▶ 0:19:11I've been, um. I want to, um, just say that, um, let's see. Am I going to say. >> the right to repair? >> I do I do support the idea of the right to repair so that people can have the right to, uh, to to fix their, uh, to fix their cars. And I want to, um.
▶ 0:19:45I also want to, um, yield at this time to. >> representative mullin. Mueller. Mueller. >> okay. I want to yield now to, uh, congressman mueller, um, to talk about this, someone who has, uh, a lot of work that he does when it comes to car safety. And I appreciate his efforts. So go ahead. >> thank you, ranking member schakowsky. Thank you, Mr.
▶ 0:20:15Chair, for convening this hearing. The bill is on the agenda today. Touch on important aspects of automotive safety. Nearly 40,000 people lose their lives on our roadways each year. That is a sobering statistic. And it underscores why congress has an obligation to act and get this right. Advances in vehicle technology, from driver assistance features to increasingly automated systems, hold enormous promise to reduce human error, avoid crashes, and save lives at the same time.
▶ 0:20:47Premature deployment, unclear standards or gaps in oversight can undermine safety and public trust. For some of my colleagues, avs may seem like something we can worry about in the future. But in my district in san francisco and along the san francisco peninsula, avs are already here. My constituents are riding in them every day. I've been riding in them myself and it's remarkable technology.
▶ 0:21:12It has the potential to make life safer and more convenient for everyone, including for seniors and those with disabilities who face mobility challenges. But it's also unchartered territory. We've seen the risks and outright hazards that they can cause. Yet I'm excited to see them develop. It just needs to happen safely. As we consider these bills, I hope we focus on a few core principles.
▶ 0:21:36First, safety must remain paramount, particularly as vehicles become more complex and less intuitive for consumers to understand. Second, transparency matters. Drivers and passengers deserve to know what a vehicle can and cannot do, and regulators need access to accurate data to assess performance and risk. And third, there is a strong need for a framework that ensures that safety standards keep pace with innovation.
▶ 0:22:04We don't need to view innovation and safety as competing priorities when done right. Strong guardrails actually accelerate innovation by providing certainty to manufacturers, clarity to consumers, and confidence to regulators. Clear federal standards can help ensure that new technologies are tested, rigorously, marketed honestly and deployed responsibly across the country. I look forward to hearing from our witnesses and engaging in a robust discussion on these bills.
▶ 0:22:34And with that, I yield back. >> gentle lady yields. Is that correct? Yes. Okay. All right. Uh, we have the next is the the chairman of the full committee, Mr. guthrie. I recognize you for five minutes. >> thank you. Thank you, Mr. chairman. Good afternoon, everybody. Thanks to all of our witnesses for being here. Appreciate you being here today.
▶ 0:22:56And we're here to examine proposals to modernize the automotive marketplace and strengthen motor vehicle safety, as well as the agency responsible for that mission, the national highway traffic administration. I want to start by saying that we have to work together on this, this these have to be bipartisan bills to move forward. And I enjoy working with my my good friend from new jersey, Mr. pallone.
▶ 0:23:20I think we can work together on this, and we look forward to making this lasting in an adorable way. If it's bipartisan, and I hope we can bring the same bipartisan spirit as we've done on other things to today. So the stakes couldn't be higher. Uh, the automotive sector is america's largest manufacturing base, supporting over 10 million jobs and contributing to more than 1 trillion to our economy.
▶ 0:23:42And my own background before congress is working in the automotive sector globally, our economic competitors like china are speeding ahead to expand vehicle production and accelerate innovation as american manufacturers work hard not just to keep up, but to remain global leaders. You hear jim farley from ford talk about how china can has the capacity to do 50 million cars. Uh, they need about 30 million means. They have a 20 million float.
▶ 0:24:10The american car industry is booming at about 17 to 18 million cars. That gives you, um, perspective. Many of the proposals before us today will address challenges to improve safety, promoting affordability and cementing american global automotive leadership. Among them are proposals to reform nhtsa by modernizing its research and regulatory mission and strengthening key motor vehicle programs, as well as the discussion draft establishing a federal framework to be to enable the deployment of autonomous vehicles.
▶ 0:24:39My friend, Mr. mullen, I've been in san francisco and I've they don't have many of those in kentucky, if any. But it's interesting to watch them drive by. Um, so it's, um, it's an interesting technology. And we will also need to carefully examine the full slate of proposals to prevent unintended consequences, such as worsening the affordability crisis or overburdening a resource constrained nhtsa.
▶ 0:25:01Our goal must be a set of clear and predictable solutions that allow the automotive industry to build the safest, most advanced, and the most affordable cars in the world right here at home. And we do a lot of cars in kentucky. My kentucky truck is right next to my district of rock and hit it for my district. In fact, the road old henry, named after henry ford at uh, is the border from my district. And all the corvettes in the world are made in bowling green, kentucky.
▶ 0:25:30So, um, I look forward to working with my colleagues on both sides of the aisle to get this right. I thank you, and I yield back. >> gentleman yields back. Now, recognize the ranking member of the full committee, Mr. pallone, for his five minutes. >> thank you.
▶ 0:25:47Chairman bilirakis, as as we consider the reauthorization of core motor vehicle safety programs administered by our nation's auto safety agency, the national highway traffic safety administration, or nhtsa, we must keep in mind the undeniable reality that tens of thousands of lives are lost on our roads every year. Nhtsa has an important mandate to save lives by establishing safety standards, investigating vehicle defects, and enforcing recalls.
▶ 0:26:14And we must ensure nhtsa has the staff, resources and authority it needs to protect americans on the roadways. And this is particularly important as the trump administration slams the brakes on safety progress. In 2025, the administration cut nhtsa staff by 25%, finished zero new safety rules, and cut in half the number of safety defect investigations. As a result, safety standards that congress mandated years ago are not yet complete or have been delayed.
▶ 0:26:43This includes rules to require new cars to deter drunk driving, avoid crashes, protect pedestrians, improve seatbelt usage, and avert child deaths in hot cars. And as we continue this reauthorization process, I look forward to working with chair guthrie to enhance safety, promote affordability, and ensure that nhtsa delivers on its safety promise.
▶ 0:27:02Now, I'm pleased to see that legislative proposals from democratic members addressing many of the leading and emerging causes of vehicle crash, fatalities and injuries are included in this hearing. We will consider proposals addressing driver distraction, drunk driving, vulnerable road users like pedestrians and bicyclists, and people getting trapped in cars when power is lost.
▶ 0:27:24We will also discuss bills tracking, transparency related to the safety of driverless cars, and consumer awareness about driver assistance features. Now my bill, the safety is not for sale act, promotes affordability and consumer choice. It lets consumers buying a new car choose proven safety features to protect their families without having to pay for luxury finishes or convenience features like leather seats or a moonroof.
▶ 0:27:53And this bill puts consumers and their safety first. The committee is also considering a bipartisan discussion draft, led by representatives dingell and latta to regulate autonomous vehicles. And avs are a transformative technology that has the potential to reduce deaths and injuries, increase mobility, drive growth, and bring environmental benefits.
▶ 0:28:13So it's critical that legislation prioritizes the safety of occupants and other road users like pedestrians, while also preserving access for first responders during emergencies, holding responsible parties accountable, and maintaining legal recourse for harm consumers. So I look forward to working with my colleagues on these issues, and I'd like to yield the balance of my time to the gentlewoman from michigan, miss dingell. >> thank you, rick, and ranking member pallone, and thank you to all of my colleagues. Everybody knows I'm a car girl.
▶ 0:28:45My home state put the world on wheels. And, uh, we've been the center of the american auto industry since henry ford first built those early cars. Our industry has been a ping pong ball for decades between conflicting political strategies. And it's never been worse. What our industry needs is certainty and a clear path forward.
▶ 0:29:05Every day, every day that we delay global competitors and foreign adversaries race ahead in areas like evs and autonomous vehicle innovation and deployment. Last year, china overtook the united states as the world's leading seller of evs, surpassing american automakers in the global ev sales for the first time. And let me be blunt, I never want to see that happen again.
▶ 0:29:33For decades, congress has worked in a bipartisan way on these issues, and I believe we need to continue to do so. We need to be working with the regulatory agencies to prioritize safety, protect consumer privacy, support innovation, strengthen domestic manufacturing, and ensure that american workers are part of the future of this industry.
▶ 0:29:56Safety is not partizan, and I look forward to discussing ways to strengthen auto safety and ensure that we have a fully functioning regulator. We must support long term investment, protect jobs, and stay competitive in a global marketplace. Moving full speed towards electrification and advanced vehicle technologies, but has been said by my colleagues.
▶ 0:30:21We need to protect consumers from emerging threats, make critical safety technologies accessible to all drivers, and address rising challenges such as the catalytic converter theft. And we must ensure safe repair, access and protect survivors from misuse of connected vehicle technologies. Our industry has always been a global leader.
▶ 0:30:45This leadership isn't guaranteed, but our responsibility is to help keep them together. I look forward to today's discussion and working together with members of this committee and all stakeholders industry, labor, the dealers, the trial attorneys, consumer safety groups, environmentalists to keep america's auto industry strong. Yield back. >> gentlelady yields back. Uh, and I welcome our witnesses today.
▶ 0:31:14Uh, miss hillary cain, uh, senior vice president of the alliance for automotive innovation. Welcome. Uh, Mr. bill. Uh henvey. President and ceo of the otter idol care association. Thank you so much for being here. Mr. michael brooks, executive director of the center for auto safety. Thanks for being here. And then, Mr.
▶ 0:31:41Finch fulton, uh, the government affairs advisor for k and l gates, thank you so much for being here. Now, I recognize miss kane. Uh, you're recognized for five minutes. >> good afternoon. I'm hillary kane, senior vice president of policy at alliance for automotive innovation. I'm grateful for the opportunity to share the auto industry's perspective on motor vehicle safety with you today.
▶ 0:32:07Let me say at the outset, safety is a top priority for the auto companies. We represent. Vehicles on the road today are the safest that they've ever been, because the auto industry has continued to invest in the testing, development and integration of increasingly advanced crash avoidance systems and crash protection technologies, systems and technologies that save lives and prevent injuries.
▶ 0:32:34And yet, we still experienced nearly 40,000 deaths on our roadways last year. This is a shocking and tragic number that is not acceptable to anyone. The question is, how do we further improve roadway safety without sacrificing our other shared goals like consumer choice, affordability and competitiveness?
▶ 0:32:59My written testimony outlines some specific policy recommendations for your consideration, including one. Modernizing the national highway traffic safety administration nhtsa's role in vehicle safety is essential. Nhtsa also supports our global competitiveness by enabling the united states to lead the world in the deployment of cutting edge and innovative automotive safety technologies the auto industry wants.
▶ 0:33:26It needs a regulator that is agile, transparent, and grounded in objective research and data. Fortunately, a reset appears to be underway. Nhtsa we've observed a commitment by the current administrator to retire outdated regulations that increase the cost of vehicles but don't meaningfully improve safety, and to revise existing regulations and implement new regulations to promote technological innovation and progress.
▶ 0:33:54These changes at nhtsa are welcome. Congress can support further agency reform by requiring nhtsa to develop and release a research and rulemaking roadmap, a roadmap to help ensure alignment between the regulator, the industry, and other stakeholders on where the agency is and where it is headed.
▶ 0:34:14Congress can also reimagine the new car assessment program to better incentivize the deployment of new vehicle safety technologies to empower car buyers with clear, comparable information about the safety of vehicles and to inform future safety regulation. Two implementing a national autonomous vehicle framework avs represent the next great leap in personal mobility.
▶ 0:34:40We believe avs will reduce crashes and congestion, provide transportation for seniors and people with disabilities, and transform how we live and work. Countries around the world are racing to shape the av future and dominate this space. But america must lead, and the best way to do that is with national standards that support the safe and immediate deployment of avs.
▶ 0:35:07That is why representative lada and dingell's efforts on the self drive act are important and worthwhile. We urge congress to get a federal av bill across the finish line as fast as possible. Three protecting consumer choice for safe and proper vehicle repairs. Automakers continue to support right to repair vehicle. Owners should be able to get their vehicles fixed anywhere they want.
▶ 0:35:34The good news is that automakers already provide independent repairers with all the information, instruction, tools and codes necessary to properly and safely fix a vehicle. We appreciate doctor dunn's tireless work on this issue, and are committed to working with the committee to enact a comprehensive federal right to repair law, one that doesn't force automakers to provide aftermarket parts manufacturers or auto parts retailers with data that isn't necessary to diagnose or repair
▶ 0:36:05A vehicle, one that properly protects the intellectual property of automakers, and one that addresses some of the key challenges that remain in the vehicle repair space, including the power of insurance companies to dictate where and how a consumer's vehicle is repaired. The upcoming surface transportation reauthorization bill is an ideal opportunity to reform vehicle safety policy, while strengthening consumer choice and affordability and ensuring the united states remains globally competitive.
▶ 0:36:37The greatest risk to our competitiveness is not a lack of innovation. Fragmented policy, outdated rules, regulatory delays and uncertainty are slowing our ability to bring the safest, most affordable and globally competitive technologies to the marketplace. Thank you. I'm looking forward to your questions. >> thank you very much. Uh, Mr. henry, you're recognized for five minutes. Thank you. >> good afternoon.
▶ 0:37:02Chairman bilirakis, ranking member schakowsky, and members of the subcommittee. My name is bill hanvey, and I am the president and ceo of the auto care association, representing the entire supply chain of the automotive aftermarket. I started in this business more than 40 years ago, working my way up from the ground floor.
▶ 0:37:23And I'm now extremely proud to represent our $500 billion industry, with more than 525,000 businesses who service more than 298 million vehicles on the road today. On behalf of the 4.9 million employees who call our industry home, I want to thank you for inviting me here today to testify.
▶ 0:37:45The auto care association's top priority on behalf of its members and all vehicle owners, is the inclusion of the repair act in the safety title of the surface transportation reauthorization act. The repair act represents the most complete and thoroughly reviewed bill that will immediately enhance safety for vehicle owners.
▶ 0:38:08I am grateful for the continued support of so many of you who have worked with doctor dorn and stakeholders to improve this legislation. At each step of the process, doctor dunn has worked tirelessly with this subcommittee and all interested parties, resulting in the current repair act, which incorporates priorities of the members of this committee, automakers, the aftermarket and consumer groups.
▶ 0:38:36Our industry performs more than 70% of the out of warranty repairs. But over the last ten years, with the introduction of wirelessly transmitted vehicle data or telematics, owners have seen threats to their repair choices.
▶ 0:38:55Vehicle manufacturers are increasingly restricting access to repair and maintenance data, forcing vehicle owners into franchise dealers where costs are on average 36% higher and repair wait times are significantly longer. The need for the repair act is critical in real. Today's vehicles are essentially computers on wheels.
▶ 0:39:21Manufacturers use secure gateways to block aftermarket access to repair and maintenance data. And make no mistake about it, automakers unilaterally control the data, not the owner of the vehicle. It may be your car, but currently it's the manufacturer's data to do with it whatever they choose.
▶ 0:39:42A survey of independent repair shops concluded that they send, on average, 1 to 5 vehicles each month back to the dealership due to data restrictions costing consumers millions and added repair expenses. This problem will only get exponentially worse if congress does not act now. The repair act is also an economic issue.
▶ 0:40:07Imagine the plumber who has one truck and has to wait three days to get it fixed at the dealership because the local repair shop can't access the truck's data. That is three days of lost productivity and many disgruntled customers.
▶ 0:40:22The repair act has real consequences for working men and women across the country, which is why it has been supported by so many organizations like the national federation of independent businesses, the national independent automotive dealers association and the national association of truck stop owners, equal access to repair and maintenance data is critical to a thriving aftermarket.
▶ 0:40:51Our members in your districts are the cornerstones in their communities. They provide jobs, pay taxes, and provide a reliable service for your constituents who need their vehicles to drive to their jobs and get their children to daycare. Without the repair act, vehicle owners will experience skyrocketing repair costs, increased wait times, and the elimination of consumer choice.
▶ 0:41:20The subcommittee is also considering several other pieces of legislation today that aim to enhance passenger, vehicle and pedestrian safety. Chairman guthrie's plan to empower nhtsa to be proactive in its rulemaking on safety standards is a welcome effort, and representative harshbarger's adas functionality and integrity act is needed to ensure vehicle owners can make modifications without the fear of jeopardizing the safety of
▶ 0:41:51Their vehicle. I commend all sponsors of the legislation on the docket for finding ways to make our roads and vehicles safer, and our association stands ready to work with them and the committee on this legislation as it moves through the legislative process. Thank you. >> thank you, Mr. henry. I now recognize Mr. brooks for your five minutes.
▶ 0:42:26>> good afternoon, and thank you. Chairman, ranking member schakowsky and members of the subcommittee for holding this important hearing today. My name is michael brooks, and I am executive director of the center for auto safety. Since 1970, the center has served as an independent voice for consumers dedicated to improving vehicle safety and quality for the benefit of everyone on american roads.
▶ 0:42:51During that time, the center has continually pressed for the introduction of proven vehicle safety technology into the nation's fleet as soon as possible. Today's hearing focuses on a range of legislative proposals, the bulk of which are geared toward issues involving the safe development and deployment of new technologies by the automotive and auto autonomous vehicle industry.
▶ 0:43:14While a number of the legislative options presented for consideration in today's hearing would undoubtedly increase the safety of modern cars, other proposals are more accurately described as anti-consumer gifts to the auto and av industry that would degrade current federal safety authorities and eliminate state and local consumer laws that have long served to protect road users in our communities.
▶ 0:43:42The united states is currently lagging far behind other developed countries in terms of fatality and injury, injury rates on our roads, and loosening already weak federal protections is an unacceptable solution to this failure to do so, while simultaneously crippling the ability of state regulators to react and respond to safety and other threats posed by unproven technologies is unprecedented.
▶ 0:44:08And while the auto industry is abuzz with the introduction of features to increase human convenience and access to creature comfort features, as well as highly aspirational but unproven claims about the future of automated vehicle utility and safety, automakers continue to drag their collective feet when it comes to the introduction of proven safety technology that could dramatically decrease the carnage on our nation's roads in the immediate future.
▶ 0:44:36Better automatic emergency braking that protects everyone on the road. Active and effective speed prevention, tech impairment detection and prevention systems, and effective driver monitoring could be deployed broadly on new vehicles to address the contributing causes most often cited in the nearly 40,000 fatalities and 2.5 million injuries on us roads annually.
▶ 0:45:05Instead of actions that seek to prop up automaker economics at the expense of established consumer safety protections, congressional efforts should be focused on supporting the mission of the national highway traffic safety administration. Effective safety research, data collection, defects investigation, and standard setting are challenging assignments that have become even more difficult due to the complexity of modern vehicles.
▶ 0:45:32This job won't get easier in the future, and rapidly evolving technology often overtakes the agency's ability to research and respond in a manner that is acceptable to both automakers and the safety community. Closing this gap is critical to reducing the toll of traffic crashes on our roads, and ensuring that industry can work effectively with nhtsa.
▶ 0:45:56There must be federal involvement to create rules and oversight, fostering an environment that can iteratively introduce innovative vehicle technology safely to the market, thus laying the groundwork for consumer confidence. Creating and enforcing safety standards.
▶ 0:46:13As one of the most useful tools at the federal government's disposal to assist in achieving the department of transportation and nhtsa core mission of saving lives, preventing injuries, and reducing economic costs due to road traffic crashes. By writing minimum performance standards for vehicles and components, nhtsa can provide a baseline on which both manufacturers and consumers know they can rely.
▶ 0:46:38Further, automotive history has repeatedly shown that absent regulation requiring the adoption of life saving technology, safety is typically only available as an option or for an additional price, and that's a price that's frequently paid by everyone on the road. The promise of such technology, in combination with smarter infrastructure and a dedication to consumer rights, is a safer world for all, starting right now.
▶ 0:47:07The perils are our continued acceptance of more than 100 deaths a day each year, and trying to explain to our grandchildren why we ignored a public health crisis for which solutions were readily available. Thank you. >> gentleman yields back. Thank you very much for your testimony. And now I'll ask Mr. fulton to give his testimony. You're recognized for five minutes. >> thank you.
▶ 0:47:36Chairman bilirakis, ranking member schakowsky, chairman of the full committee. Guthrie. And the ranking member of the full committee. Pallone. And all members of this committee for holding this important hearing today. I am grateful and honored to come before you to testify. My name is finch fulton. I am a government affairs advisor at cal gates, where I lead our transportation and infrastructure policy practice. However, I speak on behalf of myself today and do not necessarily represent the opinions of my firm or any of my clients.
▶ 0:48:05In addition to my time serving as a staffer in both the house of representatives and the senate, I previously served as the deputy assistant secretary for policy at the at the us department of transportation, and was nominated by president trump to be assistant secretary during the first trump administration. There, I led the development of key automated vehicle policies for the department, including automated driving systems 2.0, which focused on the safety of automated vehicles and continues to serve as the cornerstone for the efforts of the federal government in this area.
▶ 0:48:35Ab 3.0 expanded the scope of this effort to all on road vehicles and clarified the role of the state, local, and tribal governments in regulating these technologies. Av 4.0, which is an effort led through the white house by michael kratsios, now advisor to the president, ensured a whole of government approach to ensuring american leadership in automated vehicle technologies.
▶ 0:48:58And finally, the automated vehicle comprehensive plan, which brought together the research, the policies, the enforcement actions and the efforts, including regulatory updates to enable the full and safe integration of automated vehicles into our national transportation system. I also helped support the development of the department's draft rulemaking for automated driving system safety. The framework the first time the department considered how to regulate the operations of the vehicle, not just the equipment on a vehicle.
▶ 0:49:25A key component to this rulemaking was the prioritization and consideration of requirements for safety case to be completed for automated driving systems operations. Safety cases are structured arguments supported by evidence that help prove vehicle safety before public road operations. Innovators can and should be able to meet these high performance based standards. I urge the committee to continue supporting this work.
▶ 0:49:49After my time in government, I worked as the vice president of policy and strategy at an autonomous vehicle startup called locomotion. There, I personally worked on developing and publishing our voluntary safety self-assessments, a key safety tool very similar to the safety assessment letters endorsed by this committee and included in the first self drive act and passed by the house back in 2017, I served on the ul 4600 and j3068 standard development committees, working to develop and standardize the approaches to safety cases for automated
▶ 0:50:20Vehicles, as well as the naming conventions for these technologies. Lastly, I've served for years on the board of the partners for automated vehicle education, which focuses on educational efforts to inform the public on the capabilities and limitations of automated vehicles. I have long been a supporter of the benefits that advanced vehicle technologies like automated driving systems, can bring to the safety, efficiency, and accessibility of our transportation system.
▶ 0:50:43As you are all aware and have voiced, one of the greatest calamities facing our nation is the number of crashes, injuries, and deaths occurring on our roadways. Every year. Approximately 40,000 roadway fatalities are occurring and these are more than numbers. They are family members, friends and loved ones whose deaths leaves homes shattered and hearts permanently broken.
▶ 0:51:07Speeding is still a critical factor in about a third of these fatalities, as is drunk driving, and statistics for distracted and drowsy driving are unreliable but also make up a significant portion. We've also seen that while unbelted passengers only make up about 8% of the driving population, they make up about 45% of the fatalities. There are overlap in these grim statistics, as drunk drivers may also speed and neglect to wear their seatbelts, but we've seen that in 94% of crashes on roadway fatalities occurring on our roads.
▶ 0:51:36The final critical factor. But for these reasons, these crashes would not have occurred. We can debate what new issues may arise, but I have no doubt that responsible and thoughtful legislators, regulators, safety advocates, innovators, parents, families and friends will find new ways to address new issues that could potentially arise with the introduction and integration of these technologies. There are many critical provisions being considered by this committee today, and I look forward to discussing them all, particularly the self drive act.
▶ 0:52:06We need congress to act assertively to support the safe and full integration of these life saving american technologies for the benefit of american people and people around the world. Thank you and I look forward to your questions. >> thank you, Mr. fulton. Uh, I will begin the questioning and recognize myself for five minutes. Start off with miss keene.
▶ 0:52:27Can you discuss how research into wheelchair securement systems can help improve safety of wheelchair users? >> yes. Thank you so much for this question and your interest in this issue. My mom was a wheelchair user, so I'm particularly sympathetic to what you're trying to accomplish here. Um, so nhtsa's research has shown time and time again that the highest crash safety risk for wheelchair users is misuse of wheelchair securement systems.
▶ 0:52:57Um, uh, you know, when wheelchair users are properly secured, um, in their wheelchairs, the users can benefit from existing safety features like airbags and seat belts. So obviously those things will significantly reduce injury and risk of death. The thinking is, if you have an automated securement system, that you can address some of the misuse that happens when wheelchairs are manually secured. It also obviously increases the opportunity for wheelchair user independence.
▶ 0:53:28When we're talking about autonomous vehicles, not having to have somebody travel with them, um, we're really supportive of all the work that's been going on on this at nhtsa and elsewhere. Um, we support more research. We support all efforts to accelerate the development of this important technology and really appreciate your leadership on this topic. >> my pleasure. And, uh, it's very important to my constituents. I have a lot of wheelchair users, uh, in my family as well.
▶ 0:53:55So, uh, miss cane, uh, can you discuss how partnerships between oems, firefighters and fire rescue can help address uncontrolled battery fires and ensure the safety of firefighters and the general public? Please. >> yes. Thank you also for your interest in this topic. There's obviously a lot of attention on it.
▶ 0:54:20Um, so available data shows just to level set that evs actually catch fire less often than gas powered vehicles. However, the fires in evs, they burn differently than fires in gas powered vehicles. They burn hotter, they burn longer. Um, and so as a result of that, it requires new training and new firefighting techniques. Um, we we are focused on helping to disseminate that information to as many first responders as it can be disseminated to.
▶ 0:54:47We have worked with the national fire protection association, for example, on the development of sort of best practices around firefighting techniques, training protocols, that sort of thing. Also work directly with, uh, first responders to disseminate that training information, help get them trained. More needs to be done. There is no doubt that the solution to this issue is better training and more collaboration. And so we welcome any and all ideas that that you or anybody else on the committee has about how to foster more collaboration.
▶ 0:55:18>> okay. Let's stay on this again. Uh, I work with my state legislator. Uh, meg weinberger, and she does an outstanding job. But again, this is a federal issue, so we've got to stay on this, please. All right. Uh, Mr. fulton, avs have a significant potential to provide independence to persons with disabilities and seniors.
▶ 0:55:45Can you discuss how the self-drive, uh, discussion draft will help increase mobility options for seniors and persons with disability? >> thank you for the question, Mr. chairman.
▶ 0:55:57Uh, certainly, we see this as a valuable tool to increasing accessibility not only for others, but for each and every one of us, the average american, the vast majority of americans will, uh, will live through transportation, limiting disabilities at some point in their life, whether it because of something that happens to them, something that happens within them, or if we may be so lucky, just through the natural processes of aging.
▶ 0:56:21Studies have shown that autonomous vehicles can provide can access to 4.4 million jobs for people with disabilities a year and 9.2 million jobs across the us. That would be a 4.1% increase in employment. Um, and the when you combine all of the issues with bringing people off of rolls and putting them into jobs, the total federal net improvement in revenue and savings is estimated to be over $120 billion a year.
▶ 0:56:49As we look at ways to make this technology and to think about accessibility, to build an accessibility on the front, we need to be thinking through the cognitive, the visual, the mobility impairments that we may come into play. And by building towards a goal of universal accessibility, we can take all the billions of dollars of investments being made today, focus them on this, and not wait for the future of a perfectly universally accessible vehicle to start incorporating these lessons learned today.
▶ 0:57:18We can use them to improve the accessibility of our transportation systems today, not just in the future. >> very good. Let's stay on that too. And I have a lot of folks in my district, uh, that, uh, particularly in the rural areas, they have difficulty with public transportation. It's just limited. Uh, and this could really help them out a great deal.
▶ 0:57:42So, uh, and I appreciate all of your, your question, your answers to my questions, and I'll yield back and now recognize the ranking member of the subcommittee, Mr. schakowsky, for her five minutes of questioning. >> yes. >> so, Mr. uh, Mr.
▶ 0:58:05Brooks, I know that your job is really to look how consumers can do the best that they can to make auto safety and the kinds of messages that we should be learning about.
▶ 0:58:22And that's, uh, and I'm very excited about the work that you do and that you're, uh, focused most on, um, what I, what I wanted to, um, ask you are what are the most important things that everyday people should know when they're driving their car, the things that they need to do to make sure that they're safe as
▶ 0:58:53Possible. >> sorry. Well, I think if you look at the data, there are really great clues that primarily on what consumers should or should not be doing when they're driving a car, I mean, we know that speeding that, um, uh, drunk drunk driving and drunk driving and that distracted driving contributes significantly to the fatality and injury tolls
▶ 0:59:23On our roads. And, you know, ultimately, that's something that consumers need to be aware of and avoid those behaviors. And also, you know, what we've recognized over time is that there are some drivers who are not going to obey the lessons that they could be learning. Um, and that's where vehicle technology can step in and prevent speeding, prevent drunk driving.
▶ 0:59:49Um, make sure that if someone's distracted, their vehicle is able to stop for a pedestrian or for another vehicle in front of it. Um, and those are technologies that are available and could be installed on vehicles starting tomorrow. Um, but they're not yet. And that's primarily because of a number of reasons. There's some resistance by the industry to putting those technologies into all vehicles on the road.
▶ 1:00:17Um, the industry's often focused on selling some safety technologies as part of other packages. Um, and additionally, um, you know, the the national highway traffic safety administration moves very slowly in putting rules into place and mandates into place that get this technology into vehicles.
▶ 1:00:43Um, and that would that that's probably something that, that most consumers should know about. >> so are we making progress in training drivers to do better? Um, and what do we need to do to make sure that we're having more safety in the cars and that people should be aware of?
▶ 1:01:09>> well, in terms of drivers, I think that we are lacking in, you know, state educational efforts from drivers and and licensing and training of new drivers, um, and monitoring drivers as they go through life and ensuring that they're able to continue operating vehicles safely.
▶ 1:01:27Um, beyond that and beyond the human element, we know that humans are going to fail and that there may, despite the amount of new, no matter how much education you give them, there are consumers that aren't going to be able to respond to it and operate vehicles safely.
▶ 1:01:46And in those circumstances, we think it's, you know, very important, maybe more important than and definitely, in our opinion, more important than getting, you know, autonomous vehicles on the road is getting technology into the vehicles that americans operate in bulk. Um, now, as soon as possible so that the next 50 years, as you know, autonomous vehicles come onto our roads.
▶ 1:02:10We're still protecting the great majority of of folks that are driving on our roads and cars that aren't autonomous. >> so what are the most important things? >> this is really what your job is to is to inform consumers about some of the best things that they can do to make sure for the safety, the safety that they need there. >> I mean, there are many things that consumers should do.
▶ 1:02:37I think most importantly would be focusing on following the rules of the road and, and the state traffic laws that, that, that are there to protect them. And in addition to that, when they are buying cars or renting cars, make sure that they're looking at the safety information that's available about those vehicles to ensure that they're putting themselves in in a safe vehicle. >> since that's your job, what are the things that you emphasize when you are addressing consumers?
▶ 1:03:07Um, to, to make it safer? >> mostly, I would emphasize, and we talked to a lot of consumers about their purchase of a new vehicle. So we spend a lot of time pointing them in the direction of the, you know, the national, the national highway traffic safety administration ncap program results, the insurance for the insurance institute's ratings as well.
▶ 1:03:33Um, mainly because we want folks to be able to empower themselves to to purchase a vehicle that can keep them safe. >> well, my time is up, but thank you so very much for the work that you do appreciate you. >> gentlelady yields back. Now recognize the chairman of the full committee, Mr. guthrie, for his five minutes of questioning. >> thank you, Mr. chairman. Thanks, everybody, for being here today. This is an important hearing.
▶ 1:04:00Um, I was just thinking, as we're talking about, um, the cars I have now have backing cameras and I don't think I ever backed up, ever, without looking back and checking behind me until I got a backing camera. And I just wonder if sometimes there's a moral hazard, sometimes all. There's somebody on the song. I'm glad I looked. I guess I do it by habit, but sometimes I don't realize I do. It is because we make it so. We think it's so safe, but we still can't dismiss the the human element that we have to have to do.
▶ 1:04:29Um, and I know when you talk with executives in the car industry, there are big concerns about affordability. How do we make products that people can afford to buy? We want them safe. Uh, we want them affordable. So, miss kane, how can excessive regulatory mandates on manufacturers and other in the automotive industry adversely affect automotive affordability, increased costs? >> yeah. Thank you. Thank you for the question. And thank you for your interest in this topic.
▶ 1:04:55Um, there's no doubt that there are a number there are a variety of factors that go into the price of a vehicle and that impact affordability. I think there's also no doubt, um, that antiquated, outdated, unnecessary and duplicative regulations are one such contributor.
▶ 1:05:10Um, when we look at safety regulation, I think, uh, what we would we would urge for you all and for policy makers in general, is to to seek a balanced approach, a balanced approach that promotes safety but also strengthens consumer choice and affordability. And that's a very difficult balance to make. I'm not implying that it's easy.
▶ 1:05:31Um, so one of the things that we're very excited about is, is, uh, some of the reforms that that you are proposing as part of the motor vehicle modernization act, we think that these reforms will give nhtsa the tools and the flexibility. And can. >> you talk about the vehicle cap and and the, um, yep. In the duration of the exemption, the shot clock? Yeah. >> so thank you. >> for that. >> the exemption process is a critical program for getting new safety technologies into the market.
▶ 1:05:58The problem is the program isn't being used as much as it was used in the past because it's become opaque, unpredictable. And to your point, the caps on the number of vehicles and the length of those exemptions make it almost an unusable program for the industry right now. And we think it's a critical one for new innovative safety technologies. >> and also to you, Mr. and Mr. fulton, if you want to go first and miss, can't catch your breath there.
▶ 1:06:23Um, autonomous vehicles are the center of technology competition with china and have the potential to save lives and reduce traffic fatalities. Can you discuss how the self drive act will help achieve these critical objectives? >> certainly, the self drive act would provide one federal framework for automated vehicle companies to need to achieve before introducing automated vehicles onto the roadway. And I see this playing out very differently from how it plays out in china.
▶ 1:06:50If china has one superpower in this world, it's the ability to just direct where industry should go and they go. No debate, no discussions. Clear path forward. In the us, we have a much better system. And the way I've seen this play out over the last decade is, for example, the energy and commerce committee spoke definitively about a decade ago passing the self drive act in the house of representatives did the same. Key areas were included in there, and the example I would use are the safety assessment letters.
▶ 1:07:16Now, the national highway traffic safety administration and dot under the trump administration, incorporated that and then started promoting the voluntary safety self assessments. Similar to the safety assessment letters. 12 key areas that manufacturers and innovators needed to hit as they tested and developed automated vehicles. Throughout the process, we saw that continue further in states like california and pennsylvania, arizona, texas, florida as they consider different ways to do this.
▶ 1:07:42And so as I look at the self drive act today, I don't see preemption, I see agreement, I see the nation coming together on a clear path forward, endorsing the safety case approach to proving the safety of an automated vehicle before it's introduced into the national roadways and introduced into commerce. We've done our job. We've worked in a federalist society to get an agreement on the right path forward, and this committee is leading the way once again.
▶ 1:08:07So if this committee can come together, pass this bill, which includes this approach to it that we've been working on as a nation for a decade, we will overcome china's superpower of simplicity and direction, and we will do and we will be able to continue to beat them in this technology. >> thank you. As we compete with them in so many ways, ai, all the other things. And I consistently say we're not competing with europe to regulate. We're competing with china to innovate. However, having said that, we don't want to be china in terms of just direct where you go. We want people to have a say.
▶ 1:08:36Um, and obviously there's I was going to let Mrs. king go, but I'll, I'll finish because I'm about out of time. But we'll, uh, we clearly have a national standard that we need was clearly within our jurisdiction within interstate commerce. Not many self-driving cars are made in or any cars made in one state and only sold in one state. So we are it's clearly within our purview, and we have to do it in a way that doesn't have. We can't have 50 different patchwork standards. We can't compete with china.
▶ 1:09:01If we do that, we need a national standard that's robust, gives people assurity and safety and allows us to compete. So I will that's what we're working on and hopefully we can work on it together. And we certainly are trying to do that. And I will yield back. >> very good I appreciate it. I agree and I understand Mr. ladders bill a few years ago passed the house unanimously, uh, so we can get this done in a bipartisan fashion. All right. I'll recognize, uh, Mr.
▶ 1:09:28Pallone for his five minutes of questioning. >> thank you. Chairman bilirakis, research by consumer reports and national consumer league has found that life saving car safety features are often sold only on luxury models or as part of expensive add on packages with other features like lavish seats and premium infotainment systems.
▶ 1:09:51So my bill, the safety is not for sale act, will let consumers choose the common safety features they want, rather than effectively being forced to purchase non-safety options in order to access features that could reduce the risk of crashes and injuries. My questions are Mr. brooks and I have three, so I'm going to try to get through all three. But the first one, Mr. brooks says. How will improving the accessibility of safety options for new car buyers improve affordability and the safety of everyone on our roads?
▶ 1:10:20>> well, I believe the way it will work effectively is that more consumers will be willing to buy, uh, safety equipment that's offered optionally when it's not tied to more expensive vehicle packages. So it allows individual consumers when they're buying a car to select safety options and not select a lot of junk that they don't want or need.
▶ 1:10:44Um, which is going to increase the amount of optional safety equipment items that are in cars on the road. And that's going to make ensure that that safety equipment proliferates across the population of all vehicles on the road quicker than it would if consumers didn't have that ability. >> well thank you. Now, nasa has the mandate to reduce traffic accidents and deaths by establishing safety standards and conducting research.
▶ 1:11:10Yet the trump administration is impeding progress on this mandate. Three safety updates completed in 2024 that will save hundreds of lives each year have been delayed at the request of industry investigations into car safety defects dropped in half and progress on new safety standards stopped completely. Nissan needs a new path forward to deliver for the american people. So second question, Mr.
▶ 1:11:34Brooks, how does congress need to reform nhtsa's processes, authority, staffing or funding so it delivers the safety gains americans were promised? >> nhtsa needs a lot of support. You know, they they get significantly less support per fatality than than the airline industry and the faa or someone like that for interest for, for example. So I think it's important that nhtsa receives a lot more funding as vehicles become more complex.
▶ 1:12:02Modern vehicles are more complex than ever. They're turning into computers on wheels, knits, and needs more software experts. We've got artificial intelligence powering vehicles in the future, and there are a lot of questions around things like, how do you repair a defect in an artificial intelligence that's controlling a vehicle's movement?
▶ 1:12:23The agency is going to need this committee and congress's support generally, to be able to keep up with the new technology as it comes out. And I think their ability to keep up with new technology is going to make it easier for the industry to work with nhtsa, and it's also going to prevent, uh, you know, them, the delay, the inevitable delays and lack of response that we often see coming out of the agency.
▶ 1:12:55>> all right. Thank you. And I'm trying to get to my third question. Um, the new car assessment program, also known as five stars for safe cars, has been a priority of mine for years, and this program has helped consumers compare new vehicles when making a purchase and encourage motor vehicle manufacturers to make safety improvements. However, over time, it's not been as useful due to technology's changing faster than the ratings, and nearly all manufacturers earning 4 or 5 stars. So last question, Mr.
▶ 1:13:22Brooks, what needs to be done to reform this program and restore it as a valuable tool for consumers and a safety incentive for manufacturers, if you will. >> right. I mean, the power of ncap is setting new tests and standards frequently so that they can discriminate between vehicles and vehicle offerings from different auto companies.
▶ 1:13:43What's happened in the last couple of decades is we're seeing a very large number of vehicles getting four and five stars, and when that happens, consumers have less ability to discriminate between the manufacturer's offerings, and manufacturers have less incentive to make improvements to their vehicles in order to achieve five star ratings, which are, you know, kind of a coveted award for use in advertising and marketing of these vehicles.
▶ 1:14:09Um, so that that would be the number one thing I would recommend for ncap. >> but is it possible that this because they're all doing better, or it's just that, well, when you leave. >> when you, when you, when you, when you leave a test the same for, you know, 20 or 30 years. It needs. >> to. >> be updated to design to it. >> needs to be updated. All right. Thanks a lot. Thank you, Mr. chairman. >> gentleman yields back and, uh, we'll recognize the vice chairman of the subcommittee, Mr. folger, for his five minutes of questioning.
▶ 1:14:40>> thank you, Mr. chairman. Uh, miss cane, I envision a a world where, um, my insurance rates are increased because they get access to data that says that I exceeded the speed limit x number of times, or perform some driving behavior that was against their standards.
▶ 1:15:07Or maybe a world where a rental car company refuses to rent me a car, or requires me to purchase their insurance, or gives me a higher rate because they have access to that same data, are my fears worthy? >> um, there you are right to have these fears.
▶ 1:15:33Um, but let me tell you a little bit about what we've tried to do as an auto industry to make sure that your fears aren't realized. Um, so back in 2014, the auto industry, uh, did a set of privacy principles, essentially privacy code of conduct that governs the collection and use of vehicle data. Um, it's enforceable by the federal trade commission. Um, which is something that's very important to us.
▶ 1:15:56And one of the restrictions that is in that code of conduct is a prohibition on sharing sensitive vehicle data with any third parties in the absence of the affirmative consent of the vehicle owner. And we talk about sensitive vehicle data. We're talking about things like location information, driver behavior information, which is probably something you don't want your insurance company to have. Um, and biometric data. >> so it was a follow up to that.
▶ 1:16:21I think I understand what you're saying, but if I, if I'm an automaker and I know that I have to turn over that data or at least provide access to it, wouldn't I be concerned about intellectual property being leaked out? >> yeah, sure. I think that would be absolutely be something that that we would need to think about and be concerned about.
▶ 1:16:52>> Mr. hanvey, I'm going to I'm going to go back to that same question for you. My fears with the insurance companies in the car rental companies and so on and so forth. Are those justified? >> uh, they are justified. Congressman, and thank you for your question. Um, and that's why the repair act is a very limited piece of legislation that only includes vehicle repair and maintenance data.
▶ 1:17:17Uh, the automakers are, uh, compiling, uh, personal data and and selling that on, uh, in the marketplace. But from an insurance standpoint, the repair act is not an insurance bill. It it simply allows for the consumer to be able to choose where, when and how their vehicle is being repaired. >> so can you talk to that? I think I understand what you're saying, but can you talk to me about controls a little bit?
▶ 1:17:47Uh, do you certainly. What kind of controls are in place realistically may ensure that what you're saying is true? >> certainly. And we take that very seriously.
▶ 1:17:59And this version of the repair act ensures that our industry would access the data using the same cryptographic and technological protections as an oem dealer or any other third party authorized recipient from the automakers. We're not asking for anything more. We're not asking for anything less. It's using the same secure protocols that the automakers are using.
▶ 1:18:27And let me reiterate that that's only for vehicle repair and maintenance data. >> all right. Thank you for that. I've got about a minute left. Miss kane, I'm going to ask you on the innovation issue. Do you believe that the motor vehicle modernization act will actually enable nhtsa to keep pace with innovation at the rate that it's going right now? >> uh, we think these are critical reforms for being able to put the agency on the path to being able to do that. Yes. >> okay.
▶ 1:18:57So realistically, is that going to happen? I mean, uh, I realize you say the tools, but I'm looking for a little bit more here. >> yeah, I sure hope so. I really hope so. The the industry does need a regulator that is keeping up with the pace of innovation. Um, 100%. >> okay. Um, Mr. chairman, I do have more, but it's going to take more than 20s to answer them. So I'll submit those in writing and I yield. >> gentleman yields back. Thank you. And now we'll recognize Mr.
▶ 1:19:25Soto from the great state of florida for his five minutes of questioning. >> and what a great state it is. Chairman, what an exciting day. We're finally here today discussing autonomous vehicles, a fascinating new trend in us transportation. And as technology advances, it can improve mobility, vehicle safety and more. And they're already here in florida's ninth congressional district. We have beep, the longest running autonomous public transit in the nation at lake nona.
▶ 1:19:54And, uh, you know, just a few weeks ago, my friend has a tesla model x, and I was very surprised. I saw his vehicle pull out of parallel parking, take local roads, then the highway, and end up at our destination nearly nine miles away. And at no point did he actually need to touch the steering wheel.
▶ 1:20:18Uh, and I think not everybody understands how advanced some of these self-driving technologies are. We also have waymo that just announced its arrival in orlando to help shuffle millions of tourists in the the theme park capital of orlando. Uh, and I have three concerns that we have to continue to address as we're looking through this. First, ensure strong safety standards and collecting data and support. We have a couple of bills today to do that.
▶ 1:20:45Second access, making sure our seniors, americans with disabilities, young people continue to get access. This is about getting americans around the nation and then liability. You know, in florida, uh, our state passed a law in 2019 which, uh, had both parts for the vehicle owner for liability if there's poor maintenance, misuse or legal modification, um, part products liability, if there was a defect in the vehicle or system that caused the crash.
▶ 1:21:15Uh, and then, of course, human operators, the, the drivers who failed to properly supervise and intervene, I think that's really important that that sometimes it could be the driver, but sometimes it might be the programing or the product. And so, um, that's going to be important as we, we look forward on it.
▶ 1:21:32There are other concerns in labor and transportation that don't involve this committee, but it is important as we look to improving mass transit in places like central florida, where we're evolving sunrail and brightline, that these vehicles play a key role. And then I was excited to see right, to repair, uh, a growing consensus and compromise on the calendar feels like an epic as we're going through this. Um, we have a lot of mom and pop shops in our district. Uh, we also recognize that manufacturers have intellectual property rights, so we'll continue to work through it.
▶ 1:22:03But what concerns me is the big ugly law, electric vehicle incentives. And we also have a 25% cut to nhtsa staff. So this is something, uh, as we're helping lift up avs, evs and hybrids, um, are are getting cast aside. And that's, um, that's concerning to me, given the, the popularity of them. Uh, Mr. brooks, I want to talk a little bit about redundancy.
▶ 1:22:29You know, in a lot of these autonomous vehicles, we have both cameras, radar and lidar, and we do a lot of lidar research in central florida. How critical is it when you have bad weather, uh, obstructions like small children or debris? Um, and expanding the range and improving the accuracy, as it were, to have that, that three fold redundancy in these sensor systems. >> it's very critical.
▶ 1:22:53Um, and I think a lot of the issues we have seen with, uh, level two vehicles, particularly tesla, is their inability to distinguish, um, during distinguished, you know, crash events and potential crash events when there is a, you know, low light conditions, when, you know, we've seen the flashing lights, we've seen them unable to detect, uh, emergency responders and fire trucks and vehicles with, you know, that are pretty obvious
▶ 1:23:25To most of us now. >> are there manufacturers are using all three of these redundancies, because I know that we see that in, in, uh, in beep and in waymo and some of these others. >> yes. And you know waymo is, is is operating at a, at a much higher level of autonomy than tesla would be. You know, waymo's aren't requiring human drivers to take over at a moment's notice when a problem occurs.
▶ 1:23:49>> so when we're talking about minimum standards, this redundancy of having multiple different types of sensors is critical. Then, uh, what other elements do you think the performance standards should include? >> I think the performance standards for, um, certainly for sea level two and three vehicles should really look at the human takeover part of things.
▶ 1:24:13Both both sea level two and three vehicles would be conditionally automated, which means essentially they're driving themselves until, you know, the human has to take over. Um, now, level three might do that at a slightly higher level, but level two is is something we we have got to make sure that humans are able to take over the operation of the vehicle when necessary. >> thanks. Neil. Back. >> and Mr.
▶ 1:24:41Fulton, eventually I'd like for you to to comment on that too. Uh, I was on I was in one of these two or threes, uh, in my, uh, my good friend was driving just the other day in tarpon springs and the the car actually took us. He put the program on, the self-driving program on, and the car actually took us. Well,e had the ability to change it.
▶ 1:25:12But with regard to, uh, how to get there, uh, the program would have gotten us there like 15 minutes later, uh, which I think, you know, and we realized that so that that needs to be corrected if we have a full, full self-driving car where you don't have the ability to do so. So I guess maybe you can address that. But let me get to, uh, let let me go ahead and get to Mr. goldman. Now, you're recognized for five minutes. >> thank you, Mr. chairman.
▶ 1:25:42Thank you for this very important hearing. And I'll go ahead. Mr. fulton, I'm not going to use all my five minutes, so please, you can you can respond to the chairman. >> you gotta be careful. Go ahead is the best question. >> yeah, right. No, it's totally fine.
▶ 1:25:56>> so it's critically important to describe correctly the capabilities and limitations of a tesla and waymo or name your brands fundamentally a level two system, which is outside of the scope of what we're talking about in self-driving act, only part of the driving task is done by the system. The human is still in charge of what is known as object and event detection and response. If you're not paying attention and you get into a crash, it's your fault.
▶ 1:26:24If you think about it the same way you think about professional drivers. Truck drivers are otherwise three fourths of the crashes they're involved in are caused by other road users, objects, animals, other drivers, professionally trained and routinely trained drivers work at such a high level. So amateur drivers 94% of the time. The critical factor is human error. Professional drivers three fourths of the time. So only 25% of the time is it?
▶ 1:26:51Well, even among that three fourths of the time it's something else. So when we think about a tesla that only does part of the systems and an automated driving systems that do it all, including figuring out what's going on in the world around them and doing something about it, we absolutely must treat them differently in how we think about them, how we talk about them, and how we regulate them. And this is critically important because it ultimately boils down to what the consumer expects for their vehicle to do.
▶ 1:27:18I was involved in a number of efforts, and I congratulate many of the safety advocates that have been involved in efforts, like my vehicle does what, and really working to clarify the capabilities and limitations of the vehicle, because we all have to get this right and it impacts how we legislate these technologies. Fundamentally, if you can fall asleep in it the same way you can with an uber or taxi, then you're looking at a level four vehicle. Otherwise you're in charge and you're liable if something happens. So that's important. As we look at the regulations of these vehicles and the legislations on them.
▶ 1:27:49>> thanks for clarifying that very much. Uh, miss king, considering the national highway traffic safety administration resource constraints, what legislative reforms could improve the agency's efficiency in addressing high traffic fatalities, especially in districts such as my own, that consist of urban and rural mixes? >> yeah. Thank you so much for the question. We really do think a number of the reforms that are laid out in the motor vehicle modernization act are precisely the sorts of reforms that are needed in order to make the agency more effective.
▶ 1:28:18Um, a couple I'll highlight, we think the research and rulemaking plan that's outlined in the proposal is, is fantastic and way to ensure alignment between nhtsa's research program and rulemaking program. Uh, the modernization of ncap will be a critical component of getting, uh, new and innovative safety technologies on the road as well. >> great. Thank you very much, Mr. hamby. How do you limited repair options affect rural communities or people without nearby authorized repair centers? >> uh, thank you for your question, congressman.
▶ 1:28:47Um, it's let's start with the numbers, shall we? So there's about 17,000 authorized, uh, repair dealerships, uh, gm, ford, chrysler, about 17,000. There's 235,000 independent repair shops on the corner of every elm and main of every town in this country. So the sheer numbers alone.
▶ 1:29:12And number two, um, our industry typically, on average, the repair cycle is 36% less than the dealership. So economic convenience is number one. And then, you know, if I live in a rural community, I'll drive 100 miles to buy a new vehicle, but am I going to drive 100 miles to get my oil change? Am I going to drive 100 miles because my check engine light is on?
▶ 1:29:40That's why our industry is so critical to the rural community that that this is an important piece of legislation. >> right. Thank you very much, Mr. chairman. I yield back the balance of my time. >> thank you. And the chair recognizes gentlelady from massachusetts, miss trahan, for five minutes. >> thank you, Mr. chairman. Uh, well, there are many important bills on today's agenda. I'm going to focus my limited time on autonomous vehicles, specifically representatives. Uh dingell's and ladas self-drive act.
▶ 1:30:08I think their discussion draft is incredibly important. And at a minimum, it will force our committee to deal with a real problem. Autonomous vehicles, particularly waymo's, are showing early safety benefit but lack a coherent federal framework to operate within. At best, the self drive act could create a single set of federal rules for safety, um, for safely deploying avs across the country while leaving room for local innovation.
▶ 1:30:35Uh, like any draft bill, it needs improvements. That's expected, but we shouldn't use that as an excuse to do nothing. All of us should ask those hard questions, look at the facts, and make changes to improve the bill where needed. So I want to focus on areas where the self drive act could could be a little bit better. Uh, the bill's main tool is something called a safety case, basically, a report arguing an autonomous vehicle is safe. Mr.
▶ 1:31:01Brooks, are the safety case requirement requirements in the self drive act strong enough? And if not, what other information should be required? >> the safety case requirements in the self drive act are a little problematic for us, mainly because they trigger the preemptive effect of the act, but also they the safety cases are, you know, essentially a autonomous vehicle manufacturer doing their homework in secret.
▶ 1:31:31You know, they're not there's no requirement to self drive act for the safety cases to be submitted routinely in any form or reported to the secretary of the dot or to nhtsa. There's no real oversight of that process. Um, and even, you know, when the safety case structure is, um, put together and rule a rule is made by the department around it.
▶ 1:31:55You know, there's some optional features that don't have to be included in the safety case that are difficult for us to understand why they're optional. For instance, one of them is around software upgrades and hardware updates. Um, you would think that that would be a critical component of any safety case, because hardware upgrades and particularly software updates are taking place all the time in autonomous vehicles. And to have that sitting out there as an optional portion of a safety case, it makes no sense to us.
▶ 1:32:27>> right? Well, like you, you know, I'm glad the act requires every manufacturer to complete a safety case for each autonomous vehicle. However, I too am worried that the current draft may not require companies to submit their safety cases to a federal regulator until it is requested or updated. When significant software updates are made. Mr. fulton, could you clarify what the bill, uh, draft bill requires from manufacturers regarding the safety case? And when must the safety case be finalized?
▶ 1:32:56And does a federal regulator need to approve either the initial version or future updates? >> so fun. Thank you for the question. Uh, congresswoman, uh, it is very important that we make sure that there is a clear and consistent path for regulators to have access to the safety cases and for any need, uh, any issue that raises their attention.
▶ 1:33:18They do not have to wait for there to be a situation for them to proactively engage with any of the manufacturers or innovators that are part of the overall automated driving system. The bill does clarify that before these vehicles are introduced into commerce, a safety case must be submitted to nhtsa for their review. And, you know, presumably would also come and meet and explain it and discuss this with them. Uh, I do you know, I do recommend all of the above. I recommend routine engagements, not only nhtsa, but the ntsb.
▶ 1:33:48When I was at my automated vehicle startup, we proactively engaged with the regulators, and we found many great lessons learned in ways that we could improve our system through this routine engagement with the regulators. And we found them to be more confident in understanding in what we were trying to do and why. So I do recommend that routinely. But there's not a one size fits all approach to this, and you certainly don't want to put in perverse incentives to prevent software updates, minor updates, you know, tweaks to the system, ways to improve the safety and the performance of the system.
▶ 1:34:19So while I do agree that there should be a submission before entering into, uh, commerce, I do think that there should be some routine touch points. But I don't know if there's one simple system and one simple way to do that. >> thank you. I have a couple questions on preemption that I'll submit for the record. But before I conclude, I just want to associate myself with representative mullins focus on requiring safety data from autonomous vehicle manufacturers and his work on the av safety data act.
▶ 1:34:45We need more data on autonomous vehicle deployments, especially on unexpected stoppages and how they affect first responders, and I'm looking forward to working with representatives dingell and mullen and the rest of the subcommittee as we move forward. Thank you so much, I yield back. >> thank you. Chairman. Recognize the gentleman from california, Mr. obernolte, for five minutes. Thank you, Mr. chairman, and thank you to our witnesses. I have really enjoyed the testimony today.
▶ 1:35:09Uh, miss keene, I'd like to start with a question for you on advanced driver assistance systems. And as we know, those adas systems are becoming increasingly sophisticated and increasingly critical to ensuring safety on the roads. And yet, those systems, because they are so complex, require precise calibration and precise knowledge of exact vehicle geometry to be able to do what they do.
▶ 1:35:37So the question has arisen what happens when one of these vehicles is damaged and needs to be repaired? What happens when a vehicle owner wants to modify a vehicle by putting aftermarket parts, for example, on it? You know, how do we ensure that those these adas systems continue to operate the way they were intended to?
▶ 1:35:55So in response to that, I'm sure you're familiar with one of the bills that's, uh, a topic of our hearing today, which is a bill that I am very proud to co-lead with my colleague, representative harshbarger. It's h.r. 6688, the adas functionality and integrity act. And basically, what we're trying to say is that we don't want to solve this problem with mandates.
▶ 1:36:17Instead, we want to direct nhtsa to develop some guidelines which are grounded in empirical testing, to make sure that when an adas equipped vehicle is damaged and needs to be repaired, or when it's modified, that a repair shop will have something concrete that they can use to verify that the adas systems are still in, uh, in compliance with their calibration and will still function the way they were intended. So, uh, I assume you're familiar with the bill.
▶ 1:36:47Is are we on the right track? Is this the right approach? >> you're asking all the right questions. So we appreciate we appreciate the fact that you're looking into this. I mean, there's no doubt I'll just double click on something you said. There's no doubt that adas technologies are making vehicles safer. And there's also no doubt that we need to make sure that those systems continue to be properly calibrated. So they continue to work. And you're right, repair is an issue. Uh, maintenance in terms of just over the life of the vehicle, you want to know that your system in year 11 is working the same as it was working in year two.
▶ 1:37:16Um, and then modification, um, we appreciate the thoughtfulness that's been going into this. We understand the interest in the topic. We understand trying to find a path forward. I will just share for you that just recently we did send a letter up to nhtsa. Um, we do on this issue specifically, we do think that nhtsa needs to convene a conversation, a dialog, a forum between all of the various parties, automakers, the modifiers to discuss what a path forward looks like here. And we look forward to continuing to work with you and representative harshbarger on this bill. >> well, excellent. Yeah.
▶ 1:37:45Well, the the point we're trying to make is that, uh, mandates is probably the wrong approach. And a better approach is to make sure that everyone is informed on, uh, what needs to be done when a vehicle is repaired or modified. And, uh, we think that that if, if nhtsa develops that guidance, that, uh, you know, that we'll be able to achieve what mandates couldn't achieve. Uh, Mr. fulton, I am just fascinated by your background.
▶ 1:38:09Uh, and I am interested in your views on this, uh, this intersection between state, local and federal law when it comes to autonomous vehicles. And you touched on it a little bit in your testimony. You know, on the one hand, we, uh, currently live in a world where most of the vehicle standards are set at the federal level, but, uh, roadway safety standards, for example, and the rules of the road are set at the state and local levels.
▶ 1:38:37Uh, as you said in your testimony, the advent of avs is blurring these lines because, uh, you know, these systems kind of kind of spread themselves across both of those worlds. How should we think about, uh, this in terms of preemption? I mean, are there lanes for both federal and state law making here? And if so, what should be preempted and what shouldn't be? >> thank you, congressman, I appreciate that and appreciate your comments.
▶ 1:39:03Um, fundamentally, I think we're only really looking for preemption in a few key areas, narrowly scoped. And that would play out over time as the department of transportation and national highway traffic safety administration put forth the rulemakings for the federal motor vehicle safety standards around key areas around the operational competencies of the vehicles, around how you create and and put forth a safety case and the process for doing that. I don't think anybody's looking to have to go to congress to change the speed limit in their neighborhood.
▶ 1:39:32We're not looking for anything like that. State and local authorities would still have right to regulate the rules of the road and how operations can happen around them. When we look at insurance dealer distributor issues, safety and emissions inspections, sale, distribution, distribution, repair and servicing requirements on vehicles. These are all done by the states and sometimes local authorities. We're not looking to change any of that.
▶ 1:39:54We're saying we agree on what the states and this committee have put forth on terms of how you make a safety case and what you do with it. There should be access to a federal data repository that's shared with state authorities, state dmvs. So everybody has one place to submit information on these things.
▶ 1:40:12We take care of the data submissions that we were talking about and have one database, one way to submit it, so that even if states agree we're not dealing with all sorts of systems around the country, we have one place to put it and they can access it there. So what we're talking about with preemption is very narrow. And I think this bill does a good job with that. >> well, thank you very much for your testimony I yield back. Thank you. >> the chair recognizes. >> Mr. mullen for five minutes. >> thank you, Mr. chair.
▶ 1:40:37I would like to thank the chair and committee staff for carefully considering and putting two of my bills on today's agenda. H.r. 3360, the driver technology and pedestrian safety act, as well as h.r. 4376, the safety data act. Both of these are attempting to address knowledge gaps in automotive safety. If you've been in a car made recently, you know the driver experience has been changing.
▶ 1:41:03Touch screens have been quickly replacing switches and knobs, requiring an increasing amount of driver attention. The user interface of these touch screens also vary widely from car to car, but there has been little research on the effects of these on driver distraction. The driver technology and pedestrian safety act would direct nhtsa to study the effects of these technologies and other changing conditions on traffic injuries and fatalities.
▶ 1:41:29I'm proud to have the support of the aa foundation for traffic safety, advocates for highway and auto safety, national safety council, and now the center for auto safety. So, Mr. brooks, I want to thank you for your support for the bill. And could you share more about why you think this bill is, quote, necessary, as you put it in your testimony?
▶ 1:41:49>> I believe it's necessary because currently there is no research that's been conducted into these systems to determine whether or not we need to put more efforts into figuring out if they're creating distractions for drivers and potentially resulting in crashes. And it's a very difficult data collection, because you might have crashes where you're not sure what what was taking place during that time period.
▶ 1:42:14It's going to be, you know, a very difficult data collection to make, but it's necessary that it's done because, you know, the national highway traffic safety administration has been looking at distraction for a couple of decades now. And, you know, touch screens were never really on the menu. Then they were looking at phones and some of the distractions that existed from the early 2000.
▶ 1:42:37But now with touch screens being deployed and frankly demanding a lot of driver attention, they're moving a lot of the the features that that operate various systems in the car to touch screens, migrating those from buttons. That might be a little more intuitive for people who have driven for a long time. Um, I think it's really necessary to identify whether touch screens are contributing to distraction.
▶ 1:43:04But also, you know, whether the features and potential potentially some safety features such as wipers and other things that have been migrated to touch screens, are posing difficulty for drivers accessing those functions while they're operating the vehicle. >> thank you for that. And in switching topics, I would like to go back to the safety of autonomous vehicles, which I mentioned in my opening remarks. Uh, my bill, the av safety data act would require reporting vmt vehicle miles traveled.
▶ 1:43:32Um, having this data is important because we essentially do not have the denominator to be able to calculate incidents per mile. This bill would also require reporting when avs stop in the middle of roads and intersections. These unplanned stoppages causing safety hazards or preventing first responders from getting by. For example, just last week, an av in miami stopped on a bridge, causing a major traffic backup. Human drivers had to go into oncoming traffic to get around it.
▶ 1:44:01Just a few weeks ago in san francisco, there was a power outage. Uh, there was widespread meltdown of hundreds of avs operating, uh, in the city, causing chaos and confusion as to how police, fire and other agencies should deal with these new vehicles. These examples also highlight a lack of coordination between av operators and emergency responders. In addition to closing the data collection gap, I am developing legislation to address this and I hope to work with the committee on it.
▶ 1:44:28But there's no question that collecting safety data as an essential is an essential first step. And I applaud some industry leaders for being willing to share that data. But cherry picking data in a one off press release is not a stand in for standardized data reporting to a government regulator. So, Mr. brooks, again, could you share more about why you think expanding nhtsa's data collection would help inform policy makers? >> yes.
▶ 1:44:56Uh, the first thing I would say in that regard is that currently we are only receiving our nhtsa, only receiving under the standing general order reports of crashes or incidents that that could could produce injuries or vehicle tollways and that type of thing. What I think is more important is to figure out what the problems are before they occur.
▶ 1:45:17And so looking at disengagements and other unplanned stoppages and things that avs are doing that might be able to tell us about ways to prevent those crashes from occurring in the future is very important. >> thank you for that. And thank you to the committee again for your work. And I yield back. >> thank you. And the chair now recognizes Mr. cain for five minutes. >> uh. >> thank you, Mr. chairman, and thank you to our distinguished witnesses for being here today.
▶ 1:45:48State farm recorded over 20,000 claims of catalytic converter theft in the united states in 2023. Since catalytic converters are challenging to trace, they're often stolen and sold on the black market. As a co-sponsor of the part act, I believe it's important to address this issue and better protect american consumers from theft. This bill would inhibit the resale of stolen catalytic converters, and decrease the incentives for bad actors to continue committing this theft.
▶ 1:46:18And and while I'm encouraged to see the part act moving forward, I'm concerned that one of the other bills not being considered today may not effectively protect citizens in my district. And I have concerns with the repair act. On january 8th, I received a letter from one of my constituents, edgar chavez jr, as the owner of an independent repair facility in new jersey, he is concerned that the repair act might ultimately prevent his customers from receiving the parts that they want.
▶ 1:46:49Additionally, he does not believe that it will provide his company with access to any new tools. Mr. chairman, I have this letter. His letter here, and I ask that it be entered to the record without objection. Thank you. And I look forward to discussing how some of the issues raised in this letter would impact my constituents. Miss cain, uh, new jersey is an innovation state, once home to america's renowned inventor, thomas edison.
▶ 1:47:16New ideas have long fueled new jersey's economy, with innovation playing, uh, such a vital role in new jersey's economy. I want to be sure that any law that we pass protects innovators intellectual property rights. Can you discuss the repair act's impacts on intellectual property? >> yeah. Thank you very much for the question. Um, the repair act, just a little bit of step back. The repair is complicated because it does two things at the same time.
▶ 1:47:42The first is making sure that independent repairs have access to the data, information and tools that they need to repair vehicles. That's something that automakers are aligned and wanting to achieve. The second thing, though, that it does is it makes data and information available to aftermarket parts manufacturers so that they can manufacture parts that compete with the parts that the automakers make. And that's where things get sticky and where intellectual property is something that we need to be thinking about right now.
▶ 1:48:10I think, and you know, this, that automakers are investing billions of dollars every year into research and development, into new parts, new components, new technologies. And I think we would all agree that that research, that development and that intellectual property should be protected. I'll end on one last point, because I think it's really important right now, if an aftermarket parts manufacturer wants to make a part that competes with an oem part, they have two options.
▶ 1:48:36One is to license the intellectual property from the automaker and make an identical part. And the second is to invest in their own research and development to develop a compatible part that differs enough from the automaker's part so as not to infringe on its intellectual property. We think that construct should be preserved, and we're not confident that it is in the repair act. >> okay. Uh, the repair act includes a rule that construction that some argue does protect ip.
▶ 1:49:03And I guess that that is your point, which is that why isn't that rule of construction sufficient to protect intellectual property? >> yeah. And I'll start by saying that there are there are intellectual property protections in the bill. And we appreciate doctor dunn's willingness to put them in. We fear they fall short. I'll give you just two examples of where that's the case. One is it's not clear in the repair act that automakers would retain the legal right to impose a licensing fee for the use of their intellectual property.
▶ 1:49:31It's also there is a car or there is a provision protecting trade secrets. Um, but there's also a strange carve out attached to it that makes it ultimately look like maybe it doesn't actually apply to aftermarket parts manufacturers. >> and could you discuss how insufficient ip protections could steer consumers towards less tested parts manufactured overseas, particularly in china? >> yeah, it's a it's a very critical point. Um, we're seeing a lot of intellectual property theft and counterfeit parts coming out of china.
▶ 1:50:00And our fear would be that these, uh, reducing the intellectual property protections in the law may encourage more of that. >> thank you. Um, Mr. fulton, innovation has long been a cornerstone of prosperity in new jersey and across america. Self drive act takes an important steps to ensure that america continues to lead by ensuring a safe regulatory framework for autonomous vehicles.
▶ 1:50:26Why is a federal framework essential for the us to win the ai race with china? >> thank you very much, congressman, for your question. I will be brief. It provides the certainty to innovators, manufacturers and the entire ecosystem, including those who invest in the technology so they can continue to flourish and be integrated safely into our ecosystem. >> okay. >> thank you I yield back. >> thank you.
▶ 1:50:52And the chair now recognizes the gentlelady from michigan, miss dingell, for five minutes. >> thank you, mister chair. I thank the witnesses for being here. There's a lot to cover, so I'm going to jump right in and ask you to be short. I want to touch on autonomous vehicles and the future of our auto industry. Since I've been in congress, I've been committing to finding a bipartisan path forward on legislation.
▶ 1:51:14We've made very significant progress in this draft, but we've still got stakeholders that are concerned. So our work is not going to stop. I'm also looking forward to working with all the members of this committee to get it right and welcome the feedback of everyone as we continue in this process. That's why I call it a working draft and not a bill. Yet every day we fail to act.
▶ 1:51:39Our global competitors, including china, are racing ahead in av innovation. Without a clear federal framework, we're putting american leadership, jobs and safety. That's the biggest my biggest worry at risk. We're currently stuck with a patchwork of state laws and outdated federal rules that do not reflect the realities of today's technology.
▶ 1:52:00We need a comprehensive federal framework that prioritizes safety, protects consumer privacy, supports innovation, strengthens domestic manufacturing, and ensures american workers are part of the future of this industry. And in every discussion I have, I say to my staff and rep, we have to make sure that everyone is safe.
▶ 1:52:23If we don't provide strong federal leadership, we risk letting bad actors and foreign adversaries exploit gaps in regulation, which they're already doing at the expense of consumer safety, privacy and fair competition. Miss kaine, does china play by the same rules as we do here in the united states? >> no, it does not. >> miss kaine. If we fail to safely innovate, do we risk losing our domestic auto industry and american jobs? >> yes, I believe we do. >> miss kaine.
▶ 1:52:53If we don't lead in autonomous vehicle technology, who will? China and miss kaine? Is china complying by safety rules the way we do in this country? >> I think they have a very different approach to safety rules in china. >> thank you. Mr. fulton. Does china play by the same rules as we do here in the united states? >> no, congresswoman. >> if we fail to safely innovate, do we risk losing our domestic auto industry and american jobs? >> yes, ma'am.
▶ 1:53:20>> and if we do not lead in autonomous vehicle technology, who will? >> china. >> so, Mr. brooks, my last question on ives, why is trust so essential for the safe and eventual widespread adoption of av technologies? >> I think it's a very, um, it's a situation where consumer confidence is very important to ensure that autonomous vehicles are trusted. You know, we we we have to ensure that, you know, that's one reason we're we're a little critical of the safety case requirement is that it's not transparent.
▶ 1:53:49You know, consumers don't have the right to see how things are progressing, to see what's going on and to make sure even even, you know, not just your regular consumers, but all the way up to the top, it's going to be very difficult for consumers to trust that companies have their best interests at heart, unless they can see the results. >> thank you, and you'll continue to work with us to improve this. Thank you. Now, um, I also have a couple of other bills today. I'm interested in all the bills, but the crime of drunk driving is 100% preventable.
▶ 1:54:17We passed the halt act. It's sitting over it, and it's, uh. Mr. brooks, what do you think the auto industry, nhtsa and others can do to make the halt act a reality as soon as possible and with short pleas. >> they need to work on what what happens after the vehicle detects that there's a drunk driver in the vehicle to make sure that that the process that takes place is acceptable to everyone. >> thank you. And lastly, we've got a problem that is vehicles become increasingly connected.
▶ 1:54:48We have a responsibility to make sure these vehicles are not putting people in vulnerable situations, especially survivors of domestic violence. We know these technologies are being misused. I appreciate the support from both those in the survivor community and in the auto industry on this legislation, and I hope we get it across the finish line. Miss cane, can you explain why legislation like the safe vehicle access for survivors act is so necessary, especially as connected vehicle technologies get more advanced?
▶ 1:55:19>> yeah. Where this issue gets particularly challenging is when you've got an owner of a vehicle who is the abuser, and you have a survivor who is using that vehicle to try to get out of the situation that they're in. Um, so we need a federal law that gives the auto companies the ability to cut off access to the vehicle by the owner of that vehicle. >> thank you, Mr. chairman. I have about 100 more questions in 15 seconds, so I'll be submitting them. For the record. >> Mr. engel, I can relate. I'm the same position. >> thank you, I yield back.
▶ 1:55:50>> thank you. The chair now recognizes Mr. evans for five minutes. >> thank you. Chairman, ranking member and of course, the witnesses for coming today for this conversation. Um, it's super intriguing to me because what I did before I came to congress, I was a cop for ten years, and I got to do forensic accident reconstruction. So everything from, uh, little fender benders on the roadway all the way up to a full blown reconstruction that spends the next five years going through litigation.
▶ 1:56:12Uh, and so I have a lot of questions about a lot of the different things that we're talking about today, specifically with some of the, um, the level four and above autonomous vehicles. Um, so we know that most of the time, uh, if an autonomous vehicle, fully autonomous level four or above is involved in some sort of collision, it's more than likely going to be the result of human error. Um, but we also know that these things are going to happen regardless of whether, you know, we like it or not.
▶ 1:56:39So, uh, you know, my question is that boots on the ground cop who's got to go figure out how to unsought, you know, sort out this whole mess in the middle of rush hour traffic on a friday afternoon is, um, can you talk a little bit about. And I guess this first question is, uh, to, uh, to miss kane. Um, can you talk a little bit about just some of those basic things that a cop would do in a collision involving two manned vehicles, driver's license, registration, proof of insurance, dash camera footage, um, things like that.
▶ 1:57:08Can you talk about how that process happens for the boots on the ground cop? Uh, with an autonomous vehicle, the vehicle that has no driver in it? >> yeah, it's a good question. And it's it's an important question. It's essential. I mean, one of the things that I think I'll point out to you is in the draft, the discussion draft that's under consideration, the self drive act. I think there's a recognition of the importance of getting this right. Um, and so as you look at the bill, you'll see that there are a couple of places where this interaction with law enforcement is captured.
▶ 1:57:37It's identified, I think, as a key element of the safety case. It's also reflected as a key competency. Um, so I think everyone's aligned and needing to figure out what this looks like and get information into the agency about how it will unfold. >> awesome. And I know I talked about, um, you know, crashes here. There's a lot of other categories that come to mind, uh, you know, fender benders where the vehicles are drivable. We've all seen the signs on the roadway move, minor crashes out of the roadway. How do I do that with a with an autonomous vehicle? Um, I come from colorado.
▶ 1:58:05We get snow, we have hills. So two wheel drive cars get stuck sometimes, or somebody else's two wheel drive car gets stuck. And then I got to figure out how to open the roadway up here with a bunch of stalled vehicles scattered all over the lanes of traffic. So those are some of the things that I'm thinking about. And so I just want to make sure that we continue to have that very, very intentional emphasis on how the the boots on the ground first responders who have to sort this all out, you know, that they're not going to be forgotten in this conversation.
▶ 1:58:34Um, pivoting on from there a little bit to to Mr. hanvey. Um, last question is for you. We also have today the, the part act, um, to address the scourge of catalytic converter theft across the country. Again, that was a cop. I took lots of reports about these things here.
▶ 1:58:50It's a particular problem, uh, that colorado has grappled with being the number one state in the nation for auto theft, uh, multiple times over the last five years, being the number two state in the nation for property crimes and having a major, major problem with catalytic converter theft as a part of, of that crime. Crime, tsunami, uh, in colorado. Um, and, uh, you know, quite often the result of some of these, uh, statewide democrat soft on crime policies.
▶ 1:59:17Um, our attorney general, phil weiser, just a few years ago, on camera, remarked, and this is a quote here, um, people should only be kept in jail after here's the quote. Someone commits a third or fourth car theft in three months. End quote. Uh, and then talking about catalytic converter theft, uh, you know, our sitting attorney general said this is a, quote, purchasing insurance that covers your catalytic converter if stolen, uh, end quote is the best way to prevent this.
▶ 1:59:42So I'm heartened by the part act actually taking this problem seriously, because I've seen the impact that this has on my constituents and real people who have a catalytic converter. Sawed off and have to wait nine months because of a parts backlog to go get a replacement catalytic converter and their vehicles down the whole time, denying them transportation to jobs, health care, so many other things. Um, so can you talk from the perspective of the auto care association?
▶ 2:00:08Uh, are you ready to go today with all of the logistics, helping drivers get vin stampings on the on their on their catalytic converters and other different procedures? Are you ready to go? Is the auto care association ready to go? If we were able to make these funds available. >> we think that's a very important issue. And as a matter of fact, as an association, we have had seminars on this catalytic converter issue. Specifically, are we ready to go and have vin stamping immediately done?
▶ 2:00:36We are not quite ready for that, but we're more than willing to work with the committee on rules regulation enforcement. We take it very seriously, and we would most certainly be a willing participant in that. >> awesome. Anything we can do to help you get ready to go. Super important to me. Yield back. Chairman. >> thank you. I recognize the gentlelady from illinois, miss kelly, for five minutes. >> thank you, Mr. chair.
▶ 2:01:01I'm glad we're discussing important safety issues to keep our roadways safer for all americans. And I'm thankful that my bill, the safe act, is included in today's hearing. I look forward to discussing the importance of this bill and hearing from our witnesses about how we can strengthen vehicle standards to prevent unnecessary injuries and death. Mr. brooks, there has been extensive reporting on the dangers of electric door latches, particularly when a vehicle is involved in a crash or the battery loses power.
▶ 2:01:28Can you discuss the importance of establishing performance and labeling requirements for these doors? >> yes. There is. It's very important to establish both for access from outside of the vehicle by first responders or good samaritans, as well as on the inside of the vehicle.
▶ 2:01:47We've seen numerous situations, many of which involve tesla vehicles, where there's a recessed door handle on the outside that can't be operated unless there's battery power going to it. That prevents firefighters and good samaritans from being able to operate the door handle from the outside. When a crash doesn't disable the doors, and they're able to access the interior that way.
▶ 2:02:10Also, from the point of view of of escape from passengers on the inside of the vehicle, tesla and I believe rivian had one model as well that did this. And there are previous models that aren't electric vehicles. I believe there was a corvette's in the past and some chrysler vehicles that had electric door latches that played a role as well.
▶ 2:02:30You you can't find the, uh, emergency manual release to exit the vehicle unless you studied the studied your owner's manual and know exactly where they are. Examples. In tesla vehicles, there were no manual releases hidden inside of map pockets under seats. Some of their vehicles in the rear seats don't even have a manual release. And so we think it's incredibly important to standardize these types of systems.
▶ 2:02:59A lot of the auto industry has always already done so, um, and made handles easy to use and intuitive. You can pull on your handle once or twice and get out of the vehicle. And it's I think we need to move in that direction versus consumers having to figure out what vehicle they're in and go look in its owner's manual. If they're in a rideshare vehicle or riding with a friend to make sure they're safe. If there's a crash and a fire. >> thank you.
▶ 2:03:26And my bill would do just that by requiring the national highway traffic safety administration to issue a final rule amending standard 2006, establish those performance and labeling requirements. Uh, miss kane, what steps can automakers take to ensure the safety of passengers within their vehicles, not only driving during an initial collision, but also in the event of an occupant being trapped within a vehicle? >> yeah. Thank you. Thank you for the question.
▶ 2:03:55And thank you for your leadership on this topic. Um, you know, I do think it makes sense for nhtsa and for, for congress for you to be to be looking at this. We're currently working with our members to figure out what we think makes sense. As a next step. I will tell you in some of the preliminary conversations that we've had, um, that we we are generally open to some sort of door release redundancy in the event of a primary power loss.
▶ 2:04:16One thing I'll just flag for you, as you're thinking about this going forward is one thing we've heard is, while that may make sense to be a mechanical release, there also might be things like a backup power source that kicks in in the case of a primary power source. So those are the sorts of things that we'll get you more, you know, constructive feedback in the coming days. Appreciate you looking at this. Um, but but think that there is, you know, a opportunity for us to work together going forward. >> well, thank you so much.
▶ 2:04:43And let me be clear regarding my bill and others being considered, I strongly support innovation and american leadership in our automotive sector, but we must not compromise safety. As you've heard from all of my colleagues in pursuit of style or convenience, and I look forward to further discussion of this safe exit act and working with my colleagues to address this important issue. Thank you. And I yield back. >> my yield. Yield. Mike kelly.
▶ 2:05:14Yes. All right. Thank you. Chair now recognizes rep schreier for five minutes, please. >> thank you, Mr. chairman. >> and thank you to our witnesses. This is a really interesting hearing. And the, um, the crossover, if everything were automated, I'd feel super safe. Um, but with the crossover between human behavior and automated cars, um, things are tricky.
▶ 2:05:42Um, I'm really happy to see my bill in the no. Before you drive act included in today's hearing, there's been a lot of discussion about autonomous vehicles, but the reality is that in the short term, we're going to have a mix of what's out there, and most americans are going to continue to drive cars with much more limited automated systems, if any. Um, my car is almost 20 years old.
▶ 2:06:08Um, it my household cars are not all but, um, advanced driver assistance systems. The adas systems are, um, the automated supports that most american drivers are using in their car every day. These are things like collision warnings, collision interventions, driving control assistance. They can be incredible safety tools, um, if used appropriately. And they, as we've heard today, can help prevent crashes and save lives.
▶ 2:06:39And we talked a lot about human error. And depending on these. So the tools can actually become quite dangerous when drivers don't really understand their limitations. And we have seen rising numbers of accidents where drivers relied completely on advanced assistance that failed to identify an obstacle or another vehicle. And you talked about exactly that, the outside things.
▶ 2:07:02To make things worse, some manufacturers, um, have misrepresented the capabilities of their assistance mode, suggesting that, um, they can be true autopilot or full self-driving. And I remember test driving. This is just anecdotal. Uh, tesla model 3 in 2018, when they were just about to come out and was so wowed by the fact that it could park itself. Uh, at that point, I believe you could summon it, although I never tried that in real life.
▶ 2:07:31Um, but the staying in the lane, the notion that it could just do that for me was wild. So we tried it out on straight streets or. Great. So that would be fun to take it on. A little spin on a windy country road, and figured out very quickly that that had exceeded its limitations. And I'm very glad that I had my hands on the wheel. Um, so that's where this bill comes in, because the person who is showing me the car didn't give me that bit of information, that on a windy road it would not work.
▶ 2:08:00Um, the night before you drive act would prevent auto manufacturers from making false or misleading claims about a car's driver assistance system. And the bill also requires manufacturers to provide clear, easy to understand explanations of just what these systems are capable of and what responsibilities the drivers need to maintain even while using them.
▶ 2:08:21Um, miss kane, can you talk about, uh, some of the technical differences between adas systems, cruise control, adaptive cruise control, those kinds of things, and a truly autonomous vehicle? And I know Mr. fulton said, if you can go to sleep in it, it's truly autonomous. But could you expand on some of the adas systems? >> yeah, for sure. I mean, the key differential between just automated features and automated driving systems is the role of a human in the vehicle.
▶ 2:08:50And if you're if it's an automated feature, it requires the human to be paying attention to the driving environment at all times. Okay. >> thank you I appreciate that. And, um, Mr. brooks, uh, what kind of data do we have on adas features and crash statistics? Like which ones help most? Um, so that we can prioritize some.
▶ 2:09:14And I also really appreciate your comments about packaging all the safety features together, but not packaging them with other things. >> I mean, currently, I believe the insurance insurance institute for highway safety has noted that adas features don't really have any proven safety benefits at the moment. Um, which is something that could change for things like lane keeping systems and other things in the future.
▶ 2:09:37But for now, I think, you know, it's it's a it's another area where I think we need a lot more data collection and research to be able to make a determination. >> so nothing with proof, is that right? Even the little blinker on the on the rear view mirrors? >> well, I don't think that would be considered. You know, a that would be like a lower level, like, uh, not not quite adas at this point. >> thank you. Higher level than my 20 year old car.
▶ 2:10:06Um, last comment. I just want to say that I appreciate your discussion of the screens and the distraction of having a screen that is not directly in front of you, that is to the side, and that you might need for something like windshield wipers until you learn that there's a button that does the same thing that we need really good instruction manuals. Uh, right up front. Thank you. Yield back. >> thank you. The chair recognizes Mr. veasey for five minutes. >> Mr.
▶ 2:10:35Chairman, thank you very much. I really appreciate it. Um, today, I know that we aren't just discussing car safety. We're discussing global, the global technology race. The automotive industry is a cornerstone of the american economy, supporting over 10 million jobs and representing 5% of the gdp. But now we're at a crossroads.
▶ 2:11:00And while us vehicle production has dropped since 2004, china has seen a 297% increase. And they are moving with incredible speed to dominate the global market and electric and automotive tech and automated technologies. I believe the us must lead in this race, but winning doesn't mean just moving the fastest. It means also moving the smartest.
▶ 2:11:22Uh, I do believe that, um, the us asserting ourselves in a dominant way in these technologies is the only way to ensure that the future of transportation is inclusive. Uh, if we lead the world in av and safety innovations, we, not our competitors, get to set the standards for quality, safety and accessibility. Uh, winning this race means expanding access to all communities. As Mr. brooks rightly points out in his testimony, federal oversight is not a barrier to innovation.
▶ 2:11:50It's the foundation for it. By creating clear rules and minimum performance standards, we provide the baseline that both manufacturers and consumers need to move forward with confidence. Uh, Mr. brooks, china is aggressively pursuing leadership in automated vehicle tech. Some say regulation slows us down. But doesn't the absence of clear federal safety standards make us more vulnerable to being leapfrogged by foreign competitors, who are operating under a more unified national strategy?
▶ 2:12:22>> I believe so I think we need something more than, you know, what's in the current version of the self drive act, which is just manufacturers developing safety cases. We need some clarity around all sorts of automation. First of all, I don't believe that. You know, obviously there are significant differences between a level two tesla and a level four waymo. But there are a lot of confusion in the public about what is the difference.
▶ 2:12:47And if you don't have confidence in, you know, you know, a car that can drive itself 10 to 100 miles without people touching the steering wheel, which is what many people do in teslas. And you and people hear that automation is killing people in tesla's, then they don't really know the difference between the automated vehicle at level two versus an automated vehicle that's fully automated, where they don't have to continue to monitor the vehicle. So that's important.
▶ 2:13:17>> yeah. Uh, miss kane mentioned that avs can expand transportation for people with disabilities. Uh, Mr. brooks, I want to ask you, how can congress provide the baseline of public trust needed to get these vehicles into underserved communities that currently lack reliable transit options?
▶ 2:13:34>> I mean, I think the best way to do that is, is to get federal standards on the books that can make sure that once these vehicles are deployed, that they're actually serving disabled communities and making sure that that's not just, you know, part of the hype or the aspirational ism that goes along with pushing for the introduction of autonomous vehicles. >> yeah, yeah. >> um. >> I also want to ask, um, there's been some discussion on how we can modernize the, the, uh, the end cap.
▶ 2:14:02I'd like your input. On what on on the matter so that the end cap, uh, better rewards companies that are winning the race on pedestrian detection and impairment tech. >> yes. We need we need nhtsa to effectively rate crash prevention features and vehicles. At the moment, they're, you know, giving out a, you know, a checking a box if you have it installed in the vehicle. But they're not discriminating between the performance of each of these systems.
▶ 2:14:30And so ultimately, nhtsa needs to be testing these systems to discriminate between which ones work the best, which ones aren't working so great to incentivize the manufacturers that aren't doing so well to, you know, up their efforts in those areas? >> yeah, yeah. No, absolutely. Thank you, Mr. chairman, I yield back. >> thank you. The chair recognizes Mr. ladder for five minutes. >> thank you, Mr. chairman. And thank you very much for holding this important hearing on vehicle safety.
▶ 2:15:00And I also appreciate the opportunity to wave on today. I start by acknowledging that the preemption provision and our discussion draft self-drive does look different than previous versions. If there is one thing certain the gentlelady from michigan's sixth district and I are working to get this legislation completed, and we believe that this new structure provides the most nimble and narrowly targeted way of doing so. Let me be very clear.
▶ 2:15:26We have no intention of upsetting current state and local laws related issues that are well within state and local purview, such as traffic, franchises, titling and licensing. What we are concerned about is making sure on the bumper to bumper, how vehicle preemption has always functioned and how it should continue to function for avs. Mr.
▶ 2:15:51Fulton, will you explain why the federal preemption provision is necessary and how its intersection with safety case provision will foster the development of avs here in the united states? >> thank you for the question, congressman, and thank you for your continued leadership on this issue. As I mentioned before, you and congresswoman dingell were right a decade ago. You you're right today, and I hope you'll continue to be right long into the future on these questions.
▶ 2:16:17As we look at the development of safety cases, we're looking at the processes for setting up claims for how you were safely operating within the design of the domain in which the vehicle is operating, how you prove that in the evidence that you use to prove that. Also part of this is how do you make sure that this evidence actually proves what you think you're proving? All of this comes together through a series of processes, engineering processes and rigor to the point where it takes a significant amount of expertise to be able to put forth a safety case.
▶ 2:16:46It is not a quick and easy thing to do. So as we look at sending this nhtsa, sending these safety cases to nhtsa, it takes a lot of expertise to be able to understand these things and to be able to understand all of the standards that go into it, including, for example, the safety of the intended function to address an issue that was raised earlier. What is the system intended to do? How is it intended to do it, and is it doing that? That's something that's built in to the development of a safety case.
▶ 2:17:12All of these things are well intentioned regulators around the country thinking I've heard, I've read in the press that there's a wild west. Nobody's out there regulating this technology. Nobody's finished the rulemaking. My god, somebody needs to do something. That is not the case.
▶ 2:17:25What we're seeing is not only are we looking at different approaches around the country, but there's ultimately agreement with the legislation that came from a decade ago that you championed with the rulemakings that were started in the first trump administration around a framework for automated vehicle safety, and in the safety case provisions that you've got in your self drive act here. There's a grand agreement among republicans, democrats, state and local regulators, and the congress and the executive branch itself across multiple administrations, that this is the consensus industry driven way to do it.
▶ 2:17:54That is fully understandable and can be executed upon. Congressman, you're right on this question, and you'll continue to be right. And I certainly hope that congress once again agrees with you and passes this bill with the safety case provisions. >> thank you. Thank you very much. Because some some have said the legislation we've put forward would just leave avs unregulated with no power for oversight of this technology. And I've been I've said it from the start and I've always said this avs must be as safe or safer than anything on the road today.
▶ 2:18:22Miss kane does the legislation is currently drafted do anything to upset current oversight authorities such as recalls and other information gathering? >> uh, no, it does not. >> on the point of safety the united states has averaged, unfortunately, 41,000 deaths per year due to traffic accidents over the last five years. And according to nfsa.
▶ 2:18:46And you know, when you look at the the accident numbers here, 94% of the traffic accidents are caused by driver error, and those are from recognition errors, decision errors, performance errors and nonperformance errors. So, you know, importantly, the self drive act directs the fmf fmvss rulemaking for adds. We know that fmf vss takes a while and we don't want the technology to be unregulated in the meantime.
▶ 2:19:16That's why we have a requirement for a safety case for the date of enactment. Mr. fulton, how would the in my last 34 seconds, how would the safety case structure promote avs safety? >> congressman, an ab safety case structure and the structure of this bill would give a consistent approach for innovators to reach the highest bar of safety that this congress and nhtsa can develop and set today and improve upon over time.
▶ 2:19:40This gives a simple, clear way to do it and clear, consistent guidance that only congress can give innovators around the country to meet those high levels of safety. >> well, thank you all for being with us today. And, Mr. chairman, I yield back the last one second I have. >> all right. Thank you. Chair recognizes Mr. klaus for five minutes. >> thank you. Chair, and I appreciate the testimony from the witnesses. I've learned a lot. Uh, Mr.
▶ 2:20:07Brooks, I want to begin with you, sir. Uh, appreciate your testimony today. And I want to highlight an important safety issue that impacts pedestrians, cyclists and other road users. Building off the, uh, comments from the gentleman from texas under the new car assessment program, ncap, nhtsa currently grants 4 or 5 star safety ratings to increasingly large vehicles. Uh, because the program focuses only on the safety of those within a vehicle and not how those vehicles impact those around them.
▶ 2:20:36Uh, and we've seen a surge in pedestrian deaths. I'm not going to go over the numbers. You all know them. And it's a tragedy, particularly children. Um, the biden administration had proposed a crashworthiness pedestrian protection program to evaluate new model year vehicles abilities to mitigate pedestrian injuries. But earlier this year, nhtsa announced it was delaying implementation of the program. In your testimony, sir, you noted that the motor vehicle modernization act would weaken ncap by allowing manufacturers to submit their own test results in place of nhtsa testing.
▶ 2:21:05Uh, given the surge in traffic and pedestrian deaths, can you expand on the danger that this proposal to gut ncap poses, and why ncap must take into account the safety of all road users? >> yes, I think that's an important point you bring up about the the the size of modern vehicles as they grow. Uh, not only do they, they produce greater, you know, forces that are going to unfortunately injure and kill more pedestrians, um, than smaller vehicles.
▶ 2:21:33You know, that that is all the larger vehicles also contribute to less affordability. >> yes. And just to put some numbers on that, over the past 30 years, the average us passenger vehicle, four inches wider, ten inches longer, eight inches taller and 1,000 pounds heavier. I think we can all kind of feel that like you're crossing the street and you and you're looking at the vehicles, waiting at the red light, you're like my head and I'm six foot one. My head is like the grille for all these cars.
▶ 2:21:59And I look at my kids crossing the street and it's just you can see what what what the danger is. Sorry. Continue. >> and that that's not just a danger because of the vehicle weight. They're also, you know, significant blind zones that are created by that. Um, that and that's an area that needs to be addressed. And, you know, the the larger the vehicle is, the less drivers have the ability to see children or other vulnerable road users in front of it.
▶ 2:22:25I think there's been some really good research done lately by the insurance institute showing, um, the patterns of, of of areas where drivers cannot literally see anything on the road based on the design of some vehicles. And that's, um, there there has been legislation introduced in the past to address those issues, and I believe that's something that should be considered in the future.
▶ 2:22:50>> miss kane, uh, your testimony calls for revitalizing ncap, including a robust and sustainable ten year roadmap. Uh. Would you agree that revitalizing ncap must take into account the safety of pedestrians and other vulnerable road users? >> uh, yes, we would. >> and so do you.
▶ 2:23:08Uh, would you support having the ncap have its 4 or 5 star safety ratings, or any of the safety ratings really take into account the effect of accidents on pedestrians? >> um, if I understand your question, I think we are absolutely open to that. Good. >> um, and you know what? I will yield my time back. >> thank you. Chair now recognizes miss harshbarger for five minutes. >> thank you. >> Mr. chairman.
▶ 2:23:38Thank you to the witnesses for being here today. This is what happens when you wave on. You get to be the last one. But, um, you know, it's, uh, this is fun stuff for me with vehicles and things of that nature. I'm an independent retailer at heart. And, uh, you know, it's all about vehicular, uh, technology.
▶ 2:23:57And, um, as it continues to grow and advance, it's clear we need a national framework for avs, one that promotes safety, affordability, and, uh, you know, innovation. And that's why I support, um, the ada's act and repair act and, um, the driver act.
▶ 2:24:16So the ada's, um, act will mean for millions of americans who modify their vehicle that they can trust their cars, lane assist or automatic emergency brakes. Braking system works as intended. And the driver act makes clear that your car's data belongs to you, the vehicle owner.
▶ 2:24:36So I commend my colleague, doctor dunn, for his hard work in getting the repair act ready for prime time, and the repair act is motivated to support consumers choice and a fair and open marketplace in the automobile repair industry. And much like with my driver's act, uh, if it's your car, then you own the data generated by your car. And there's key supporters of these bills, and I'd like to recognize them.
▶ 2:25:02Uh, the specialty equipment market association, the american vehicle owners alliance and auto care association. And, Mr. chairman, I request that a statement from sema ceo mike spagnola in support of the adas functionality and integrity act, a statement from avoid executive director richard warren, support of the driver act statement from doctor dunn, and a letter from seth greenstein of constantine cannon in support of the repair act be entered into the record.
▶ 2:25:34>> without objection. >> thank you. And I also want to thank the auto care association for its support of my bill and for its willingness to work with me on the driver act. In I want to thank the alliance for automotive innovation for continuing to work with me to find a constructive path forward on adas. And it's a complicated issue, very complicated. Mr. hamby.
▶ 2:25:54The adas functionality and integrity act requires initiative to engage with stakeholders, including the independent auto automotive aftermarket. What types of data and real world experience can your members contribute to help nhtsa develop effective, practical guidelines? >> I thank you so much for your question, congresswoman. Uh, we are happy to work with nhtsa to provide any data that we need, any data that we have, we'd be happy to provide it.
▶ 2:26:22We provide an annual fact book that is a comprehensive view of the automotive aftermarket that they might find useful. We'd be happy to work with nhtsa to do a survey of our membership, and those folks that install those types of systems. So we're very willing and able to work with, uh, with nhtsa on this very important piece of legislation. >> very good. You know, it used to be when you, uh, wanted to check your oil, you just raised the hood and you got the dipstick and you stuck it in there to check it yourself.
▶ 2:26:52You know, the last vehicle I had didn't have a dipstick, and I almost ordered one so I could do it myself, but, uh, some new cars don't have them. And the dashboard screen alerts you to the oil level. And, you know, I don't like I talked about this last time. Will you get in, ladies? You won't like this either when you get in and that seat weighs you. That's a problem for me. And so does this. Gatekeeping of data pose a challenge in the future? Mr. hamby?
▶ 2:27:23>> uh, it certainly does, congresswoman. And, you know, right now the restrictions are on the data, but there's real two overriding factors for that. And number one, um, for the oems to drive consumers back to the dealerships for repair. Uh, number two, uh, to monetize the data off the vehicles like stellantis, uh, who have business units dedicated to selling that data.
▶ 2:27:49Um, and with respect to whether blocking data is a future challenge, it's absolutely correct. Um, the repair act protects consumers and their rights to affordable and accessible repair. Uh, and the driver act would extend those privileges and those protections for all vehicle data. So we're very supportive of that. Thank you. >> and I've looked at a lot of different things. But if I buy a car I buy a car and I want the data as well. Mr.
▶ 2:28:16Brooks, every american relies on public fleet vehicles, whether operated by local police or fire departments or public work agencies. How could the lack of guaranteed access to vehicle data negatively affect state and local governments that manage these fleets? >> it prevents states from being able to track a lot of the data they need to manage their fleets appropriately. >> okay. >> um, well, I've got four seconds, so I guess I'll yield back, Mr. chairman. >> thank you.
▶ 2:28:45Chair recognizes miss clark for five minutes. >> thank you very much, Mr. chairman. And I thank our ranking member, schakowsky, for holding this hearing. And thank you to all of our witnesses for joining us today. Uh, I'm going to be speaking about the safe streets for everyone act of 2026. So I want to take this moment to thank jill and michael white for being here today. They are the parents of magnus. Magnus white.
▶ 2:29:11Magnus was a 17 year old us national cycling champion. Getting ready for some of the most exciting years of his young adulthood while on his final training ride before before representing the united states at the mountain bike world championships in the summer of 2023, a reckless driver hit and killed him on a designated bike
▶ 2:29:45Route. Advanced safety features like automatic emergency braking systems could have prevented this tragedy. And that's why I, with congressman joe neguse, plan on introducing the magnus white and safe streets for everyone act of 2026, the discussion draft of which is included in today's hearing.
▶ 2:30:13The magnus white and safe streets for everyone act would require the national highway traffic safety administration to amend the current motor vehicle standard for automatic, excuse me, automated emergency braking systems to ensure these systems can detect cyclists and other vulnerable road users, regardless of color of clothing, color or skin tone, in both day and night.
▶ 2:30:41While nothing can bring magnus back, this legislation could help prevent the unnecessary death or injury to countless other pedestrians, cyclists, or any vulnerable road users, and I applaud the white family's tireless advocacy for such essential protections to ensure no other family should ever experience such a loss.
▶ 2:31:07The white family's nonprofit, the white line, has collected national, state and local crash data data to help identify vulnerable road user risk. They found that from 2001 to 2023, the nationwide vulnerable road user fatality rate increased by nearly 30%.
▶ 2:31:32Even more alarmingly is that people of color face significantly higher fatality rates per capita for every 100,000 fatalities. Black americans are 2.24 times more likely and more at risk. So here's my first question.
▶ 2:31:52There's a disparity in road fatalities, which is why I believe it is so essential to improve the accuracy of automatic emergency braking systems in all visibility conditions and for all skin tones. Mr. brooks, how do you believe the updated standards in the safe roads for every discussion draft could improve safety and reduce the current disparities that we're seeing? >> I believe it would help significantly.
▶ 2:32:21Um, you know, essentially we are at a, I would say a middle school level on arb after nhtsa's last, uh, rulemaking, you know, cars are going to be able to detect cars at a higher speeds, but they're not going to be able to detect pedestrians at higher speeds. They're not going to be able to do a lot of things that we think automatic emergency braking is ultimately capable of doing.
▶ 2:32:47And, you know, and in the process, you know, avoiding problems like algorithmic bias can be overcome and particularly can be overcome using, as we were speaking of earlier, with with new and better types of sensors, for instance, infrared sensors that sense that, you know, that that thing that's the same about all of us, which is our body.
▶ 2:33:09>> and just quickly, I only have a few seconds, but how do you believe the magnus white safe streets for every act would benefit all drivers and manufacturers? >> I think it would benefit drivers immensely by giving them the confidence to drive in areas where there are high pedestrian, uh, zones and that type of thing. You know, it's it can be very challenging to see and notice pedestrians and heavy pedestrian environments. >> very well, Mr. chairman.
▶ 2:33:39I only have nine, seven, six seconds left. I'm going to yield back. >> thank you. Thank you to the panelists. Uh, as you can tell, there's a lot of interest in this, and we probably could have done another full session and kept going. I know I could have, but your input is very much appreciated, and you're highly likely to get a whole slate of questions further here moving forward. So thank you for your contribution to our efforts here. We're trying to do the right thing.
▶ 2:34:04I ask unanimous consent that the documents on the staff document list be submitted for the record. Without objection. So ordered. Thank you again to our witnesses. Members may have additional written questions. I'll remind members they have ten business days to submit questions for the record. Ask witnesses to respond to the questions promptly. Members should submit their questions by the close of business january 28th. Without objection, the subcommittee is adjourned.