▶ 0:25:17>> we meet today to consider the nominations of jonathan mckernan , undersecretary for domestic finance at the treasury department, and Dr. alex adams, assistant secretary for family support at the department of health and human services. The meeting this morning will provide members with the opportunity to offer remarks on the nominees. Following statement we will recess briefly and proceed to this morning's nominations hearing. We will meet at 11:00 a.m.
▶ 0:25:47Today off the senate floor to vote on Mr. mckernan and Dr. adams at the first mode. During his hearing Mr. mckernan discussed plans to use the office of domestic finance to bring back sound and balanced regulation to the finance system. Properly -- will provide much needed relief to financial institutions and the individuals they serve.
▶ 0:26:17I look forward to working with him is confirmed to accomplish this goal. Dr. adams spoke about his belief that federal policy should strengthen rather than supplant parents but with the capacity to make the best decisions for their children. As a director of the idaho department of health and welfare, Dr. adams knows what policy decisions and power states to provide critical assistance to some of america's most vulnerable populations.
▶ 0:26:43I'm confident in his ability to lead the array of programs at hhs. I will be voting in favor of both of these nominations and I encourage all of my colleagues on the committee to do the same. Before turning to senator wyden for his remarks, let me also take a moment to acknowledge the retirement of all vicar. Bob -- bob vicar. He is retiring in august.
▶ 0:27:13Today's session and hearing are his last. Although he's not actually here in this room I know he's monitoring what is going on. We are glad to see you get to end your career with us, the best committee. He's a recording studio's go to hearing director and has been essential in directing hearing coverage and coverage of the senate floor and working in the recording studio in various roles. We wish bob the best in his well-earned retirement and thank him for his many years of service. I now recognize senator widen.
▶ 0:27:43Sen. Wyden: Thank you very much. I join you in giving a special salute to bob. His excellent work with the senate recording studio is legend here on capitol hill. I have been told this is his last hearing. Is bob here? Bob is not here. We want him to know that we thank him for his extraordinary service.
▶ 0:28:12Sen. Wyden: He brings new meaning to the concept of keeping the trains rolling. He keeps everything rolling and we wish him all the best in his retirement. With respect to the nominees the committee will vote on shortly, first up is Dr. adams, nominated to serve as assistant secretary for family support at the department of health and human services. Initially I thought Dr. adams was someone who could make a really big difference.
▶ 0:28:40Sen. Wyden: What I found as we looked into his record and some of the questioning of the committee, he talks and encouraging game with respect to safety and healt -- helping families. A look at his record shows something very different. He weakened oversight standards for treatment facilities for my staff of 10 kids to be at high risk of abuse and neglect.
▶ 0:29:09Sen. Wyden: He single-handedly defunded programs in idaho that supported kids with disabilities and their families. He oversaw the well of staffing standards at childcare facilities in idaho. Simply put, the record shows a significant number of kids and families were hurt. He appears to be just somebody else who will greenlight donald trump's dangerous and destructive agenda.
▶ 0:29:34Sen. Wyden: During his hearing he bobbed and weaved as we asked questions about various issues in areas where the administration is undermining the health of kids and families. Dr. adams repeatedly stated his job was to follow the law. When asked by committee members for commitment to make sure congressional he appropriated funds for essential programs like head start actually gets out the door and is something required by law, he just did not answer.
▶ 0:30:05Sen. Wyden: He is measles response -- we have been seeing concern about measles all over the country. He said he was ready to tackle measles because on his watch there had been one case in idaho. If confirmed, I intend to hold Dr. adams to his initial commitment and work to address abuse and neglect of children in residential treatment facilities. To that end, Mr.
▶ 0:30:31Sen. Wyden: Chairman, make the public our latest findings in that investigation you will remember as we worked on it together as it relates to the mistreatment of lgbtq youth. I would like to make sure the staff works with viewers to have this made part of the record.
▶ 0:30:50Chair Crapo: Without objection.
▶ 0:30:52Sen. Wyden: Now let me turn to jonathan mckernan's nomination. Earlier this year, treasury handed doge the keys to the kingdom for the treasury payment system. When I pressed about the takeover of the payment system and its implications for privacy, Mr. mckernan basically said there is no there there. If confirmed he would play key role in how the department handles the most sensitive data of american taxpayers found in that payment system.
▶ 0:31:23Sen. Wyden: The american people deserve to know what doge is doing with their personal information of what's being done by the trump administration to protect the data. Instead we have been met consistently by this administration with stonewalling by what is going on in the fort knox of people's personal information. My seatmate has been doing great work on privacy issues for years. We sure need a lot of it give it given what's going on with doge. Mr.
▶ 0:31:51Sen. Wyden: Mckernan failed to demonstrate he will be committed to protecting taxpayers from the ongoing campaign of destruction at the treasury. For that, I respectfully urge my colleagues to vote no on both of these individuals.
▶ 0:32:02Chair Crapo: Thank you, senator widen. Does any of the senator was to make a remark? The committee will recess briefly and proceed to this morning's nominations hearing. We will fight notify members of the time a day which will be 11:00 a.m. At the first vote for the vote on these nominees.
▶ 0:32:21Sen. Wyden: I gather it's been hectic. You want to start in a few minutes and your hope is we get out and done by 11:00?
▶ 0:32:31Chair Crapo: Yeah. If not, perhaps we can rotate going through the votes if we need to.
▶ 0:32:37Sen. Wyden: That will be fine.
▶ 0:32:38Chair Crapo: Without objection, the committee stands in recess.
▶ 0:38:50Chair Crapo: The committee will come to order and thank you to our nominees, Mr. switzer, Mr. chiarello, Mr. stuart and Mr. theurer. Thank you for all of you for your willingness to serve. We will first hear from rick sweitzer, nominee for deputy united states trade are presented for asia, textiles investment, services and intellectual property. Mr.
▶ 0:39:18Chair Crapo: Switzer has over 25 years of experience in advancing strategic interest both domestically and internationally. Throughout his career as a foreign service officer at the department of state he negotiated international agreements, expanded market access for U.S. businesses, and protected american firms from unfair trade practices such as intellectual property theft and forced technology transfer.
▶ 0:39:46Chair Crapo: I look forward to working with him if confirmed to ensure ustr implements policies that promote U.S. competitiveness, filled supply chain resilience and addresses emerging global challenges. Next we will hear from gus ch iarello for financial research sources at the department of health and human services -- resources.
▶ 0:40:12Chair Crapo: Is responsible for providing advice and guidance to the secretary on all aspects of the budget -- excuse me -- financial management, acquisition policy and grants supervision. If confirmed, Mr. chiarello would play a role in managing and overseeing the allocation of resources across the full range of hhs programs.
▶ 0:40:34Chair Crapo: His experience in consumer protection, regulatory reform , competition and antitrust to make him a valuable addition to the team. As an attorney here served at the federal trade commission and the house judiciary committee, he's prepared to ensure the hhs resources are stewarded to benefit all americans. We will hear from mike st uart.
▶ 0:41:03Chair Crapo: The general counsel supports the development and implementation of the departments programs by providing the highest quality legal services to the secretary and the organization's various agencies and divisions. Mr. stuart will be making sure laws and regulations are effectively prevented -- in limited. -- effectively implemented.
▶ 0:41:31Chair Crapo: His experience prosecuting cases related to opioids and medicaid fraud demonstrates a strong commitment to protecting patients and root out waste and abuse in health care systems. Finally we will hear from derek theurer, nominated to serve as deputy undersecretary for legislative affairs at the treasury department.
▶ 0:41:55Chair Crapo: The deputy undersecretary is responsible for advising the secretary on congressional relations matters in order to assist in the formulation of policy and determine the overall direction of the department. Mr. theurer is a veteran of capitol hill and undoubtedly understands the importance of keeping congress and formed departmental actions. Given his experience I expect him to prioritize timeliness and responding to inquiries from congress.
▶ 0:42:21Chair Crapo: Thank you again to our nominees for their time today, that I recognize ranking member wyden for his opening remarks.
▶ 0:42:28Sen. Wyden: Thank you, Mr. chairman. We will talk to four nominees for deputy united states trade representative covering asia and a number of key sectors in the economy, including textiles. This is a key position, Mr. switzer. Based on the answers the committee received in discussion with a number of nominees I'm worried americans will get hurt on their watch if they are confirmed.
▶ 0:42:57Sen. Wyden: The burden of proof is on the nominees to show they will bring a fresh approach to a presidential administration that has made chaos's calling card. I will start with the nominee to be general counsel of hhs, michael stuart. The lawyer responsible for calling balls and strikes and making sure the department follows the law. Robert kennedy and donald trump have shown little interest of that.
▶ 0:43:23Sen. Wyden: The administration's slash and burn approach may satisfy some of the people on the far right but it's causing real harm to communities and families. Republicans have no doubt the biggest blow to the medicaid program in the history.of the program robert kennedy is getting the federal body that decides which vaccines americans get and which kind of preventative screenings are encouraged.
▶ 0:43:49Sen. Wyden: They are systematically dismantling head start, threatening early education that starts kids and families walking economic tight ropes up on the right foot. Donald trump and robert kennedy have show have little interest in upholding an important federal law known as mtala that protects women and mothers.
▶ 0:44:11Sen. Wyden: Robert kennedy has played 52 card pickup with federal workers responsible for keeping seniors, kids in americans with disabilities and working families healthy and safe. The trump health department is now on the taxpayer dime defending these actions which I think are unquestionably reckless. This is the direct result of hhs's flawed interpretations and sometimes disregard of the federal law. Mr. stuart would be responsible for advising the department about these questions.
▶ 0:44:40Sen. Wyden: The real question is how does somebody approach the role for being in administration that has turned violating the law and to what amounts to it olympic sport? I will look for evidence that these nominees are not going to be another rubberstamp in these crusades. Next up we have gustav chiarello , nominated to be the assistant secretary for financial resources at hhs.
▶ 0:45:07Sen. Wyden: This nominee will be responsible for the budget and the distribution of grants and other financial issues. We looked at his resume and here I was troubled about the overall lack of background managing finances of any organization, let alone one of the largest in the country.
▶ 0:45:28Sen. Wyden: Given the trump administration's self-proclaimed interest in the budget, it seems there would have been the possibility of finding somebody with a background into actually managing things. It's an important role, especially in light of the administration's weaponizing of federal grants to punish and pressure political opponents. Members of this committee ought to be looking for impartiality and independence from political influence for a role that touches lives of so many communities across the nation.
▶ 0:45:56Sen. Wyden: I mentioned already bryan switzer, nominated to be deputy U.S. trade representative, an important position now as we look at upcoming deadlines. From day one donald trump's trade agenda has been nothing short of disastrous. Basically it consist of a few lines on a napkin for the most part and a lot of flip-flopping on tariffs. Farmers, businesses and workers are left in limbo.
▶ 0:46:26Sen. Wyden: Something I felt very strongly about and spoke about on the floor. This roller coaster of uncertainty is causing huge harm to the farmers. I say to the chairman are part of the world we farmers -- the wheat farmers told me prices are down, that's a big problem. The input costs are up. Go back there and tell everybody in D.C. to give us some certainty, give us some predictability. That's the kind of leadership we would like.
▶ 0:46:55Sen. Wyden: Finally, that brings us to derek theurer nominated to serve as deputy under secretary of the treasury. During the first six months in office donald trump has managed to weaponize nearly every part of the treasury department to target his enemies or those that disagree with him. That has been to the detriment of the country. Mr. theurer is well-known to this committee. I hope he makes improvements down there.
▶ 0:47:21Sen. Wyden: Folks know that we work closely together on a bipartisan effort in the last congress to try to deal with taxes. The reality is right now among the current class of trump appointees, even familiar nominees have been put in situations that they simply cannot address the public interest. Trust is long gone but this treasury department. It is turning the irs against taxpayers and looking out for the wealthy and powerful.
▶ 0:47:52Sen. Wyden: I know there will be questions for Mr. theurer. I want to think the nominees for being here and I look forward to question and answers.
▶ 0:47:58Chair Crapo: Thank you, senator wyden. Before, I will provide a short introduction of each nominee. I have given a partial introduction during my opening comments. Mr. switzer served as a foreign service officer with the state department for over 20 years. Most recently as a director of policy and strategy for the special envoy office for critical and emerging technology.
▶ 0:48:27Chair Crapo: He was also previously a member of the secretary of state's policy planning council and a senior state department advisor to the department of defense, working with the air force and the army. Mr. chiarello previously served as senior special counsel to the house committee on the judiciary. He was an attorney at the federal trade commission for over 15 years and has years of experience in the private sector. Mr. theurer --Mr.
▶ 0:48:50Chair Crapo: Stuart serves as a member of the west virginia state senate and was previously the U.S. attorney for the southern district of west virginia during the first trump administration and was confirmed by the senate in 2017. Mr. theurer previously served as a senior policy advisor to speaker johnson. Mr. theurer also served as a republican chief tax counsel for the house committee on ways and means and began his career in the private sector.
▶ 0:49:21Chair Crapo: Before you will give your opening statements, I have four obligatory questions we ask all nominees before the senate finance committee. You can just give me a brief yes or no answer to these questions. We will start on this side and go down the row. Is there anything you are aware of in your background and my a conflict of interest with the duties of the office to which you have been nominated? >> no. >> no.
▶ 0:49:48Chair Crapo: Do you know of any reason that would in any way prevent you from fully and honorably discharging the responsibilities of the office to which you have been nominated? >> I do not. >> no. >> no.
▶ 0:50:08Chair Crapo: Do you agree without reservation to respond to any reasonable summons to appear and testify before any duly constituted committee of congress if you are confirmed? >>.yes >> yes. >> yes.
▶ 0:50:20Chair Crapo: Do you commit to providing a prompt response in writing to any question addressed to you by any senator from this committee? >> yes. >> yes. >> absolutely.
▶ 0:50:28Chair Crapo: We will begin in the same order with Mr. switzer and move down the line. You may give your opening statements.
▶ 0:50:34Mr. Switzer: Chairman, members of this committee, I'm honored to appear today as president trump's nominee for deputy united states trade representative for asia, textiles, investment, services and intellectual property. I'm grateful to president trump and ambassador greer further trust and confidence. I appreciate the time members have spent with me. I look forward to working with you if I am confirmed. I'm also -- I want to express my appreciation for my family, some of whom are present today.
▶ 0:51:05Mr. Switzer: I'm grateful to my mother and father to my three siblings. I'm thankful for the support of my wife sandy and our three children, ethan, charlie and finnigan. I spent more than two decades in public service advancing you a strategic interest at the intersection of diplomacy, trade, technology and national security. If confirmed, I look forward to continuing that mission to serve the president in partnership with congress and on behalf of the american people. United states and our allies look to build the international trading system.
▶ 0:51:36Mr. Switzer: While we have benefited from the system, it like all systems of governance from time to time are in need of reform. The status quo trading system of the past two decades ignored the unfair trading practices of many of our largest trading partners and as a result many americans in the middle class are hurting. We need trade policies and practices that placed the american economy, the american worker first, requiring all of our trade partners play by wills based on reciprocity.
▶ 0:52:04Mr. Switzer: Throughout my 20 years of government service I worked to promote the economic interest of the united states around the globe. I have served in senior positions in the department of state, including on the secretary of state's policy planning staff as a senior advisor to the department of defense. I had the honor to develop and teach graduate courses on china's economy and innovation system at the national intelligence university. In every role I have seen how trade policy, technological leadership and national security are deeply intertwined.
▶ 0:52:35Mr. Switzer: As our global competitors seek to rewrite the rules of commerce we must ensure our trade agenda supports not just economic growth but also the values, resilience and strategic strength of the united states. By ensuring an american worker, farmer and businesses can compete fairly in global markets. Having spent my career negotiating agreements and defending our companies forced technology transfers and other discriminatory practices, I believe the policies must ensure america's producers, not just consumers benefit from global commerce.
▶ 0:53:07Mr. Switzer: That means securing reciprocal access, raising labor and environment the standards, and confronting coercive practices at home. Additionally we must strive to enhance our economic and supply-chain resilience. The past two years have exposed vulnerabilities in the supply chains, particularly in strategic sectors like semiconductors, pharmaceuticals and critical minerals. In the geopolitical climate we must treat economic resilience as a core pillar of national security.
▶ 0:53:35Mr. Switzer: Ustr has a role to play in advancing trade agreements and partnerships that strengthen our ability to withstand shocks and reduce overall reliance on adversarial economies. I believe he was leadership should be principled, pragmatic and strategic. In my experience across the executive branch and overseas, successful policy depends on deep integrated -- interagency coronation, close consultation from congress, and sustained engagement with allies and partners. Trade is not an end unto itself.
▶ 0:54:06Mr. Switzer: It's a tool to advance our broader goals, economic prosperity for all americans, industrial-strength, technological leadership, and global stability. I am committed to working with this committee to ensure our trade agenda reflects those priorities and delivers tangible results for the american people. Thank you again for the opportunity to be here. I look forward to your questions.
▶ 0:54:27Chair Crapo: Thank you very much. Mr. chiarello.
▶ 0:54:35Mr. Chiarello: Members of the committee, thank you for the opportunity to testify here today. I would like to introduce my wife jill who is joining me today. We have been married for 31 years. We have four children. Our daughter frances and gus I v, peter and dominic.
▶ 0:54:57Mr. Chiarello: I also want to acknowledge my parents, linda and gus watching from florida and my in-laws dona and paul. I am thrilled and honored and think president trump for nominating me to serve as the assistant secretary for financial resources at the department of health and human services.
▶ 0:55:23Mr. Chiarello: It's an honor and privilege to be nominated by president trump and to be invited to serve in his administration. I'm grateful to secretary kennedy for his encouragement and for his vision and leadership in shaping hhs in a way to restore integrity and competence in our government health programs and inspire americans to live healthy lives. Secretary kennedy has long been a champion for the well-being of all americans and it's a great honor to be able to serve on his team to make america healthy again.
▶ 0:55:55Mr. Chiarello: For some background, I grew up in cooperstown, new york, moved to washington for college, graduated from law school and became an antitrust and competition policy lawyer. Jill and I met just after college and married and settled in alexandria, virginia, where we raise our family. After law school, I worked in private practice and for many years at the federal trade commission in antitrust enforcement and competition policy. I worked with chairman jim jordan with the house committee on the judiciary. We need to address health care spending.
▶ 0:56:26Mr. Chiarello: For decades our health care costs have been rising. Hospital and facility consolidation increasing. New product approvals have become more costly. Despite best efforts on legislation, the financial burdens of health care have grown to a point of crisis. The hardest hit have been rural communities and vulnerable populations in urban and suburban areas. Throughout the last four years of the biden administration, the department budget increased by nearly 40% in the staffing increased by 17%.
▶ 0:56:56Mr. Chiarello: Hhs spent $1.7 trillion in fiscal year 2024, the highest among federal agencies in total spending. Meanwhile cancer rates in young people are growing. Mental health needs for all age groups continues to rise. Diabetes rates for americans have reached new highs. Increasingly more and more americans are affected a chronic illness. In short, the money being spent has not resulted in overall improvements of the health quality of americans.
▶ 0:57:27Mr. Chiarello: Clearly what government have been doing did not work. That said, I think now as one of the most exciting times for america, particularly because we are on the cusp of a revolution in the way we approach health care. The hhs budget accounts for more than 25% of federal spending.
▶ 0:57:45Mr. Chiarello: My role should I be confirmed will be to provide advice and guidance to the secretary on all aspects of the budget, financial management, grants and acquisition management, and to provide for the direction and implementation of all these activities across the department. I learned the ftc that good policy comes from asking good questions.
▶ 0:58:07Mr. Chiarello: I look forward to capitalizing on that experience and my background to bring health care spending under control, to generate greater access to care and important medicines, to revitalizing the science behind our health care, and thereby spur the mission to promote a healthier america.
▶ 0:58:23Mr. Chiarello: Drinking my background is an antitrust lawyer to hhs, I plan to lead the division by digging into the details and making recommendations so taxpayer dollars are being used efficiently and producing maximum outcomes so hhs can better identify the best ways to address waste, fraud and abuse so we can better direct those resources to improve health care in america. No doubt the work we will do will be arduous.
▶ 0:58:53Mr. Chiarello: Taking this proactive approach and applying my background it will be well worth it to unlock the awesome potential of our health and prosperity. It is a great time to be an american. It's a great opportunity to be part of secretary kennedy's agenda. I welcome your questions.
▶ 0:59:12Chair Crapo: Thank you, Mr. chiarello. Mr. stuart.
▶ 0:59:20Mr. Stuart: Members of the senate finance committee, thank you for the opportunity to be here today and considering my nomination to be the general counsel of the department of health and human services. I want to begin by thanking president trump for his confidence in me and nominating me to the to this important role to support his vision for america. I want to thank secretary kennedy for his support and confidence in his leadership to make america healthy again.
▶ 0:59:50Mr. Stuart: I want to thank all the men and women of hhs who work hard each day in capacities that touch nearly every aspect of american life. Finally, I would not be here today as a nominee without the strength and encouragement of my family. Family in many ways defines me. I want to thank my wife, who is here today and had no idea what this journey called life would be nearly three decades ago.
▶ 1:00:17Mr. Stuart: You're blessed to have two amazing daughters. Bella is here with me today and audrey is not able to be with us today. She is working but watching this hearing right now. At least that is what she tells me. The opportunity to be here as a nominee is a testament to the opportunity of america.
▶ 1:00:39Mr. Stuart: If you were to have told me as a young boy that one day I would be sitting here testifying before members of the united states senate in consideration of a position in a president's administration, I would have told you impossible. Nothing is impossible in america. I'm a proud son and grandson of west virginia coal miners and I was blessed with great parents. My dad would go to work in the dark, come home in the dark, and he worked more than 50 years in the coal mining industry.
▶ 1:01:12Mr. Stuart: My mom worked nearly 30 years as a nurse. My grandfather served in the military. One fought on the beaches of normandy and both spent decades as coal miners. After being nominated by president trump, I had the honor of being confirmed and served as the united states attorney for the southern district of west virginia. I may have left the role of united states attorney. My experiences in that role will never leave me. Our work was significant.
▶ 1:01:42Mr. Stuart: For the first time in west virginia history, my office prosecuted members of the west virginia supreme court, established a landmark settlement for children with disabilities, and our focus on health care fraud resulted in the largest medicaid fraud prosecution in the history of west virginia. I worked on the front lines of the opiate scourge. We took on a fentanyl off the streets to kill more than 40 million people. In a state of only 1.75 million.
▶ 1:02:14Mr. Stuart: I carry a wallet in my pocket filled with beautiful faces of the victim of the opiate academic -- epidemic while I was U.S. attorney. These are the pictures that haunt me in the silence of the dark of night. Young people like joel archer and victoria douglas. I have gotten to know too many of the moms and dads at the point of their darkest, gravest grief. Moms like stacy archer and melody douglas.
▶ 1:02:44Mr. Stuart: As state senator, I represent one of the districts hit hardest by the opiate crisis but also the technological revolution, changes to the american industrial economy and a population exodus. I have led efforts on child welfare and the opiate crisis. My experience as a state senator gives me a true appreciation of the role of elected bodies like congress for the establishment of public policy, constituent representation, and priorities.
▶ 1:03:15Mr. Stuart: I have unique perspective and appreciation for the importance of rural health care. I care about issues like medicane because the recipients are my friends, neighbors clan constituents, people I attend church with on sunday. I know the importance of effective delivery of services and the impact of fraud and the harm it does to those who most need support. I will place priority on developing a team with a focus on continual improvement and training.
▶ 1:03:45Mr. Stuart: I will build multidisciplinary teams to address critical issues. I will place a priority on identifying and eliminating fraud. I will work in collaboration with members of congress with a sense of urgency. I way to have confidence in me and the department. As general counsel, I will bring the totality of my experiences, personal and professional, to the role to help president trump and secretary kennedy do the work of the american people.
▶ 1:04:14Mr. Stuart: If I were to define how I feel today, it would be grateful. I'm grateful for this opportunity for the countless generations of american heroes upon whose shoulders I stand today, people like my mom and dad and my family. Thank you for the opportunity to be here today and for your consideration. Thank you.
▶ 1:04:38Mr. Theurer: It is a privilege to have my nomination considered by you all today. Thank you for the time that you and your staff have taken to meet with me. I know there are many demands on your time. I am grateful for the trust that secretary bessent has offered me and my role as counselor. It is an honor to be nominated as deputy under secretary of the treasury by president trump and to have the continued confidence of the secretary.
▶ 1:05:07Mr. Theurer: I want to thank my team at home as well as my parents, my father-in-law, and late mother-in-law. They have been my biggest champions. I take seriously the responsibilities that attend the positions I have held in public service. I love this great nation. I'm honored by these opportunities to serve and help improve the lives of our fellow americans.
▶ 1:05:34Mr. Theurer: I have been fortunate to work for a remarkable series of principles while in government, chairman bill cassidy, chairman jason smith, speaker of the house mike johnson, and now sec. Bessent. It is inspiring to see the sacrifice, skill, and dedication these individuals bring to their leadership roles.
▶ 1:05:59Mr. Theurer: Having previously served as a senior tax counsel to a member of the finance committee, there is a feeling of home in this hearing room. I recognize the scope and significance of the issues deliberated here, including tax, trade, social security, and family assistance. I have great respect for members of this committee and the equipment to public service displayed by all those serving in congress. I count as friends and colleagues the outstanding finance committee staff on both sides of the aisle.
▶ 1:06:29Mr. Theurer: I have been privileged to work with them on matters of well-being and prosperity of workers and families across the country. Of note, the security .0 acta 2022, which culminated more than two years of bipartisan effort to strengthen our retirement saving system.
▶ 1:06:46Mr. Theurer: I was pleased to see the one big, beautiful bill signed into law by president trump on july 4, locking in critical tax benefits for families and small businesses and priming our economy for growth. If confirmed, as tippy under sec. Of the treasury, I look forward to continuing to partner with you on the important work undertaken by this committee. I understand your responsibilities for legislating and conducting oversight.
▶ 1:07:14Mr. Theurer: To assist those efforts, the treasury office of legislative affairs will be open and responsive on relevant matters, increase our departmental office -- I am confident we can find ways to strengthen the economy and build greater security for american families. Thank you for considering my nomination and I look forward to your questions.
▶ 1:07:36Sen. Wyden: It is great to see you here in this room again and I'm glad to see you on the other side of the table. We look forward to your service with sec. Bessent. I do not have a question for you. I know from working with you in the past how committed you are to the agenda that we are seeking to implement in the trump administration and sec. Bessent is pursuing.
▶ 1:08:05Sen. Wyden: I wanted to let you know I look forward to this continued opportunity to work with you.
▶ 1:08:10Mr. Theurer: I look forward to working with you and all the members of the committee.
▶ 1:08:14Chair Crapo: Mr. switzer, intellectual property protection is a critical issue. The U.S. trade representative plays a key role in protecting those rights around the world. For example, ustr prepares the annual special report which identifies a wide range of concerns that limit american innovation and investment.
▶ 1:08:36Chair Crapo: How are you going to use the tools at your disposal to address the challenges identified in the special report to ensure rigorous enforcement of american intellectual property rights exists and fosters that innovation?
▶ 1:08:51Mr. Switzer: Very important question. Intellectual property rights are a priority of president trump. It has been discussed several times. Everyone one of our trade agreements is first and foremost in our discussions. Issues like digital service taxes and others are issues that we are very concerned about.
▶ 1:09:18Mr. Switzer: We can -- intend to use every tool in your disposal, working with commerce and other elements of the U.S. government to ensure that U.S. intellectual property rights are protected, that U.S. property rights holders are protected, including things like trademarks and other items where you have counterfeit goods from certain countries and also where U.S.
▶ 1:09:43Mr. Switzer: Intellectual property is stolen outright or countries have provided access to intellectual property. We intend to use every tool at our disposal. I have lived in china and worked in china. I have work on these issues most of my adult life. I worked with tech companies, helping them understand how to protect intellectual property rights in places like china. In many cases, that included developing strategies where they sold through third parties.
▶ 1:10:14Mr. Switzer: I worked with companies who had intellectual property stolen. One of the real issues we have faced in this regard when it comes to china is when firms come to us and tell us the things that happened to them they often tell us not to do anything about it. This administration has decided we are going to take on those practices. We are not going to choose to prosecute one case or not prosecute one case on behalf of a specific firm.
▶ 1:10:44Mr. Switzer: We are going to look at the totality of the trade actions, intellectual property theft that takes place in any given country, and take action against the entire country as opposed to one-off attempt that have been attempted in previous administrations.
▶ 1:11:05Mr. Switzer: Particularly living and working in china, in almost every case that approach did not work so we are using a systemic approach that uses every tool at our disposal to approach this from the ground up.
▶ 1:11:19Chair Crapo: You have learned firsthand that when a person steps forward to serve the political world we live in goes on the attack and personal attacks are the weapon of the day. I would like to give you an opportunity to respond to accusations that you have a conflict of interest with respect to your campaigns for virginia state senate and attorney general, respectively. These are brief, quick questions.
▶ 1:11:49Chair Crapo: In your campaigns for the state senate and attorney general in 2022 and 2024, did you fully comply with west virginia campaign-finance law?
▶ 1:11:58Mr. Stuart: Thank you for the question. I appreciate the opportunity to answer. I did. I have always done everything I can to comply with the law. When a question was raised by a member of the staff with respect to the subject I think about a week ago, within 24 hours I believe, give or take an hour, I made sure, because I take great pride in my background in terms of my ethics and the way I have
▶ 1:12:29Mr. Stuart: Complied with the law. I provided every single finance report from my senate campaigns and campaign for attorney general in west virginia to the office of government ethics. It is important to me. I take pride in this record over 30 years as a professional. Their zest -- has never been controversy in terms of my character, conduct, or ethics, so I thank you for that question. >> thank you.
▶ 1:12:59Mr. Stuart: I wanted to be sure we got that on the record. My time is expired, so you got away without my question.
▶ 1:13:07Sen. Wyden: Let me start with you as you sensed from our visit that I'm concerned about some of what you have been involved in in west virginia on the health care front. I will get into a couple issues that you would have to deal with if confirmed and I want to start with the trump administration record on the law.
▶ 1:13:34Sen. Wyden: For those who may not know the details of it, this is a law that requires hospitals to provide emergency stabilizing treatment for all patients that show up at their door.
▶ 1:13:49Sen. Wyden: After the dobbs case, the biden administration provided clarity that hospitals must provide stabilizing productive health care in all states, so the trump administration, one of the first things they want to do was to get rid of that guidance and women have been suffering, even dying, and there is even more chaos and confusion.
▶ 1:14:21Sen. Wyden: At the heart of the problem is under the trump administration approach, doctors play lawyers, lawyers play doctors, women are suffering, and they tell us we have one witness, in the emergency room come and people are arguing about what to do. Women suffering and even dying under these trump rules.
▶ 1:14:45Sen. Wyden: My first question to you is, do you believe that this federal law I just described requires women to become septic or at risk of death to receive emergency reproductive medical care? >> I look forward to many opportunities in the future if confirmed to be able to work with you and your staff on important issues like this.
▶ 1:15:14Sen. Wyden: I have taken a look at the law with respect --
▶ 1:15:16Sen. Wyden: My time is short. Do you believe that the law requires women to become septic to get reproductive emergency medical care?
▶ 1:15:30Mr. Stuart: The answer is nothing in the law prevents emergency treatment for pregnant women. Nothing in the lot today prevents that.
▶ 1:15:42Sen. Wyden: Let's do it this way because you are ducking the question. What would you do to make sure that hospitals comply with the law I just read to you? When you get this job, what would you do to make sure hospitals comply with the law I read you?
▶ 1:16:04Mr. Theurer: --
▶ 1:16:07Mr. Stuart: I encourage everyone to follow the law.
▶ 1:16:10Sen. Wyden: You will be walking into a situation where in hospitals there's so much chaos and so much confusion -- women get hurt and it is because, as we have heard testimony, doctors play lawyers. Lawyers play doctors. We need somebody who is going to step in and make sure women are protected in line with the law.
▶ 1:16:34Sen. Wyden: I asked you two questions already and I would like to know , if you get confirmed, what are you going to do to step in and deal with his confusion and chaos about the law that is hurting women?
▶ 1:16:46Mr. Stuart: I am a lawyer, not a doctor, but I will provide guidance with respect to the law. I believe the law is clear. Nothing in the law today prevents private women from getting life-sustaining emergent treatment. When they are in the hospital.
▶ 1:17:01Sen. Wyden: I will move on because you ducked three questions on this topic. If you like to send us something in writing that would describe how you would actually make sure that hospitals are following the law -- not encouraging and all the rest would actually following it -- I would like to see it. Mr. switzer, we are having all kinds of problems with business people. My state is a business state.
▶ 1:17:31Sen. Wyden: After you're done with a couple big companies, everybody is a solid business operator. It is the tariffs hitting them like a wrecking ball. If you are confirmed, what would you do? I would like a specific idea to help these small businesses. Because they are getting hit by taxes. That is what tariffs are. What would you do?
▶ 1:17:53Mr. Switzer: Thank you for that question. What I would do is what the president is trying to do now and has been doing with great trade deals and what ambassador greer has been doing. I would push for access. U.S. small businesses have been denied access to most markets around the world.
▶ 1:18:14Mr. Switzer: The tariff barriers, regulatory strictures, use of white lists of products that are available to be purchased -- my experience in china is deep and I can tell you small businesses from the united states trying to sell in china, whether they compete on price cut whether they have a huge market -- none of those things matter. The government puts in place restrictions --
▶ 1:18:38Sen. Wyden: What would you do for the small business person?
▶ 1:18:41Mr. Switzer: Opening business. We are in the middle of opening business.
▶ 1:18:47Sen. Wyden: You are faced with taxes. A tariff is a taxpayer they want tax relief.
▶ 1:18:54Mr. Switzer: We are working diligently.
▶ 1:19:02Sen. Grassley: My first question -- maybe it will eat up all my time. The one big, beautiful bill was a historic achievement. We averted the largest tax increase in history and made business provisions permanent.
▶ 1:19:19Sen. Grassley: It unlocked a business investment that would create jobs and provides a middle class tax relief so now, getting to treasury regulations and making decisions, as treasury works to them lament the bill, the agency must work with members to ensure provisions are and lamented according to the statute and faithful to congressional intent so the first questions are general.
▶ 1:19:48Sen. Grassley: Can we count on you to keep congress well-informed during the process and consult with relative members of congress where questions arise as to what was congressional intent?
▶ 1:20:03Mr. Theurer: Absolutely. I want to recognize that you have long been a leader on this committee. I remember fondly the late nights and hard work we had in 2017 through that bill. I know you have done the same here and treasury will implement the law. I look forward to working with you and your team.
▶ 1:20:24Sen. Grassley: There are several provisions I am particularly interested in seeing faithfully and lamented. This includes the structure of the phase out for wind and solar credits and modifications of the clean fuels production credit. Remember you are talking to the father of the wind energy tax credit. I worked with my colleagues to provide wind and solar and an path for the orderly phaseout of the tax credits.
▶ 1:20:56Sen. Grassley: Congress enshrined in statute a 12 month transition period based on when projects begin construction. What it means for a project to begin construction has been very well established by transferring guidance for more than a decade, or congress references current
▶ 1:21:27Sen. Grassley: Treasury guidelines to set that term's meaning into law. It seems to me this is a case where the law and congressional intent are very clear, so will you commit to advising the department that the law and the congressional intent are clear and that the beginning of destruction -- construction means what it has meant for more than a decade?
▶ 1:22:00Mr. Theurer: You have been a leader firtash
▶ 1:22:03Sen. Grassley: Is your mike on? Get closer to it.
▶ 1:22:09Mr. Theurer: You have been a leader for many decades on these tax policies. It is tough to imagine a better representative of constituent interest then you are and this is an issue that falls squarely in the purview of the office of tax policy at treasury. We had an opportunity to meet with your staff this week. I understand there was interaction directly with you as well.
▶ 1:22:30Mr. Theurer: If confirmed, you can expect that type of engagement to continue, and open-door through the office of legislative affairs at the office of tax policy works through these questions.
▶ 1:22:43Sen. Grassley: Now to biofuels. The reconciliation bill proposed an extension and modification of clean fuel production tax credit . In lamenting this properly and quickly is important for the industry and participants, especially farmers.
▶ 1:23:04Sen. Grassley: The biden administration failed to meaningfully address regulation, which has caused major market disruption, including plant closures. When can we expect to see guidance on the clean fuel credits so the biofuels industry can confidently move forward? With its operations?
▶ 1:23:27Mr. Theurer: This is an issue that falls within the office of tax policy. I do not have the timeline, but this input is helpful. It is noted and we will be sure it is conveyed as a priority to my colleagues.
▶ 1:23:44Sen. Grassley: Can you expand my point of view to everybody? This will have to be quick. Do you think -- you will be handling areas of international and I'm interested in china aced on your personal history you know how challenging this will be. Do you think the whole united states economy needs to decouple completely from china or only certain sections of our economy?
▶ 1:24:23Mr. Switzer: We do not seek to decouple from china. We seek trade reps up -- reciprocity. There are certain segments of the U.S. economy that require de-risking, semi conductors is important. Autonomous vehicles. We have cyber physical systems that can turn on and off elements of our infrastructure, aerospace, defense, other areas of national infrastructure.
▶ 1:24:52Mr. Switzer: These are things we need to de-risk, but when it comes to other areas we want to sell into china. As long as there's trade reciprocity we should be able to buy from china items they produce that others cannot produce, whether certain types of textiles or others. What we seek is fairness, reciprocity, and strategic de-risking.
▶ 1:25:20Sen. Wyden: The time has expired. >> dan sullivan and I have been working together on ocean plastic waste problems.
▶ 1:25:37Sen. Wyden: One of our bills attracted the president's attention and we went up to the trump office for a bill signing and he was excited enough about it that he called in the press, not just a bill signing, and did a long riff about how important it is to our coasts that all the plastic waste that is being dumped, often through asian rivers into the ocean and then once up on our shores, that was a problem we should be solving.
▶ 1:26:08Sen. Wyden: Obviously dan and I agree that is a problem we should be solving. One useful solution to that would be to put a trade penalty or consequence of some kind on these asian countries that do not invest adequately in their own waste management systems. Which would seem also to be good for american companies that provide waste management equipment and advice and support.
▶ 1:26:34Sen. Wyden: So I would ask you to consider that as you are looking at trade policy with asia. At the moment, they are getting away free. There are no consequences for them from that. It is not even in our list of trade concerns come and get it was enough to aggravate president trump in this meeting. Would you comment on that?
▶ 1:27:00Mr. Switzer: I agree. I have a long history of working on these specific issues. I was the environment science technology counselor in beijing from 2015 to 2018. I have visited the settling ponds in mongolia met where they process rare earths.
▶ 1:27:20Mr. Switzer: One of the ways they are able to flood markets with products that are below market value is because they do not internalize environment lacrosse. It is an unrecognized subsidy in my opinion. It is a priority of the ustr to begin better environmental safeguards within our trade agreements.
▶ 1:27:45Sen. Whitehouse: Let me jump to that because that is a perfect segue to my second point, which is that, with respect to carbon pollution we are at a disadvantage with respect to china, which has become the greatest polluter. It gives financial vantage to chinese firms that do not have to invest in appropriate environmental safeguards and protections and scrubbers and so forth.
▶ 1:28:15Sen. Whitehouse: Versus us. So I gather you would agree that we suffer both in economic and environment to harm when we allow off shoring based on the fake advantages of one country not meeting up to its environmental responsibilities the way that we do.
▶ 1:28:35Mr. Switzer: I would agree. That is why the usmca had environmental safeguards built into the trade agreement. And pastor greer said many times we want to build high quality environmental safeguards into other trade agreements. As we move forward with our discussions about providing more reciprocal trade environment and labor standards, these are other aspects that we intend to build.
▶ 1:29:01Sen. Whitehouse: Senator cassidy and senator graham have a bill on the republican side. I have a massing -- matching bill on the democrat side. We are in conversation constantly about try to reconcile the two and we have asked the trade representatives to participate in those discussions and he has promised he will once this flurry of tariff activity that must have you pretty overburdened over there is through. So I look forward to making good on that pledge.
▶ 1:29:29Sen. Whitehouse: The last thing I will mention, since we have hhs here, I know Mr. stuart, it is not really going to be your problem. I can't let anybody from hhs come through without once again pointing out how infuriating it is to me that hospitals in connecticut, our neighboring state -- I am from rhode island.
▶ 1:29:55Sen. Whitehouse: And massachusetts, the other neighboring state, get paid about 20% more than my hospitals. If a president is visiting martha's vineyard and gets hurt, they fly over saint and hospital to the better, higher quality emergency department, but if they stopped they would get paid $.20 on the dollar more. That is indefensible. Hhs has never defended it. The organization is too lazy and disinterested to fix the problem.
▶ 1:30:25Sen. Whitehouse: It is very real in my home state, so it probably is not general counsel business but you are here from hhs and you are going to hear this from me every chance I get to make this case. There is no defense for this discrepancy. We are one regional health care market and we are getting clobbered as a result of a completely unfair payment discrepancy that your organization does not bother to defend but just maintains.
▶ 1:30:51Sen. Whitehouse: So excuse my rent but I hope you can understand how irritating and unfair that is.
▶ 1:31:00Mr. Stuart: I can guarantee I will be available to you to talk about that issue, other issues, whenever you want to talk about those things. I will take them seriously.
▶ 1:31:14Sen. Whitehouse: We talked about the end of life program in rhode island as well. With that, my time is expired. I thank the ranking member for his courtesy.
▶ 1:31:27Sen. Wyden: Senator lankford is next.
▶ 1:31:33Sen. Lankford: We experience the same thing in oklahoma with a just proportion payment system for surgeons, physicians, whatever it may be based on other states around us and that might have made sense 40 years ago. It does not today. So that will be one of the things -- I look forward to that conversation. Let me continue with you. You are going to have questions that will come up from some of my friends that are here saying, are you going to follow the law?
▶ 1:32:05Sen. Lankford: When president trump asks you to do something. So since you are the council on this, I want to ask you some questions based on what president biden did when he ignore the law repetitively and it had a direct effect on my state and the people in my state. Let me give you examples. Title x funding is out there. It does aids testing in rural areas, breast cancer screenings in rural areas all over the country.
▶ 1:32:31Sen. Lankford: President biden's hhs team invented a new standard to say if each state does not promote, not provide, but does not promote abortion in their state they will not get title x.
▶ 1:32:47Sen. Lankford: He followed up with it in my state and cut off funding for aids testing come up for breast cancer screenings, for all kinds of screenings in my state of oklahoma because my state would not bend to his will and promote abortion in the state they wanted us to put a one 800 number on health materials that went out for my health to barman saying here's the number you can call to get an abortion. When we said no, they said no aids testing funding. There is nothing in the law that says that. They just created that.
▶ 1:33:19Sen. Lankford: That had a direct effect on the health care in my state. The conscience protection issue is clear in law, that if a nurse or physician says to their hospital I do not want to be part of an abortion, I do not want to be part of a sex change operation, that violates my conscience, the federal government is to be able to step in and make sure that protection is actually protected.
▶ 1:33:43Sen. Lankford: The biden administration told everyone at the beginning we are no longer going to protect people and then created a rule they sent out hospitals to say if you are a physician and you do not perform sex change operations we are going to come down on you, literally violating the law on its face. Orr tried to find new ways to shuttle people for abortions.
▶ 1:34:12Sen. Lankford: We just drove them there and provided staffing. I could go on and on about the way they ignore the law. So my question to you is are you going to work to make sure that this administration follows the law that the biden administration ignored?
▶ 1:34:29Mr. Stuart: I appreciate that question. It will be a theme in terms of will you follow the law. I have a career that proves I follow the law. Role I will have is to interpret the law and give good advice to secretary kennedy and members of hhs. When it comes to interpreting and applying the law and I believe my job is not to look outside of that and create new law.
▶ 1:35:00Mr. Stuart: I believe policymakers to a great job of that themselves.
▶ 1:35:06Sen. Lankford: The simple thing here is we want everyone to follow the laws and I'm grateful to have that fixed when previous presidents ignore the law. Let's get back to follow the law. You are going to have a lot of budget issues and big decisions to make on how the process is going to go.
▶ 1:35:25Sen. Lankford: I have noticed a lot the decisions for grants, if you look at the grants and grant decision-makers, they are made by the same people year after year and I'm always shocked that when harvard seems to get a grant every year for the same thing and you look at the grant decision-makers it is made of all harvard graduates. Shocking that that would happen when there are lots of other universities and entities doing great health care research all over the country that do not get a shot to be able to do it.
▶ 1:35:58Sen. Lankford: My simple question -- you do not need to answer a complete today -- grant decision-makers need to change. They need to have fresh eyes. If the same people are make decisions over and over again on that, it will be helpful to get new voices. When you are doing scientific research, getting stuck in a rut does not help. I want to be able to raise that to you as an issue here is that fair?
▶ 1:36:25Sen. Lankford: The other issue want to raise is the decision about some of the health care grants as they are done in general. There has been frustration about how some of the dollars go out. In ih did a 350 thousand dollar award to develop a smarter toilet using ai. Not 100% what the ai toilet is supposed to do. Federal taxpayers paid for a study through hhs about wearing helmets, if they prevent injuries in west africa.
▶ 1:36:56Sen. Lankford: I will tell you for free wearing a helmet in west africa has the same health effects that it does in united states. It is probably a good idea, but we paid for that. There was a study done to study the effect of climate change in a specific area of north africa and its health effects on things. Most americans will say what are we investing our dollars in? We want good research on cancer and rare diseases that are out there.
▶ 1:37:27Sen. Lankford: They are dependent on us doing basic research. When we are doing grant studies and evaluating who gets it, let's make sure we are putting priorities in the places and needs to be put.
▶ 1:37:36Mr. Chiarello: Fair. Thank you.
▶ 1:37:41Chair Crapo: Senator hassan.
▶ 1:37:44Sen. Hassan: Good morning to our nominees and congratulations on your nominations come unto you and your families because I know this is a full family effort. I am going to start with a question with respect to my colleague from oklahoma. I want to be clear I ask all nominees this question. If directed by the president to take action that would break the law, would you follow the law or the president's directive?
▶ 1:38:13Sen. Hassan: I am not talking about regulatory interpretation that courts decide. That is part of democracy. I'm talking about a president whose director sat in front of me in a committee hearing and said he did not believe he or the president had to follow the impoundment control act even though the supreme court of the united states ruled it is constitutional. If you are directed to take an action by the president that would break the law, are you going to follow the law or the president's directive? >> the law.
▶ 1:38:41Sen. Hassan: >> I do not think I'll be asked to do that, but I am an attorney. I follow the law. >> I was never asked to violate the law and I believe if president trump were here now he would say mike stuart, follow the law.
▶ 1:38:55Sen. Hassan: Good because he pardoned people who attacked police officers and were convicted by a jury of ordinary americans. >> I do not expect to be asked that cup -- asked that, but I will follow the law.
▶ 1:39:10Sen. Hassan: We share a commitment to ending the scourge of the fentanyl epidemic. I represent new hampshire on this. 1.4 million people have been devastated by the fentanyl epidemic as the people of west virginia have. Addiction -- agree that methadone is one of the most effective methods to treat people with opioid use disorder. Secretary kennedy said that medication assisted treatment is a critical tool for preventing overdose deaths.
▶ 1:39:40Sen. Hassan: This is one area where secretary kennedy and I agree. As a state senator, you traduced a bill that would outlaw methadone clinics, which would have ended the use of methadone to treat opioid addiction in west virginia. I understand there are bad actors in the methadone clinic space, but do you think secretary kennedy is wrong to support medication assisted treatment like methadone?
▶ 1:40:05Mr. Stuart: It is an important question. It is inside my soul. Time is of the essence. I support and agree with secretary kennedy full heartedly on the issue of medically assisted treatment here in that store that you're talking about, in terms of methadone, the issue methadone and other treatment methodologies with respect to the opiate scourge or people who surfer -- suffer a substance abuse disorder, they need
▶ 1:40:36Mr. Stuart: Wraparound services.
▶ 1:40:38Sen. Hassan: So you will support efforts at the department to expand access to all types of medication assisted treatment, including methadone?
▶ 1:40:47Mr. Stuart: I will support secretary kennedy on this issue. I agree, but there is a difference between being a policymaker --
▶ 1:40:54Sen. Hassan: I wont understand that you agree that the gold standard here is medication assisted treatment for fentanyl addiction in particular -- doctors cannot prescribe it in their offices. I agree that wraparound services are also important. I want to make sure we are clear on that. Let me move forward. If confirmed, you would oversee the distribution of grant funding that congress appropriates to the department.
▶ 1:41:25Sen. Hassan: Congress appropriated $286 million for the title x family fund -- family planning program. The supports reproductive care visits. It funds cervical cancer screenings detect possible signs of cancer in tens of thousands of women every year. Will you commit to distribute every dollar that congress appropriates for the lifesaving title x program in accordance with law?
▶ 1:41:56Mr. Chiarello: I appreciated the opportunity to meet with you and talk about this issue appear the title x issues you are talking about, in particular cancer screenings, are issues that affect my family. I cannot emphasize the importance of getting tested and be evaluated on those things. I will follow the law when it comes to appropriations. I will lean on divisions to guide as to what the mission-critical funding is.
▶ 1:42:26Sen. Hassan: The administration is withholding $500,000 from my state even though it has been appropriated and is supposed to be used for cancer screenings. I hope you work to get that money out. We need to work on a bipartisan basis to counter china's abusive trade practices. The president seems to back down every time there is a chance to hold the chinese government accountable, like this week extending the tariff pause on china without any clear wins for the united states.
▶ 1:42:57Sen. Hassan: The ministration has targeted our allies like canada with tariffs that raise costs for families in new hampshire and damage our economic partnerships. As debby U.S. trade representative, would you advise the ministration officials to reverse tariffs that target our allies like canada in order to focus on actually combating unfair trade from adversaries like the chinese government?
▶ 1:43:23Mr. Switzer: I am not in now, so the specifics of canada are difficult for me to speak about. What I can say is the totality of the trade policy of the president is to address global. We've a global natural secured program -- problem -- security problem. It is not solely about china.
▶ 1:43:45Mr. Switzer: I would say I would recommend that we continue to focus on china with the recognition that china is the second-largest economy in in the world.
▶ 1:43:56Sen. Hassan: I just got back from a bipartisan trip to canada. Our best friends to our north. My state's biggest trading partner, having to look elsewhere for the kind of partnerships, undermining our relationship and joint security interests. With canada. Who is highly cooperative and constructive partner with border security and other issues.
▶ 1:44:23Sen. Hassan: We are making a grave mistake in the way we are treating canada and it is going to haunt us for years if we do not change quickly.
▶ 1:44:31Chair Crapo: Senator cortez masto. Congratulations to the nominees and welcome to our family members. Mr. switzer, as deputy U.S. trade representative, you would be charged with overseeing U.S. engagement and negotiation for trade in services. I'm curious if you know the number one U.S. services export.
▶ 1:44:58Mr. Switzer: Tourism, I believe.
▶ 1:45:00Sen. Cortez Masto: That is a great answer because it is. It is travel and tourism. According to the U.S. department of commerce, travel and tourism is the largest service export for the united states, accounting for 20% of american service exports and 10% of exports in 2024. Travel or tourism contributed $2.9 trillion to the united states economy and supports more than 15 million american jobs.
▶ 1:45:34Sen. Cortez Masto: What would you do to ensure that president trump's blanket trade war on our allies, like canada, does not cause further damage to america's travel and tourism industry, including the 300,000 nevada jobs the industry supports?
▶ 1:45:50Mr. Switzer: Thank you for the question. Tourism is an important industry. The service industries are important for us. Commerce runs our tourism promotion policies so I recommend reaching out to the commerce department.
▶ 1:46:06Sen. Cortez Masto: You do not have to lecture me on what commerce does. I was just in canada with my colleague. The impact that the tariffs have had on travel and tourism in this country is documented. It is legitimate. That is in your belly wick -- balliwick.
▶ 1:46:29Sen. Cortez Masto: I need someone who will be an advocate in addressing the -- how the tariffs are impacting trade. What are you going to do about it?
▶ 1:46:43Mr. Switzer: I can commit to that I will learn as much as I can about the specifics of tourism. In your state, how we can further encourage tourism to the extent that any policy is impacting that, whatever that policy might be.
▶ 1:47:02Sen. Cortez Masto: You are familiar with the travel and tourism policies and programs we have set up for this country, not just nevada. I look forward to working with you and having you develop a strategy to talk about the impact these tariffs are having on trade, travel, and tourism in this country. It is not just about nevada. We are seeing direct impact, so we need to work together. Let me jump to one other issue.
▶ 1:47:36Sen. Cortez Masto: The end ministration has announced trade deals with several countries. Neither congress nor the public has seen the text of most of these agreements. What little has been issued by ustr and the white house has been questioned or refuted by countries we have actually claimed we have reached deals with, so in your opinion what is the value in a trade agreement that is not legally binding, does not come through congress,
▶ 1:48:09Sen. Cortez Masto: Has no written enforcement mechanism, and can be unilaterally violated at will?
▶ 1:48:17Mr. Switzer: And my over 20 years experience commit much of it working overseas, my experience showed that when the president gets together whatever president that is, with a prime minister or president and they set policy direction, they tell not only the U.S. government but the other government officials who now know that this is what our boss has told us we are going to achieve. I can only speak to what I know.
▶ 1:48:47Mr. Switzer: I know what is in the public domain, so you know as much as I do. These agreements will be structured as executive agreements. We have a number of executive agreements. When I worked at the department of state we negotiated executive agreements on technology, health , all sorts of things. None of those are congressional approval. Wherever these agreements require congressional approval, we will seek congressional approval.
▶ 1:49:17Mr. Switzer: Ambassador greer has committed --
▶ 1:49:20Sen. Cortez Masto: Do you think that it is important there is congressional approval.
▶ 1:49:24Mr. Switzer: Wherever it is required, we will follow the law.
▶ 1:49:27Sen. Cortez Masto: You are not doing it now, but I hope you use your voice and committed today to follow the law to make sure that happens. The rest of the questions I will submit for the record.
▶ 1:49:39Chair Crapo: Senator daines.
▶ 1:49:42Sen. Daines: I want to thank all the nominees here for your willingness to serve this great country. I want to speak about that big, beautiful bill, now a big, beautiful law. It is worth the most trans-formative pieces of legislation I have had a chance to work on on capitol hill. When you get to a bill that is nearly a thousand pages in length, typically in washington, D.C. after a bill like that gets passed got the more you dig into it, the worse it gets.
▶ 1:50:13Sen. Daines: Except for this bill. This is a bill where the more we dig into it the more the american people see what we actually passed, the better it gets. I am proud of what we did here. Chairman crapo, thanks for your leadership this was a consequential moment. I'm grateful we got this passed and signed by the president. This strengthens the border. It preserves medicaid by rooting out waste, fraud, and abuse.
▶ 1:50:42Sen. Daines: We have to combat the allies from the left about what we did here to make sure medicaid is there for the future by going after the abuse and fraud that exist today in that program. We protected the second amendment. We funded our military. This will unleash the american economy, making these provisions permanent. These are jet fuel for our economy and how we beat china long-term by incentivizing investment and innovation.
▶ 1:51:12Sen. Daines: We prevented a four point $5 trillion tax increase, the largest that would have occurred in american history, that was stopped with what we did. The average montana family is going to save $3000 a year because what we did. We need to keep talking about that. Senior citizens, about 90% of senior citizens see social security benefits not taxed as a result of the bill. No tax on tips.
▶ 1:51:44Sen. Daines: That brilliant thought that president trump received during the campaign, what a way to help reward hard-working men and women across america who service us every day. The president delivered on his promise to unleash american energy dominance. We saved a couple coal mines because it was done without bill and our energy sector will continue.
▶ 1:52:11Sen. Daines: The administration understands the need for grid reliability, all provisions in this bill that are going to help our country. The previous administration tried to shut down the coal strip power plant in the state of montana. It is a major power provider. They put burdensome redtape. This administration is overturning those harmful rules to power our economy.
▶ 1:52:42Sen. Daines: Let me move to some questions here. Will you commit to safeguarding these projects that we just passed that are complying with law as written and the existing beginning of construction guidance?
▶ 1:53:03Mr. Theurer: To begin, I want to recognize your leadership on small business provisions in this bill as well as cost recovery will be a significant accelerant for businesses. The office of tax policy will interpret and provide guidance and I look forward to working with you and your staff as they go through that process.
▶ 1:53:23Sen. Daines: Thank you. I want to have assurances that any revisions to existing guidance will hold harmless projects that comply with the rules in effect prior to changes made in the bill. As you know, I have been a strong supporter in the past.
▶ 1:53:44Sen. Daines: I was thanked to hear secretary bessent reiterate in march that the end ministration also recognizes the important role in expanding access to capital and providing technical assistance to communities across the united states. I appreciate sec. Bessent's affirming recognition of the statutory functions of the cdf I fund and the programs it administers, confirming these programs will require by law.
▶ 1:54:18Sen. Daines: We have heard from stakeholders who are concerned with administration commitment to administering vital fund programs in light of funding delays -- given the secretary's earlier statement and memo to omb, can you provide assurances the department of treasury will commit to allocating the remaining 2025 funds already appropriated by congress?
▶ 1:54:48Mr. Theurer: It is not a matter within my current responsibilities. If confirmed, I look forward to working with you and your team.
▶ 1:54:56Sen. Daines: A lot of ground to cover. Thank you.
▶ 1:54:59Chair Crapo: Senator warren.
▶ 1:55:01Sen. Warren: Thank you, Mr. chairman. Congress is worried about the opioid crisis and mental health issues. Last year, we allocated more than $7 billion for the prevention and treatment of these conditions. Secretary robert f. Kennedy, jr. Heads the department of health and human services, which is charged with administrating the funding through the substance abuse and mental health services ministration.
▶ 1:55:32Sen. Warren: If confirmed, you will be the top lawyer at hhs, advising secretary kennedy. Let's do a little law so we can understand what kind of advice you would give to the secretary.
▶ 1:55:47Sen. Warren: 42 usc 300-55 says hhs shall terminate grants only if a state has materially failed to comply with the agreements or other conditions required for the receipt of the grant. That is the only condition under which congress says the grants can be canceled. Let's start easy.
▶ 1:56:13Sen. Warren: Can secretary kennedy wake up in a bad mood one morning & he say to the worker who is running a suicide hotline, I do not like your face, I'm canceling your grant money?
▶ 1:56:29Mr. Stuart: Thank you for the opportunity. I look forward to working with you in the future. I did receive your letter.
▶ 1:56:35Sen. Warren: We are limited on time. Would that be legal?
▶ 1:56:40Mr. Stuart: In every instance I will give the advice --
▶ 1:56:43Sen. Warren: That is not the question I asked. I'm asking you if secretary kennedy wakes up in a bad mood one morning can you say to somebody I do not like your face so I'm canceling or state's grant?
▶ 1:56:57Mr. Stuart: What I would like to do is review the code.
▶ 1:57:00Sen. Warren: I just read you the code language. Did you have problems understanding it? You can only do cancellation if a state has materially failed to comply with the agreements or other conditions required for the receipt of the grant. That is all it says.
▶ 1:57:19Mr. Stuart: The keywords are the agreements.
▶ 1:57:21Sen. Warren: You think there is an agreement that says the secretary can cancel a grant because I do not like her face?
▶ 1:57:28Mr. Stuart: I think -- I do not believe that has been the case. I do not believe that is ever happened.
▶ 1:57:35Sen. Warren: I am asking you about the legal advice you will give. I want to understand, under a statute that says these are the only conditions under which a grant can be canceled, do you think secretary kennedy can say I do not like her face so I am canceling your grant?
▶ 1:57:56Mr. Stuart: Excepting the term I do not like her face -- I'm telling you the terms and conditions of this agreement matter.
▶ 1:58:02Sen. Warren: I don't think any of them say I do not like her face.
▶ 1:58:06Mr. Stuart: I agree with you on this.
▶ 1:58:09Sen. Warren: We are three minutes into this. Can I have a that would be illegal?
▶ 1:58:15Mr. Stuart: You cannot cancel a contract to my knowledge because you do not like somebody's face.
▶ 1:58:20Sen. Warren: What if secretary kennedy wakes up in a bad mood and he said I heard you are a republican and it turns out I do not like republicans so I am going to cancel your grant for your addiction treatment center. Do you think that would be legal?
▶ 1:58:39Mr. Stuart: Secretary, I think there is a formula to review these things.
▶ 1:58:44Sen. Warren: There is a formula for reviewing them. I'm asking if the secretary wanted to do that to cancel all the grants held by republicans, would that be legal?
▶ 1:58:54Mr. Stuart: My advice would be to follow the rules and laws.
▶ 1:58:58Sen. Warren: You are supposed to tell him how to interpret a statute that says the only conditions are if the state is not meeting the terms of the contract.
▶ 1:59:07Mr. Stuart: We have to meet the terms of the contract. If they are outside the terms of the contract, it can be canceled.
▶ 1:59:13Sen. Warren: Can he cancel because you are a republican?
▶ 1:59:17Mr. Stuart: If it is not included in the terms of the contract, no.
▶ 1:59:22Sen. Warren: How about your work is no longer necessary, your state's grant is canceled? Let's say there's nothing in the contract about whether the work is necessary. Would it be illegal to conch -- cancel under those conditions?
▶ 1:59:38Mr. Stuart: That is not as easy a question. We have to be able to look in terms of the intent of the contracts as well. C1 -- and you are the lawyer having advice to secretary kennedy.
▶ 1:59:56Mr. Stuart: I want to know as the person who gives advice, when you read statutory language that says there's one condition under which you can do this, and that's if the state has materially failed to comply with the agreements or other conditions, that you can cancel the grant. By the way, you have to get the notice and hearing for doing that. Can you wake up and say we decided we don't need you anymore? If that's not in the grant?
▶ 2:00:21Mr. Stuart: My advice will always be to follow the terms and agreements.
▶ 2:00:26Sen. Warren: In this case, you would say you can't do that, Mr. secretary.
▶ 2:00:30Mr. Stuart: I will give the advice to follow the terms of the code ash
▶ 2:00:34Sen. Warren: If the contact doesn't -- contract doesn't say that, you will say not to do it.
▶ 2:00:39Mr. Stuart: We will follow the terms and conditions and make sure we follow the code.
▶ 2:00:44Sen. Warren: I hope you do follow the terms and conditions. That is exactly the letter secretary kennedy sent, canceling projects all over this country. And the only grounds he gave for grounds that are not in the contract and clearly in violation of the law. So, I hope Mr. stuart, based on what you said, you will deliver that message to secretary kennedy and give advice that is consistent with the law in the future. >> thank you. Senator young.
▶ 2:01:14Sen. Young: I congratulate your nominees for their nominations to these important positions. Mr. switzer, you've been nominated for an important post, ip with the rank of ambassador. I will be directing some questions at you.
▶ 2:01:37Sen. Young: For too long, american patients have unfairly burdened the shoulder, while foreign governments propose price controls that shift the share of r&d costs to U.S. consumers. This isn't just a health policy issue, it's a trade issue and one that president trump has rightly prioritized.
▶ 2:02:04Sen. Young: These foreign pricing practices function as nontariff barriers that distort markets and undervalue american innovation and undermine U.S. exports and jobs. That's why I welcomed the administration's directive for the administration to address these policies directly, and to secure binding commitments from our trading partners to fairly valued U.S. developed medicines. Trade policy must defend american innovation, not allow it to be discounted abroad.
▶ 2:02:35Sen. Young: Foreign nationa should not be permitted -- nations should not be permitted to game the U.S. systems at the expense of future medical breakthroughs. If confirmed, how -- in key asian markets. And what practical steps would you take to encourage our trading partners to share this burden of pharmaceutical innovation?
▶ 2:02:58Mr. Switzer: Thank you very much, senator. It is important question and I agree completely. The president has made it a priority so that mix it easy for someone like me, when I go in and speak to my counterparts in any country, having the backing, the public backing of the president where he has called us out, his long-standing history at this point of being serious about trade.
▶ 2:03:23Mr. Switzer: Countries taking the president seriously and me going again and having my words taken seriously. There are a number of trade tools we could use. As we negotiate through specifics and any given country, making sure our firms get fair access, that they are not discriminated against. I can tell you again, specifically in china, what they do is they have a national drug list.
▶ 2:03:50Mr. Switzer: When a drug is available to be sold in china, it has to go through the national family planning and health commission. They have to decide that the drug can be provided to their customers, to their consumers. When they negotiate that, however, it starts with a negotiation that says they want an 80% discount off of the global price.
▶ 2:04:15Mr. Switzer: And they have a three year negotiation, whether it is to renegotiate another 50% down. We need to attack those things head on. Those are discriminatory rectus's. Europe has its own products they can sell here to the U.S.. In order to gain access to those markets. I agree with you completely, sir. It is a priority of mine.
▶ 2:04:40Mr. Switzer: >> it seems to me this would be a smart way to address one that brings together republicans, democrats, consumers around the country. I am not yet sold on the whole most favored nation construct. But, this is an area I think that is ripe for opportunity for the administration. I think president trump -- thank president trump for prioritizing it. Digital trade and infrastructure, I have a minute left. I would like to briefly touch on this.
▶ 2:05:09Mr. Switzer: This is going to be an important tool moving forward. Economically, the U.S. leads the way with respect to development and provision of digital services. We need to strike more digital trade agreements. It also becomes a national security issue when you think about the ability of this ecosystem, continuing to be billed out around the world, as opposed to the chinese standards which don't value openness,
▶ 2:05:41Mr. Switzer: Transparency and in operability. The U.S. digital trade agenda has to go beyond dataflow commitments to include standards that promote trust, transparency and security. If confirmed, Mr. switzer, how would you balance the commercial opportunities of digital services and trade with the national security risk posed by un-trusted suppliers, particularly chinese state linked providers?
▶ 2:06:09Mr. Switzer: Thank you, senator. I have written extensively on this in the past. It is something that I know a great deal about. I worked extensively on the hardware side. One of the aspects that -- >> it's the U.S. senate. So if you could summarize a lifetime of scholarship in 30 seconds.
▶ 2:06:29Mr. Switzer: Sure, senator. I agree completely. We need to build networks of trust. We need our partners and allies in europe and latin america and elsewhere in asia to agree to networks of trust to install telecommute occasions. Cyber physical systems that can be trusted. That means in most cases, those products and the core technology underneath them are american-made, in most cases.
▶ 2:06:54Mr. Switzer: We need to make sure those are made in america and wherever possible, made an allied countries wherever possible. >> couldn't agree with you more. Look forward to working with you on that already. >> thank you. Senator warnock.
▶ 2:07:14Sen. Warnock: Much of the funding for the cdc, which I'm proud to say is based in atlanta , flows directly to state and local health departments. But the trump administration's massive firings at the cdc mean that many dedicated expert staff are no longer there to assist and guide with state and local health officials, with trying to respond to public health threats.
▶ 2:07:43Sen. Warnock: Many grants that were already awarded to state and local health agencies are now left in limbo. Several -- with several multiyear contracts canceled. By this administration. Including some contracts that were already near completion. Mr. sherello, you are nominated to be in charge of financial resources at hhs.
▶ 2:08:11Sen. Warnock: Please tell me, how is canceling active multi year contracts, awarded by the cdc, some of which were 90% completed with most of the money already out the door, and efficient use -- an efficient use of federal funding? To me, it seems on advised, a summary dismissal of work that's already being done and an ideological waste of federal resources. Can you help me understand why this makes sense?
▶ 2:08:43Sen. Warnock: >> thank you for the question and the interest in the topic. You are talking about our contract that I have not had the opportunity to work in or understand the facts. The law when it comes to the allocation of funds and the management within the agency.
▶ 2:09:05Sen. Warnock: Welcome to the hearing and congratulations to you and your family. I questioned the nominee about similar contracts a couple of weeks ago, or last week. I am hearing the nominees, peer and say I will follow the law. That's good. I support that. It is basic but it is good. I'm asking you a management question, if this makes sense.
▶ 2:09:33Mr. Chiarello: The issues from my perspective requires learning about the issues to understand how those decisions are made. And then evaluating the allocation of the resources. >> so you haven't had a chance to take a look.
▶ 2:09:50Mr. Chiarello: I haven't looked at those.
▶ 2:09:54Senator Warnock: If confirmed, we look into these canceled cdc contracts to see if any federal funds have been wasted due to incomplete work and will you report your findings, whatever they are, back to this committee?
▶ 2:10:06Mr. Chiarello: I commit to work with the committee on their inquiries, relative --
▶ 2:10:12Sen. Warnock: Yes or no, it's a simple question.
▶ 2:10:17Mr. Chiarello: I don't know exactly the contract you're talking about and I will look into the issues should I be confirmed.
▶ 2:10:23Sen. Warnock: You will look into the issues.
▶ 2:10:28Mr. Chiarello: I will look into it and report back what I found.
▶ 2:10:33Sen. Warnock: I take that as a yes. -- particularly in a situation where the grants are almost completed. We can begin to see the impact and do some analysis to have those grants in -- and to have those grants summarily dismissed seems more ideological than anything else. If confirmed, you will be response mode for developing and advising the secretary on the budget for hhs.
▶ 2:11:03Sen. Warnock: Do you agree that public-health investing dollars upfront, through grants and other programs can often save money down the line?
▶ 2:11:11Mr. Chiarello: Senator warnock, I'm an antitrust lawyer and as such, I know there is different economic incentives based on when money flows into different projects. You won't be able to balance the incentives, particularly when you are spending public dollars, to both incentivize the outcomes that are intended by the allocated resources, but also to do so in such a way so as not to create an environment that festers for waste fraud and abuse.
▶ 2:11:41Sen. Warnock: I feel like I give you a softball question. I asked do you think investing money up front can often save money down the line?
▶ 2:11:49Mr. Chiarello: I think I just answered the question.
▶ 2:11:52Sen. Warnock: Let me give you more context. We know secretary kennedy talks a lot about wanting to address chronic disease read and I support that. I have seen it up close as a pastor and a senator. Let's look at what he's done over the last few months. On april 1, secretary kennedy demolished the cdc's national center for chronic disease.
▶ 2:12:19Sen. Warnock: This office ran programs for preventing alzheimer's disease, diabetes. Let me say that one dollar out of four in our country on health care is spent on people with diabetes. It's the context for which we see emerging disease and sickness. Heart disease, cancer.
▶ 2:12:40Sen. Warnock: Do you think working to prevent alzheimer's disease, prevent diabetes when one dollar out of four in our health system is spent on people with diabetes, does that feel like government waste to you?
▶ 2:12:54Mr. Chiarello: Secretary kennedy's efforts to focus on things like waste fraud and abuse and to make sure that the funds that are being allocated by congress are getting to the people most need them, and sometimes that involves reorganization or refocusing. I look forward to getting into the position.
▶ 2:13:15Sen. Warnock: Chairman, I want to thank you for giving me some extra time. Let me just say that an ounce of prevention is worth one pound of cure. And we see that with the work the cdc does, and I would hope that you would look at this and take it seriously because it is literally a matter of life and death. Not to mention the implications for the federal budget. Thank you so much.
▶ 2:13:41Mr. Chiarello: Thank you, senator. >> senator tillis.
▶ 2:13:46Sen. Tillis: Mr. stewart, I want to congratulate you for being the only person who we don't have an answer key for how to pronounce their last name. Congratulations, Mr. schweitzer on near not -- on your nomination. You're going to get the first question. I intend to support all of your nominations and probably won't have time to get to all of you. Mr.
▶ 2:14:15Sen. Tillis: Sweitzer, on the -- I'm the chair of the subcommittee. I spend time on the theft from china. We can legitimately say that china is an innovator. A lot of the foundation for the innovation is blatant theft from U.S. intellectual property. I will give you a good example.
▶ 2:14:41Sen. Tillis: I have a bill that I would like to talk with you about, it's called fighting tax per trade sheets. We have to figure out a way to get a force multiplier from the private specter to go after the hundreds of incidences that we just do not have for customs, we don't have the capacity to do it. I would like to talk about that bill.
▶ 2:15:07Sen. Tillis: I want to start by -- the president made a comment on ai that I found concerning. He said the intellectual property copyright infringements were just too complicated to be dealt with in the implementation of ai and it would have to be settled by the courts. The challenge I have with that is that would be great news for china.
▶ 2:15:29Sen. Tillis: Now, we are going to flood the zone with not only their rampant theft of ip, but maybe an administration posture that says it is too complicated on the front end and maybe we should wait and get it done on the backend. That's not a way to keep our competitive edge.
▶ 2:15:48Sen. Tillis: What do you think about that, and negotiating a trade agreement with china, what advice would you give to people on the front line, saying how do we get them right and hold them accountable for most of their economic miracle being founded on the theft of U.S. innovation?
▶ 2:16:05Mr. Sweitzer: Thank you, senator for a very important question. I've spent my life working on issues like these. I speak chinese and have helped companies solve these problems directly. It's complicated in some aspects but less complicated than it needs to be. The president has shown the leadership that is required. You have to attack these problems head-on.
▶ 2:16:29Mr. Sweitzer: You can't attack them one at a time prayed I have seen companies who would say they had intellectual property stolen and they would say please don't mention our name because they knew they were stuck in a prisoners dilemma. That requires that only the U.S. government can step in. While we want to partner with private sector, it requires deep leadership on behalf of the U.S. government who says these practices will no longer be tolerated.
▶ 2:16:57Sen. Tillis: We also have to hold india accountable. One of the reasons why we have pressure on prices is we are being undermined by counterfeit drugs coming across the border and pretending, number one, they do not stand up to the same safety standards. Number two, they are undermining the intellectual property protections of, generally speaking, U.S. biotech.
▶ 2:17:25Sen. Tillis: I will have other questions for the record but I appreciate, support and look forward to your nominations. When we are around here, sometimes you pass a bill and it is 34 years down and people wonder what congress intended. We only passed the big beautiful bill about four weeks ago.
▶ 2:17:48Sen. Tillis: People who voted on that bill are here and it was clear congressional intent with respect to the strategy on some of the renewable energy projects. To be honest with you, I'm not surprised. Full disclosure, I voted against the bill for reasons other than the renewable energy.
▶ 2:18:07Sen. Tillis: But it already looks like we are kind of moving away from congressional intent, particularly in the senate, and something more baked in to the previous position of the freedom caucus from the house. -- that you consult with us that dealt with the drafting of it?
▶ 2:18:31Sen. Tillis: >> there is a cadre of very skilled, impressive appointee and staff. If confirmed, I look forward to working with you and your team. >> there's a few things that seem to be popping up that run afoul read there are some people who may have voted against it, if they were going to be having discussions of congressional intent four weeks later. I hope we can avoid that euros and of trust.
▶ 2:19:03Sen. Tillis: Thank you. I look forward to supporting all of your nominations. >> thank you. Senator blackburn.
▶ 2:19:08Sen. Blackburn: Thank you, Mr. chairman and congratulations to you all. Nice for allowing us to be up and down and in and out during boats. Mr. sweitzer, I want to come to you. Because I think protecting U.S. innovation is something that is vitally important. I know a couple of times this morning, you've been asked about ip protections.
▶ 2:19:33Sen. Blackburn: And, when we look at some of the trade deals that are being executed, and we look at china, there are other people that are bad actors, other countries that are bad actors. I want you to talk for just a moment about how systematically you can approach protecting ip.
▶ 2:19:59Sen. Blackburn: Because we are seeing it, not only in the pharmaceutical space , as we looked at the active pharmaceutical ingredients, as we look at vaccines and things of that nature. But also, as we utilize ai for predictive diagnosis and disease analysis, and some of the health technology provisions that have come to be since I got the software act, which put health
▶ 2:20:31Sen. Blackburn: Technology into federal statute when I was in the house. And, so, protecting this is owing to be an imperative. So, talk about that for me.
▶ 2:20:43Mr. Sweitzer: Thank you very much, senator and thank you for your previous work. It is very important. The president has made this a priority. He has mentioned china by name. He has mentioned how other countries use drug pricing to undermine the intellectual property of our world leading drug discovery firms. Secretary greer has spoken extensively about it. What I can say is if confirmed, this is a huge priority of mine.
▶ 2:21:15Mr. Sweitzer: I have a very extensive background. I've done policy research at the university of california san diego for two years. At one point, I had every federal unclassified r&d grant between 1994 and 2002 on my home computer. I've literally read hundreds of thousands of short descriptions. It is a very complex problem. But it is one that is at the very top.
▶ 2:21:41Mr. Sweitzer: If we don't continue to protect our ip, if we don't invest in research and development and ip, we are going to continue to lead the economy or the 21st century. I will seek every opportunity and every tool available to ensure that I build it in and get the buy-in of the president and others. To approve those agreements.
▶ 2:22:05Sen. Blackburn: We think it will be imperative to -- this issue. I know senator daines talk with you about things that are in the big beautiful bill and restoring r&d and interest expensive bonus appreciation is all to help spur this innovation.
▶ 2:22:28Sen. Blackburn: As we look at this global marketplace, as we look at ai and innovation, it is going to be imperative that we do not seed any ground to our competitors or to our adversaries. Thank you for that. Mr. stuart, thank you for the work you've done as we've looked at fentanyl, opioid and some of those other things.
▶ 2:22:57Sen. Blackburn: We passed the fentanyl act earlier. I know that you and -- in 2019, you formed a task force that demonstrated the importance of coordinated enforcement efforts, as you are looking at fraud and medicaid, medicare, the chip in those programs.
▶ 2:23:22Sen. Blackburn: As we worked on the big view to full bill, we found out that as much as 25% of medicaid payments were improper payments and fraud. We know there is an issue with of coding and -- up coding and medicare. Talk with me about how that past work would support the work we are going to do here at this committee to try to get rid of this waste and fraud in these entitlement programs.
▶ 2:23:51Mr. Stuart: Thank you very much for the question and I look forward to working with members of this committee as we push forward on issues like medicaid, fraud or fraud in the health care sector. A lot of folks like to presume there is no victim when it comes to a monetary fraud. There are. It's the american taxpayers. There's a limited bucket of money that is available for health care policy.
▶ 2:24:19Mr. Stuart: I think you referred to our abuse, recovery and response team. As a U.S. attorney in a district that suffered so bad with respect to the fentanyl and opioid crisis, we knew it was most important, at least my view was, that we bring both a civil team and a criminal team a multidisciplinary approach so that we can approach this with all information on deck. So we can make sure that both supply and demand were dealt with.
▶ 2:24:49Mr. Stuart: I plan to use those tools as a former prosecutor, who had some pretty big results in terms of medicaid fraud. The numbers to the american economy is dramatic. Secretary kennedy has said the public debt is a social determinant of public health. And so, it is critically important that we do as efficiently as possible with the dollars that we have, the work that we have to do. The recipients, of programs like medicaid, they need those dollars.
▶ 2:25:20Sen. Blackburn: Thanks Mr. chairman. >> senator barrasso.
▶ 2:25:27Senator Barrasso: I want to congratulate you on this nomination. It's clear that -- has prepared you well for the role in which you been nominated. As assistant and secretary of financial resources, you will advise secretary kennedy on the department of human services budget. And you will oversee their implementation. This one big beautiful bill that we just passed included a dedicated effort to help support rural health care.
▶ 2:25:59Senator Barrasso: The rural health transformation program. This program will provide over $500 million to each state to support our hospitals, clinics and health centers. It will ensure that health care facilities across rural and frontier wyoming will provide quality care close to home.
▶ 2:26:29Senator Barrasso: States can actually access these funds and quickly put them to work. Last week, I was in wyoming, visiting with a number of health care providers, including the head of the wyoming hospital association. The questions they asked is as you oversee these funds, how will you ensure that states can access the funds efficiently? >> thank you, senator for the question on this topic near and dear to my heart. My mother was a nurse at our local hospital.
▶ 2:27:00Senator Barrasso: My first job as a teenager was volunteering there. Health care has been a passion of mine. I looked at lots of health care mergers in the rural space. I looked at health care markets in general. I was enthusiastic because of secretary kennedy's support for bolstering care in rural markets.
▶ 2:27:23Senator Barrasso: The way I approach things as an antitrust lawyer is looking at how we can get the best quality services and care to the consumers at the lowest and most effective prices. -- and bringing my competition principles to bear so we can get the best quality solutions. Not all rural markets are created equal. We have different needs.
▶ 2:27:49Senator Barrasso: Weighing in on those things, looking at my background and looking at different health care markets and hospital markets will be a priority of mine and bringing that to the staff there. >> it sounds like I can commit on you -- count on you committing to working closely with the states as this is rolled out. >> I would expect that working with the states and the business operations that have those elation ships, to bolster the effectiveness of those.
▶ 2:28:14Sen. Barrasso: Mr. sweitzer, you have considerable experience with china and I think it gives you insight on how they operate within the global markets. I'm concerned about their deceptive trade practices and how they threaten our critical nuclear supply chain. In 2024, congress banned russian uranian imports to protect our national security. It seems like china is helping russia circumvent the band. -- ban.
▶ 2:28:47Sen. Barrasso: Russia gets its china and china to the united states. Russia has exploited over 150 thousand pounds of uranium to the united states. We have clear evidence that this is russian enriched uranium going to china which they dump into the U.S. market. We are swapping one adversary for another. Wyoming has the resources, the workforce to rebuild the american nuclear supply chain.
▶ 2:29:11Sen. Barrasso: State subsidized, russian and chinese uranium -- can you commit to working with congress to end this chinese circum-vision of our russian you uranian band -- uranium ban?
▶ 2:29:35Mr. Sweitzer: I commit to working with congress. There are aspects that ustr can do and aspect the executive order could look at. Binding long-term solutions, congress is where you look to find those kinds of solutions. Like ambassador greer, I commit to working with you and finding any way possible to address these issues.
▶ 2:30:02Mr. Sweitzer: We need the ability to supply critical minerals, including uranium in the united states wherever possible. To process those profitably wherever possible. And were not possible, we want to be searching this from friendly nationstates and allies. >> last week, we had secretary right for critical minerals in addition to uranium, for the groundbreaking of the first critical elements mine in 70 years.
▶ 2:30:31Mr. Sweitzer: We don't want to be dependent upon anybody for that. How will you work with our asian allies to counter china's domination in terms of global, critical minerals?
▶ 2:30:39Mr. Sweitzer: I've had the opportunity, I was in charge of our economic relationship with japan. I worked closely across south east asia. The governor of japan is very interested in partnering with us . My understanding, I'm not in yet so I don't know the specifics. My understanding of the U.S.-japan trade agreement is there is a $550 billion of pledged financing to go into these sorts of projects.
▶ 2:31:09Mr. Sweitzer: So what we will look to do is how can we work with countries like japan with governments like wyoming? With folks like mountain pass and others who actually do this processing and the department of defense who can fund some of this. What we need is a holistic supply chain. And not just defense products, we need them to go into our cars and our planes.
▶ 2:31:39Mr. Sweitzer: Thank you --
▶ 2:31:41Sen. Barrasso: Thank, Mr. chairman. >> senator lujan. >> I have a question for each of the panelists. Thank you for being here. Do you commit to following the law, Mr. switzer? -- sweitzer? >> yes. >> yes. >> yes. >> yes, I will follow the law.
▶ 2:32:03Sen. Lujan: Measles was declared eliminated in the united states in 2000, things to the vaccine. Today, united states measles cases have hit their highest levels in more than 30 years. I asked you if you believed the measles vaccine is safe and effective. >> I support what secretary kennedy has said, the best way to prevent the measles is the measles vaccine.
▶ 2:32:30Sen. Lujan: Is that a yes? >> I am not a vax knowledge just so I support what the science says.
▶ 2:32:37Sen. Lujan: You are not willing to say yes or no but you are willing to say you agree with the secretary? >> I will tell you how I approach it as a parent.
▶ 2:32:50Sen. Lujan: That's not my question. My question is a yes or no. >> just repeat your question.
▶ 2:32:55Sen. Lujan: Yes or no, do you believe the measles vaccine is safe and effective? >> the best way to protect yourself from measles in america is by getting a vaccine. Secretary kennedy has said that and that's what I believe. I'm not a medical expert but I believe the best way to protect yourself from measles in america today is the vaccine.
▶ 2:33:16Sen. Lujan: Is that a yes or a no? It's not either, I respect your answer. Thank you very much. I will try one more time, one more yes or no question. Is the vaccine the best way to prevent measles? I think I heard it in your first answer but it is a simple yes or no. >> I understand. I am not a vax knowledge just and I'm not qualified to say what's the best way to prevent. That's not my background or training.
▶ 2:33:45Sen. Lujan: I understand that science is saying the best way to protect yourself against measles is through the vaccine.
▶ 2:33:51Sen. Lujan: I will accept that. That's a good answer. We are in agreement. I appreciate that. In new mexico, there are currently 207 head start centers and operations serving 7342 children. Mr. stewart, do you know what headstart is? >> I do. >> I apologize, I didn't know what the question was.
▶ 2:34:15Sen. Lujan: Do you know what headstart is? >> yes.
▶ 2:34:18Sen. Lujan: President trump has undermined the stability of the headstart program by withholding nearly $1 billion in federal funding that congress has appropriated, including funding for new mexico. I have heard from headstart, child and family services in lee county in new mexico about the period of uncertainty they experienced due to the federal hold on headstart funding, leaving them unable to draw down funds for payroll. This places a severe strain on staff members.
▶ 2:34:52Sen. Lujan: While lee county was fortunate to have reserves, for the delays in funding could have devastated impacts on their operations in the future of early childhood education. Last week, as you may be aware, gao found the administration violated the law by withholding headstart funds. My question is a yes or no. Do you believe it's against the law to delay or withhold headstart funding that congress has already appropriated?
▶ 2:35:15Sen. Lujan: >> as I've testified already, my lone star is an attorney that follows the law. You look at the statute with the appropriations and what the facts are and if there are any other case holdings. My approaching, to answer questions like that will be to follow the law. You are asking questions that I believe are in dispute through litigation. So, I think those questions as to what the law is are unanswered.
▶ 2:35:44Sen. Lujan: Mr. stewart, you have an incredible background in legal responsibilities. You are charged with being the chief legal counsel. You are the expert, you know the law better than most. Yes or no?
▶ 2:35:59Mr. Stuart: I'm a lawyer who likes to have all the facts and all the information before me in terms of these matters. In every instance, I have a long career on this, I will always recommend that we follow the law and that we do things correctly. But I am not at hhs right now and I don't know the facts and certain stances we hide any of these decisions that were made.
▶ 2:36:20Sen. Lujan: Are you familiar with the laws that govern health and human services?
▶ 2:36:25Mr. Stuart: Reasonably so, yes.
▶ 2:36:28Sen. Lujan: Are you the best person for this job?
▶ 2:36:30Mr. Stuart: I am the best person for this job.
▶ 2:36:33Sen. Lujan: You are the expert, then. You're the best person for this job.
▶ 2:36:38Mr. Stuart: I will have a great team with me.
▶ 2:36:41Sen. Lujan: When you are not familiar with all of the laws that govern hhs, you just said.
▶ 2:36:46Mr. Stuart: It is an incredibly wide breadth of capability within the department of health and human services. Am I an expert at every single subject, no. I bring a wide swath of experience and I will have a great team around me, so that we can make sure on every subject, we bring capable expertise to be able to provide the recommendations that are needed by secretary kennedy and the administration to make the right decision.
▶ 2:37:12Sen. Lujan: I have other questions that I will submit into the record. Once you are confirmed, I know how to count. Basic arithmetic matters around this place. I will follow-up in writing, in your official capacities and re-ask the questions that will be yes or no. I hope we can get those in a timely fashion. Thank you, Mr. chairman. I yelled back. -- yield back.
▶ 2:37:40Sen. Lujan: >> you had a good, full, two hour hearing. The good news is there will not be more questions from the dais. We will make some closing remarks and then we will cut you loose. >> I will be brief. Mr. stuart, let me give you my reaction because I think you heard me say I invite you to supplement whatever you said.
▶ 2:38:10Sen. Lujan: You want to be the tough lawyer at hhs. It's one of the most significant legal positions of the country. Always talk about old, you have to go -- oh, you have to go to the hhs office in order to get the definitive opinion.
▶ 2:38:39Sen. Lujan: I asked you three times about them t, a hugely important law for hospital emergency rooms. It's been confusing in the trump administration, to the point that women are suffering, some are dying and I described it as can beating to this, the doctors play lawyers and the lawyers play doctors.
▶ 2:39:08Sen. Lujan: And, you gave me an incomprehensible set of comments. A word salad by any kind of assessment. And I hope that you can get me something more concrete, in terms of a formal answer. Because, what you said verbally is an affirmation of something I heard over the weekend when we were having town hall meetings in rural oregon.
▶ 2:39:35Sen. Lujan: And that is americans are looking at what we've done in this reconciliation bill and walking away and saying your health care is not safe under donald trump. And certainly, the answer you gave me with respect, confirms that. And to be fair, I wanted to give you a chance to come back with a more thoughtful response, one that actually protects women who are in these dangerous situations.
▶ 2:40:03Sen. Lujan: But I want to tell you, I found the answers you gave me before and the way you tackled it disturbing, and not befitting the general counsel. Thank you, Mr. chairman. >> thank you. And to our panel, thank you for coming. We appreciate your responsiveness to the questions that were asked. We will be moving as rapidly as we can to get you to the floor and to get this all resolved.
▶ 2:40:32Sen. Lujan: The next step will be for the committee to have an opportunity to have a business meeting and put your nominations out to the floor. I will encourage all of my college to vote in favor of that. You are all highly qualified. I appreciate you stepping up to serve. And with that, this hearing is adjourned. [gavel knock]