigger right now and smaller programs struggling uh and that is a concern on more popular sports like football men's and women's basketball are surging in National popularity and in resources uh but other lesser known sports are suffering and we need to recognize that we're also home to EA Sports uh which every college football player in the nation uh signed up and uh got a got a compensation
▶ 1:35:12for um being able to lend their likeness so that's something that we're we're really proud of in our area but as was mentioned we need rules of the road we've had many hearings but no bill passed into law just yet and so we we have work to do financial literacy making sure that our student athletes have representation safeguarding uh all NCAA Sports and potentially an independent Players Association Mr falcinelli uh where do you think we need to go next on
▶ 1:35:42it is a player vote it is is it an NCAA vote do we need a law on this what where do you hope to go with this next yeah what the future we see for College athletics and for college football is a a world in which we're not relyant Upon A Court ruling or legislation to really set what is going to happen next but a world in which the athletes themselves are empowered to negotiate to shape their own Futures uh we firmly believe that that can be done through collective bargaining and whether they are employees or not we believe it is collective bargaining
▶ 1:36:12that what is what matters if athletes were made employees tomorrow they would still face many of the same issues they are facing now and many more uh and it's until they are organized and represented by independent players associ ations will they be able to actually enact the health and safety regulations they need or engage in the further Revenue sharing and getting uh good deals on Revenue sharing I'd like to point out the EA deal for the NCA video game is one of the only group licensing deals in sports to ever be signed where the athletes had no
▶ 1:36:42Revenue share on the royalties from it and we just given a $600 fee for one time for their appearance in the game or every year they reup but their name image and likeness is already guaranteed to continue to be used whether they whether they year up reup or not for the rest of their eligibility and that game has gone on to probably cross over $700 million in Revenue this year it was the top selling Sports video game of all time and athletes have not been able to share in any of that Revenue share well we certainly believe in collective
▶ 1:37:12bargaining I also want to turn to NIH briefly we've been talking about nil what the National Institute of Health student health is Paramount we've seen uh in Florida the Chairman's own University created Gatorade because it was it's super hot to practice in Florida we actually make Gatorade in the district Mr chairman I'm sure you're happy about that but we've seen student athletes uh pass away after conditioning including unfortunately uh at our home University at UCF back in 2008 uh a lot of progress has been made
▶ 1:37:43since then both there and in many other areas and one of the NIH grants that UCF has is uh looking at Digestive and kidney research uh one of the biggest issues we see is dehydration and then even if it doesn't happen at the time of a student athlete that dehydration can affect them going forward as they get older Mr Falcon Elli how important is it for us to continue to look at hydration for student athletes and have these NIH grants that are so important oh it's absolutely important as
▶ 1:38:13Miss Cole testified to today there can be tramatic effects with stuff that surrounds that and as a former football player hydration brain damage thousands of subconcussive blows every day or you know every year for five years straight the research being done into health and safety into issues that we're still trying to understand like CTE is incredibly important and these are the things that we as athletes are going to carry forward to for the rest of our Liv so whether or not we have the time to enroll in a stem major and help be part
▶ 1:38:43of doing this research we're going to be feeling the impacts of its loss for a long time as after as many of us can attest to who are former athletes after your career is done your injuries are are still there you still wake up with pains your knees your back your joints your shoulders uh that stays with you for life so continuing to do important medical research is something that impacts all athletes and we'll be fighting this Trump Administration freeze and lawful restrictions to make sure we can continue to prioritize athlete health and a yield back thank you thank you very much speaking of Gatorade
▶ 1:39:14uh Dr Kate you invented Gatorade in the late 60s at the University of Florida and my mother Evelyn bill oracus was a t for Dr K so I'm sorry I I yeah I just thought that that had to be said all right uh we have uh representative harburger from the great state of Tennessee a Tennessee VA and she represents she knows I'm going to say this she represents the hometown of my favorite
▶ 1:39:44alltime coach Steve Spurrier yeah so you're you're recognized for five minutes he's a traitor just so you know anyway um thank you Mr chairman and ranking member thank you to the witnesses for being here today uh you know I got a lot of worries about this nil and uh I have two grandsons coming up they love football basketball the whole nine yards I worry about the number of times they can go through the portal um I worry about the agents and the collectives is there a
▶ 1:40:14standardization do they need to have some type of accreditation and I worry about no limit on outside money but um I guess my first question we're going to talk to Mr Eggo because you're a wildcat and you know I went to high school I was a wildcat once a wildcat always Wildcat yeah just so you know in your opinion how many times can a student athlete transfer without expecting shortfalls to their educational attainment would it be once
▶ 1:40:44twice five times eight times in opinion yeah I I don't know if I have that answer actually I do know that I don't have that answer um but I do think that student athletes you know every every student athlet is different at the stage that they they enter into the portal some are are grad students that have earned their degree already and are looking for a new opportunity and others are 18 19 year old kids that are you know for whatever case enter in the portal so I just do think that there's different situations and circumstances
▶ 1:41:15but I don't think it's a I don't I don't know the answer to that I know we're trying to figure that out um I guess my question my followup to you is does transferring during the semester affect the student athletes academic success I mean what that without question in my opinion um I don't think that um it's hard to see that a mid-semester transfer is very disruptive to the educational principles that coach Beamer mentioned before like at the end of the day um
▶ 1:41:45education is at the Forefront and at the foundation of what we're trying to do so um protecting that is important I agree uh this goes to coach Beamer um if other schools follow the dynamic approach to nil that schools in the SEC have where do you think college football will be in five years if there's a uh National Standard in regards to the legislation but also with Revenue sharing coming in with the optimism of the settlement uh next month to
▶ 1:42:15me it will level the playing field for the U for programs across the country where we're all um playing by the same rules if we have the legislation and enforce enforcement to that it up uh Mr Whitman this will go to you and Coach Beamer um should University Revenue sharing include performance-based bonuses like say in Mr bamber's case you've got a quarterback at those 3,000 yards and you be Clemson
▶ 1:42:46should he get a bonus you start Mr Whitman then we'll go back to an interesting question I I think it's important to remember under the terms of the settlement the payments to our student athletes will come in the form of nil licenses and so the idea being in the performance bonus context that the better a student athlete performs and the more valuable their nil license becomes for the use by the institution or by the Athletics program uh and so we certainly are contemplating
▶ 1:43:16A system that would permit performance bonuses I think a different question is how those are ultimately accounted for in terms of the cap structure that's being developed um but ultimately we we think performance bonuses have a place whether institutions ultimately choose to use them or not is a is a different question I think one of the the intentions of this process is to allow each school a lot of autonomy to determine for itself how best to structure its contracts and its relationships with its student athletes to make their institution as appealing
▶ 1:43:46as possible to potential student athletes great which I would agree with Mr Whitman in fact that's a convers ation that I literally just had yesterday morning with Don Staley our women's basketball coach at South Carolina in regards to bonuses and yes ma'am if a player for us plays his tail off against Clemson and allows us to win yes absolutely sorry young man I knew he was going to say that he got the first dig in yeah um yeah exactly all right this goes
▶ 1:44:17to coach Beamer and uh Mr Whitman um how should a student athletes fair market value be generated I know you're speechless it it it's a really important question and and certainly we are champions of our student athletes nil rights it's important that we look for ways to separate true market-based arms length transactions that support our student athletes in their legitimate nil interest
▶ 1:44:47from the synthetic artificial competitive based nil opportunities that have been created ated over the last handful of years and so we certainly don't have an interest in in micromanaging those opportunities for our student athletes in fact we want to continue to try and help facilitate and create those in the ways that are permitted under the most recent changes to NCAA rules uh but it's important that we we do try and create some system to monitor that to create some level of transparency our student athletes want that transparency those working within our
▶ 1:45:18system want that transparency and ultimately we also know that uh this isn't going to be a perfect system at the outset uh and we'll continue to evaluate it improve upon it um but we feel confident that here at the at the beginning as we develop a clearing house with a partner like deoe very reputable firm uh that will be in a strong position to make those assessments and I would agree the fair market value uh range of compensation there's no cap on that so I want to be clear that we're all for
▶ 1:45:48our student athletes being able to make as much as they possibly can legitimate nil outside income but it'll what we need is transparency and a clearing house like we're saying that will give us that uh those the teeth in that okay very good and we want to take into consideration that uh some of the players that uh you know such as the offensive lineman we have a senator I mean we have a well maybe a future Senator but a senat right here
▶ 1:46:19uh that they also be compensated as well fairly uh even though they don't get the recognition they just yeah really I love the offensive line just FYI they spell relief that's okay all right now uh representative Tory Han well thank you Mr chairman and thank you for our Witnesses today especially our players um the state of College athletics while imperfect it's better today than it was four years ago uh now it may not be better for the people who have historically benefited from the guise of
▶ 1:46:49amateurism but it's certainly better for athletes and those are the folks who have always created the value in this industry but while I celebrate the progress I remain concerned about the inequities that persist in college athletics and with respect to nil I worry that University's plan to finally share Revenue directly with athletes could again short Change women at a time when women's sports are seeing a massive surge in popularity Mr Whitman
▶ 1:47:19are you aware of the tenative agreement in the house V NCAA lawsuit that will require the NCAA to pay out nearly $2.8 billion dollar in Damages to current and former athletes dating back to 2016 with 75% going to football players 15% for men's basketball players 5% for women basketball players and 5% for all other athletes I am aware yes and I figured um then you and
▶ 1:47:50great I'm I wouldn't expect any other answer you must also be familiar with the filing in that case by Barbara Osborne an independent title 9 specialist with extensive experience auditing Collegiate institutions uh who studied the house settlement terms if the lopsided terms of the house settlement were used in an institution Miss osbor claimed she would have advised the institution that they were violating Title Nine Mr chairman I ask unanimous consent to enter Miss Osborne's report
▶ 1:48:20on the gender inequities present in the house settlements Revenue model into the record thank you Mr Mr Whitman you Advocate that Congress codify a revenue sharing framework that is and I'm quoting here from your testimony largely in line with what is contemplating by the house settlement your testimony comes admid reports that power five schools like the University of Georgia are already planning to use
▶ 1:48:50those same thresholds in their future Revenue new sharing model scheduled to take effect later this year Mr Whitman can you understand why many current uh and former women athletes like myself are alarmed that NCAA institutions and leaders are adopting a revenue sharing model that only gives women at most 10% thank you for the question congresswoman and this is an issue that has weighed heavily
▶ 1:49:20on our campuses as we have tried to EV evaluate how to apply excuse me an old a 50-year old law to a new set of facts that weren't contemplated when that law was was passed and we have worked very earnestly to consult with a variety of different Council to to gain some clarity on that issue and all that we have learned through those conversations is there seems to be some lack of consensus around exactly how that law will apply to these new
▶ 1:49:50opportunities that we can make available to our student athletes what we know is that we're seeing an explosion in popularity in women's sports we know that people who work in college athletics remain very strong champions of advancement in our women amongst our women's teams but we also see that uh we are faced with some some really challenging balancing of equities in a case like this one if we were to apply Title 9 in the sense that of the traditional
▶ 1:50:21financial aid balancing proportionality we would potentially be diverting money away from the athletes who generate that Revenue many of whom are student athletes of color many of whom come from underprivileged backgrounds on the flip side we understand that if we were to maintain those revenues with the student athletes who generate it we wouldn't be potentially passing as much of it along to our female student athletes and so it it creates a really challenging Dynamic for us to navigate on campus
▶ 1:50:52what we know which is why I asked that question because as you're aware in your role as director Athletics Title 9 requires that if a School awards financial assistance to athletes they must quote provide reasonable opportunities for such awards for members of each sex in proportion to the number of students of each sex participating in in Scholastic or inter Collegiate Athletics end quote surely the model that Georgia and other schools plan to use cannot comply with Title 9
▶ 1:51:22we don't think that's been identified or established we think there's there's a lack of clarity around how Title 9 will apply to these new payments uh we currently comply with Title 9 we're required to comply with Title 9 we have every intentions of continuing to comply a time when women haven't seen their fair market value because they've never had the benefit of promotion or boosting at a time when women's fandom of college sports is surging I would hope that we would not base forward
▶ 1:51:52looking and forward-looking Frameworks for um how we're going to distribute those revenues based on a Model where women were short changed um so I thank you for the extra time Mr chairman and I I yeld back if I could just one final statement to that it is important to note that at the University of Illinois our women student athletes will receive far more benefits in the new paradigm than they have in the previous and and that includes scholarships that includes nil payments that includ includes a
▶ 1:52:22number of different benefits that will now be made available by virtue of the settlement uh and so that's a that's an important note to make thank you thank you Chanel Le's back now I'll recognize Mr alaly uh for your five minutes questioning well thank you Mr chairman and thank you to our Witnesses this hearing is on a topic that is very important and deeply personal to me little known fact I was a student athlete many years ago when I was in college I played on the Caltech football team go beavers when was a Caltech
▶ 1:52:53football team uh and the given the high quality and caliber of student athletes at our witness table you'd probably argue that doesn't count and maybe it doesn't uh but then later in my life uh I I got into video game development and my company did the development of NCAA college football for EA Sports for a couple of years in 1998 and 1999 and I remember vividly having the argument of like why can't we use the student athletes names in the game you know they told us
▶ 1:53:23that we could use your number uh we could use your stats we could make a player that looked vaguely like you but not too much like you you know and I remember vividly saying this is completely stupid because everybody loses right the student athletes lose because they're not allowed to get compensated uh we as game designers lose because we're not allowed to design a game around the athletes as we wanted to uh the players of the game lose because they're not allowed to see the players that they love and recognize and the games that they bought
▶ 1:53:53so uh we have an opportunity here to create a system where everybody wins where student of athletes are allowed to play the game and the sports that they love where colleges are allowed to benefit from having these Sports where millions of fans around the country are allowed to participate in these Sports and root their teams on right so uh I guess my message is let's not mess it up because we need to create a system here where everybody wins and if we create a system where some loses then
▶ 1:54:23we're not doing our jobs right so one of the kind of recurring themes that uh has been in today's testimony has been around this question of whether or not student athletes are employees and I think it's really interesting because it fits into a larger debate that we're having here in Congress about whether or not when someone says look I don't want to be an employee and uh an entity says I don't want to be employer does the federal government have the right to step in and uh you both lose
▶ 1:54:53you know you're going to be employer employer and I think it's particularly compelling that I've heard our student athletes say loud and clear today that they don't want to be treated as employees so miss Cole I know in your testimony you said that classifying athletes as employees is not the right answer can you talk a little bit about why you feel that way yes absolutely thank you so much for your question Congressman I mainly as I touched on in my testimony am just focused on continuing to to promote and
▶ 1:55:24grow the equity with Olympic and women sports as well and I do believe that the employment model could make that difficult uh Mr Whitman you had said in your testimony that uh one of the things that you would like Congress to do is to clarify that the relationship between school and students is not that of employer and employee why do you think that that's not the right model I think it's not the right model on on number of different levels first and foremost from
▶ 1:55:54the perspective of the student athletes I think it creates very real questions around the taxability of some of the benefits that they're already receiving as part of our system I think It ultimately could result in less freedom for them in terms of the mobility to move from one school to the next I think It ultimately could create less protections I think in terms of their their status on the team the opportunity to be cut or fired if they're not performing at a certain level uh and ultimately as we've heard from several Witnesses today the opportunity to
▶ 1:56:24lose uh roster spots across all of College athletics as a result of forcing schools to to support this compensation and importantly they they don't want to be employees I've had the privilege the last 15 years of my career to work every day with student athletes I take a lot of pride in having a great relationship with them of having an understanding of their experience on our campus and and what we can do to improve upon it not once have I had a student athlete come to me and say Mr Whitman I'd really like to be an employee of this
▶ 1:56:54institution I think we are developing a model through the house settlement that allows us to address many of their concerns we're putting us in a position to provide them with additional compensation we're in a position now to offer them more scholarships we're doing things at the University of Illinois like uh providing continuing education after they've broken time with the university if they want to come back and complete their degrees we offer enhanced Medical Care where our student athletes are the beneficiaries of what I would call concierge medical service
▶ 1:57:25they they receive 247 care from independent medical authorities who provide care to our uh student athletes independent of any uh oversight or supervision from coaches or administrators uh and ultimately they want a greater voice and and I think that we're looking for ways to develop that through sack through some of the opportunities that we've given student athletes to provide feedback on our campus whether that's in the form of uh exit surveys into the season interviews
▶ 1:57:56uh in more informal conversations with administrators who are embedded with their programs ultimately our student athletes are the beneficiaries of a very robust system and opportunity that system continues to need tweaking uh but ultimately designating them as employees is not that answer well well thank you everyone for your testimony and I just in conclusion let me reinforce I think that there's a win-win-win here and I'm hoping that Congress can work together with the NCAA and the schools and the athletes to make that happen I
▶ 1:58:26you back I agree thank you gentleman yelds back now we have Miss Clark you recognized uh the great state of New York thank you uh you recognized for your five minutes of questioning thank you and good afternoon chairman bakus ranking member xowski and thank you to our panelists of witnesses for joining us today the ncaa's decision in 2021 to finally allow College athletes to to capitalize on the value of their name image and likeness in the open market was
▶ 1:58:56undoubtedly correct and also long overdue for years the NCAA was content to rake in profits from the multi-billion Dollar business of college sports while hiding behind the inherently flawed and totally totally madeup concept of amateurism as justification for maintaining an unpaid labor force primarily comprised of black and brown ath student athletes now that the college athletes have the ability to pursue their true worth on the
▶ 1:59:26open market as a result of public pressure C Court decisions and state level action which forc the ncaa's hand we expected to believe that college sports is in a crisis and on the verge of collapse simply because the jobs of highly paid coaches and administrators have become slightly more difficult I don't buy it ending the legalized exploitation of an unpaid labor force is an inherent good and one we should not seek to put unnecessary restraints
▶ 1:59:57on if we want to talk about protecting College athletes let's do that ending the legalized oh excuse me let's talk about meeting the long-term Health Care needs of former cath College athletes who suffer Grievious injuries on the field of play Let's talk about guaranteed scholarships for four years let's talk about the quality of Education these young people receive when the sport they participate in requires time commitments T amount to
▶ 2:00:27full-time jobs and requires more travel than almost any other job let's talk about the revenue sharing on the multi-billion dollar contracts that the NCAA and power for conferences earned on the backs of these young people who are overwhelmingly students of color in the revenue generating Sports we could even talk about the role of agents and their bro and their brokers in the new nil landscape or the attempts to artificially cap the amount a student athlete can earn in Revenue sharing and
▶ 2:00:57nil deals but let's not pretend that a Young Person's ability to be compensated for the use of their own name image and likeness is some kind of crisis in need of an urgent congressional action when there are far more pressing issues this committee could take up in fact if we really want to dive into the core issues facing college sports in addition to hearing from today's panelists we need to hear directly from the Power Players involved in the business of college sports
▶ 2:01:27the NCAA the college football playoff and the commissioners of the power for conferences particularly Southeastern Conference the Big 10 conference the college athletes who have sued the NCAA for violating their rights and failing to protect their Health and Welfare the collectives that are helping to funnel money to students and universities the agents who claim to represent the best interest of the college athletes but too often fail to do so and the accountants who think they can
▶ 2:01:57figure out the fair market value of an nil deal despite the fact that corporations large and small are willing to pay ever more money for endorsements from Superstars like former LSU basketball player Angel ree while I appreciate the desire to examine the issues related to College athletics and the well-being of our student athletes the lack of participation from the powers that be and all participants in the diverse and complicated ecosystem
▶ 2:02:28likely in part due to the beginning of March Madness means that we are not ready to address these issues in a very serious way so I look forward to the opportunity to do so in the future having said that Mr chairman I yield back the balance of my time thank you Miss Clark chair recognizes Rin for five minutes please thank you Mr chairman and to the ranking member uh schakowski for holding this hearing uh thanks to the witnesses for your testimony we really appreciate
▶ 2:02:58your time and your Insight this issue is especially important for my home state of Indiana as we have nearly 60 colleges and universities across the state including Kurt signet's Indiana University who your football team in my district in fact in 2014 IU was the first University in the nation to establish a student athlete Bill of Rights which enshrined protections and commitments for ed student athletes and they were also one of the first universities to implement an nil policy Mr
▶ 2:03:28Whitman you're a fellow hoer from La West Lafayette I appreciated your testimony and that of Coach Beamer and Mr egbo your emphasis on the impossible Patchwork of state laws as a member of the uh Indiana general assembly in the state senate uh I was hoping to tackle a data privacy issue for our state I sent the proposed text of legislation to some stakeholders and they promptly replied please do not file this bill we don't want to have to abide by 50 different state laws
▶ 2:03:59and that is exactly what what the states are currently doing with nil I may be the only state legislator in history to kill her own bill but I did at that point because I understood uh the I understood the assignment uh so with that experience I certainly appreciate the need for a National Standard and framework I would like to hear though from director Whitman and Coach Beamer how is the lack of a National Standard impacting competition and recruiting between universities and states with different or no nil laws uh direct director
▶ 2:04:29Whitman if you'd like to go first thank you congresswoman the the lack of clarity and the lack of transparency has become very challenging in in the recruiting space and in in terms of the competitive field at the end of the day we're trying to create national competition with with absence of a national framework and that's a really difficult place for us to be that the idea here is not to figure out who can build the best cars to figure out who can drive the car the best
▶ 2:04:59and and ultimately the the rules that are being passed state by state are are standing in the way of of really determining who puts together the best program who builds the right things culturally from a leadership perspective from a strategy perspective coach Beamer and his colleagues work really hard to to go out and and compete on the most Level Playing Field we can create uh but the result of these state laws is that the state laws are ultimately influencing what that playing field looks like and I don't believe that's an appropriate place for
▶ 2:05:29our state legislators to be coach Beamer yeah I would agree and and also I know Miss Clark had to step out but she and I are on the exact same page and what we're trying to get done she alluded to Rogue agents that aren't certified I completely agree we need to protect our student athletes from these uncertified uh Rogue agents she talked about Healthcare I I agree I think we should expand Healthcare uh after their careers are over as we look at that as well but it's a challenge to do
▶ 2:05:59that because she mentioned the NCAA would is com constantly getting sued uh of anything they try to enforce uh to answer your question it's a challenge we're all extremely competitive whether it's Mr Fry's Gamecocks or your hooers or Mr F fure Boise State Broncos or the Florida state seminal and everyone is trying to find a competitive advantage and no one is here today saying that they're against the portal they're
▶ 2:06:29against nil they're against expanding uh uh uh resources for our players we're all just trying to get a uniform standard that benefits all of us the schools the administrations and the student athletes thank you we have a saying in my office as we were trying to anticipate unintended consequences we say the mouse will find the cheese uh it seems like the states are getting very creative in how to give the their teams a competitive ad advantage through their nil state laws I want to touch just briefly uh on the current
▶ 2:06:59lawsuit and impending settlement could could uh could either of you speak to the lack of Title 9 protection and clarification within the settlement and why Congress might need to weigh in on how the nil dollars are allocated whichever one thinks they can best answer that I'm happy to do that my my understanding is is that the Title Nine question has not been put directly in front of the judge and that she's declined to Aline on that particular issue because it's not mundane to the partic to the the uh conflict
▶ 2:07:29that's being evaluated uh my understanding is when it comes to the distribution of the back payment damages those are decisions that are being led by plaintiff's counsel uh not by the judge not by the defendants certainly uh and so how they've chosen to build that algorithm and and allocate those dollars is is really a decision has been left to to those attorneys thank you and in closing I just would like to take a quote from Mr egg's testimony uh because I think it perfectly encapsulates
▶ 2:08:00what we need to do on this issue of nil he says I'm asking you to help student athletes by creating uniformity and stability in nil protecting us from employment status classification and ensuring consistent rules can be made and enforced I hope we can achieve that through our work in this committee thank you Mr chairman I yield back thank you m m howchin the chair now recognizes representative Dingle for 5 minutes thank you Mr chairman and ranking member schakowski as those of you
▶ 2:08:30uh you know and I'm from Michigan College sports are a big deal I'm committed to ensuring all athletes are treated fairly female athletes are protected and supported and the Integrity of college sports is maintained as we figured this out it's well known that women's sports often do not receive the same support promotion recognition or attention as men's sports programs at schools in the media and elsewhere so we got to address this as we're doing all of this
▶ 2:09:00we have to strengthen Title 9 improve gender equity in nil and ensure collective schools and conferences distribute resources more equitably in April 2024 the ga reported that 93% of Institutions with athletic programs failed to meet Title 9 participation standards and data shows female athletes are short changed over a billion dollars annually in scholarships schools continue to invest more in
▶ 2:09:31promoting men's sports and the success of Revenue programs has enhanced male athletes in iio and recruiting value schools are indicating that they will be giving men's basketball and football players 90% of the new Revenue sharing payments up to $20 million a year for the next decade and publicly saying these payments payments don't count against Title 9 Mr Whitman how can thoughtful ni nil policy
▶ 2:10:01promote women's sports programs and Bridge these disparities in treatment thank you congresswoman Title Nine has been absolutely instrumental in the advancement of college athletics' be hard pressed to find any law that has had bigger impact on the opportunities for students across this country over the last five decades than Title 9 and as I mentioned earlier we're thrilled by the explosion
▶ 2:10:31in interest in in women's sports we've seen a volleyball match that was played in front of 90,000 people at the University of Nebraska we've seen women's basketball played in a football stadium at Iowa we saw a women's basketball national championship game that outdrew the men's counterpart on National tele Vision we've seen the NCAA now for the first time begin to reward women's basketball performance with the adoption of the women's basketball performance fund a hugely important change that was recently
▶ 2:11:02adopted by uh the National Organization we've seen some of these changes happening on our own campus at the University of Illinois we have attendance and revenue records happening in women's basketball volleyball we've made real Investments recently in our soccer program track and field uh ultimately as I mentioned earlier we have an obligation and are complying with Title 9 and we have every intention of continuing to comply with Title 9 as we move forward there do continue to be some questions around how Title 9 will apply to these new payments
▶ 2:11:32it has been a a question that has needed Clarity for some time we continue to seek that Clarity I expect that will reveal itself in in the months and years ahead every person who sits in my chair understands our our federal obligations and and will adapt our our policy and our strategy to be in line with with whatever clarification we ultimately receive thank you we really do have to work on this and I always have Hutch who's trying to help me figure it out um in February 2025
▶ 2:12:02the Trump Administration rescinded guidance that required nil payments in college athletics to be proportionately available to male and female athletes under Title 9 Miss Cole do you think this decision undermines title 9's goal of ensuring equal opportunity for women in sports I am not familiar with um this topic and not um able to speak on the question okay thank you I may ask you to familiar yourself and get you to answer in the for the record
▶ 2:12:33traditionally all sponsorship gate receipts donations and TV Revenue go into one pot that supports all sports without discriminating on the basis of sex of sex this commitment has made the United States a world power in Olympics and a global Powerhouse Mr Whitman I'm coming to you again can can you tell us what an overhaul of this presedent would mean for the athletes I'm sorry Congressman can you clarify what overhaul of which precedent the that all
▶ 2:13:03the sponsorship gate reseats donations and TV Rue go into one pot that supports all sports without discriminating on the basis of sex that's made the Olympics a success I don't see that changing and certainly at the University of Illinois our intent is for our resources to continue to support all of our student athletes and and we do believe under the house settlement we'll be in a position to offer additional benefits to every student athlete in our program whether those benefits take the form of additional
▶ 2:13:34scholarships potential nil payments uh or some of the additional benefits that are now made available by virtue of the house settlement uh Our intention is to continue to invest heavily in the experience of every student athlete who wears the orange and blue and we think the house settlement provides us an even greater tool set to to approach that opportunity thank you the gentlemen gentle ladies time has expired the chair recognizes representative fry for five minutes please thank you Mr chairman I think this has been a great hearing I appreciate the witnesses for
▶ 2:14:04being here for your expertise your professionalism um it it is it is a really important issue I think that touches a lot of uh a lot of uh aspects in our country people like college sports they want to see it succeed um it's great to have two of South Carolina's uh finest higher ins tions present uh from our football programs but there is only one University South Carolina sir go Gamecock and for The Californians in the room USC stands for South Carolina and not Southern California we were an institution
▶ 2:14:34before you were a state uh that being said um that being said um the NCAA I think the prior scheme you had a very restrictive not player Focus scheme uh that that uh you know you went to school you got a a scholarship there wasn't many other benefits that were afforded to you uh maybe not the correct legal protections and of course we have seen that uh go the opposite way right and I think in some ways uh people welcome that uh that that players that are adults that're 18
▶ 2:15:04years old are going and capitalizing on their talent on their nil their name image and likeness uh but there are some real concerns right and we've heard that uh last year I filed the protect the ball act right which was a a shield if you will for institutions uh and the idea was that you wanted to give the breathing room uh between the NCAA the co the colleges the conferences and the players uh to figure out the framework but we have uh as been alluded to I think Miss howon talked about it a patchwork of state laws
▶ 2:15:34you have states that are coach be were talking about competition but you have state legislators that are invested in preserving and enhancing their state institutions and and so there are some dangers on the horizon on where we go from this when states are doing their own thing and I I think the big thing that we've talked about here seems to be a level of preemption that is needed right that you cannot have a patchwork of 50 state laws that you have to have one standard uh the framework may be being provided by Congress but most of that effort being provided
▶ 2:16:05by the institutions themselves The Players uh the families that are affected the the conferences and of course the NCAA that seems to be I think where we need to go right that that this is a collaboration between those who are engaged in the space uh it isn't a mandate a top down heavy mandate uh from Congress uh but but there there are some framework that that is that should be available uh to to allow college sports to thrive that focuses on the players that focuses on the college athlete
▶ 2:16:35experience uh and with that being said coach Beamer um obviously with that backdrop how has nil changed just recruiting in general football but You' I'm sure heard stories from you know Don Staley or whomever how has that how has that changed the recruiting aspect of college College athletics thank you for the question and thanks for all you do for the great state of South Carolina Mr Fry and great to see you again as well as you know this is my third time to Washington DC in the last couple years
▶ 2:17:05on this issue so appreciate everyone uh being here today uh to to listen to us as well it certainly changed things in regards to when you're recruiting a student athlete finding out what's important to them and certainly name image and likeness is a is another aspect of that without a doubt but we're really well situated at the University of South Carolina because of the things that we have to offer Beyond nil as I mentioned we're in the capitol city
▶ 2:17:35and there's so many opportunities for our student athletes at the University of South Carolina and schools across the country should have advantages from a recruiting standpoint because they have great academics which they do we do they have great coaches which in all of our Sports we do uh great development and not necessarily who pays the most and uh that's what's happened in in so many instances as well it's still about the educational experience and on and off the field with everyone
▶ 2:18:06for sure coach do you think that that a federal standard uh I think you testified uh to this earlier but do you think a federal standard would level the playing field um in college athletics yes okay uh and obviously you said that college sports should be more about money it's about the education it's about the experience what guidance or structure would you uh do you believe would help ensure that nil remains a tool for empowerment rather than a distraction obviously with the uh settlement next month with Revenue sharing that's going to
▶ 2:18:36uh help things we'll have a real enforcement arm behind that is the way it's trending right now which would be very beneficial for all coaches all sports and then as Mr Whitman mentioned a clearing house for any outside income Beyond Revenue share which we are all for and our student athletes at South Carolina as you know Asia Wilson a former women's basketball player has a statue outside our basketball arena so there's fantastic opportunities for all of our student athletes with uh with national legislation
▶ 2:19:07coach finally and and I'm I'm go over here just briefly but you know I think collectively we talked about maybe some of the Olympic uh style Sports we've talked about some of the smaller schools uh and how they might be impacted how do you see nil affecting those Olympic type Sports and and can Congress help to protect those types of sports for college athletes very quickly please we're yes sir no I would say this with the terms of the settlement and I'm not a legal expert I defer to someone that is but the way I understand it Mr Fry with the terms of the settlement all of our Olympic sports
▶ 2:19:38there's a unintended consequence there's going to be some roster spots that are cut but all members of the Olympic sports non-revenue sports going forward will be on scholarship so in so many situ so many ways that has bettered their situation thank you Mr Beamer the chair recognizes representative vzy for five minutes thank you Mr chair um first of all I want to say thanks each and every one of you for coming to testify I want to for Mr eggby wanted to uh give a special shout out to him my uncle uh back in the 1960s
▶ 2:20:08before the now defunct Southwest Conference um uh started accepting black athletes he had an opportunity and graduated from abalene Christian University and so I have uh my late Uncle so we have aene Christian uh University uh uh shared uh value there so uh welcome uh Mr Beamer the we are here to talk about nil and I will tell you that I think that one thing that southeast conference is is facing and I talked a little bit of touched on that
▶ 2:20:38earlier with when I mentioned the Southwest Conference and integration I think that the SEC particularly with all of the uh Governors and the wokeness and Dei that they're bringing into these college campuses I think y'all are going to run a lot of the brothers off honestly I I'll be straight up with you y'all need to figure out how you're going to make your campus comfortable for the black athletes that are playing there with all of this rhetoric around some of these topics um Mr Whitman
▶ 2:21:08I wanted to also point out you talked about the grades and I think that you're right on to mention that uh what worries me and everybody knows it it's not anything new that in order for players to stay eligible and in order for players to be able to participate that there are certain degrees that are off limits certain degrees that make it really tough for them to be able to major in if they don't want to be moved down the depth chart and if
▶ 2:21:39they want to be able to stay on the team and so it's great to talk about that that that education is still one of the priorities but everybody knows that that that game has going on for a long time that there were players that had all these credits and the credits absolutely led to nothing or they get a degree uh and something like general education to where it's not really a lot that they can do with it and no one really knows what those degrees are for and so I'm glad that you're talking about the education
▶ 2:22:09but that but that brings me to to my first question I want to talk about and I know that you're not from UCLA but want to just mention this they're going to travel over 22 2,000 miles this season going from the West Coast all the way over to the east coast uh in Stanford Washington uh other schools are going to face uh that those same demanding itineraries uh and this is going to be disruptive to their academics
▶ 2:22:39and so with knowing that you're going to have that increased FAL uh physical and mental uh fatigue that's going to be taking place how is that good for the student athletes I I I I I really don't understand that uh this these increased travel schedules uh I'm just curious how have athletes been able to work around that and how's it impacted them academically thank
▶ 2:23:10you for the question Congressman I we've had the chance now at the University of Illinois to participate in the expanded Big 10 since the beginning of of the fall and so have some firsthand experience watching a number of our teams make those trips the thing that I would remind you is that we continue to try and Champion our student athletes both in their academic and their athletic Pursuits and in the expanded Big 10 footprint just as an example uh for schools that compete at the level that we do we're we're used to traveling
▶ 2:23:40nationally our our student athletes in all of our Sports travel extensively across the country uh to participate in their non-conference competition and so for Illinois we've now replaced some of those non-conference competitions maybe in California or Texas or Florida with now conference competitions and and so the chance for them is not that much different than what it was before uh and we're also able to provide them with robust academic support we have tutors and academic advisers who travel with our student athletes
▶ 2:24:10to help them study when they're when they're and sorry to cut you off but rain remain in time I want to ask Mr fenelli about that too could you touch on that yeah we had a number games and traveling across the country is uh incredibly taxing and especially to the point of I really want to get on the point of your practice schedule far outweighs your academic schedule to where the majority of your time as a college athlete is spent on your point on your sport in your workouts in your team meetings
▶ 2:24:41in your practices traveling for games to where I've had a number of times where you're getting off that bus returning from a game at 7 in the morning and the sun's coming up and you're thinking great on the way to meetings and then back to bed and hopefully I'll be awake for class on Monday um those longdistance games are very tough and oftentimes lead to lack of sleep lead to lack of all these issues that are part of it in that athletes do enjoy the brace athletes are all about the grind on it but it is incredibly difficult in taxing to manage having a final later in the
▶ 2:25:11week when you're getting you're not sleeping uh for part of that week yeah thank you very much thank you Mr chairman appreciate gentleman yields back now recognize uh Mr Gman for five minutes for your questioning thank you Mr chairman thank you all to the panelists for being here and yes I too am a huge fan of women's sports especially the number one lady Longhorns right now um I'll I'll be very brief U Mr Whitman can you just tell us in your
▶ 2:25:41world what's the number one producing Revenue sport football Congressman do any of them other do the any of the others make money men's basketball so just men's football and men's basketball are Revenue producing none of the others are we have two other sports that produce Revenue they don't earn profit and so we we also make money through women's basketball and volleyball as well so they make Revenue I mean you put it perfectly they make Revenue but not profit yes sir so how do you all
▶ 2:26:12divide what goes everywhere else I'm sorry how do you divide what goes everywhere else we generate our resources through football men's basketball women's basketball volleyball and then we redistribute that money out to fund the experience and the opportunities for the remainder of our student athletes so again like what programs do you decide you have or not have based on the revenue that you have coming in ultimately there's strategic decisions left to the discretion of each institution to determine for themselves
▶ 2:26:42what programs we wish to sponsor and at what level of resource were able to provide them so what's what's your let's say um what what's your okay you have football men's basketball what isn't what's do you have a third what's number three uh we have we have an incredibly competitive men's golf program okay so men's golf perfect example what what do those kids get paid nil uh they they do receive nil contracts U they probably don't
▶ 2:27:12at many institutions but at the University of Illinois because of the profile that our golf program enjoys uh they are the beneficiaries of of nil Arrangements so the golfers make money but the program does not correct thank you coach Beamer thank you very much for being here can you take us through a a normal and I know SEC now um so recruit comes in you're you're you go to a home or recruit comes in what's the first topic of
▶ 2:27:42discussion these days uh we start recruiting them really early so so maybe when they're a uh young player in high school it's about the uniforms and things like that and then certainly as they get older and closer to making a decision uh they want to talk about opportunities in our town they want to talk about academics they want to talk about playing time uh we talk about the fan base and the resources and the development that our program
▶ 2:28:12provides and certainly nil is a topic that comes up but is it typically at the Forefront not necessarily Define not necessarily I mean let's say five star four star recruits is that not the number one topic of discussion wouldn't necessarily say it's the number one I think it honestly it really depends on on the young man there have been those type of players that have been in my office that it's one of the first things that comes up and there's other players that have come in my office and it hasn't come up at all now I'm not naive to say that
▶ 2:28:43outside of my office with other people they may be having those conversations but in regards to me that's the uh experience that I have with players and what about for the players in the portal is that players in the portal I'd say the nil conversation is a little bit more prevalent because so many of those young men in the portal they've done something at the other school in a lot of situations as well being from the state of Texas you're familiar with your rival Oklahoma and Spencer rler Spencer rler transferred to the University of South Carolina Spencer had accomplished a lot at the University
▶ 2:29:13of Oklahoma him coming to the University of South Carolina he had proven a lot so certainly in situations like that they're going forward there's nil conversations that are a little bit more prevalent with transfers that have been in college and that's kind of where I'm going right I mean the the whole student body experience in my opinion is to get into Education First we all know the reality of this is with NI with the money in sports now um with the golfers at Illinois getting paid more than the
▶ 2:29:44generates um we have a major problem in this country and we have to fix it and I believe now it's up to us to fix it because there is no equality anymore right it's who gets paid the most and where those players go and if they're unhappy they transfer and they can easily transfer and do they go to another academic institution because of the the programs that they have in education or possibly what they're going to get paid these are 18 19 20 year old kids
▶ 2:30:15that are out for a paycheck rather than an education and I think it's up to change that moving forward thank you all very much for being here today gentleman yields back now recognize Miss Kelly for her five minutes of questioning thank you chair bakus and ranking member schakowski as we continue with today's hearing I look forward to discussing how we can protect College athletes ability to benefit from nil and NIH funding for crucial biomedical research done at our nation's colleges and universities as
▶ 2:30:45I said in my opening remarks indirect costs are the infrastructure that makes research possible they are the oversight buildings utility safety protocols training and Regulatory Compliance that is necessary part of medical research and particularly critical to clinical studies if these costs are not supported institutions Across the Nation like Lor's Children's Hospital which is affiliated with Northwestern University's fineberg school of medicine will lose the ability to continue discovering and delivering
▶ 2:31:15Cutting Edge treatments and cures and therapies will be essentially undermined in fact Lor's children expects that by 2030 will need to subsid subsidize their infrastructure cost by an additional 30 million per year college athletes particularly those in contact sports like football face significant risks when it comes to long-term Health especially concerning head injuries that may not be immediately diagnosed Studies have shown that around 10% of college football
▶ 2:31:45players sustain concussions each season with many going diagnosed and untreated at the time these injur injuries particularly repeated concussions can lead to long-term neurological conditions such as CTE which may not manifest symptoms until later years Mr Whitman welcome given the growing body of research on the long-term effects of brain injuries what steps are athletic directors and universities taking to ensure that college athletes have access
▶ 2:32:16to Comprehensive Health Care including ongoing monit ing for head injuries even after they've left the field our student athletes are the beneficiaries of world class healthc care conci arage Healthcare 247 health care that's managed by independent medical advisors doctors Physicians they are encouraged to receive as many second opinions and expert opinions from any medical facility in the country uh when they present with with
▶ 2:32:46injuries that require that level of uh of attention uh relative to the the head injury question we've invested heavily as an institution into better uh safeguards for our student athletes competing uh in contact Sports particularly in football uh we now outfit every student athlete with custom fitted helmets that are built specifically for their head and only their head uh it's one of many changes that have have come to College athletics here in
▶ 2:33:16the last number of years as technology has improved we've been able to uh outfit our student athletes with uh ever improving equipment that we think can can help prevent that uh those those kinds of long-term injuries we do uh as mentioned earlier provide ongoing health care for our student athletes for a number of years after their Collegiate careers are over uh and again I I think that's now a a protection that's provided not just at the University of Illinois but it's mandated all across division one which is a a tremendous step
▶ 2:33:46in the right direction thank you and that's great to hear Mr fenelli cremson which has an enrollment of 76.5% of white students received over 25 million in 2024 from NIH to do research why is preserving This research important to college athletes especially given the health risk they face on the field yeah and and as you mentioned with your references to CTE there's so much that can go on there that it's something that's incredibly personal to me as an
▶ 2:34:17offensive lineman the average lifespan of an NFL offensive lineman is 55 years old um that's 20 years less than the national average and so while I did not play in the NFL I sure played a lot of snaps so that's something I think about every day and the research into CT is something that will be critically important into my life and to those of many like me and I just want to say I appreciate Mr Whitman and the way he is running his program there and his emphasis on second opinions in independent Medical Care and that is the model that
▶ 2:34:47we as an institution want to see bargain for for all institutions everywhere that is how a a college football program should be run and that that is the kind of medical treatment that all players across the country should be able to have thank you so much and I'm very proud to hear that since part of uh his school is in my district so thank you both and thank you to the witnesses and I yo back General a y's back now I recognize my fellow Florida Gator Miss Lee for her five minutes of
▶ 2:35:17questioning thank you Mr chair chairman uh gogators and thank you to all of our Witnesses for being with us here today uh I'd like to go back to you Mr Whitman for some follow-up questions in your testimony you advocate for Congress to establish a uniform name image likeness and revenue sharing framework in line with the house settlement how do you see the dynamic between the collectives and schools changing if we are to codify the basic provisions
▶ 2:35:48of the settlement thank you congresswoman the question around the relationship between institutions and their respective collectives is is one that I think is best left to those organizations I think there's no question that in the new environment that will be created by the settlement we expect those relationships to evolve and I would imagine they would go one of three different directions in one instance you could see some collectives wind down and cease operations secondly you could see some
▶ 2:36:18collectives that come quote unquote inhouse to the athletic program and begin to operate internally Under the Umbrella of of the athletics department or third you could see some collectives continue to exist separate and apart from the athletic program but repurpose their their focus and and begin to develop a true market-based nil opportunities for student athletes and I'd also like to discuss the application of antitrust laws to Collegiate Sports in the NCAA in your testimony you distinguish
▶ 2:36:48between a blanket exemption and a safe harbor why do you believe that a safe harbor is appropriate and why is that important for Collegiate Sports it's important today to understand that we have leadership across College athletics that recognizes the need for college athletics to evolve and change to modernize the structure that has existed for decades around college sports the challenge that we face is that every time we try and Implement new rules new procedures
▶ 2:37:19we get pulled into court under the opes of the of the antitrust laws and and so we're not looking for Congress to quote unquote fix college sports we're looking for Congress to create a a legally defensible space where we can fix college sports and and right now because of uh the the overarching concerns around antitrust and the need for us to create a national environment that lends itself naturally to some challenges uh in the antitrust space and that's where we would appreciate
▶ 2:37:49some protection so that we could function more openly uh and create that National playing field that we think everybody wants in college athletics Mr Eggo I'd like to go back to you uh as a student athlete uh you bring a very important perspective to the conversation that we are having here today and we are nearing the end of our hearing so I wanted to come back to you and ask this question is there anything that you believe is an important perspective that you have not had the opportunity to share with us today
▶ 2:38:20or haven't been asked about yet today yeah I like to take the time to um just reemphasize some of the things that I have said in my opening statement um you know student athletes we we value this experience greatly like this Collegiate Experience is something that creates opportunities like I mentioned my life has changed from my opportunity to play college sports and it will continue to change because of those connections I have um so I want to reemphasize that um student athletes again when talking
▶ 2:38:50about employment like we want to preserve those opportunities and we we believe that the opportunities that we do have come from being student athletes first so a lot of what we are Desiring and and asking Congress to help with is to protect those opportunities like I said for student athletes like me um that are in these situations at institutions like myself but just want to say thank you again for the opportunity to hear us um because we know that you guys care about these issues and Miss Cole the same question for you is there anything you were hoping to share with us today or want to emphas for our
▶ 2:39:22benefit I really think I just would like to emphasize how grateful I am to have had a positive experience with the new nil regulations and I'm so grateful to all of youall for taking the time to put effort into continue to help athletes have a similar experience to as I had right Mr Whitman coming back to you how are you anticipating what are you doing now to prepare for challenges the settlement is approved and implemented how will that affect the resources and the programs that you currently
▶ 2:39:53provide it will allow us to begin generating additional resources we think through a number of different avenues that allow us to begin uh providing direct compensation to our student athletes in the form of nil licenses allow us to control that environment more to provide greater accountability to our student athletes our student athletes trust us they trust our Athletics program uh they understand that we are actively working in their best interests and uh we look forward to under the settlement being able to lock arms
▶ 2:40:23with them and create a stronger partnership that ultimately enhances their opportunity to be a student athlete at our University thank you Mr chairman I yield back you know the lady yields back and now I recognize Miss shrider for her uh five minutes of questioning thank you thank you Mr chairman and thank you madam ranking member and thank you to all of our Witnesses I've enjoyed listening to your testimony uh I really appreciate this discussion about compensating young athletes for
▶ 2:40:54their performance especially as a mom of a 16-year-old basketball player and a pediatrician who's taken care of a lot of the athletes that play for you uh I also want to make sure that these athletes continue to grow and Thrive and so I just want to really drive home the point that athletes need to have universities to play for the United States is the gold standard in scientific research for a reason it has
▶ 2:41:24always been a bipartisan priority for us in this committee and in the Congress to fund the National Institutes of Health in order to support brilliant scientists and researchers across the country who are doing cutting Ed research who live and work in both Democratic and Republican districts This research benefits the entire world and our nation takes such Pride in their accomplishments I'm a pediatrician as I mentioned it and I've seen firsthand
▶ 2:41:54the kids who I've taken care of uh who have cancer and most children people don't know this most people most children who are being treated for cancer are participating in clinical trials uh that are funded by the National Institutes of Health and that's how they get access to groundbreaking new treatments that can help them do better and give them the best chance for survival and when this Administration takes away NIH funding we're
▶ 2:42:24putting those kids' lives at risk uh in Washington state we are blessed with amazing research institutions University of Washington Washington State University we have Fred Hutchinson uh uh cancer center and we have Seattle Children's Hospital um Fred Hutchinson that researches cancer cures would lose an estimated $125 million annually if the Trump administration's 15% indirect cost caps go into
▶ 2:42:55effect and this phrase indirect cost is so misleading the reality is that indirect funding just means anything other than funding for the scientist salaries the materials and the equipment that are specific for that study so if you have shared equipment like Labs or infusion centers an MRI machine uh refrigerators computers grant writers all of that is considered indirect and so it is really indispensable
▶ 2:43:25for the research that your do um this is not insignificant for some of the research institutions in my state uh we're talking about 50% inir cost so for every dollar that goes specifically to the project another 50 cents goes to all of the support equipment so this isn't uh cutting fast when they go from 50% to 15 um this is kneecapping research and it will shut down our greatest
▶ 2:43:56research institutions and our medical schools and I'm hearing from people in the middle of Trials right now uh scheduled to get their next dose of trial chemotherapy and they can't get it because it's delayed that messes up of course not just their health putting it at risk but it messes up the study because now a dose has been given late and how do you evaluate those results this is already happening um so I just want to emphasize that it is threatening the universities where
▶ 2:44:26you play and you coach uh it makes our brightest young scientists think about not pursuing research even though they could and it makes our Bright Young scientist athletes reconsider whether they want to go into sports medicine research or sports medicine so I have no specific questions for all of you I do have gratitude to all of you and I just want to ask that as we consider these programs to benefit our student athletes uh that we also consider
▶ 2:44:56the well-being of the universities that they play for and restoring that National Institutes of Health funding keeps our universities strong and keeps us all at The Cutting Edge thank you and I yield back thank you recognize now the gentleman from New Jersey Mr Kaine for his five minutes of questioning thank you Mr chairman and thank you to all of our Witnesses for being here today as the landscape of College athletics continues to evolve n has
▶ 2:45:26create new opportunities for student athletes are also raising concerns about fairness Recruitment and the role of higher education in sports as we consider Federal legislation it is critical that we strike the right balance ensuring that athletes can benefit from their name image and likeness preserving the Integrity of College athletics and keeping comp comption fair for all schools including those in New Jersey Mr Whitman thank you for your testimony and one of
▶ 2:45:57my concerns is how to reclassifying students as employees would drastically harm smaller universities where we already have seen many eliminate specific sports teams or their entire sports program in its entirety I know that you are the athletic director of a larger school but what are the consequences of Shifting students to become employed employees are there alternative ways in which we can bring about some of the protection for student athletes without naming them employees
▶ 2:46:27and potentially eliminating their chance to continue playing the sports they love thank you Congressman uh I do have some firsthand experience with this prior to coming to the University of Illinois I was the athletic director at two different division 3 institutions and so have uh an understanding of what it means to be at a at a smaller institution that that competes at a different level of College athletics I do think the the Dartmouth men's basketball case is instructive to the question that you've asked in that case
▶ 2:46:57the regional director of the National Labor Relations Board found the men's basketball team at Dartmouth to be employees based on the fact that Dartmouth exercised control over their schedule and ultimately they compensated them in the form of free apparel shoes and sweatshirts priority scheduling and the opportunity to give their family free tickets the problem with that is that that is the test than every student athlete in America at every division one division two and division three institution is also an employee
▶ 2:47:28because every school provides free sweatshirts free shoes free tickets for their kids to have for their families to attend their games and and that becomes a tremendous problem if schools like University of Wisconsin lacrosse where I began my athletic director career were forced to begin compensating student athletes they don't have the financial res resources to support a program that that is required to do that ultimately they'll have to make decisions that may ultimately uh result in in significant reduction
▶ 2:47:58in opportunities for student athletes and potentially even the closure of full programs and and and that would be catastrophic for the educational mission of College athletics thank you coach Beamer do you feel n opportunities have created challenges in maintaining team chemistry and if so how do you keep players focused on the team it's a uh it's a new challenge that all of us as coaches are navigating for the first time to
▶ 2:48:28me sir it starts with bringing the right kind of people into your program that certainly understand that they can capitalize on their name image and likeness but making sure that's not the sole reason uh that they're at the University of South Carolina uh for sure and uh you know they understand all of our players they they're not but they all have a goal of going to professional football and that's an aspect of professional football as well players getting paid and some guys are going to be making more in
▶ 2:48:58their name image and likeness in college just like the NFL players will be as well when they're paid a salary okay and how can Federal nil legislation create a fair playing field for all student athletes including those at smaller schools or in non-revenue sports certainly just the national uh legislation that we need that would one promote academics and enhance welfare for for all of our U student athletes that allows the conferences in the NCAA
▶ 2:49:29to to regulate without being caught up in in litigation and then certainly something to protect the student athletes as well a national uh uh law that will help with the agents because as as it's been mentioned there's some great ones out there don't get me wrong but in Pro Sports you have to be certified to be an agent so many of our student athletes have agents that help them with nil that aren't really agents and so many young student athletes are being taken advantage of uh by
▶ 2:50:00these thank you are you back thank you very much uh and now I recognize Mr Evans from the great state of Colorado I'm not sure if you represent uh neon d on Coach prime or not but uh but you're recognized for your uh your five minut answer questioning thank you Mr be a great Witness by the way thank you Mr chairman uh and thank you to the ranking member and to the witnesses no they're actually just outside of my district but I am honored
▶ 2:50:30um to be representing the University of Northern Colorado uh where we have student athletes who of course will be directly impacted by the nil reforms that we're discussing here today um and I've had the chance to to hear from this institution uh about some of the needs for Federal Regulation to set those basic rules of the the road for all schools and ensure that we're setting up our student athletes for Success um they're a Big Sky Conference member uh with a very I think they have the highest graduation rate actually um in a very good sports program
▶ 2:51:00and so look forward to working with them to be able to just explore how we can get this critical work done and so my first question with that um with that backstory is to to miss Cole uh again University of Northern Colorado they have that very very crucial role of setting up their student athletes for Success not just in college but for the rest of their lives um but as we've heard you know we have situations where student athletes uh can get in trouble with owing back taxes or being uh taken advantage of or exploited
▶ 2:51:31and so um just want to hear a little bit about your experience in how as a student athlete uh you can navigate the nil landscape um responsibly um and how institutions and conferences can play a role in making sure that students get the appropriate guidance to navigate that situation absolutely thank you so much for your question Congressman Evans I actually spoke on two different panels at the nil Summit which started obviously right after the laws changed um for
▶ 2:52:01Invesco and then Robin Hood to really bring up the importance of awareness around these topics and education for student athletes um especially in such a a new and Ill defined space and I think it's extremely important that we put in um program prrams to help make sure these student athletes are are educated in a way that they can go into these decisions informed to um really set themselves up in the best position to thrive both during and after their careers
▶ 2:52:32thank you and kind of continuing on that same vein of questioning Mr egbo um you sered some time on the student athlete advisory committee can you just talk a little bit about how that exposed you to some of the decision-making processes for your athletic department yes I was uh I was on sack for my institution president um and then represented my conference and then now sit on National sack which I'm on Visual and council with Josh um integrated in every every level of
▶ 2:53:02of governance and decision- making at the national level um 32 reps one from each division conference we sit on every voting standing committee on Council and board of directors and Board of Governors so um just being exposed to that and also trying to you know create more avenues like Josh mentioned earlier to give student athletes more decision-making influence and voice is very important um but we are integrated in it and there's a system in place right now to to have that continue to be built up thank you and then um to
▶ 2:53:32to Mr Whitman you know we've heard today about some of the good work that institutions are doing to make sure that they're taking care of their student athletes but we also understand that there is a need for again just basic rules of the road um legislation for example one thing that I specifically heard from my athletic director at the University of Northern Colorado and it seems to be a concern that you all are facing as well um is last week CBS Sports obtained a draft Bill uh from the capital in Springfield to exempt nil payments from state income tax which is modeled after
▶ 2:54:02some policies uh in other states and so um the question is do you think that that Patchwork where some states are able to exempt those payments from income tax gives a competitive Advantage um and how do you think that affects the the recruiting landscape um with without general rules of the road thank you for the question and yes I absolutely do think it's a competitive advantage and and that's the kind of political maneuvering that we need to try and eliminate through
▶ 2:54:32the the use of federal legislation right now we have this environment that makes it very difficult to compete on a Level Playing Field which is the point of college sports is when coach Beamer goes out on on Saturday afternoon to know that he has the same opportunity for his team to be successful as those teams that he's competing against and right now some of these state laws are are creating uh in inequity uh across our system that that really can only be addressed through through Federal legislation and so with my last 20 seconds
▶ 2:55:03uh just very briefly how do you see such a piece of legislation structured to give the institutions the flexibility they need to be able to do the good work that many of them are doing um but also to provide guidance ultimately I I think it's it's on two fronts one is is preemption making sure that this new piece of legislation preempts State efforts to to address some of the issues that are active in college athletics and then secondly as I discussed with Miss Lee earlier I I think it's important
▶ 2:55:33that we create some limited antitrust Safe Harbor so that we have flexibility to to manage our own house and and we've heard from you and your colleagues that people are interested in seeing College athletics step up and and manage its own Affairs thank you we'd like to do that but we need additional resources on the legal side to to manage thank you yield back gentleman yields back now I recognize the vice chairman of the full committee Dr Joyce for your five minutes of questioning first I want to thank chairman Bill AR rockus for holding this important hearing and for
▶ 2:56:03allowing me to wave on I also want to thank the witnesses for appearing the unique nature of College athletics is something that's firmly embedded in American Sports in our psyche and in our culture millions of Americans have been able to attend college and Excel both on and off the field because of the opportunities that the NCAA and their member institutions offer in the wake of the Alon decision in 2021 and the changes in the nil policy
▶ 2:56:34we recognized that the amateur model that had existed at colleges across the country must evolve in the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania steps have already been taken to ensure that student athletes can navigate the the evolving nil Landscapes responsibly Penn State has been a leader in ensuring that nil opportunities are both beneficial and sustainable by offering robust financial literacy programs and prioritizing student
▶ 2:57:04athlete well-being this year Penn State athletics announced the creation of the Roar Solutions a powerful and dynamic group of resources assembled to deliver the best student athletes endorsements and support in the country this collaboration between the university and the worldclass student athletes at Penn States like NFL player Mike Kiki Sports commentator Adam brenaman and 2025 Super Bowl champion saquan Barkley will help
▶ 2:57:35to tell the unique stories and Propel their their careers forward besides my alma moer of Penn State Pennsylvania hosts 14 other D1 schools these universities range from large univers ities like the University of Pittsburgh and Temple to smaller colleges like Bucknell and St Francis University the experience of being a student athlete not only prepares great opportunity academic opportunities but allows young adults to enter
▶ 2:58:05the world after college in my own Congressional office we have an outstanding example of this Lily Benzel a former St Francis University basketball Superstar and three-point Specialists whom I am proud to have as my director of operations as we consider nil as legislators we must examine this issue and the impact that any action will not only have on big teams like Penn State but also the Ripple
▶ 2:58:35effects that this might have on St Francis University women's basketball team the Shippensburg baseball team the Juniata College volleyball national championship team and the thousands of athletes who compete and go to school every day in Pennsylvania 13 Mr Witman in 2021 Pennsylvania's nil law went into effect and subsequently they have had to amend their law several times largely to respond to other states seeking a competitive advantage in the recruiting of
▶ 2:59:05athletes additionally states are now looking to other laws as we have discussed to do the same regarding tax law what are the dangers to this approach when states are creating and amending tax laws to seek competitive advantages in college sports thank you Congressman I think your question strikes at the the challenge that we confront and the reason we're all here today is is the need to identify a standardized playing field for College athletics
▶ 2:59:36and as states have become increasingly active in passing legislation to benefit their Hometown institutions that's a new phenomenon that's not something we have experienced in college athletics in the past and I believe it's antithetical to the the purpose of college athlets which again is to educate our student athletes but also to provide them a worldclass competitive opportunity on the most fair and even playing field that we can create and the only way at this point in time for us to be able to do that is to get some support from the federal government
▶ 3:00:06uh and ultimately to preempt those State efforts Miss Cole as a student athlete who has to deal with the ever evolving situation in your opinion what are the greatest misconceptions that the public has about n that is a great question and I think the main misconception that I've seen is you know people really only think of like football and collectives whenever this conversation comes up and it's really under like two different buckets there's also the whole legitimate nil side of actually working with
▶ 3:00:36um Brands separately on these different brand deals and so there really are like two different buckets and I think a lot of people get them confused um but a lot of my experience and expertise is totally with in the the more working with um companies to do brand Partnerships which is separate from the collective conversation coach Beamer with the remaining time I wanted to see if there's anything that we haven't discussed today that should be brought to into this conversation regarding nil from your perch
▶ 3:01:07no I think it's been very beneficial for all of us uh without a doubt that we're all pro student athlete but making sure that we understand it's still about the educational experience and it hasn't been mentioned but there's a lot of rules that have come up there's a lot of laws that have been changed and talked about one thing that hasn't changed is student athletes still have to go to school to be eligible to compete in college athletics and just making sure that we don't get too far away from the educational model uh as it stands
▶ 3:01:38right now coach Beamer I'm glad that you put that exclamation point on the question because the educational model the experience is important but to walk away with a Class A educational experience is what student athletes should want to achieve Mr chairman again I thank you for allowing me to wave on and I yield back thank you I thank the gentlemen now we have uh representative Carter for his five minutes of questioning welcome sir thank you Mr chairman and I appreciate
▶ 3:02:08um all you being here I know you're tired and you're ready to go so we'll try to be be uh suin and get to the point um thank you Mr chairman for allowing me to uh wave on as as well you know nil has has as as we all know has has certainly changed sports but it's it's really a great opportunity and I hope we'll recognize the opportunity that it uh that it brings for for student athletes as well as for fans like myself I'm graduate of uh the University of Georgia go
▶ 3:02:38dogs so just want to get that out there uh real quick but nevertheless it is um something that we in the state of Georgia have tried to address and the state has actually um has actually come up with some state laws the governor and the state legislature have already passed executive orders and and bills to make um make the state of Georgia one of the country's most competitive inil participating States and that's one thing that concerns me and I and I I suspect
▶ 3:03:08it concerns all of y'all is that consistency throughout the country because that that is very important then and I think that's the role I hope that's the role anyway that the federal government can play is is making sure we're consistent another thing that I'm concerned about and I would suspect that um Miss Cole you're concerned about this too and and you've mentioned it is um how the the the proceeds are distributed throughout the sports um as a student at University of Georgia in 19 I I will tell you that
▶ 3:03:38um that you know I I thoroughly enjoyed um all the sports that that were offered obviously I'm big football fan but I I'll never forget I got to see uh John mackenro play tennis at University of Georgia when he played um when he went one year at Stanford and what a great experience that was but even the gymnastics all the other sports are so very important coach would you agree with that would you would you elaborate just a little bit on how important it is for us to to make sure we keep those
▶ 3:04:09those I'm not going to refer to them as minority sports but those less popular sports if you will yes sir and your Georgia Bulldogs come to Columbia tonight for basketball so go game Cops they do that in Colombia as well uh no to me it's and I tell people this all the time Mr Carter it's what I love about my job is being in the middle of a college campus where I'm able to be a part of the entire athletic Fabric and support all sports and and go and watch our
▶ 3:04:40men and women compete my wife is here with me today and our three children they love being in a part of a college campus where we're able to go see the different sporting events and I have two young daughters that are teenagers that that uh certainly enjoy going to watch sports and being able to take them and support all of our student athletes not just the football program is something that's very special and important to me what about South Carolina do they have a plan on the on the sharing uh among the sports on the different sports is there or how's that handled yeah I believe it's obviously
▶ 3:05:10in the works and our athletic director Jeremiah denat has done a great job of spear hitting that and and uh commuting communicating to all of us coaches at the University of South Carolina some of his initial plans as we get ready to finalize it Mr Whitman what about at Illinois how do y'all handle that as at South Carolina across the country all of our schools are working to identify what those plans will be how how we'll handle the the new opportunities that are made available to us through the house settlement
▶ 3:05:40but I just reiterate a point coach Beamer made which is uh it's become very popular in today's world to to take shots at College athletics there have been a lot of cynics who have developed around the industry of uh of the college athletics ecosystem and uh we just encourage people to spend a day on our campus to to Really interact with our student athletes we have great Representatives here on the panel today but to understand that the core of College athletics remains as true as it has ever been it's about education it's about
▶ 3:06:11personal growth and development it's about how a program like ours at Illinois can bring people together from all walks of life uh it's just an incredibly important part of of the American tradition and right uh there's nothing that has changed from that as as College athletics has continued to evolve over time Miss Cole let me ask you again um has nil changed the environment of the team sports and the chemistry between teammates and now that money's a factor there
▶ 3:06:41it's a great question I I think we all know that the the majority of of that change is not happening in cross country and track the sports that I did participate in so I didn't witness those types of changes yet but I can see how it would be a factor other sports Mr ragb I mean yeah I mean I think it's different for every team you know different cultures at different teams but I think at the end of the day I said earlier no student athletes anti getting paid so it's it's a matter of you know just another factor of Team culture and chemistry
▶ 3:07:11but it's not a negative factor great I'm glad to hear that I hope That Remains the Same as well again I want to thank all of you for being here look look you know we're all big sports fans especially college football I mean if you live in the south you're you're a big college football fan and and we want to see this we want to we want to get this right we want to help you we don't want to hurt you and but we do want to help you so please know that that we're on your side and we're we really appreciate you coming today and really appreciate your participation
▶ 3:07:42in this Mr chairman I yield back never thought I'd agree with a Georgia Bulldog but I do in the case uh you know we don't want to lose a school spirit that's for sure all right uh I'll you now we'll yield some time to the gentleman from Texas Mr fluger I believe he's a Red Raider right is that right well Mr I know you represent Baylor well I'm actually an Air Force falcon oh Air Force that's right that's right right a student athlete which I don't know what we talked about
▶ 3:08:12service absolutely go ahead I yield to you special special case thank you Mr chairman um I'll get right into it uh the uh and thank y'all for being here five minutes is not enough to ask questions but coach I'll start with you do you think that the conferences have aligned themselves as a result of no federal standard for nil first of all thank you for your service to our country uh as well I believe the conferences are certainly as a whole trying
▶ 3:08:42to align themselves for the betterment of the student athlete experience in college athletics but within that there's individual states within those conferences that are trying to find a competitive advantage to uh better their individual states as we've discussed in here what one thing I'm worried about is just having you know uh East Coast West Coast you know you've got UCLA and Ruckers in the same conference and as a student athlete I mean that's that's a tough especially if you're playing multiple
▶ 3:09:12games that's a very tough thing so lack of federal standard I think is is an issue and then I'll I'll go a step further and get your thoughts on um the threat to the non-revenue generating Sports the threat to um women's sports um you know talk to me about is there is there such a thing as too much market share for one conference uh or another and we seeing a lot of uh a lot of domination and does that then affect uh how the title 9 Sports and how the um non-revenue Olympic
▶ 3:09:42sports uh are able to actually exist yes certainly with the uh upcoming settlement next month and and it would better the situation for the non-revenue sports because they would all be part of a roster cap that they're all on scholarship as well and I'm all for that absolutely as those Sports continue to advance I mean these are uh three fantastic athletes right here and I know two of them ran football but with Emily from uh track
▶ 3:10:13and field as well we want those opportunities to continue for all student athletes and you've seen what the student athlete experience can do for people with these three being here today I know as a as a guy that's going to be 48 at the end of the month I was nervous as heck coming in here today and to see what they've been able to do as young people because of their ath experience as student athletes I have so much respect for and want the continued advancement of all student athletes in all sports um Mr chairman there's a tweet by RG3 says the soul of
▶ 3:10:43college football is dying because of money allowing the Big 10 sec to get four automatic bids into another expanded college football playoff anyways I want to enter this into the record because I think it's important thank you um and love competition love the fact that Mr Eggo I'll go to you uh because I am 90 miles south of you in my hometown of St Angelo so thank you for representing abene Christian here um and talk to us about the pros and cons of being a student athlete coach I love what you said about being a student athlete that's the most important thing I was a student
▶ 3:11:13athlete if you can call it that at Air Force Academy it's more of a you know military school um but uh talk to us about the opportunities that you've been provided because of being a student athlete greatest experience I mean I don't you said there's nothing like it and it's true and I'm an embodiment of that I mean the opportunity that I got to walk on to abin Christian it eventually paid for my undergraduate and graduate um it it allowed me to work with the president of my University as was a president intern my senior year allow me to make the connections I've made
▶ 3:11:43student athlete advisory committee at the national level I mean you can point almost to every good thing that's happened in the last 5 years to some sort of experience as being a student athlete it's the it's the greatest experience that um I think exists in this country folks at ABN Christian would be very proud of you uh they are very proud of you for representing so well today um I'm sorry I don't have time to go to everybody but I'll go to miss Cole because I have three daughters um and um you know wanting them to to have that experience and
▶ 3:12:13um you know what what's in your wave your magic wand and what what's the what needs to be fixed first from your perspective yeah absolutely thank you so much for the question and also for everything you do for the great state of Texas I'm actually from Houston so yeah um I'm very grateful for everything that you do but I actually I think that there should be a big emphasis on giving these female athletes the same platform and voice that the male athletes have been given and
▶ 3:12:43that's something that we've been able to see happen through social media and all of these female athletes being able to prove that they can sell tickets and they can make money and obviously there's still a lot of work to be done but I really believe in the power that social media has had and helping these female athletes have the platform and voice to show that we can do the work and have the potential to drive the same um progress and revenue that men sports do Fantastic Mr chairman I got to thank you for continuing to
▶ 3:13:13lead on this issue with all the other things that we're doing um having these three student athletes here uh but also the experience you get I think you're right Mr Eggo that you know um learning how to be on a team learning how to compete that's that's a skill for life and I know coach uh by the way Sandstorm interesting uh how that's just been a phenomena that has taken off uh that had anything to do with nil but chairman thank you for um it's the song they play in in advance of the games in the South Carolina
▶ 3:13:44Gamecock football games they have this European dance song that they play he's he served as a gator when they've come to Columbia anyways Mr chairman great job and I yield back my pleasure thank you I I just want to tell y'all y'all did an outstanding job and I appreciate it is a sacrifice the time that you've given to us today uh and I'm telling you we're going to be we're going to get a good bill we're going to build some consensus on both sides
▶ 3:14:14of the aisle and partially because of your testimony today so we appreciate you so very much uh I ask unanimous consent that the documents on the staff document list be submitted for the record without objection so ordered uh I remind members that they have 10 legislative days to submit questions for the record and I ask the witnesses to respond to the questions promptly our members should submit their questions by the close of business on March
▶ 3:14:4418th so without objection the subcommittee is adjourned thank you so very much we appreciate all of you Mr chairman
▶ 3:15:15yeah e