▶ 0:00:00Subcommittee on Border Security and Enforcement will come to order. Without objection, the chair is authorized to declare the committee in recess at any time, any point. The purpose of today's hearing is to examine the consequences of the Biden administration's abuse of immigration parole and how Congress and the Trump administration can work to address those consequences. I now recognize myself for an opening good afternoon again.
▶ 0:00:26Welcome to the Subcommittee on Oversight, Investigations, Accountability, and the Subcommittee on Border Security and Enforcement's joint hearing on returning immigration parole to its proper statutory purpose. First, I would like to thank our witnesses for being here today. This hearing was originally planned for April 8th. However, due to last minute and unforeseen circumstances, it had to be postponed until today. And we appreciate our witnesses understanding and grateful you can be here to talk about this important matter.
▶ 0:00:55On the note of witnesses, unfortunately, due to a flight cancellation, one of our witnesses, Charles Marino, will not be able to join us today. I would like to welcome the gentleman from Louisiana, Mr. Carter, who will serve on the oversight, investigations, and accountability subcommittee for the 119th Congress. And we look forward to working with you. We are here today because Congress must find a legislative answer to prevent the future abuse of parole.
▶ 0:01:20Whether that means changing the standard for parole, expediting removal of paroles, or eliminating parole access to welfare benefits, we must act so that another administration cannot repeat or even worse expand what occurred during the Biden Harris time period. From a from February 21 to February 2025, under the Biden Harris administration, US Customs and Border Protection encountered more than 11 million illegal aliens nationwide.
▶ 0:01:47According to our witnesses today, nearly 3 million individuals who had no legal reason to be in the United States were allowed through an unlawful mass parole program were parrolled into um and by an overwhelmed border patrol. We know we don't know how many people actually entered through these various unlawful mass parole programs because the Biden Harris administration refused to give us numbers and data. And that's even after former chairman Green issued a subpoena for the data.
▶ 0:02:17Why are they hiding the numbers? Because parole was out of control and it would have been a political disaster if the American people knew how bad it was. And they abused this authority in support of an openended borders agenda. Congress created immigration parole to provide temporary entry into small numbers of of aliens on a case-byase basis. started six started 60 years ago and it was designed to be for a significant public benefit.
▶ 0:02:45This case byase uh temporary pause in normal processing uh or a urgent humanitarian Presidents and cabinet level officers in the past have used it to enable essential witnesses to cross the border, testify at criminal hearings, or allow illegals with dire medical conditions to receive aid in American hospitals. One former senior ICE official has said that he parrolled just two individuals in his entire career.
▶ 0:03:11No administration abused parole to such a degree and was such flagrant disregard for congressional limitation as compared to the Biden Harris administration. While the that administration and then at the time Secretary Morcus refused to provide Congress with clear information, their playbook was clear. The administration exceeded exceededly expanded existing PRO programs such as the Cuban family reunification program to an amount that strained DHS screening and vetting capability.
▶ 0:03:40Second, the Biden Harris administration reintroduced ineffective parole programs that the first Trump administration ended like the Central American Miners program. The Trump administration ended these because they served no purpose other than promoting greater illegal immigration and encouraging the exploitation of unaccompanied minors. Third, the Biden Harris administration just invented new parole programs to release individuals from Afghanistan, Cuba, Nicaragua, Venezuela, Colombia, Haiti into the interior.
▶ 0:04:09Slapping parole on an inadmissible aliens file. Releasing them into the interior doesn't magically make one less inadmissible. It just means you're not following the laws in intended. The parole vetting was so inadequate that one DHS inspector general report found that three Afghan paroleies had derogatory information related to felonies in the United States and at least one had an indication of terrorism related activity.
▶ 0:04:34An additional Afghan national who received parole through Operation Allies Welcome was arrested in my home state in Oklahoma City for plotting an election day terrorist attack for ISIS. While Republican members of this committee and millions nationwide recognized the national security threat of providing parole to poorly vetted immigrants, the Biden and Harris administration surged, making it even easier for more individuals to apply for parole through a CB1 application.
▶ 0:05:05They even we even found that during the administration that cartels hijacked that CB-1 app to create appointments for wouldbe parole for a fee of course so that the administration parole program was helping cartels pocket more dollars from desperate individuals. The Biden Harris administration also raised the legal requirement for granting parole allowing entry to individuals if they could find a sponsor who could financially support them once within the United States.
▶ 0:05:32Even though the law requires parole to be granted only on a case-byase basis for urgent humanitarian reasons or significant public benefit by law. That is what it stated before it was upended. Even when an internal DHS report indicated that thousands of potential parole sponsors were filing out fraudulent applications and supporting their financial statements with illegal income, the Biden Harris administration continued accepting applications after after a just a long a month-long process pause in in their review of the program
▶ 0:06:02and that did not last. If if this wasn't bad enough, the DHS Inspector General published a report this month stating that during the Biden Harris administration, DHS did not have a process to address parole expiration. Furthermore, DHS did not prioritize taking enforcement action for parole remained in the United States after their parole had expired, usually a one-year or a 2-year time period. The report concluded that DHS had no assurances that pearls were lawfully present in the United States after their parole expired.
▶ 0:06:31When you apply these findings to the estimated millions of paroleies let into the country during the Biden Harris administration, it's very troubling that the administration flagrantly abused parole and it has serious consequences that continues for the American people. While illegal immigration itself is a huge financial strain on the American taxpayer, paroleies are are especially expensive because they are eventually eligible for federal welfare benefits.
▶ 0:06:58One analysis found that beginning in January of 2026, that's 6 months away, the Biden Harris parole calamity will cost about $3 billion a year in welfare benefits per 1 million parole lees. $3 billion a year for just 1 million. And we know that there's we believe three million. So by as the time period ticks on, we're looking at 9 billion, which is that's a state budget.
▶ 0:07:22That's an entire state That's just the quantifiable cost. American citizens face serious national security and public safety costs in the lack of screening and vetting these paroleies. The stories are becoming too many to count. Prolies have been charged and con convicted of serious crimes including terrorism, murder, rape, and sexual assault of children.
▶ 0:07:44Thankfully, the Trump administration has made it clear that inadmissible aliens hiding behind the fig leaf of parole can no longer hide under the protection of temporary parole and remain in the country. On March 21st of this year, President Trump announced his administration would revoke the parole status for 532 thousands that includes the program for Cubans, Haitians, Nicaraguans, Venezuelans, more commonly known as the CHNV program.
▶ 0:08:10By returning parole to its proper purpose, the Trump administration can announce to the world and prospective immigrants that parole status cannot be gifted unlawfully and cheaply. More needs to be done. We're here today to determine how we can begin to undo these devastating impacts, the illegal parole did for untold numbers of inadmissible aliens into America and what that impact will be on our states and local communities. We must protect the taxpayer. We must protect the American people.
▶ 0:08:40We must protect our We need to further limit and clarify executive parole authority to prevent future abuses. I now recognize ranking member for the subcommittee for oversight investigations and accountability the gentleman from Michigan Mr. Mr. Thanodar for his opening statement.
▶ 0:09:06Thank you chairman and good afternoon to all of you. Uh first of all, I want to welcome um the gentleman from Louisiana. Um Representative Carter, thank you for joining the committee. Uh we are honored to have you and honored to have your expertise. Um we're supposedly here today to examine the use of parole.
▶ 0:09:35Let's cut to the chase. President Trump has already ended all parole programs. Yet another cruel step in his immigration agenda.
▶ 0:09:51President Trump and Republicans are only interested in cruelty, chaos, and Republicans are really using this hearing to distract from the recent passage of their one big ugly bill that is going to cut Medicaid and SNAP while increasing the national debt by trillions of dollars because
▶ 0:10:21Republicans don't want to face the future they created where millions of Americans lose health care and food They prefer to live in the past and perpetuate false claims about President Biden's use of parole programs. Since Republicans seem to enjoy history so much, let's go back to 1956.
▶ 0:10:49That's when President Eisenhower first used parole to help 30,000 Hungarians come to the US after a failed revolt against communism. Pole has been used by every Republican and Democratic administration since it is a valuable tool to help those in urgent humanitarian situations.
▶ 0:11:16Parole programs also reduce illegal border crossing, increase the US workforce, and grow our economy. Given the benefits, the public might be asking why Trump is terminating parole Is it simply because he is on a revenge and a retribution tour? Is it because he hasn't done enough already to shatter the economy?
▶ 0:11:48Or is it because he needs to turn proies into undocumented migrants that cosplay Christie can then shackle and deport to a prison in El Salvador for a photo op. Trump and Gnome are not focused on just violent criminals.
▶ 0:12:11They're arresting and deporting hardworking immigrants who wash dishes, pick crops, and construct homes. This administration is so desperate to achieve its goal of 3,000 arrest a day.
▶ 0:12:29It is targeting US citizens and lawful residents exercising their first amendment rights all while ignoring court orders. It is my Republican colleagues want to investigate immigration abuses. There is no need to relitigate false claims from the past.
▶ 0:12:55President Trump's daily actions are a continual assault on the Constitution that warrant congressional oversight. The American people are waiting for Republicans to stand up to the mad king. With that, Mr. Chair, I yield back. Thank you, Ranking member. I now recognize the chairman for the subcommittee on Border Security and Enforcement, the gentleman from Mississippi, Mr. Michael Guest for his opening statement.
▶ 0:13:24Uh thank you, Mr. Chairman. Uh this afternoon, our hearing will provide a critical opportunity to investigate how the Biden Harris administration systematically weakened our national border security and at the same time intentionally facilitated the influx of millions of inadmissible aliens into the United States through the unlawful use of mass parole.
▶ 0:13:47As members of the legislative branch, it is our duty to determine how and why the Biden Harris administration abused this authority to grant parole meant to be applied only on a case-bycase basis for urgent humanitarian reads or significant public benefit to justify the mass release of between two and three million inadmissible aliens into our country.
▶ 0:14:12However, the Biden Harris mass parole programs, though stopped by the Trump continued to impose significant financial costs on the American public and generate increased public safety threats. During his time in office, former President Biden's open policies incentivized illegal immigration, signaling to the world that our borders were open.
▶ 0:14:36In response, people from around the world fluttered across our borders and overran our communities there. This resulted in historic, never-beforeseen apprehension numbers. To combat the bad optics of the growing border crisis and to try to cover up the true scale of illegal immigrants entering the United States, the Biden Harris administration created multiple mass parole programs to hide the truth from the American people and to quickly release individuals into the interior.
▶ 0:15:06These programs were deliberately designed to conceal and downplay the true scope of our border crisis. One of the ways the former administration misled the public was through the conversion of a littleknown program originally designed to schedule cargo inspections into the one of the most abused programs in our nation's history. The CBP1 app was used in a manner never authorized by Congress to create a fasttrack pathway for parole into the interior of the country.
▶ 0:15:36The implementation of the CB1 mass parole program resulted in nearly 1 million illegal aliens entering this country. This committee found that the individual who is who applied for entry into the US using the CBP1 app were ultimately released into the interior at least 95% of the time. Additionally, more than half a million other inadmissible aliens were granted parole under the mass parole program for Cubans, Haitian Nicaraguans, and Venezuelans Venezuelans.
▶ 0:16:07The Trump administration has widely wisely ended both of these programs by executive order, but the fallout remains. Earlier this year, DHS Office of Inspector General released a review of specific Biden Harris administration parole programs, confirming that the previous administration had no plan to remove aliens whose parole had expired.
▶ 0:16:32That meant that there are potentially hundreds of thousands of inadmissible aliens who may still be at large in a country long after their parole has To make matters worse, many of these aliens and those who sponsored their entry were not properly vetted. Both the CHNV program and the CBP1 appointments had to be paused due to suspected rampant fraud.
▶ 0:16:58The consequences of these reckless and unlawful parole programs have been devastating, and the American public has paid the price. One horrifying example is the brutal murder of 22-year-old Lake and Riley, an Augusta University student at the hands of an illegal alien from Venezuela who was parrolled into the country by the Biden Harris administration.
▶ 0:17:23More recently, an Afghan national who was parrolled into the United States in 2021 was arrested for plotting an attack in the name of ISIS on election day 2024. This arrest and Leaken's tra tragic death should be a wake-up call to lawmakers that we must be serious about preventing future abuse of our immigration law.
▶ 0:17:45In closing, Congress has a responsibility to examine what steps should be taken to mitigate the ongoing financial and public safety threats enabled by the previous administration's abuse of parole. There is no scenario in which in which parrolling millions of inadmissible aliens in the country is consistent with current law. We must never allow this to happen again.
▶ 0:18:13We must work together to ensure that future administrations can never again jeopardize our nation's safety and sovereignty. We must implement legislations legislative solutions that will guarantee American security for generations to come. I look forward to hearing from our witnesses today. And with that, I yield back. Thank you, chairman guest. I now recognize a ranking member for the subcommittee on border security enforcement, the gentleman from California, Mr.
▶ 0:18:42Lou Koreah, for his opening statement. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I want to thank our witnesses for being here today. Um, concur word just said need legislation to guarantee to support American security and American prosperity too. Going to ask what happened? What's going on, folks?
▶ 0:19:06President Trump got elected, said he was going to deport criminals, those that had been in the country less than two years, and those with orders of deportation. Last I looked, 70% of the individuals being deported right now don't fit any of those categories. They're essentially hardworking individuals. many individuals that have been in this country 25, 30 years.
▶ 0:19:38My district just a couple of weeks ago, man been here 25 years, not a ticket to his name, not a traffic ticket, was apprehended by ICE. It's a gardener. Three children, all serving in the US Marine Corps. Let me repeat. Man held by ICE 25 years in this country.
▶ 0:20:08Not a ticket to his name, not a traffic ticket. Apprehended. He has three children in the US Marine Corps. Now, I don't know about you, but we make movies about people like that. We give people like that a tour of the White House.
▶ 0:20:28He raised three patriots that were ready to make the ultimate sacrifice for this What do you say to those three Marines? Spirit the core. Keep up the good attitude. Everything's going to be okay A lot of people in that situation.
▶ 0:20:55I know the president understands that this policy is hurting this nation economically. Just a couple of weeks ago, he came out and said, "I'm going to suspend the deportation of those that work at farms, those that work in hospitality industry." Two days later, he said, "I was just kidding. Never mind.
▶ 0:21:16We're going to continue to sweep them up." You know, each one of us represents a different part of the country, a different state. Tell you a little bit about California. And I've said this before, so please excuse me for repeating myself. It's important to note California, a big portion of of our workforce is undocumented.
▶ 0:21:41As a state, we've done everything we can to document those workers, driver's other things that we need to do. As a result, today, California is the fourth largest economy in the world. And if we deregulate a little bit, we could be number three in the world, number one nationally on agriculture. 50 to 70% of those workers are undocumented.
▶ 0:22:08And we feed a lot of parts of this country and the rest of the world. We're also number one in manufacturing in Southern California. It's not Pittsburgh. It's not Michigan. It's Southern California. Manufacturing sector of the United States. Center of manufacturing in the Guess what? A lot of those workers are what? Undocumented.
▶ 0:22:33I thought we were supposed to do some nearshoring to bring back a lot of those jobs from other parts of the world. That's what we were supposed to be Let's talk about venture capital. Guess what state and union has about 60 to 70% of the venture capital today? Talk about high-tech Silicon Valley. A lot of those workers are guess what? Visa holders.
▶ 0:23:00overstate visa, India, China, Europe. We attract the best and brightest. We have the best biotech in the world right now. We invent the best medicines in the world right now in California. As a result of that, folks, we pay a hundred billion dollar more in taxes to the federal government than we get back. I hear statements burden. Well, no.
▶ 0:23:31We are a net donor to the federal and now the federal government is going to tell us how to run the economy of the state of California. Is that what I'm hearing to today? Let's stop for a minute and not talk about undocumented. Let's talk about American citizens.
▶ 0:23:55I live in Orange County, not LA, Orange We have the National Guard downtown, okay? Almost had the Marines there. Sheriff Barnes, who's been in this committee testifying, okay, has told me, "I didn't call for Local police, I didn't call for backup. Why are they here? They're messing things up.
▶ 0:24:23Work that we've done for public safety for the last 30 years. And when they leave, we got a mess to fix. We didn't call for them. Go downtown Santa Ana right now where I live. It's peaceful. Why is the National Guard there? American citizens right now.
▶ 0:24:44American citizens afraid of going out on the Parents telling their kids, "Take your your birth certificate. Take a passport." Are you kidding me? Is this America or is this a communist country? American citizens.
▶ 0:25:07Just two weeks ago, female attorney, Americanborn citizen, walking down the There was a raid going on. turned around, they took her into, arrested her, never been so frightened in her life.
▶ 0:25:27She said, "Masked man grabbed me, put me in a van with no windows, took me in a holding cell that I had no idea where I was going." Few hours later, she was let go. Why was she profiled? Thought you weren't supposed to be doing that. Okay. Home Depot. heard another story. An offduty police officer walking into Home Depot.
▶ 0:25:58They were about to grab him. He turned around and said, "Back off. I got a concealed weapon." Can you imagine what we almost had? Almost had a shootout there because you have masked individuals and I have no idea who they are. I have no idea what training they have about to grab somebody without even a warning. These are our streets in the United States of America. What are we coming to?
▶ 0:26:27You know, the other day, President Trump was meeting with President Blly said, quote, "The president homegrowns are next. You got to build about five more of these places. This place is not big enough. So, we're sending American citizens now to foreign prisons. Forget about green card holders. I'll tell you, I've told them, "Do not leave the country.
▶ 0:26:56You will not be let in." What are we coming to, folks? What is going on? California is the fourth largest economy in the world. Our a industry is getting devastated. I won't even talk about the trade that the ports of LA, Long Beach, the biggest ports we have in this country, I think their trade is down 30 40%.
▶ 0:27:30this hearing is about parole, but I think the bigger issue is of our immigration policy. My colleague just said we need to protect, legislate, protect American security. We've also needed immigration reform for a long time. And it's not only California. I've got some articles here talking about the Wisconsin dairy farmers. 70% of the workforce is undocumented.
▶ 0:27:56So, get rid of those workers and I guess our milk will be less expensive, I would imagine, if you can get it at all. Another one here. Immigrants contribute greatly to the social security's trust fund solveny. They pin his social security never get a dime back. Labor and immigration reform. Many dairy farmers struggle to recruit and retain native workers despite higher wages and benefits.
▶ 0:28:26But I guess we're going to take our graduate students and now tell them to go milk the cows and take care of the cows. That's what we're saying. This is an interesting one. Little bit off point. Irish tourist jailed by ICE for months after overstaying the US. His visa by three days. By the way, tourism is a big industry in my district. They're down 20 to 30%. Dairy farms are vulnerable to Trump's mass deportation threats.
▶ 0:28:56The industry hopes to get a pass. All you have to do is read the newspapers every day. I'm not quite sure where we got off on this track. We're supposed to deport criminals.
▶ 0:29:16And I can tell you back home, I've talked to who believed the president when he said he was going after these these three sets criminals, overstays, those here with less than two years and now going after hard workers. Our economy is going to suffer. Inflation shortages. maybe the president doesn't know what's going on.
▶ 0:29:43He needs to know that ICE is doing more than maybe he knows we're doing. Look forward to hearing the testimony from our witnesses today. Mr. Chair, take over the G. Gentlemen yields. Other members of the committee are reminded opening statements may be submitted for the record.
▶ 0:30:09I'm pleased to have a panel of expert witnesses before us today on this very important topic. I ask that our witnesses please rise and raise your right hand. Do you solemnly swear that the testimony you will give before the committee on homeland security of the United States of the House of Representatives will be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth? So help you God.
▶ 0:30:36Let the record reflect that the witnesses have answered in the affirmative. Thank you. I would now like to formally introduce our witnesses. Mr. Ken Cuchinelli is a senior fellow at the Center for Renewing Dr. Steven Kamarata is the director of research at the Center for Immigration Dr. David Beer is a director of immigration studies at the Ko Institute.
▶ 0:31:08I thank the witnesses for being here today. I now recognize Mr. Ken Cuchinelli for five minutes of his opening statement. Uh thank you, Mr. Chairman and ranking members and members of the committee. I will try not to repeat some of the data some of you have already talked about. I would go straight to the statute that provides legal authority for the granting of parole. There's only one statute. It's INA section 212D5A.
▶ 0:31:38And particularly it says the Secretary of Homeland Security may in his discretion parole into the United States under such conditions as he may only on a case-bycase basis for urgent humanitarian reasons or significant public benefit. Four Four conditions.
▶ 0:32:07This is a change in 1996 in the illegal immigration reform and immigrant responsibility act which was passed on an overwhelmingly bipartisan basis on a voice vote in the Senate um and by over or approximately a 10 to1 margin in the House. This was the first time the casebycase requirement was included in the parole statute.
▶ 0:32:39So the example of President Eisenhower from 1956 was executed under the 1952 version of the parole statute which did not include the casebycase language.
▶ 0:32:53Congress intentionally narrowed the parole authority in 1996 to require decisions on parole to be on a casebycase basis only on a case-bycase basis to quote the That's a that is the most significant change in this statute in the 1996 amendments. And again, it passed on an overwhelmingly bipartisan basis.
▶ 0:33:25Despite that rather obvious limitation, the Biden administration created a series of new immigration admission arrangements without congressional approval, essentially making its own law, using the parole authority, sometimes explicitly and sometimes The two words were used together in some of these statements already made today, parole programs. Well, parole program is an oxymoron.
▶ 0:33:56Parole is intended to be exercised on a case-bycase basis. You said so as an institution almost 30 years ago. The restrictions added to the parole authority in 1996 have never been fully litigated.
▶ 0:34:15Such a case was in process at the transition from the Biden administration to the Trump administration, but the case was withdrawn by the Trump administration and the district court ruling was vacated and dismissed. So, we'll have our discussion here today, but there is not a high court ruling to point to interpreting the application of the casebycase language.
▶ 0:34:38Normally basic statutory interpretation, you go to the plain language of the statute unless it's in some way unclear. Well, only on a case-byase basis strikes me as extremely clear. But if Congress truly wants case by case to be applied one case at a time, then clearly even more explicit restrictions should be put in place.
▶ 0:35:06My suggestion would be to pick a number low enough that any competent Secretary of Homeland Security would want to be particular with each parole slot. I would suggest something around 3,000 a year. At that level, there would be no point in setting up so-called but misnamed programmatic parole arrangements as they would reach annual limits so fast they wouldn't be useful for those purposes.
▶ 0:35:33America is reaping the financial and security costs of former President Biden's unprecedented and illegal importation of millions of illegal aliens. Uh 2 and a half to three million. It depends how you'd like to count them um using the parole power and we will literally be paying those prices for decades to come.
▶ 0:35:58I know parole reform as noted uh I think it was by Congressman Koreah that parole reform is just but one of the immigration tasks you have before you and that require Congress attention if it's ever to be set on a proper long-term footing. But I'm happy to join you today and address this subject and answer any questions that you may have. Thank you, Mr. Cuchinelli. That was uh excellent. You hit your time mark. you're seasoned in this.
▶ 0:36:28Appreciate that. Um I want to now recognize uh Dr. Kam Kamarata for five minutes for his opening statement. Thank you, Mr. Chairman and members of the subcommittee for having me here today. I'm Steve Camarada, director of research at the Center for Immigration Studies.
▶ 0:36:47As many of you pointed out, the Immigration and Nationality Act gives the Secretary of Homeland Security discretion to grant parole on a case-byase basis for a limited number of people for a limited time to individual aliens for urgent humanitarian reasons or because it would create a significant benefit. It's not a program to be used in mass.
▶ 0:37:09And yet published data indicates that the Biden administration released nearly 2.9 million people into the United States using parole. It's very hard to see how parole granted on this scale could have been done on a case-byase basis. Now my testimony will focus specifically on the fiscal implications of this.
▶ 0:37:33Prior research is very clear that educational attainment at arrival is a key determinant of immigrants fiscal impact because it not only determines what types of jobs they'll do but also their likely income and their tax payments and use of social services. Census Bureau data indicates that one out of every four recent immigrants from the top parole sending countries lack a high school diploma compared to just 6% for the US born.
▶ 0:38:02Also, new adult parolees are significantly less likely to have a college degree than the US-born. As a result, the average wages of newly arrived immigrant men from these top parole sending countries is only 44% that of US-born men. Further, half of households headed by new immigrants from the top parole countries access at least one welfare program.
▶ 0:38:29That's nearly twice the rate of the US born. Now, the budget reconciliation legislation that just passed states that paroleies will no longer be quote unquote qualified aliens after one year of residence. Qualified aliens have to live in the United States for 5 years to be directly eligible for many welfare programs.
▶ 0:38:52But my analysis of Census Bureau data showing high welfare use is confined to parole countries who have lived in the United States for less than 5 years. So the designation of qualified alien is not the reason for the heavy use of welfare programs. So the removal of that designation isn't going to make much difference. The reason so many paroleies use means programs is first many are poor and have low income. Second they can receive benefits on behalf of US-born children.
▶ 0:39:21Third, all lowincome residents of the United States can access some programs regardless of legal status. And finally, some states uh give benefits to otherwise ineligible aliens. In addition to traditional welfare, 40% of households headed by recent immigrants, again from the top parole sending countries, are poor enough to receive cash payments from the earned income tax credit.
▶ 0:39:46paroleies have work authorization and social security numbers for the most part so they can get the EITC. Again, the big beautiful bill doesn't change any of this. Now, to be sure, immigrants from top parole sending countries with work authorization most certainly do pay some taxes. However, on average, parolei headed house households have only 47% of the federal tax liability of US-born households.
▶ 0:40:15Now having said this, the low average tax payment or high use of welfare by paroleles should not be seen as some kind of moral failing on their part. Instead, the fiscal drain they create simply reflects the realities of the modern American job market, our progressive system of taxation coupled with an extensive social safety net.
▶ 0:40:38It should also be pointed out that immigrant men from the main parrolling sending countries have relatively high rates of work but that does not preclude use of welfare in any way nor does it mean their average tax contributions will be large. Now to be sure by working and consuming in the United States paroleies do make the US economy bigger but it is a common mistake to confuse this with their tax contributions.
▶ 0:41:08Almost all of the increased economic activity they create goes to the paroleies themselves in the form of wages as it should since they're the ones doing the work. In conclusion, the decision by the prior administration to grant parole on a massive scale will have significant negative fiscal impact for years to come given all we know about the educational attainment of paroleles. Thank you.
▶ 0:41:39Uh thank you Dr. Comrada. I now recognize Mr. Beer for five minutes for his opening statement. Chairman, ranking members, and distinguished members of the subcommittee, thank you for the opportunity to testify. For nearly half a century, the Kato Institute has produced original research showing that people, whatever their ancestry, background, or birthplace, benefit the United States.
▶ 0:42:03Sadly, the US immigration system is outdated, approving just 3% of immigrants seeking legal permanent residence last year. This fact has made temporary statuses like parole even more important as a way for legal entry. Since 1952, when Congress created the parole category, administrations have invoked this authority at least 126 times.
▶ 0:42:29Millions have entered legally as paroleles and have contributed greatly to our country for decades. The parole processes created under the last administration were no different. The Congressional Budget Office estimates indicate that recent parole will lower US debt by more than half a trillion over the course of a decade.
▶ 0:42:52The current administration admits these recent parole processes were lawful and case by case and that they reduced illegal immigration. But it terminated them anyway, tore up promises to 1.5 million legal immigrants, stripping them of status with no warning. This chaos typifies the administration's mass deportation policy, which consists of three basic pillars.
▶ 0:43:21One, strip people of legal status and US citizenship. Two, arrest based on convenience and profiling, not threats. And three, deport without due process. First pillar, paroleles, temporary protected status holders, thousands of international students, and even some green card holders who haven't committed any crimes are having their status stripped away.
▶ 0:43:48They are even attempting to take away US citizenship from many US-born babies and threatening to do the same to many naturalized citizens. In some cases, they are taking away people's status explicitly to retaliate against their free speech. Millions losing their status isn't fixing illegal immigration, but that's not their goal. Their goal is to increase targets for deportation paid for by us the taxpayer.
▶ 0:44:20Second pillar target based on convenience not threat. ICE isn't prioritizing the worst of the worst. Paroleies were and are continuously vetted. They aren't threats. They're just convenient targets. That's why ICE is rounding up those who are complying with the asylum process, attending court hearings, and not committing any crimes. Twothirds of those detained by ICE this year have no criminal conviction. None.
▶ 0:44:49Just 7% have a violent conviction. ICE agents themselves are sounding the alarm. Quantity over quality, said one agent, deprioritizing the real threats. Indeed, the White House has explicitly ordered them to stop focusing on serious criminals and conduct indiscriminate random roundups at bus stops, parking lots, at Home Depot, and even churches.
▶ 0:45:17ICE is arresting over 10 times as many noncriminals on the streets as even under the first Trump administration in But you can't see someone's legal status. So this means blatant illegal profiling in violation of the fourth amendment. As one court has already found, they are detaining US citizens for street interrogations and then wrongfully arresting them if they refuse to talk.
▶ 0:45:45Third pillar, after detaining without reasonable basis, they're deporting without due process. In March, the administration grabbed more than 50 people who entered America legally, never violated any law. It threw them on a plane and sent them to a foreign torture prison without a trial or so much as a hearing and in violation of a court order. The Supreme Court has already found these expulsions were unconstitutional.
▶ 0:46:14But DHS, it disagrees. The president is violating court orders, openly flouting US law, and violating the first, fourth, fifth, sixth, eighth, 10th, and 14th amendments to the US President Trump can certainly make America poorer, weaker, and less safe with his feckless, chaotic deportation crusade, but he cannot ignore the Constitution.
▶ 0:46:41The Constitution is our wall of defense against tyranny. It's the one wall we all should agree needs to be higher. Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Beer. Members will be recognized by order of senior seniority for their five minutes of of questioning. Additional rounds of questioning may be called after all members have been recognized. I now recognize myself for five minutes of questioning. Uh Dr. Camaruda, you you uh talked about the cost. I appreciate that.
▶ 0:47:12Um Dr. Comarado, what do you think is the total cost? And you know the last statement is forgetting that we are debt loading upon American children right now and every expense that we are incurring is taking from the next generation of US citizens. So what is that true cost that the one big beautiful bill that did address some things is not addressing? specifically the earned income tax credit.
▶ 0:47:40And of the 3 million uh illegals that came through in under this process, what do you think that cost is per individual multiplied by 3 million specific to the earned income tax credit? Yeah. So it has to run into the few billions. About 40% based on the calculations the Census Bureau has done of recent arrivals from those countries are eligible, have income low enough, and we would assume since they have work authorization and have valid Social Security numbers, they can get that.
▶ 0:48:09Um, and so that number has to run into the billions, maybe two, three billion in the value of the earned income tax credit. But we we don't have a specific Thank you. Uh, Dr. Cuchinelli, you you have explained a lot about the process. You've got a lot of years of experience.
▶ 0:48:30Um we've heard from senior officials like the current CBP chief, Rodney Scott, that when he was border patrol, at Border Patrol, he parrolled only a handful of individuals during his entire career. How many people historically have been parrolled into the country every year? Prior to the Biden administration, you would be talking in the thousands as a general matter. Thus, your pronouncement of 30,000 as a Yes.
▶ 0:48:58And it als again it also it it makes your relevant programmatic parole. But it also makes the leadership actually value the slots so that you really do look for real indisputable humanitarian benefit. indisputable significant or humanitarian reasons, indisputable public benefit.
▶ 0:49:23And I would note um you know when I I hear an example like uh Congressman Koreah's example of the father of three Marines, that's a very sympathetic case. And I would respectfully suggest that you preserve parole for those cases.
▶ 0:49:42When you use it willy-nilly for two, three million people whom you barely vet, if at all, um you don't end up with that quality of story two and three million times. Um, so if you want to just bring in those good cases, I'll call them, then you need to restrict the the availability of parole to the secretary and to to every administration, so that they're forced to use it for quality
▶ 0:50:12cases. Let me let me shift gears relative to what happens once parole is um provided that designation. What happens to that that individual um in terms of the time period? They then told to some are told to show up to an ICE office, ICE agent to be able to get be given a notice to appear in an immigration court. Uh but many of these ICE offices are so backed up by by our understanding it may be as long as 10 years.
▶ 0:50:42Again, some of these are one year, two year in terms of the time period that should be allowable can turn into much many multiplied past that um that notice to appear if it goes to the nth degree, How long does it take for these people uh to otherwise be processed than final adjudication? So, Congressman Korea's other comment about how this needs to fit into the bigger immigration reform question falls right into your question here.
▶ 0:51:12So, one thing that no one has talked about is how all of these otherwise illegal entrance clog the system for people who are playing by the rules, who have played by the rules all along. America is the most generous immigration country in the world. Um, and that's the legal portion of what we do. And that is clogged up. That's where that 10-year backup number comes from. And the estimates again are different.
▶ 0:51:41Um, presumably some of the money from the bill that just passed will be used to get more judges, more lawyers, etc., and to move those cases faster. Um, but in the Biden administration, hey, come see us at the ICE office, they knew very well that a large portion of those folks would never show up. and in fact they didn't.
▶ 0:52:01And so now we need to go find them just to end their parole and put them back in the status they were previously in and deport them where As it's commonly said, notice to appear turns into notice to disappear. Um, I now recognize uh ranking member thanar for five minutes for questions he may Thank you, chair. We have a video.
▶ 0:52:54along Sunset and Western Avenue. There's cell phone video that you just saw. It captured the raids occurring uh at this Home Depot property. Also, Hands behind your back. Hands behind your back. Behind my back. Smashing the rear window of this white pickup truck. And just moments later, yo, he's bleeding, bro. He's bleeding from his head. Look.
▶ 0:53:47Looks like I is out of control. The video we just watched is shocking. Armed and masked men with guns are American streets, chasing down, tackling, and arresting We've seen federal officers raid
▶ 0:54:17Home Depot parking lots, swarm the fields where our crops are being harvested, and march across MacArthur Park in Los Angeles like a hostile military through a battlefield. Mr. bear.
▶ 0:54:39Based on your research and who do ICE and other federal officers appear to be targeting and on what basis are they targeting Well, it's obvious that they're engaged in illegal profiling.
▶ 0:54:56We know from reports that uh White House chief uh deputy chief uh Steven Miller ordered that they stop developing target lists of criminals and to go out to the streets and just start arresting people. Uh Tom Hman again, White House ZAR on immigration says they're doing profiling. They're going out. They're saying you're a day laborer. we're gonna detain you um even in absence of any reason to believe that you are in violation of any law.
▶ 0:55:27Mr. Bear, Donald Trump claimed that he wanted to deport the worst of the worst criminals. If that is the case, why is Trump targeting people in Home Depot, parking lots, and agricultural fields, and public parks? Are they all criminals?
▶ 0:55:50There there there aren't enough criminal immigrants in the United States for him to fill his deportation quotas and get his millions of deportations that he promised people. And so what they are doing is they're going out and into the streets and profiling people. If you look at where all of the increase in arrests has come from, it's come from noncriminals on the streets. That means outside of a prison or a jail, they're going out and they're profiling people and they're arresting them. and that is resulting in all of the arrests that we're seeing in the conflict and chaos in the streets.
▶ 0:56:20Thank you, Mr. Beer. It's not just that Donald Trump's agents are unconstitutionally and immorally profiling people based on the color of their skin. It's also that no one really knows whether they are encountering a federal officer or a thug.
▶ 0:56:39We have seen videos over and over again showing suppose federal officers with their faces covered by masks, scarves, and fabric. Mr. Beer, does it concern you that mask officers are patrolling communities, refusing to identify themselves, and arresting people on the street? Does this make our country Absolutely not.
▶ 0:57:07It makes the situation less safe for both the officer and the person that they're interacting with in the public because they don't know. The person in the public doesn't know whether they're an officer or not. They could be a criminal. They could be another person. And that leads to more conflict. I have a long list of cases around the country of people who posed as ICE officers to commit crimes. Just this year, just in the last year, this is happening.
▶ 0:57:34And so there are there are good reasons for people to be careful when pe someone shows up with a mask and says do what I tell you to do. Thank you, Mr. Bear. Thank you for your testimony. And Mr. Chair, I yield back. Gentleman yields. I now recognize uh Representative Guest for his five minutes question. Uh thank you, Mr. Chairman. Uh Mr. Mr.
▶ 0:57:53Kushinelli, you mentioned in both your opening statement and your written testimony uh the applicable law that must be applied by DHS, by the secretary when parole is considered. Uh the IIR passed with overwhelming bipartisan support 1996, signed into law by then President Bill Clinton, a Democrat. Uh again, easily passed the House, easily passed the Senate.
▶ 0:58:21Um, and as I look at that law, um, it seems to me to set forth both the process and the standard. The process being that it must be applied on a casebycase basis. Is there any part of the IRA that allows the law to be applied in a situation of mass parole? Can the secretary just decide I'm not going to follow the case by case.
▶ 0:58:51I'm just going to set forth these categories of people and if you fall into this broad category of individuals then I'm automatically going to assume that the process portion of that uh has been met. No is the answer the and it's clearly no. Correct. It's it's not ambig it's not it's not even close. There's no ambiguity as to what the statute says. Th this is the only statute that contains any uh any aspect of the parole authority.
▶ 0:59:22There aren't multiple statutes to look at as we sometimes see in the immigration space. This is it. And so the first part it says forth is the the process and then the standard says it must be on the basis of urgent humanitarian reasons or significant public benefit. Are there any more standards that the secretary can choose to apply? No.
▶ 0:59:46So you mentioned there uh and some of the questioning by chairman Bream, you mentioned somewhat in your written statement too that historically prior to Joe Biden and Kla Harris and Secretary Mayo Mayorcas coming into office and abusing this parole system that historically on on an annual basis the number of individuals who were granted parole
▶ 1:00:16were in the low thousands. Is that what I heard from you, Mr. Kinelli? You did. There have been exceptions, but they tend to reach back before 1996. And uh you even mentioned a range in your written statement of 3 to 5,000. Can you can you expand on where that? That's my suggestion as to how to bring this system under control.
▶ 1:00:37If if you are going to have administrations that sometimes will simply not abide by the plain language of the statute Congress passed, uh then you need to put in harder, more objective uh in place. If the alternative is complete unfettered discretion, which is how the Biden administration operated, or zero, um there are reasons both of those are bad.
▶ 1:01:06Um, so thus my suggestion in the 3 to 5,000 range of putting a hard cap on an annual basis uh on the Secretary of Homeland Security and how many people they can let in using this parole And so when you say 3 to 5,000 that that's annually, correct? That's 3 to 5,000 a year. Uh I did some rough math. uh I took into account said that there were uh 3 million people that came in and were parrolled during that 4-year period.
▶ 1:01:36Uh divided by it by the number of days over four years. Uh and at 3 million, that's over 2,000 individuals a A day each and every day, Monday through Friday, Saturday and Sunday, Christmas, New Year's, July 4th, that were parrolled in the country. And then giving the administration just the benefit of the doubt at two and a half million. I did that math.
▶ 1:02:01That's 1,700 individuals a day each and every day for four years. And so what you're telling me is that we should be shooting for a range of somewhere between three and five. And let's just double that number just for argument sake. Maybe we say 10, maybe we say 20,000 is a good number. But we in a given week were doing over 14,000 individuals in a given week.
▶ 1:02:31And so Mr. Coo, just let me ask you a as my time draws near uh based on what you know about the law, the standards and the process that must be met. Did Secretary Mayorcis, did the Department of Homeland Security under the prior administration, did they abide by the law or did they abuse the law that was given to them by Congress? They rather obviously abused the law. Uh, thank you, Mr. Chairman.
▶ 1:03:00I yield Gentleman yields. I now recognize Representative Koreah for his five minutes of question. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Um, Mr. Scoochinelli, we're going to see if this gentleman can get parole in place. His father of these three American you mentioned we are a most generous nation.
▶ 1:03:25We are, but we also benefit tremendously from immigrants uh in any way possible. Einstein, well, all of us here are immigrants to this country. We made this country strong. Mr. Beardum, we hear a lot about the costs. We hear a lot about the cost benefits. I've been hearing this argument 30, 40 years. The cost.
▶ 1:03:54Are there any benefits to immigrants working in this country? Of course, there are huge benefits to immigration. Uh, look, without immigrants coming into the United States right now, our labor force would be in decline and that would have devastated be another Japan. Say that again. We would be another Japan. Yeah. And and look, you can survive. Japan hasn't gone away, but they're poorer as a consequence.
▶ 1:04:19And so, if you want to have a vibrant uh society, you want to have as many people contributing to it as possible. That's what the founding fathers understood from the beginning is that people are the ultimate resource. They are a benefit to the country. There are economies of scale that happen when you have more people that come in and those people end up doing more specialized labor which improves living standards for everyone in the United States.
▶ 1:04:45You know, I I I think about um people trying to get this country to work and the draw. I I don't think it's as much welfare as it is a good job. Um, and you know, I I think I would propose that the easy way to solve a lot of this is penalize the employers. I mean, put them in jail, come down at them hard. Once you stop hiring folks, guess what?
▶ 1:05:15That job magnet goes away, right? I mean, you know, the last two or three years you had people from Central America walking across the border, but it would take them 8 to10,000 paying a somebody to get them to the border, maybe across. So, I I I my proposition is it's the jobs. This is why people come. This is why my my grandfather came to build the railroads in 1900. There's a job. Go ahead, Mr. Look at the immigration system.
▶ 1:05:45We have g a guest worker program for lesserkill agricultural jobs, but only if they're seasonal and temporary. We have one for for non-aggricultural jobs that has a low cap. That's also only if it's seasonal or temporary. Look at all of the people who've come in over the last few years. Where did they go? They went into the year round permanent jobs in agriculture, in manufacturing, in uh in in poultry processing, in other areas where there is no visa. There's no way for them to come legally.
▶ 1:06:14So yes, we need a legal way. Parole is one of those ways. We're hearing from the committee. They don't like parole. I don't know why they don't like parole, but they don't like parole. So we'll call it something else. Call it a visa. Let them apply at a consulate. Let them come in legally. Let them contribute to this country. They don't need welfare as you said. So let them contribute. I don't get it. What's the problem? We can solve this with a legal I'm happy to work with my colleagues across the aisle to look at this costbenefit.
▶ 1:06:41I I always ask myself what's the value of being energy independent in terms of national defense. Everybody here wants to be energy independent. What's the value of being food independent on an international basis? Do you want to import your food, be dependent on somebody else or you good exporting it? And those are the issues I think we have to look at strategically. Where do you want to go as a country? But let's be honest about this cost benefits.
▶ 1:07:10I mentioned some of the articles, you know, Wisconsin, other parts. I just saw a map. The southern states of this country heavily reliant on a immigrant workforce undocumented. So all I'm saying and let's just be honest and let that drive policy facts. Go ahead. Well, you're absolutely right. And if you come back to this issue of parole, we keep hearing again again and again how they were otherwise inadmissible or otherwise illegal.
▶ 1:07:40Look, everyone is otherwise illegal un except for their status. So these people have status. They're already here. They're already contributing to this country. Why would we rip up their status? Create all this if they have a criminal record. If they have criminal criminal record, no criminal record. They're vetted. But if they do, then you're not in. But if you're a hardworking person, then you're in. Possibly. Mr.
▶ 1:08:06Chairman, in the last seconds, I ask unanimous consent to insert into the record a number of articles describing contributions of immigrants to social security, American egg, the dairy industry, the labor force in general. These articles essentially highlight how these industries are dependent on undocumented economic labor Without objection. So ordered. The gentleman yields. I now recognize Representative Strong for his five minutes of questioning. Thank you, Mr.
▶ 1:08:37Chairman. I want to first thank our witnesses for being here today for their contributions to this critical discussion. Uh Mr. Cuchinelli, according to the Department of Homeland Security, nonprofit organizations occasionally serve as sponsors on parole applications. How frequently do nonprofit organizations serve in this role? and what are the implications of their involvement? Um, I don't have exact numbers, but it is very common. They also do it.
▶ 1:09:06It isn't a a oneoff. So, you have organizations that are being sponsors for large numbers of people. And I would just point out, you know, this concept of sponsorship is as old as the American immigration system.
▶ 1:09:21But u the fact of the matter is in our adult lifetimes sponsors have not repeat not been held accountable to what are the supposed requirements of sponsors and um and that has just never happened under any administration. So um I it's easy for the nonprofits or any individual to do this.
▶ 1:09:46We have individuals sponsoring you know scores of people as well dozens I should say the be the high end which they could never financially fulfill the obligations if they were called on to do so for everyone they're sponsoring so this whole system is broken and thus it's very easy for a nonprofit to step in there as one part of its agenda to bring larger numbers of folks into the Thank you.
▶ 1:10:14I'm glad to see that this administration is placing national security first and is taking the necessary actions to restore integrity and accountability to our immigration system. Mr. Coochinelli, can you discuss the role that state and local law enforcement play in supporting ICE with parole removal orders as well as any challenges that they see? So, first of all, this is all more work for all of them to do if they're willing to do it.
▶ 1:10:41uh you know making the news all the time are the states and localities that refuse to cooperate with ICE and under the 10th amendment the federal government can't simply demand local or state cooperation. Now, as your budget, annual budget comes up September 30th, you can write it into the law.
▶ 1:10:59This was litigated in the first Trump administration, and without specific budget requirements tying cooperation to the cutting off of funding, then you the federal government doesn't have a tool to compel this cooperation. for those that do cooperate. We we you know, famously we're seeing it in Florida and we can go all around the country at the localities in many of your states that are cooperating. Um yes, it's it's easier, believe it or not, to target the criminals because they pop onto your radar.
▶ 1:11:30They pop onto your radar. They may be two and a half, three, four, 5% of the total population. And I've heard complaints that they're only 30% of those being deported. I would point out that they're 10 times their proportion in the population of illegal aliens being focused on. So that security and safety element is a priority numerically and proportionally. Thank you. Uh switching gears a little bit, Mr.
▶ 1:11:54Camaroda, you and I both know that America deserves an immigration system that prioritizes their interest in public safety above all else. Can you uh further expand on the physical burdens placed on American taxpayers when paroleles begin receiving welfare benefits and are there types of financial benefits that paroleles qualify for that other illegal aliens do Yeah.
▶ 1:12:21So, especially with that qualified alien provision that now apparently as I read the big beautiful bill is not going to apply. But the thing you have to keep in mind is that probably played some role. But what's driving the high use of public services is the low educational attainment of pearls paroleies and their low income. The presence of US-born children which isn't changing with the law. The fact that some states give them benefits.
▶ 1:12:48Some programs are allowed to be used like wick and free school lunch and emergency Medicaid and Medicaid for pregnant women. So there are these other factors. In other words, if you had to the bottom line is people who come to America, even those who work and as I point out, they have relatively high rates of work. If they have very modest levels of education, they make extensive use of the social safety net. And it's not because they're lazy. It's not because they all came to get welfare. It's just the reality of modern America.
▶ 1:13:17You have to be very selective or you're going to get kicked in the teeth in in fiscal costs. That's just how it is when it comes to immigration. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. and I yield The gentleman yields. I now recognize Mr. Carter for his 5 minutes of Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and thank you to our witnesses for being here today. Like many Americans, I'm deeply troubled by the cruel and profoundly unamerican mass deportation agenda being undertaken by the Donald Trump administration and his allies.
▶ 1:13:47These harsh policies are not about public safety or border security. We've seen children torn from their parents, flagrant disregard of basic due process protections, and individuals targeted for exercising the First Amendment rights. Congress must do what we can to uphold the values of our founding fathers and the rights of all people in the United States.
▶ 1:14:11We need immigration policies rooted in dignity, fairness, and most importantly, due process, not cruelty and Despite campaign promises, the vast majority of those detained or deported under the administration under this administration have had no criminal record. Many of these individuals have lived here for years, raised families here, and contributed to our communities.
▶ 1:14:40in New Orleans, my hometown and district. Just weeks ago, Madonna Kashanian, an Iranian woman who lives in who's lived in the United States for almost five decades with no criminal record, was gardening outside her home when ICE agents detained her.
▶ 1:15:03I'd like to commend my friend and colleague, Majority Leader, Congress, Congressman Steve Scaliz, who worked with me to get her released. Yeah, I said, Majority Leader Steve Scaliz, who worked to have her released. Congressman Scaliz said, and I quote, "She's been a great member of this community. She's done a lot for the people and her life work is what you should be she should be judged on.
▶ 1:15:33This was said by Republican by by your I agree with this sentiment and I hope that my Republican colleagues that see this and know that they should too treat every human being seeking a better life in this country the same way.
▶ 1:15:55Steve Scaliz, majority leader, Republican, said that we have to have a better process, that we shouldn't be snatching people who are people that are here that hadn't broke any laws that had been here for many years. Let's keep this going. Sounds like we're on the right track.
▶ 1:16:12I would ask my colleagues on this committee and in the the Republican conference to likewise follow the lead of their leader who said this and acted more importantly and she's been released as a part of that. She now has due process. That's all we're asking that people have is due process. Have an opportunity to defend yourself. If you are in fact someone that's been breaking laws and are habitual, that's another story.
▶ 1:16:39But if you've been here and you tried to go through the process, you should not be single singled out. Um, Mr. Beer, how has the Trump administration's immigration enforcement practice such as denying access to legal counsel and expedited deportations without hearings undermined basic due process and constitutional protections?
▶ 1:17:00Look, this administration went to the Supreme Court with the proposition that they could grab anyone off the streets, put them on a plane with no hearing, no warning, and fly them to a foreign prison and put them there indefinitely and pay for it with US tax dollars. They went to the Supreme Court. The Supreme Court said, "No, you can't do that. You got to go back and and give people due process." That's a good win. Unfortunately, they have tried to evade that ruling in every conceivable possible way using other authorities to fly people to other countries.
▶ 1:17:30These this We have a constitution for a reason. We have a rule of law for a reason. We have a constitution. The founders of our constitution were were keenly aware that this day might Yes, they were. Absolutely. They were. The pro the problem we're facing is there's a lack of consequences when an administration or agents of the administration violate the constitution. They can violate it with impunity. They can they will I got about 30 36 seconds. I want to get a few more questions.
▶ 1:17:58And what does it mean for civil liberties in a democ in a democratic society when the Trump administration targets individuals for immigration enforcement based on political speech and activism, not because of anything else, just because they don't like what you said. This is America, right? This is America. And in America, you don't need a passport to speak freely. And that is what it's coming to.
▶ 1:18:21If you can get a phone call from ICE to prove that you are a citizen and that then therefore you have the right to say certain things critical of the government, we have degraded free speech for every single person. Lastly, and I'm already over my time, so thank you, Mr. Chairman. ICE agents wearing masks without identifying um badges or identification. Uh we've seen people abuse this already. What risk do we have?
▶ 1:18:50And I'd ask each of the members to kind of chime in very briefly. When we have armed guards that don't wear any identification, that don't show a badge, that hide their faces. I understand the argument that we have to protect the agents, but should there not be some duty to identify yourself as a duly appointed ICE agent to make sure that nefarious actors are not misusing this role to do things that are uh further illegal than we've already seen happen. real quickly.
▶ 1:19:18Yeah, we've already seen, as I said before, a huge number of cases around the country where people have impersonated ICE agents using masks and and it's a real problem in the country. I assume they're doing it because they have a fear that, you know, that they could be targeted. Certainly, there are violent groups that have targeted ICE and that's presumed. So, why don't all police officers do I don't know that they're being they're not being targeted. Yeah. But you don't think police officers being targeted? I I beg to differ.
▶ 1:19:45When was the last time a congress we see police officers may we see police officers being targeted on the street of America every single day they don't cover their face because they understand they have to protect and serve my time as you thank you sir your time is up too your time is up too sir your time sir your time is uplaiming my time reclaiming your time is uplaiming my time have no time themselves it's you are not going to overspeak me sir when you're You're doing it to
▶ 1:20:15me. So, you're not a member of Congress. God bless you. Amen. You both suspend. Chair now recognizes Representative Crane for his five minutes of Mr. Kenelli, would you like to finish your thoughts? Your first responsibility leading a law enforcement agency is the protection of your agents. That's that's first because if you can't do it's like the first rule of first aid. You have to take care of yourself before you can take care of the person next to you.
▶ 1:20:43We all get that instruction on the plane flight every day, right? And uh that applies at an agency level as well. We I cannot remember a time in my adult lifetime where one specific law enforcement agency was so personally targeted as ICE agents are being targeted today, including by members of this body.
▶ 1:21:05by members of this body who are willing to put at risk law enforcement officers that work for the federal government they re they are part of and um so you know they have body cams the people who go out on each I'll call it a mission are identified meaning you can go back and figure out what agents were on that when they misbehave I am not going to sit here and say police officers in any department never misbehave they do They're human
▶ 1:21:35beings and they make mistakes. Um, and they do things wrong intentionally sometimes. I'm not going to say ICE agents do that. That didn't happen while I was a deputy secretary. And if you're not willing to protect your own agents, uh, whether it's the Capitol Police or whether it's ICE, then you should you have no business sending them out on the street. That's immoral. Thank you. I'm going to move on to Dr. Camaroda.
▶ 1:22:01On January 16th, 2025, the Center for Immigration Studies posted the Beyond the Border podcast episode 187 titled Why Legal Immigration Numbers Matters. You and my colleague, Representative Chip Roy, provided a detailed assessment of how US Census Bureau data shows that President Trump handed Joe Biden a border that was under control. In fact, the data shows that inter international migrant crossings were at a 20-year low in Trump's final year in office.
▶ 1:22:31Joe Biden changed course in 2022 and increased the number of international immigrants to an all-time high. My question is this. Would you agree the Biden admin failed to utilize their authority to detect, repel, detain, and deport illegal immigrants and without the use of illegal parole, the US censored data wouldn't have detected an increase? Right.
▶ 1:22:53So in that data just during the Biden administration the foreignb born that's all immigrants grew by over 8 million and more than five million or about twothirds of that increase in the data and it misses people is new illegal immigrants and yes the decision not to detain people not to use expedited removal to end the remain in Mexico policy to end the cooperation agreements we had with the Central American countries and so on caused a surge in illegal immigration.
▶ 1:23:22Most experts think illegal immigration at least there was people coming and going in big numbers all the time but it was roughly stable in the previous decade but under President Biden it grew five or six million. Um now remember some people went home some got legalized and that's a pretty conservative estimate. Would you agree Democrats benefited from parrolling illegal immigrants through increased population counted in the census and added seats for congressional representation? Well, I have a very detailed study of that.
▶ 1:23:52Obviously, it didn't matter for 2020. It is true that is a general proposition that the arrival of immigrants in Democratic leading states tend to help Democrats. Also, the other big thing it does, it creates districts with relatively few citizens because the district lines are drawn based on total population. And those districts with relatively too few few American citizens do vote overwhelmingly Democratic. But that doesn't mean the illegals are voting or that the non-citizens voting.
▶ 1:24:22It's just the people who live around them are very much Democratic. But it does increase Democratic representation while the districts that are overwhelmingly comprised of American citizens tend to vote overwhelmingly Republican. So yes, there is a political dimension here. I'm not going to comment on the Democrats motives, but that does happen. Thank you, Mr. Coochinelli.
▶ 1:24:42According to the Department of Homeland Security, until Joe Biden parole was rarely used between 2014 and 2020, parole was used sparingly to admit between 11,000 and 54,000 immigrants each year. DHS data shows that Biden admin unlawfully expanded two parole programs that brought over a million illegals into the country under the opice of legal process.
▶ 1:25:06The Cuban, Haiti, Nicaragua, and Venezuela, or CHNV parole system ballooned illegal parole numbers in conjunction with the use of the CBP1 app. Between the two programs, an estimated 53 531,000 and 936,000 illegals were parrolled into the US just by registering for an asylum hearing.
▶ 1:25:30Additionally, DOJ DOJ data states that between 2021 and 2024, the number of absentee removal orders increased from under 50,000 prior to Biden to well over 200,000 under the Biden mass parole program, meaning that the paroleies weren't returning to their hearings just vanishing into the US. My question, do you believe former DHS Secretary Mayorcis was derelictked in the oversight of DHS for agency's unlawful use of the parole process?
▶ 1:26:00Uh, well, I would use the word derelict if this was unintentional. Um, and then the answer would be yes. Thank you. I yield back. Gentleman Mr. Chairman, I'd like to enter and for the to the record, I'd like to ask unanimous consent to enter into represent Carter, if we may, just given trying to make sure I'm balancing everyone's time and I gave you an extra minute. I'm trying to be careful. I just want to introduce this to the record. I have no no comment. Miss Johnson, would you yield? I'm about to recognize you. Would you yield to give him that opportunity to do so?
▶ 1:26:28I think I have to yield my time just to enter into the record. I shouldn't take away from her minutes. I'll be a moment. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I'd like to ask unanimous consent to enter uh a legal opinion from jail that found Mr. Cuchinelli did not lawfully serve in his position as deputy secretary of homeland security as he stated. Thank you. Without objection. So ordered. Mr. Johnson, you're now recognized for your five minutes. Uh thank you, Mr. Chairman.
▶ 1:26:56Um I want to uh respond to a couple of the comments. Uh the gentleman that was implying that uh illegal immigration benefited Democratic states is the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard of. I live in Texas. Uh we have I don't think anyone can state that there's a state out there that has more immigrants in it than the state of Texas. And it's very Republican. It's very red. And I also resent the hell out of the comment. I'm a I'm a dulyeleed member of Congress by citizens of my district.
▶ 1:27:25and to imply that Democrats are not elected by citizens of this country is outrageous and offensive and you should be ashamed of yourself. Um, next, you know, Mr. Chairman, you know, recipients of humanitarian parole programs, they don't want to leave their countries. They're here because they are fleeing harm and persecution. And we are the United States of America.
▶ 1:27:47We're supposed to be a beacon of refuge, a place that says, "Give me your poor, your tired, your huddled masses." We're here, but we're neglecting these very words by virtue of this committee hearing and what's happening in this Congress. In May, the administration announced the termination of temporary protected status for our Afghan allies, the brave Afghans who put their lives on the line to support our US troops.
▶ 1:28:10You you give all this sanctimony about protecting our first our lines of enforcers of ICE, but what about the troops? What about the people who put their lives on the line in foreign countries and we had to solicit assistance from brave people in this country who risk their lives to make sure that our troops were safe and that our mission could be ex uh handled and now and we said to them if you help us we will be there for you but not So now the US
▶ 1:28:40is home to over 200,000 Afghan allies. President of the nonprofit Afghan evac and military vet Sea Van Divver said, "We made a promise to our Afghan allies. And fulfilling that promise is not just a policy. It's about integrity. It's about honor and honoring the commitment. Thousands of troops are rallying behind our Afghan allies because they know the countless American lives there were saved because of them and their bravery. They bled and died for our country.
▶ 1:29:10And how are we repaying them? by sending them back with a death sentence. I find that to be morally outrageous. It is wrong. What is happening? What is happening? All you who serve bravely in our military who love to parade pomp and circumstance about the role and honor of our US military.
▶ 1:29:33And here we have of another country who will be killed and executed because they helped our men and women who bravely serve. That is not the America that we all know we should be. And I think to the other point, you're complaining about ICE and masks.
▶ 1:30:00I think it's wrong that ICE agents are masking themselves, hiding themselves, not properly identifying themselves. And the question is not, do you not support the men who serve in law enforcement's country, because we all do, but maybe you should be questioning the mission. Why is there so much push back? Why is there so much outrage of how they're handling their mission? Why are we not questioning that? I think we are.
▶ 1:30:28that the way they're doing it by running up on people, by coming and attacking people who are in this country legally. This country said, "Yes, you have temporary protected status. Yes, you can come here. You've come the right way." And now we're saying within very short notice, get the hell out. That is not fair. That is not right.
▶ 1:30:52that's putting these people who come here to fulfill their American dream, the tired, the poor, the huddled masses, come here and you can be free. It's just so wrong. And I think what we're seeing here is an outrage by the American people.
▶ 1:31:15And it's the leadership of this administration that is sending these into dangerous, harmful activities that is causing such a public outcry. Mr. Byer, I have a question. Can you please explain the consequences for the lives of these Afghans and what's going to happen to them when America breaks its promise to them and sends them back to be executed in Afghanistan for helping the United States of America? Yeah.
▶ 1:31:44So about 70,000 Afghans were parrolled into the United States. They came legally during the evacuation. I I guess the the the the opposition to that would be that we should have left them all there to be killed. Um I prefer that we did what we did. Some some bad actors were were part of that group. We identified those people and um that's appropriate. That's what vetting should do.
▶ 1:32:09But the vast majority of the people that we evacuated were people that we should be protecting and we should allow them to stay here uh permanently with a with a permanent status. We shouldn't have a temporary protected status. We should allow them to stay permanently and there's legislation to do that right because the next gentle lady's time has expired. I now recognize representative not for his five minutes of questioning. Thank you Mr. Chairman. You know, one of the great frustrations here is the conflation of legal immigration and illegal immigration.
▶ 1:32:39And the Democratic party has made a habit of painting it with one swoop. Republicans are against all immigrants. And that could not be further from the truth. And as someone who worked over the last decade prosecuting illegal immigrant criminals, I can tell you I have zero problems with them wearing masks. We have organized crime. We have violent crime.
▶ 1:33:01We have international criminal operations that are that are here in this country the likes of which few citizens can conceive of and they perform counter surveillance. They are sophisticated. They're ruthless and the level of violence that they operate in is a level that most Americans cannot conceive of. So I find it offensive that we are calling out our officers protecting themselves. No, I will not. No, I will not.
▶ 1:33:24And this idea that we can bring as many people into this country from anywhere in the world, no matter where they come from, no matter what they believe, no matter what culture they hail from, without consequence. And truly that it will only benefit this country is just laughable. It's just laughable. We have 40 million illegal immigrants in this country. And we just have to ask ourselves to Miss Johnson, how many of the world's poor can we bring in here in addition to the legal immigrants?
▶ 1:33:52In addition to the illegal immigrants before the American economy, before Americans are harmed, we can't even take care of our own poor and the thought that we could bring in millions and millions of illegals and then not have a detrimental effect in our country. I find it offensive. How many millions of lowskilled, illiterate individuals should we bring into the United States while our own children fall behind, while our own children are lagging in schools?
▶ 1:34:21Dozens of countries from around the world sanction extreme persecution for religious or political differences. Should we bring millions of those people into the United States? In many countries, you can be executed because you are a Christian, because you are a homosexual, because you disagree on a political matter. Should we bring 10, 20, 30, 50 million of those people into the country? This whole premise is absolutely outrageous.
▶ 1:34:46And the American people know that unchecked immigration on an illegal basis will bring this country to its knees. So conflating the two, illegal immigration, open borders, unchecked migration, mass migration into this country is only harmful. We could not be more robust in our favor for legal immigration. It is illegal immigration that we should be fighting against. The Democrats have not shifted one centimeter since November.
▶ 1:35:16They only advocate for open borders and unchecked illegal immigration. And I find it Now, Mr. Cuchinelli, there was a a lengthy discussion earlier that said that the ICE uh officers who are bravely trying to eradicate some of these criminals and get them out of the country are only operating on the basis of race. Again, I've worked with them. I think that is a grotesque overstatement, but I'll let you respond to it.
▶ 1:35:46So, when I was the deputy secretary and and overseeing ICE, uh, any operation, they didn't just wake up one day and say, "Who are we going to get today?" Uh, investigation, research, and preparation goes into every field operation that you see and don't see, These are people are not winging it. Uh, they're prepared. They're professionals. Um, they do this for a variety of reasons.
▶ 1:36:14One, to preserve the safety of everyone going out, including the people they're going to encounter. By the way, you bring enough force to maintain the so that no one is tempted to be violent. Uh, that's part of the preparation as you well know. Um, they execute on that plan and all the allegations here about, oh, they're just after this or that on that one soul thing. They just hitting people at Home Depot.
▶ 1:36:41That is just the biggest pile of horse manure I've heard in a long time. Gentleman yield. Nope. So, you know, the comment was made. Maybe it's the mission. I think she's right. That's not a reason that that's not a reason that law enforcement officers shouldn't be enforcing the law. You're Congress. If you don't like their mission, change the law. They are executing the law properly. and the whole question of masks.
▶ 1:37:07Um the the fact that people in the federal government um don't don't approve of ICE agents protecting themselves under situations and let's let's be really clear here. They're not threatening ICE agents, they're threatening their families, American citizens being arrested, families are being threatened. And I will say just in closing, Mr. Chairman, that there were roughly almost 3 million people grant temporary protective status. If each one of those people were given an hour, that's 330 years of government time to vet those people.
▶ 1:37:36I think it's laughable to assume that those people were properly vetted before they were brought into this country. I yield back. Gentleman's time has expired and he Mr. Chair, uh, represent, you are uh, you are recognized. Uh, Mr. Chair, I would like to ask for unanimous consent to enter a statement for the record from the AFL CIO that speaks to immigrants being vital members of the workforce. Without objection, so ordered.
▶ 1:38:06I want to thank the witnesses uh for your time, your testimony uh and the members for the questions and the dialogue. The members of the subcommittee may have some additional questions for the witnesses. We ask the witnesses to respond to these in writing. Pursuant to committee rule 7E, the hearing record will be held open for 10 days. Without objection, the subcommittee now stands adjourned.