▶ 0:15:25Chair Grassley: Morning, everybody. Our panel this morning includes robert cekada for atf and four district court nominees, andrew davis, district court texas, judge john shepard, western district of arkansas, and --anna st.
▶ 0:15:44Chair Grassley: John, eastern district louisiana, judge christopher wolfe, western district of texas. Several introductions and just a minute. Before we turn to them, we have seen a lot of judicial activism around the country in recent months. I have repeatedly spoken about the need for judges to remain in their constitutional lane.
▶ 0:16:12Chair Grassley: They must interpret and uphold the law in a neutral and impartial manner. They serve the rule of law, not political ideology or personal position. That is why I am so pleased with today's four judicial nominees. Their diverse careers demonstrate a commitment to our constitution and a -- the rule of law. Mr.
▶ 0:16:37Chair Grassley: Davis has had eight impressive career across all branches of government, having clerked for judges in the northern district of texas and in the second circuit. He served as an assistant solicitor general and of the -- in the texas attorney general's office and has even worked in the legislature supporting this committee as senator cruz's a chief counsel. This range of experiences will benefit him on the bench.
▶ 0:17:08Chair Grassley: Judge shepard has a unique career that also prepares him well to serve as a federal judge. He has litigated civil and criminal matters and has seen all sides of criminal disputes. He did criminal defense work as a court reported advocate but also served as a prosecutor headache -- handling violent felonies and drug crimes.
▶ 0:17:33Chair Grassley: For the past year he has served as a state judge in arkansas, continuing his career of service with distinction. Miss st. John has impeccable credentials. Graduate of columbia law school, clerking for judge mark's tail on the fifth.
▶ 0:17:55Chair Grassley: Her litigation practice has covered some of the most difficult areas of law, having litigated class actions, administrative claims, and constitutional questions. Miss st. John also fought to protect first amendment rights of free speech and religious liberties and has done great work advocating to protect women's sports.
▶ 0:18:19Chair Grassley: Judge wolfe spent nearly two decades in public service as a local and federal prosecutor. He handled the most important work facing the U.S. attorney's office in the northern district of texas. Even in the district of minnesota. He tirelessly worked to protect americans against a scourge of drug trafficking and white-collar fraud.
▶ 0:18:47Chair Grassley: He has also served as a state judge for the better part of a decade, gaining experience that will serve him well on the federal bench. Our panel also features the well qualified nominee serving as the director of atf, Mr. cekada has had a extensive to its at the state and federal level.
▶ 0:19:10Chair Grassley: He has served more than a decade as a police officer, receiving numerous awards and commendations for his service. He has also spent two decades at the atf and he knows how to lead the bureau, because he has tirelessly worked throughout the chain of command. Mr.
▶ 0:19:34Chair Grassley: Cekada has worked as a special agent and managed the atf regional divisions and has spent the past several years in the atf leadership. Mr. cekada has a track record of collaborating with federal, state law enforcement to investigate drug trafficking, firearms, and trafficking, firearms trafficking, arson, and violent crimes.
▶ 0:20:01Chair Grassley: He has led investigative efforts into a host of violent gangs and domestic terror groups, including m s 13 and a raga. The committee has received nearly one dozen letters from law enforcement organizations commending him and endorsing his nomination. I have also seen Mr.
▶ 0:20:29Chair Grassley: Cekada's work first, so now I want to complement him on this. Last month I successfully worked to secure a resolution for my atf whistleblower who experience severe retaliation at the hands of the previous administration. He had blown the whistle on atf's misquote suffocation scheme and improper hiring practices. Mr.
▶ 0:20:57Chair Grassley: Cekada worked closely with my staff to bring this resolution forward, saving the taxpayers, well, a lot of taxpayer money was wasted, but making sure no more was wasted. I commend his strong leadership and aggressive efforts to find a solution for this brave whistleblower and if confirmed, I encourage him to enable more whistleblowers to come forward to help him understand what is going on in the bureau.
▶ 0:21:28Chair Grassley: Now, senator durbin is going to speak. I want everyone to keep their questions limited to the five minute allotted to keep the hearing on schedule. Senator durbin?
▶ 0:21:38Sen. Durbin: Thank you, chairman. Congratulations to the nominees and their families. I've been on this committee for a number of years and have attended more hearings and I can count. Administrations have changed, control of the senate has gone back and forth, but one thing hasn't changed, the purpose of the hearing. Here to determine whether each nominee is qualified on the judicial side for a lifetime appointment to the bench.
▶ 0:22:03Sen. Durbin: One key question is whether you will have the independence of a judge, article three judge, to rule against the government without fear or favor, if the government do something illegal or unconstitutional. The stakes have never been higher in modern times. In its second iteration, the trump administration has gone to unprecedented lengths to upend the rule of law, violate constitutional rights of americans come up blatantly ignoring court orders.
▶ 0:22:34Sen. Durbin: Look no further than minnesota. Peaceful protesters are being pepper spray in the face and they are already restrained face down on the ground. U.S. citizens being detained for hours, sometimes days, all because of the color of their skin or because they have an accent. Over two point five weeks federal immigration agents killed to yet -- two U.S.
▶ 0:22:59Sen. Durbin: Citizens in minnesota that were exercising their administrate -- the right to document and protest administrative policies and in response, the administration falsely claimed that renée good and alex petry were domestic terrorists. It's not the only time that term has come up. Yesterday we had a quick gathering for testimony for other victims of ice and border patrol. One of the most noteworthy was from the city of chicago.
▶ 0:23:29Sen. Durbin: Hit her name is mary martinez and she is 30. A teacher at a montessori school. One saturday morning in october she decided to take some clothing she had gathered to her local church so that it could be given to others. On the way to that, she encountered the individuals with the federal agencies of ice and border patrol. What happened next credible.
▶ 0:23:54Sen. Durbin: She was accused of ramming their car, though there was no evidence of that, and they ended up firing at her. Striking her with five bullets, leaving her with seven holes in the body. The man who did it was a 20 three year veteran of the border patrol. Somehow or other, she managed to die for about a mile and they called an ambulance and took her to the hospital.
▶ 0:24:20Sen. Durbin: The fbi agents met her at the hospital and started restricting her movement, saying that she could not seek further medical advice because she was under arrest. The situation went from bad to worse. She was accused of being a domestic terrorist. Let me tell you how the story ended. Thankfully, she survived the five shots.
▶ 0:24:42Sen. Durbin: The man who shot her, the official from the state of maine, ended up bragging on the internet text that he was a pretty good shot to get seven holes in her body with only five bullets involved. That's the sort of thing you can't believe happens in america, that that man would do that. It was a matter of court record that he said that. What happened to the vehicle rammed? Interesting part of the story.
▶ 0:25:08Sen. Durbin: They took it 1000 miles to the state of maine from chicago, where there was an effort made to conceal the actual contact point between the vehicles. That's the reality of the situation. This poor young woman is going to have her life changed forever because of this experience. What happened to the charges against her? They were all dropped. All charges against her were dropped. These sort of things have happened in chicago, why are we letting this go forward?
▶ 0:25:40Sen. Durbin: It's hard to understand how we reach this point in the nation. Now I whistleblower has disclosed a nice memo telling integration agents they are allowed to enter private homes to arrest people without judicial warrants. Private homes. I remember a time when republicans and democrats would have been outraged at the notion that federal agents could enter a private home without a judicial warrant and disregard the fourth amendment.
▶ 0:26:06Sen. Durbin: Antonin scalia famously wrote in 2013 that when it comes to the fourth amendment, the home is the first of on equals. If this isn't evidence of loss of control in the administration, I don't know what is. Don't take my word for it. In an order last wednesday, patrick schultz highlighted 96 court orders around the violence from ice alone. Listen to what he wrote.
▶ 0:26:39Sen. Durbin: This list should give pause to anyone, no matter their political group -- beliefs. "who cares about the rule of law? Ice has likely violated more court orders in january of 202026 then some agents have violated in their entire existence." not surprisingly, the trump administration responded by attacking him as an activist judge.
▶ 0:27:03Sen. Durbin: In fact, he's a prominent conservative who clerked for justice glia, appointed by george w. Bush. Judges face ever-growing dockets of thorny legal questions. Many have to deal with personal attacks of threats and violence from the president and his followers.
▶ 0:27:24Sen. Durbin: This went as far as filing a misconduct complaint against judge mossberg for private comments he made to other judges, including judge sutton, another george bush appointee, who dismissed the complaint. They had called for judges to be impeached.
▶ 0:27:49Sen. Durbin: As chief justice roberts said, "impeachment is not an appropriate response to a disagreement concerning a judicial decision. The normal appellate review process exists for that purpose." it is not an easy time to be a judge, but it is more important than ever in history. Hopefully this will persuade you that if confirmed you will be loyal to the law and not the president.
▶ 0:28:13Chair Grassley: Thank you, senator. Now to the introductions before we call on. Senator cassidy could not be here but he asked me to enter into statement his support for anna st. John. Without objection, that will be done. We will have senators moran and cotton speak.
▶ 0:28:42Senator Moran: Ranking member durbin, ranking members of the judiciary committee, thank you for the opportunity to be here to introduce robert cekada. Thank you for the opportunity and thank you to him for asking me to serve in this capacity. I'm here to introduce you to robert cekada as the next director of the bureau about firearms, and explosives, or atf.
▶ 0:29:08Senator Moran: As the chairman of the appropriations subcommittee that funds atf and the department of justice, I have had the opportunity on numerous occasions to get to know rob. He currently serves as the deputy director of atf and is, in my view, a consummate lawman.
▶ 0:29:28Senator Moran: He worked the beat of new york city, rising through the ranks because of his talent, skill, gumption, and dedication to his job. Dedication to our country. He is an honorable man who believes in the enforcement of law and in public safety. Members of this committee know that atf is a multifaceted agency.
▶ 0:29:53Senator Moran: In particular, its regulation of firearms, a constitutionally protected right, making it at times exceptionally politically challenging. I have had the opportunity to work in the capacity of my role on the appropriations subcommittee to try to deal with both sides of regulation of firearms and the right of enforcing our laws in protecting citizens.
▶ 0:30:22Senator Moran: I have heard from many sheriffs and police chiefs in kansas and across the country how the partnership with atf has helped to reduce gun violence in their areas. I have been in numerous meetings with Mr. cekada and have seen his commitment to cooperation between state, local, and federal law enforcement agencies .
▶ 0:30:47Senator Moran: Beginning july 24 over the course of several months, and atf undercover officer conducted multiple controlled purchases from targets in the kansas city area, leading to the seizure of firearms, including six that appear to have been modified to be fully automatic.
▶ 0:31:05Senator Moran: This is what we need from our public safety between alcohol, tobacco, and firearms agencies, working with local law enforcement to get guns off the street from non-law-abiding citizens. Contributions to crime gun intelligence through the national integrated ballistic information network is a game changer in public policy.
▶ 0:31:34Senator Moran: This nominee has been fully engaged in bringing that technology to the efforts of protecting the public. Simply put, atf is an agency that insures violent criminals are put behind bars. Several years ago through capacity in appropriations, I was visiting with the attorney general, william barr, where I asked him what I need to know about the department of justice. He said, remember, we have the responsibility of appropriating for the dea, fbi, and U.S.
▶ 0:32:03Senator Moran: Well, but he told me that atf is the can-do agency and that they deserve our support. I think we have found a person of great capabilities, character, and dedication. Robert cekada is a great nominee to be the next director of atf.
▶ 0:32:28Senator Moran: I ask your consideration of that process, in this process, and I hope you find him favorable to serve in this capacity. Thank you, Mr. chairman.
▶ 0:32:40Chair Grassley: Thank you,
▶ 0:32:42Chairman -- Sender: Thank you, chairman, my distinguished colleagues. It's an honor to be here to introduce this distinguished arkansan, john thomas shepard, to serve in the district court for the western district of arkansas. I would also like to say hello to his family and friends who are right here in attendance this morning.
▶ 0:33:11Chairman -- Sender: He is a graduate of rice university and the university of arkansas school of law. After graduating, john thomas served as an attorney and later partnered with shepard and sheppard, with matthew, a respected lawyer in south arkansas. They take after their father, who served in the court of appeals for the eighth circuit since 2006.
▶ 0:33:41Chairman -- Sender: John thomas went on to become a prosecuting attorney and judge were arkansas's 13th judicial circuit. Through his career he has earned the trust and respect of his fellow attorneys, law enforcement officials, and arkansans. There is integrity, professionalism, and thoughtful leadership. Widely regarded as a fair and evenhanded jurist.
▶ 0:34:06Chairman -- Sender: Careful analysis with sound judgment and a deep respect for the rule of law, he's consistently dedicated to his strong work ethic and intellectual rigor. I am confident that he will bring the same level of care and diligence to every matter coming before him. His experience as a prosecutor and judge has prepared him well for the bench.
▶ 0:34:30Chairman -- Sender: It is for this reason, for these reasons, I commend the president's decision to nominate. There is no question that john thomas shepard is exceptionally qualified and well suited to serve with distinction on the U.S. district court for the western district of arkansas. I strongly support his nomination and urge my colleagues to do the same. Thank you, Mr. chairman.
▶ 0:34:54Chair Grassley: Senator cotton?
▶ 0:34:59Senator Cotton: Good morning. I'm pleased to join senator boseman to be here today to introduce my fellow arkansan and nominee to the court of district of arkansas, john thomas shepard. I want to thank judge sheppard for answering the call to public service in this new rule. I would also like to recognize the shepard family, a pillar of the el dorado union county south arkansas communities.
▶ 0:35:26Senator Cotton: Joining us today are his wife, his sons, his father, his mother, his brother, former speaker of the arkansas state house, his sister, her children, and his father-in-law, Dr. james mcgee. Last but certainly not least, I would like to mention his youngest son, will henry, a busy two-year-old who is likely at home with a more enjoyable source of entertainment.
▶ 0:35:57Senator Cotton: Thank you all for the support of judge sheppard through this nomination process. He has dedicated his career to upholding the rule of law in arkansas. As an accomplished judge and prosecutor, he's worked hard to keep our communities safe from violence and drugs.
▶ 0:36:17Senator Cotton: He graduated with honors from the arkansas school of law and after private practice, focusing on areas like federal and state litigation with business formation, he was appointed as a prosecutor for the 13th judicial district in el dorado and handled a wide range of cases, including homicides, major drug cases, and white collar offenses.
▶ 0:36:45Senator Cotton: He won the election to be the circuit judge for the 13th judicial district and in his new role he continues to handle a wide range of felony cases while residing from the bench. In addition to his professional accolades, the judge is active in his community. He is a volunteer youth coach for the boys and girls club of elder radio, a radio color analyst for the high school football team in laredo, and a member of his church.
▶ 0:37:13Senator Cotton: He has done an exceptional job serving the state of arkansas is a legal professional, judge, and community leader. I'm honored to join senator boseman in supporting the nomination and I encourage my colleagues in the senate and on the committee to do the same.
▶ 0:37:29Chair Grassley: Thank you. Senator cornyn?
▶ 0:37:33Senator Cornyn: Thank you for holding this hearing today. I am honored to introduce the honorable christopher robert wolfe, to serve as district judge of texas, as well as andrew davis, also assigned to serve in the western district.
▶ 0:37:54Senator Cornyn: Texas is proud of our federal judiciary, and I'm always happy to see those who have already dedicated so much of their careers to public service receive these well-deserved promotions. The judge is no exception. After getting his degree from banner university with a brief stint in private practice, he began as a local in the federal prosecutor. He also spent time working in the U.S.
▶ 0:38:22Senator Cornyn: Attorney's office and in the district of minnesota, but in 2010 he returned to texas where he became the deputy branch chief in 2017. 20, governor abbott appointed him to serve as a state district court judge for the two hundred 30th judicial district in tarrant county, where he was reelected in 2020 and 2020 and 2024.
▶ 0:38:49Senator Cornyn: With so many years of dedicated public service in texas, I have no doubt that he will continue his excellent work now as a judge on the U.S. district court for the western district. Mr. davis hails from lubbock, texas, known as the hub city, home of buddy holly.
▶ 0:39:08Senator Cornyn: Many of you are too young to know who buddy holly was, but he made lubbock famous, completing his undergraduate education in houston, going to the big apple to attend law school at columbia, where he earned his jd .
▶ 0:39:25Senator Cornyn: Afterwards, he served for one of our most distinguished district court judges, cindy fitzwater, and then headed to the second circuit to clerk for judge raji on the U.S. court of appeals. Spending three years on civil litigation and regulatory law before becoming an assistant solicitor general at the texas attorney general's office. He was hired by a former texas solicitor general that we were all familiar with, ted cruz Mr.
▶ 0:39:57Senator Cornyn: Davis worked for him in the senate judiciary committee, eventually rising to serve as his chief counsel. After his time on the hill, he joined a private firm as a partner. Once he is confirmed, I'm sure the Mr. davis's experience, education, and west texas roots will serve him well in this.
▶ 0:40:22Senator Cornyn: Congratulations, andrew and chris, on your nominations, and I look forward to supporting both era in the committee and on the senate floor soon.
▶ 0:40:28Chair Grassley: Thank you. Now, senator cruz.
▶ 0:40:34Senator Cruz: Thank you, Mr. chairman. I appreciate my colleague, the senior senator from texas's in vacation of buddy holly. -- invocation of buddy holly. I think we all know where we were the day the music died. Today we have the privilege of considering two nominees from texas, who embody the best of service, excellence, and devotion to the rule of law.
▶ 0:41:04Senator Cruz: It is not everyday that we introduce two nominees from the same hometown, much less two graduates of lubbock high school, but it is a fitting reminder that extraordinary public servants often come from small places shaped by community, faith, family, and responsibility. A federal judgeship is a calling to public service.
▶ 0:41:28Senator Cruz: One that rump -- requires patience, restraint, and an enduring commitment to the rule of law. This over easier paths in public life. Let me begin with andrew davis. After graduating from lubbock, he attended rice university and later went to columbia as a james caan scholar.
▶ 0:41:54Senator Cruz: Andrew went on to clerk for cindy fitzwater in the northern district, and as an assistant solicitor general, andrew represented the state of texas before the texas supreme court, fifth circuit, and U.S. supreme court, handling some of the most consequential legal questions facing the lone star state. He then came to washington to serve on this committee as my chief counsel.
▶ 0:42:25Senator Cruz: I will give him a word of warning, my last chief counsel nominated to be a judge and to the senate confirmed yesterday, during his hearing, my friend and colleague, senator kennedy, asked him if it was true or false that I could burp the alphabet. So, I would advise -- backwards, backwards. I would advise Mr. davis, I hope you have prepared diligently for what I assume will be senator kennedy's withering line of questions.
▶ 0:42:55Senator Cruz: I am telling you right now that you will have no help and assistance from this front as you endure the gauntlet.
▶ 0:43:02Chair Grassley: Thank you very much. Senator kennedy? Sorry, thought you were done.
▶ 0:43:11Senator Cruz: It's the danger of pauses when one is speaking. But andrew is going to serve as a terrific judge in the western district of texas, bringing integrity, principal, infidelity to the rule of law.
▶ 0:43:27Senator Cruz: Secondly, I want to introduce chris wolfe, who was also born and raised in lubbock and is a graduate of law school and spent 15 years as a prosecutor in northern texas, trying serious drug trafficking and white-collar cases before being appointed to the state district bench.
▶ 0:43:47Senator Cruz: For nearly eight years, judge davis -- judge wolfe has presided over serious cases like child abuse, sexual assault, capital fraud, and murder. Over the course of his career he has tried and presided over 100 trials and is widely accepted as a judge who obeys the law and treats everyone with dignity.
▶ 0:44:13Senator Cruz: He is here today with his family , his wife, and five of their six children. His son not currently here is currently serving as a navy warfare officer. Judge wolfe will serve with honor and I'm glad to support his nomination.
▶ 0:44:31Chair Grassley: Thank you, senator cruz. Senator kennedy?
▶ 0:44:38Senator Kennedy: Thank you, Mr. chairman. Anna st. John is from a small town. She went off to lsu, knocked the top out of it. Graduated magna cum laude. Then she went to columbia university and got a masters degree. Then she went to columbia law school.
▶ 0:45:09Senator Kennedy: She knocked the top out of it, too. She also was a james caan scholar. She clerked for a very prestigious judge on the united states court of appeals for the fifth circuit. After that, covington and burley, firm headquartered in washington, D.C.
▶ 0:45:38Senator Kennedy: With offices everywhere. They recruited her. Now, let me just say a word about covington. It's one of the premier law firms in the world. Has been, for 75 years. You may or may not like their politics. But they don't hire dummies.
▶ 0:46:11Senator Kennedy: What they do is they hire a bunch of bright students right out of law school. They work them to death. Let them compete. Of course, the partners make money off it. They let them compete. For many of the young lawyers there for the first time in their lives, they are around people who are smarter and have a greater work ethic than them.
▶ 0:46:40Senator Kennedy: A lot of bright young lawyers leave. I'm not picking on covington, that's a model for a lot of the great law firms. So, it is rare to stay in covington for a long time, unless you are going to be made partner. Miss st. John did. She stayed seven years.
▶ 0:47:04Senator Kennedy: I have it on good authority, and I knew it anyway, that had she stated, she would have been a partner. The good news is that would have meant megabucks. The bad news is that being a partner at a major law firm is not a job, it's a lifestyle. That's ok.
▶ 0:47:32Senator Kennedy: All the big firms talk about life, balance and all of that, but it's all rhetoric, you know? It's a lifestyle, it's not a job. Before she was made partner, even though she would have been had she stayed, she said this isn't for me. I want to, I want to, I want to get married and have children. I want to have a little bit more balance in my life.
▶ 0:48:01Senator Kennedy: So, she left and came back to louisiana. Any firm in louisiana would have hired her, but she went with a boutique national law firm involved in -- they don't hire dummies either, involved in class actions throughout the country. I am telling you this to give you an indication of what her background is like. You will see in a second. I have never talked politics with missing john.
▶ 0:48:33Senator Kennedy: I don't have the slightest idea what her politics are. But I have talked about the law with her. That is why I think bill and I nominated her. She's a real student of lawyers. She understands the beauty of the law. She understands the majesty of the law. She understands the nuances in the law.
▶ 0:49:05Senator Kennedy: That's the kind of person that we want on the federal bench. That's really why I recommended her to the president. And I talked too long, Mr. chairman. But I think you will see what I mean in a second, when the committee gets to ask her questions. Thank you, Mr. chairman.
▶ 0:49:27Chair Grassley: Thank you, senator kennedy. Will the five people be nominated and questioned today come forward? Before you sit down, I would like to swear you. Do you swear that the testimony you are about to give before the committee will be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth, so help you god?
▶ 0:49:58Chair Grassley: All have answered affirmatively. Each of you can please sit down. Each of you can, before you give your statement, introduce your family and friends, whatever you want to say, you can say it. We will start with you, Mr. cekada.
▶ 0:50:18Mr. Cekada: Good morning. Thank you. Briefly, before I get my statement, I would like to thank my son, robbie, who traveled up here from florida late last night to be with here today -- be with me here today to support me. My daughter and wife, both in school today and could not join me.
▶ 0:50:37Mr. Cekada: Many of my friends and coworkers from atf here, with local law enforcement officers I've had the honor of working with over the years I've been involved with atf and nypd and plantation police department. What, chairman grassley, ranking member durbin, distinguished members of the community. Thank you for the opportunity to be before you today.
▶ 0:51:03Mr. Cekada: I am honored and humbled by the nomination to serve as the director of the bureau of the atf. I am thankful to the president for his confidence and unwavering commitment for backing up the men and women of law enforcement for their protections every day. I'm thankful to this committee for their consideration of my nomination. I would like to begin by thanking my family.
▶ 0:51:28Mr. Cekada: My wife, my children, they have been my constant source of strength and purpose throughout my career. Over the past several years my wife has courageously battled stage iii breast cancer while holding our family together in continued service to this nation . Public service and law enforcement demands real sacrifice and none of it is possible without the families who stand behind us who are serving. I want to recognize my parents, who are no longer with us.
▶ 0:51:58Mr. Cekada: In 1966 they fled communist yugoslavia and cam to the united states in search of freedom, opportunity, and the rule of law, and became naturalized citizens in 1933 and believed in what this country represents, liberty and heart work matters and that the law should the innocent while holding the guilty accountable. It instilled in me a lifelong commitment to protecting freedom of the constitution.
▶ 0:52:23Mr. Cekada: I've spent 34 years with a singular mission and law enforcement, keeping the american people safe. For my early -- from my early career as an officer and the detective to my current service at atf, I focus on identifying and dismantling violent criminal organizations, remove dangerous offenders from our streets to protect the community we serve. At atf I have at the privilege of working alongside extraordinary professionals.
▶ 0:52:55Mr. Cekada: Forensic scientists, confessional staff, they carry out some of the most difficult and dangerous work in law enforcement. Our core mission is public safety. Targeting violent criminals, disrupting firearms trafficking networks arming gangs and cartels, investigating bombings and arsons, supporting partners with world-class forensic intelligence capabilities.
▶ 0:53:18Mr. Cekada: If confirmed, our foremost priority will be to make sure that atf supports the trump mandate to make america safer and focusing on violent crime. Our mission is not to burden lawful gun owners or undermine the second amendment. The right to keep and bear arms is a constitutional guarantee of to preserving. Respect for -- this respect for civil liberty is not a competition, it's about respect.
▶ 0:53:48Mr. Cekada: I'm dedicated to the men and women of atf, they deserve modern tools, and accountability at every level. Excellence will be recognized. Misconduct will not be tolerated. Finally, I respect the essential role of congress in the committee. Oversight is vital to the public trust. I commit to being responsive and forthright as we work together to protect the american people. Thank you again for the opportunity to be here today and I look forward to answering any questions.
▶ 0:54:18Chair Grassley: Thank you --
▶ 0:54:23Judge Cekada: Chairman, members of the committee, thank you. Thank you to the president for the great honor of this nomination and thank you to the texas senators, senator korman and senator cruz it for recommending me to the white house for their support throughout the process and for their very kind introductions today. With me today from texas is my family. Most importantly, my wife, rebecca davis.
▶ 0:54:52Judge Cekada: We have been married 18 years, we met in high school, none of this would have been possible without her love and support. She has incredible patience, kindness, and has sacrificed much for our family. Our three kids are very excited to be here in D.C.. The youngest is loving the amount of snow that she has never seen in her life. With me also from texas, lubbock, my parents, dorothy davis and glenn davis, lifelong educators.
▶ 0:55:21Judge Cekada: I could not have asked for a better example of parents, who showed me strength of character, the ability to live with humility, and what a loving lasting partnership looks like. Not with us today, I also want to thank my in-laws, roger and mary set off for treating me as their own with support and love throughout the years. Thank you to the people who supported me throughout my career and in this process that cannot be here today.
▶ 0:55:50Judge Cekada: Specifically in that category I would like to thank my first two bosses for whom I had the privilege to clerk, judge fitzwater and judge reggie for the second circuit. As the owner of a lifetime to the city for you and I look forward to your questions.
▶ 0:56:14Judge St. John: Thank you, chairman grassley, ranking member durbin. Senator kennedy, thank you for the generous introduction and support. Thank you to senator cassidy for his support as well. Thank you to all members of the committee for considering my nomination. It's a tremendous honor to be before you today. Thank you to president trump for the honor of this nomination. To my husband, scott, we celebrated our 20 year anniversary last month.
▶ 0:56:44Judge St. John: One of the great blessings of my life. The other being our children, who are also here today. I am joined as well but my brother, derek, who along with my other siblings I am proud to call them not just my family, but my friends. My life has been marked by my friends and colleagues, mentors who have shared their wisdom over the years. Thank you today to all of my family members and friends supporting me from afar.
▶ 0:57:18Judge St. John: Special thanks to judge barth sale. My clerkship was a foundational experience during which I got the chance to see judicial integrity of the highest level. Finally, there are two not here physically today but who are watching from above, I know, my parents, who created a foundation of faith and family that I will always carry with me. I would not be here without their tremendous sacrifices and support.
▶ 0:57:47Judge St. John: I am again so honored to be here and I look forward to the committee questions chair
▶ 0:57:51Grassley: . Now to judge sheppard.
▶ 0:57:57Judge Sheppard: Thank you. Members of the committee, I want to thank you for the privilege and opportunity to appear before you today. I would like to thank the president for the high honor of this nomination. I want to thank senator boseman and senator cotton for their kind words this morning. About myself and my family.
▶ 0:58:20Judge Sheppard: I want to thank them for their support throughout the process and for their dedicated service to the nation and the people of the great state of arkansas. Senator cotton introduced my family. I will not list them. There were a lot here. I will mention my sister's kids, who I didn't list -- he didn't list, who would be upset if I didn't list them.
▶ 0:58:48Judge Sheppard: Robert is here today who supported me. I have a dear friend from my law school, robin wright cleary, an exceptional arkansas attorney who lives and works in the washington, D.C. area. When you live in a small town, you have a lot of support. I want to thank the people of south arkansas for their encouragement and support throughout the process.
▶ 0:59:13Judge Sheppard: Also, I know they wouldn't forgive me, but my teammates on the football team, the coaches who have reached out to support me. I want to give them a special acknowledgment. I greatly appreciate all of their support. Finally, I want to thank my family for their love and support over the years.
▶ 0:59:34Judge Sheppard: I was lucky to be raised in a family that instilled the importance of hard work, public service, and a faith of fate -- and faith in god, having carried me through the various chapters of my career, it has brought me here today.
▶ 0:59:54Chair Grassley: Thank you. Mr. shepherd? No, Mr. walsh. -- wolfe.
▶ 1:00:08Mr. Wolfe: Thank you for having me here, thank you to the president displayed on her. Thank you to the senators for recommending me and for your support along the way and for your generous introductions. Thank you. I was born and raised in lubbock, texas, and have a great privilege of having parents who loved me, encouraged me, and sacrifice for me. My mother, jill, passed away 20 years ago.
▶ 1:00:36Mr. Wolfe: My father, billy, passed away three years ago. Both would be incredibly proud that their only child sits before you today. My dad drove trucks and I roughneck until I was young and he got into law school when I was in elementary school. I spent my youth watching him try cases all over texas and during that time I developed judgeship to be a noble calling.
▶ 1:01:08Mr. Wolfe: I cannot adequately thank you for all the support. It started with my wife, my amazing wife and best friend, sarah. She was here with five of my six kids. Joseph, nathan, and our daughter lois. My oldest son is currently on deployment as a navy service officer and could not be here today.
▶ 1:01:38Mr. Wolfe: Grateful to be here, having to answer your questions.
▶ 1:01:40Chair Grassley: Thank you all for your opening statements. Starting with this or cicada -- Mr. cekada, you've been deputy director. You have been there a long time. You know what works and doesn't work. Given your unique perspective, what are your priorities for the bureau if confirmed?
▶ 1:02:02Mr. Cekada: Senator, thank you for your question. The top priorities will remain violent crime in the forms of illegal use of firearms, illegal use of explosives, and criminal acts of arson. We will prioritize those efforts as we work with state and local partners around the country. As you stated earlier and as we discussed just two days ago, etf is a small agency.
▶ 1:02:33Mr. Cekada: We are interdependent on our state and local business partners. We currently have about 1400 task force officers and firm commitments with partners to continue using intelligence in order to work with partners to identify who the scourge is of their community, people responsible for using firearms illegally, committing violent crime, etf will do that as a primary focus.
▶ 1:03:03Mr. Cekada: We will also be attempting to use the modernization of critical systems work better with our industry partners. For example, the forms and licensing systems are over 25 years old. They are very antiquated and cause significant delays in processing the forms that unnecessarily burden the american public and industry members. I think that that would be a significant efficiency.
▶ 1:03:30Mr. Cekada: In turn, I will make sure that during the next several years, we follow up on the trump second amendment executive order to review all atf policies procedures, and regulations to ensure that none of those infringe upon the second amendment unnecessarily.
▶ 1:03:56Chair Grassley: You and I discussed in the whistleblower who exposed waste up to $20 million because of fraudulent atf activity. Thank you for doing that. I hope that emphasizes listen to every whistleblower so they never have to congress and seek the protector of whistleblower protection laws. Now, Mr. davis. You have had an impressive career, worked across different branches of government.
▶ 1:04:21Chair Grassley: How did your work in those different branches shape your perspective for being a federal judge? Mr. davis: thank you, senator. Specifically in government, the opportunity to serve as an assistant solicitor general in texas was formative to me in terms of understanding the role in a courtroom when it has and a pup -- appellate advocate I argued a number of cases and I knew what it was to appear before a judge, to give respect
▶ 1:04:54Chair Grassley: For treating cases fairly, impartially, when they sought to find the right answer without appear in favor. One thing that I learned of the most working for this body is that before I arrived here, I had a sense in my academic career and practice that legislative history was not something I wanted to rely on if I were ever to be a judge. Being here taught me about the process of lawmaking, taught me about how bills become a law.
▶ 1:05:24Chair Grassley: It taught me all the factors that come into it when the text is the thing that is put forward. From that experience and from being around this body, informed how I think about statutory interpretation if I were so lucky to be confirmed.
▶ 1:05:41Chair Grassley: Thank. Mr. st. John, your advocacy cover numerous areas of the law, including class actions, administrative disputes, and constitutional questions, among others. How have your experiences in these areas of the law prepared you to step into the role of a federal judge, he ruled that by its nature is necessarily generalized?
▶ 1:06:08Mr. St. John: I have had the opportunity to handle a number of different types of matters throughout my career. I've been very fortunate in that regard. I believe that I have learned how to approach new areas of the law and get up to speed on them quickly. Throughout that process, I have learned that the rule of law is the primary centerpiece of the practice. I have a deep and abiding respect for that.
▶ 1:06:38Chair Grassley: Thank you. I've got just 13 seconds left. Mr. shepherd, please tell us what you learned from these roles that have had advocacy on both sides of criminal cases that best prepares you for the federal bench.
▶ 1:06:56Mr. Shephard: May I answer the question?
▶ 1:07:02Chair Grassley: Yes.
▶ 1:07:04Mr. Shephard: Certainly, being on both sides of the issues, criminal and civil contexts, have been a benefit to me. Not only when I was in practice, understanding the various arguments that the parties would make, but by the nature of being in a small town I represented plaintiffs and defendants.
▶ 1:07:26Mr. Shephard: As was stated, I was a prosecutor and did criminal defense work on the cga panel as an attorney in the western district. All of that. Experience gives me a unique perspective that has helped to be on the state court bench, certainly. I believe it would also benefit me if I'm fortunate enough to be confirmed to the federal district court.
▶ 1:07:48Chair Grassley: Thank you. Senator durbin?
▶ 1:07:52Sen. Durbin: Thank you, Mr. chairman. Mr. cekada, good meeting in our office. Enjoyed meeting you. Your highest priority, you say, is stopping violent crime. It is a priority well worth your attention. Ours as well.
▶ 1:08:09Sen. Durbin: At least two thirds of the atf agents, 1001 but 78, have reportedly been diverted from preventing gun violence to carry out the president's immigration agenda. Do you support the president's proposed cuts to atf?
▶ 1:08:27Mr. Cekada: Thank you for your question and for making time to speak with me. That number is incorrect. I think we discussed that yesterday. The number of agents diverted to focus on title eight enforcement is averaging somewhere between 75 and 100 agents per day. The remainder of the atf agents focus on violent crime throughout the country on a daily basis.
▶ 1:08:56Sen. Durbin: Do you support the idea of diverting atf agents to immigration enforcement?
▶ 1:09:02Mr. Cekada: I support them being used to enforce federal statutes and federal partners. The number of agents used in these efforts have been very much focused on violent crime, specifically assisting hsi and ice. So, in those efforts, I 100% support our partners.
▶ 1:09:33Sen. Durbin: Thank you. Miss st. John, we committed to the ending of force arbitration and sexual harassment act. It passed by voice vote, unusual and this committee, with strong bipartisan support, signed into law in 2022. Force arbitration deny sexual survivors -- assault survivors a day in court and required in many cases that the misconduct be concealed from public view.
▶ 1:10:03Sen. Durbin: You testified against this legislation in november of 2021, claiming that force arbitration was not in the best interest of those subjected to sexual harassment. Not the best interest of those subjected to sexual harassment. To argue that the bill terms these women into unwilling ponds , leveraging their private difficulties in pursuit of public policy objectives that don't benefit them.
▶ 1:10:30Sen. Durbin: Former fox news host gretchen carlson was one of the leading advocates for our bill, following her harassment by roger ailes. She has expressed concern about your nomination because of your testimony. Here is she said. "women around the country bravely share in the urgency of force arbitration, st.
▶ 1:10:50Sen. Durbin: John user power and interest to cast like these women in the public, download -- downplaying their stories, minimizing the pain, instead of listening to the women forced to suffer in silence, st. John tried to convince these women that their understanding of their own experiences were incorrect." do you still opposed force arbitration for people who have been sexually harassed in the workplace?
▶ 1:11:17Mr. St. John: I have deep respect and gratitude for women who speak up against predators, those who sexually harass and abuse women. I certainly did not minimize their stories. I was invited to provide testimony regarding arbitration and out-of-court resolutions.
▶ 1:11:38Mr. St. John: I provided perspectives on how arbitration can be beneficial and how it can result and often does result in much higher recoveries for plaintiffs and sexual assault survivors. It's a quicker process that doesn't require women who don't want to go public to have their names splashed on public documents and in the news.
▶ 1:12:00Mr. St. John: I respect every party's right to go to court for arbitration and I don't believe that my testimony can be interpreted to be minimizing of women or forcing them to take a certain approach in resolving these troubling problems in society.
▶ 1:12:16Chair Grassley: Eat -- Sen.
▶ 1:12:19Durbin: You have not changed your position?
▶ 1:12:21Mr. St. John: I stand by my testimony, people should have a right to choose arbitration or to go to court. I don't believe I testified against force arbitration.
▶ 1:12:31Sen. Durbin: Thank you you, Mr. chairman.
▶ 1:12:35Chair Grassley: Senator?
▶ 1:12:40Senator: I would like to start with you, Mr. cekada. I believe that the elimination of the $200 national firearms act tax stamp was a significant victory for second amendment rights. This is a constitutionally protected right, the right to bear arms. When we attach a significant tax burden to it, it's got to be taken into account.
▶ 1:13:09Senator: Unfortunately, it didn't eliminate all laws that might fall under the same argument. We still have pretty significant restrictions in place, including various registration requirements that exist under the national firearms act. Not all of which, I believe, have clear constitutional justification.
▶ 1:13:34Senator: Even before we get to constitutional justification, which may tie into the policies, I wanted to ask you a bit about whether, to what extent, or in what way law enforcement or other policy-based justification makes it compelling, makes it makes sense, makes it necessary for one reason or the other.
▶ 1:14:02Senator: Things like silencers, short barreled rifles, short-barreled shotguns. Can you think of good policy-based law enforcement justifications for having those on the books?
▶ 1:14:15Mr. Cekada: Senator, thank you for your question. As far as policy, or enforcement of firearms is strictly under the nfa. Let's say for example that they were not under there, they would still be firearms under the dca.
▶ 1:14:31Sen. Lee: Right, they are not unregulated and to buy them you would have to go through the background check process, which is, you know, significant, depending on how busy they are at the time when you're buying a firearm. You might have to wait minutes or hours, whatever it is. It's not completely unregulated at that point.
▶ 1:14:52Mr. Cekada: That's right.
▶ 1:14:53Sen. Lee: These are additional restrictions on top of the restrictions already applicable to all firearms, right?
▶ 1:15:01Mr. Cekada: Yes, sir.
▶ 1:15:12Sen. Lee: As to the short-barreled rifles and sound suppressor commonly known as silencers -- but the technical term in the industry is sound suppressor. Tell me what policy justification -- I think that one -- as legitimate as the criticism is of these restrictions as to the other items we have discussed -- short-barreled shotguns and short-barreled rifles -- it seems to me to be particularly difficult to justify the
▶ 1:15:43Sen. Lee: Additional restrictions as to sound suppressor's, because sound suppressors are themselves not guns, correct?
▶ 1:15:48Mr. Cekada: Under the law, suppressors are considered firearms, which is why they are regulated under both.
▶ 1:16:01Sen. Lee: Unlike actual guns, the suppressor is not capable of firing a bullet. Unlike guns, suppressors are there, as the name implies, to suppress sound, so that people who use guns, whether that is for hunting, for target practice, for sporting of one sort or another -- they are subjected to a bombardment of sound. It is louder than it otherwise might need to be.
▶ 1:16:29Sen. Lee: People who use certain kinds of firearms that happened to be really loud, they have to use some kind of hearing protection on their ears. The question arises what decent public policy justification for law enforcement might compel the U.S. government, with all the force of the U.S. government, and with enforcement power given to atf to restrict those, given that there is a legitimate public policy justification for wanting to encourage people to do it because it tends to protect people's hearing.
▶ 1:17:00Sen. Lee: Can you think of any good reason why we should not allow those, or at least why we should not allow them without this additional step above and beyond what a place to firearms generally?
▶ 1:17:11Mr. Cekada: From atf's perspective, atf is bound by the law at this point, and if congress chose to move suppressors into the gca, atf would be supportive.
▶ 1:17:28Sen. Lee: That is very good to know because we periodically do release legislation, and when we do that, with basically every agency -- in my office, my colleagues do the same. We receive technical input from the agency involved in the enforcement of that law. And it is good to know in advance sometimes what that might look like, so I appreciate your perspective on this one.
▶ 1:17:58Sen. Lee: Congress does need to revisit these issues. Particularly given that sound suppression can be very important both for health and safety reasons. There is not a legitimate health and safety reason, certainly, to treat this not just as a firearm, but as a particular type of firearm with additional restriction. I see my time has expired.
▶ 1:18:22Chair Grassley: I would like to enter into the record a letter supporting Mr. cekada from the president of the american suppressor association, a guns rights association. They endorse Mr.
▶ 1:18:38Chair Grassley: Cekada's nomination and praise his "unwavering commitment to accountability, transparency, and collaboration with law-abiding firearm owners and industry stakeholders." without objection, this will be entered into the record. >> welcome to all of our nominees here. Families and friends.
▶ 1:19:07Chair Grassley: I asked the following initial questions of all nominees who appear before any of the committees on which I sit, as a way to determine fitness of the nominees to serve. I will start with Mr. cekada and go down the line with the responses to my questions. Since you became a legal adult, have you ever made unwanted requests for sexual favors or committed any verbal or physical harassment or assault of a sexual nature?
▶ 1:19:36Mr. Cekada: No, I have not.
▶ 1:19:39Mr. Davis: No, senator.
▶ 1:19:41Ms. St. John: I have not.
▶ 1:19:43Mr. Shepherd: No, senator.
▶ 1:19:45Mr. Wolfe: No, senator.
▶ 1:19:50Sen. Hirono: Have you faced discipline related to this kind of conduct?
▶ 1:19:53Mr. Cekada: I have not.
▶ 1:19:55Mr. Davis: No, senator.
▶ 1:19:57Ms. St. John: No, senator.
▶ 1:19:59Mr. Shepherd: No, senator.
▶ 1:20:02Mr. Wolfe: No, senator.
▶ 1:20:07Sen. Hirono: Mr. davis, as an attorney, you defended fox news network when it was sued for defamation by dominion voting systems after the 2020 election. Dominion alleged that several fox news reporters made false statements about its voting machines. Ultimately, fox news settled for 700 million dollars. Clearly, fox news had trouble telling fact from fiction.
▶ 1:20:33Sen. Hirono: It is important, to say the least, that judges rely on facts to make their decisions. I have one question for you. Did donald trump lose the 2020 election, yes or no?
▶ 1:20:44Mr. Davis: Senator, president biden was certified as the president and served four years.
▶ 1:20:52Sen. Hirono: It is clear that all of our nominees have been coached to respond in that way. The fact that none of you can acknowledge who actually won the election is pretty disturbing when we are focused on the expectation that judges will rely on facts. This is for judge shepherd.
▶ 1:21:11Sen. Hirono: You attended rice university in houston, texas, and you previously stated that you appreciated the diversity of the student body, and that diversity, to quote you, helps better our understanding of the world. I hope that you still believe that. And I think you must be aware that this administration has a disdain for diversity, d.e.I.
▶ 1:21:44Sen. Hirono: Programs. In fact, president trump, one of the first executive orders he issued upon being inaugurated was to direct every department to eliminate any and all support for d.e.I., and this has led to withholding of funds, and even deemphasizing and eliminating official celebrations and observances of events that can be characterized as supportive of d.e.I., such as juneteenth,
▶ 1:22:14Sen. Hirono: For example. The national park has eliminated the fee-free days for martin luther king jr. Day and juneteenth, and replaced it with a free day celebrating donald trump's birthday. The anti-d.e.I. Sentiment of this regime, as I refer to it because of its authoritarianism, permeates this administration's priorities.
▶ 1:22:46Sen. Hirono: So the fact that any organization celebrating or supporting the diversity of our country is discouraged from doing so -- people are getting the message that that is not a good idea to do that, even if there is a desire. Mr. shepherd, don't you think that anti-d.e.I. Could lead to discrimination against minorities, including women? Because women are included as part of d.e.I.
▶ 1:23:17Mr. Shepherd: Senator, thank you for the question. The speech you are referring to was a discussion given to prospective college students, and the nature of those comments related to the benefit of going to a school, experiencing different people.
▶ 1:23:37Mr. Shepherd: The fact that we live in an era that is a global economy, it benefits you to experience diversity in all ranges, not simply race. As your question relates to any legal issues, as a sitting judge and a nominee to this position, I cannot wait into matters of debate amongst congress. I cannot answer the question.
▶ 1:24:04Sen. Hirono: I think you still acknowledged that we live in a diverse country, and I would say the anti-d.e.I. Sentiment creates an environment where discrimination against minorities would happen. So that is disturbing. For Ms. st. John, you were formerly a fellow at the independent women's forum, which previously advocated for exceptions to the right to access contraception for women.
▶ 1:24:37Sen. Hirono: Now, the supreme court decisions griswold and eisenstadt stands for the proposition that the constitution protects the right to access contraception. Would you consider these two cases to be settled law, and that as a district judge, should you be confirmed, that you would follow those precedents?
▶ 1:24:56Ms. St. John: If I am so fortunate to be confirmed as a district court judge, I would be bound by all supreme court precedent.
▶ 1:25:06Sen. Hirono: Would you consider the cases I mentioned to be settled law?
▶ 1:25:08Ms. St. John: I would have to look and see if they have been overturned. If they are binding law, I would apply them.
▶ 1:25:15Chair Grassley: Senator kennedy? Senator kennedy.
▶ 1:25:27Sen. Kennedy: Mr. davis, did I hear senator cruz correctly say you were a james kent scholar at columbia?
▶ 1:25:40Mr. Davis: Yes, I am in good company.
▶ 1:25:45Sen. Kennedy: You were chief counsel for senator cruz. Senator cruz is a pretty able lawyer himself. That must have been an interesting job.
▶ 1:25:54Mr. Davis: I have had the privilege of working for multiple bosses who were phenomenal lawyers. Senator cruz is the utmost lawyer. He is a supreme court practitioner. He is phenomenal. I have had the pleasure to work with many other attorneys. The judges for whom I clerked were both fantastic. I have had a lot of great mentors and examples throughout my life.
▶ 1:26:15Sen. Kennedy: In your job, where you are senator cruz a lot?
▶ 1:26:18Mr. Davis: Yes, senator.
▶ 1:26:23Sen. Kennedy: We talked a lot about heroes in america, don't we?
▶ 1:26:26Mr. Cekada: -- Mr. davis: yes, senator.
▶ 1:26:32Sen. Kennedy: People who tolerate senator cruz on a daily basis are the real heroes, aren't they? [laughter]
▶ 1:26:38Mr. Davis: Senator, I have nothing but positive things to say about working for senator cruz. He was a phenomenal boss and I just loved the experience.
▶ 1:26:51Sen. Kennedy: Senator cruz is my friend. I realize that is a questionable life choice, but he is my friend. Judge wolfe, you went to baylor.
▶ 1:27:01Mr. Wolfe: Yes, senator.
▶ 1:27:06Sen. Kennedy: We had lsu hired away your women's basketball coach, didn't we? You understand we are not giving him back.
▶ 1:27:14Mr. Wolfe: I understand.
▶ 1:27:18Sen. Kennedy: Ms. st. John, what is a universal injunction?
▶ 1:27:21Ms. St. John: Universal injunction refers to an injunction that applies universally beyond the parties to the case.
▶ 1:27:31Sen. Kennedy: The supreme court has recently had something to say about universal injunctions, has it not? What did the supreme court instruct us?
▶ 1:27:40Ms. St. John: In comfy -- trump v. Kasa, courts are limited to awarding complete relief to the parties before the court.
▶ 1:27:55Sen. Kennedy: Did the supreme court talk about class actions in its opinions?
▶ 1:27:59Ms. St. John: Not directly that I recall.
▶ 1:28:02Sen. Kennedy: Do you think -- one of the arguments, as I understand it, for universal injunctions -- it is an argument for and against. It impacts more than just the plaintiffs before the court. Is that correct?
▶ 1:28:18Ms. St. John: Yes, senator.
▶ 1:28:20Sen. Kennedy: I have heard the argument made that a substitute, some would argue a more efficient substitute for universal injunctions, would be a class-action lawsuit. What do you think about that?
▶ 1:28:34Ms. St. John: You know, class-action does allow relief beyond the named representative plaintiff. The class actions have a lot of additional safeguards set forth in rule 23. It does allow large groups of plaintiffs to come together in one case in a way that may not -- that bilateral litigation may not allow. But it does have additional protections.
▶ 1:29:02Sen. Kennedy: Ok. I'm going to go back to Mr. davis. Since we have our atf nominee in front of us today, I thought I would ask you a little bit about our second amendment.
▶ 1:29:28Sen. Kennedy: I don't want to buy a bazooka, and I have found a good deal on one in europe. Can I buy it and own it and use it here in america?
▶ 1:29:39Mr. Davis: Senator, I believe that falls under prohibitions in the national firearms act. I think that is right, but let me speak more generally to the second question, what you are getting at. There is a fundamental right enshrined in the second amendment to keep and bear arms. The supreme court has said in heller, written by justice scalia, that that is a personal right, not a right tied to being in a militia. It is a personal right.
▶ 1:30:09Mr. Davis: The supreme court has since elaborated on that doctrine, including in gruen and more recently. It has made clear the test for second amendment rights is whether the right falls under the text, history, and tradition in this country. I would need to look specifically at whether a bazooka or a weapon analogous to it would fall under the protection of the second amendment using that test.
▶ 1:30:36Sen. Kennedy: Under heller and bruin, do I have unfettered discretion to own any kind of firearm that I want to?
▶ 1:30:44Mr. Davis: There are certain exceptions that are listed within the decision in heller, and for example machine guns fall under the national firearms act. There are certain exceptions to what arms can be owned. But again I would go back to the text, history, and tradition test if a case were to come before me as a judge, that was asking that question.
▶ 1:31:10Sen. Kennedy: I'm sorry I did not get to ask everybody questions. Thank you. >> welcome. Thanks for coming to my office to talk about ballistics tracing. I believe we agreed that when local law enforcement roll up to a crime scene and find, for instance, a cartridge in the sidewalk, the quicker that those local police officers can identify the firearm that left
▶ 1:31:40Sen. Kennedy: That cartridge that leaves distinctive markings on a cartridge, the better off they are to help officer safety and investigative effectiveness. Is that correct? >> thank you for your time yesterday, and yes, you are correct. Referring to the national integrated ballistics integration network.
▶ 1:32:02Sen. Whitehouse: I look forward to working with you in trying to make sure that the database is robust as possible, and that access to the information is as quick as possible in a crime scene at night on the street. You want to know as quickly as you can where that came from. And so I am glad that we agree on that and I look forward to making further progress. Ms. st.
▶ 1:32:26Sen. Whitehouse: John, it looks to me like pretty much every one of your employers has been funded by the coke political operation. -- koch political operation. Leonard leo's political and judicial influence operation. Or donors trust, which is kind of the identity laundering operation for the koch brothers and others.
▶ 1:32:54Sen. Whitehouse: Given that, how are you going to deal with cases that come before you in which, let's say, the kochs have an interest? Would you refuse yourself? You seem to be essentially a product of their investment. And now you will be making decisions that could affect their business. Or their politics.
▶ 1:33:19Ms. St. John: Senator, my current organization, felton law institute, does not receive any funding from the koch brothers. I've never received any information I need to do any work consistent with their wishes, to the extent they did donate to any organization I have ever been part of. As to recusal, I would carefully look at each case and look at all the factors for recusal.
▶ 1:33:47Sen. Whitehouse: Well, the competitive enterprise institute seems to get lots of money, 10 million dollars, from donors trust and donor's, 400,000 from koch organizations. The hamilton law institute got at least a million and a quarter in grants from donors trust. The independent women's forum, 300,000 from the judicial education project. More than 13 million dollars from donors trust.
▶ 1:34:15Sen. Whitehouse: So if you think that that is not something that you need to be concerned about as a judge, all that history, then I am very disappointed to hear that. Mr. davis, how about qui tam cases? You say they are unconstitutional. Are you going to recuse yourself based on your stated opinion that the cause of action should not exist?
▶ 1:34:41Mr. Davis: Senator, in a capacity not as a nominee, I spoke about those actions. However there is binding on bank -- en banc precedent and I would follow that binding circuit precedent.
▶ 1:35:00Sen. Whitehouse: But there is obviously a certain amount of lean in judicial decisions. You are not automatons out there. How would you convince a qui tam plaintiff that you are not going to lean in every subordinate decision along the way against that party's interest because of your expressed views on qui tam?
▶ 1:35:20Mr. Davis: In the past, I offered views on one aspect, which was the constitutionality. That is something I have spoken publicly on. As a nominee and as a judge, if I was confirmed, I would follow the law faithfully.
▶ 1:35:36Sen. Whitehouse: I get that, but I have also been a lawyer for a long time now, and I know a lot of judges. Spend a lot of time in court. Anybody who has spent a minute in court knows that the judge is not an automaton, and everything from procedural rulings to scheduling rulings to undecided elements of a case allows the judge very substantial leeway.
▶ 1:36:01Sen. Whitehouse: And if you are not prepared to listen to a qui tam plaintiff fairly because you think they are there unconstitutionally, that is something you should consider as a judge, shouldn't you?
▶ 1:36:12Mr. Davis: Senator, I disagree that I cannot listen to them fairly.
▶ 1:36:16Sen. Whitehouse: Who said the cases would be unconstitutional.
▶ 1:36:20Mr. Davis: If I were so lucky as to be confirmed, I would follow all president, including president in the fifth circuit that qui tam is constitutional.
▶ 1:36:30Chair Grassley: Before I call on senator blackburn, I want to remind you, Mr. davis, I am the author of the 1986 qui tam legislation. It brought 86 billion dollars of fraudulently taken money back into the federal treasury. Senator blackburn.
▶ 1:36:54Sen. Blackburn: I always find it so interesting that our colleagues across the dais want to talk about money, and yet the soros foundation and the millions they have put into different nonprofits and efforts of influence are really quite astounding. They are the record breaker. Mr. cekada, thank you for your time.
▶ 1:37:24Sen. Blackburn: We talked yesterday about the memphis safe task force. President trump, a.g. Bondi, director patel have done a great work with all the federal agencies in memphis. And as I told you yesterday, they have made more than 60 500 arrests. They have taken 1500 illegal firearms off the streets. They have found 148 missing children. And it is a joint effort. You have got all these federal and state agencies that are there.
▶ 1:37:55Sen. Blackburn: Atf is part of this. Talk about what you would do as director to support the effort of the memphis safe task force, which has cut crime in memphis by over 50%. And I would like to hear what you would do for not only memphis, but other cities, to keep them safe and free of these criminals.
▶ 1:38:23Mr. Cekada: Good morning, senator. Thank you for your time and thank you for making time to speak to me yesterday. Atf is proud partner of the memphis safe task force, as we are in the make D.C. safe and beautiful task force as well. As everyone knows, atf is a small federal agency. We have about 40 atf agents in memphis that are assigned to this task force.
▶ 1:38:48Mr. Cekada: We have made up for about 32% of the federal cases that have been brought forward in memphis for federal firearms violations. So our small team is a significant contributor. I think some have called us the "can do" agency earlier. I plan on continuing to support that task force. We, as an agency every year, like to have surge operations around the country in cities like memphis and D.C. that are being impacted by violent crime.
▶ 1:39:20Mr. Cekada: We don't do it alone. We always work with our stake holding partners, with other federal partners, to ensure we are using a whole of government approach to make the largest impact on violent crime in those communities.
▶ 1:39:33Sen. Blackburn: We appreciate the number of these cases that have been able to be tried federally. We have a week d.a. In memphis, -- weak d.a. In memphis, so getting these into federal court has been helpful in making the city safe. Mr. wolfe, talk a bit about sentencing because the western district of texas really has a high volume of federal cases.
▶ 1:40:02Sen. Blackburn: Immigration, drug, firearms cases that are there. Other criminal offenses. So talk with me about how you would approach the federal sentencing guidelines, and whether you believe there are circumstances where a judge should deviate from those recommendations. Microphone.
▶ 1:40:24Mr. Wolfe: Senator, I had the great privilege of being in the U.S. attorney's office in the northern district of texas for about 15 years. I got to see outstanding judges handle these issues, who were faithful to the law. Of course, when it comes to sentencing, you look at history, the characteristics of the defendant, the nature and circumstances of the offense.
▶ 1:40:51Mr. Wolfe: Every now and then, of course, a judge feels that a sentence should go outside the guidelines. They have a duty to articulate why they think that that should happen, on the record. Why do they think the guidelines are not reasonable?
▶ 1:41:10Sen. Blackburn: On firearms cases, when you are talking about these federal firearms cases, what is the proper role of the atf in enforcing those federal laws while also respecting the constitutional rights of the individual and the second amendment?
▶ 1:41:27Mr. Cekada: Thank you for your question, senator. Atf is, I think, in a unique position. We have the ability to use intel that we gain from key trace and now dna. So atf is not driving around neighborhoods are going through people's homes, looking to burden legal firearms owners with our enforcement actions.
▶ 1:41:53Mr. Cekada: When atf comes into a neighborhood, we have used intelligence to identify who the people are responsible for violent crime, and hold those people accountable to the fullest extent of the federal authorities allowed by law. When we do that, we have seen significant impacts and significant sentences that not only remove those people from those communities that they have been terrorizing, but they serve as a significant deterrent for others that would choose that path as well.
▶ 1:42:21Sen. Blackburn: Thank you.
▶ 1:42:25Sen. Booker: Mr. cekada, I am relieved by your nomination, your years and dedicated service, something I have a lot of respect and gratitude for. I have met some of the atf agents over the years and confound them to be remarkably committed, professional public servants. The fact that you would lead the agency that has so many means a lot to me. I'm worried, obviously, about the direction of the atf. I have been for years, since I was a mayor.
▶ 1:42:55Sen. Booker: We found out that the overwhelming majority of our gun crimes would come from people who acquired gun crimes illegally. If we were just enforcing the laws, we could have driven down violence. As much as I advocate for other gun safety laws, the ones we have right now, should the atf be given resources and manpower to enforce the law, we could save a lot of lives and our country.
▶ 1:43:20Sen. Booker: And so, unfortunately, since the president's inauguration a year ago, the atf has really been under attack, further attacks, from the gun industry and high ranking administration officials. Trump proposed gutting the atf budget by $400 million. Already starved as an agency.
▶ 1:43:39Sen. Booker: The administration has diverted thousands of atf agents away from investigating illegal firearm trafficking, bombing, tax evasion, and tracing guns from violent crimes to the perpetrators, to instead do immigration enforcement. And this has primarily resulted in the rounding up of nonviolent immigrants, and not getting weapons out of the hands of people that are doing horrible things with them.
▶ 1:44:06Sen. Booker: The administration even suggested eliminating the atf altogether, which is stunning to me, to hear this administration wanting to defund the police that do some of the most important work for keeping us safe. I have a few questions about the direction of the agency.
▶ 1:44:21Sen. Booker: I just want to emphasize again my gratitude that you are up for this position, but the importance of you maintaining your independence, and not giving the gun industry or others who want to defund you any sway over the decisions you make. And so I just want to say for the record, if you can just state -- do you think abolishing or defunding atf would risk public safety?
▶ 1:44:45Mr. Cekada: Good morning, senator. Thank you for your comments. I think atf plays a pivotal role in america's communities and reducing violent crime. Although I cannot control the budgets, I think there would be a negative impact.
▶ 1:45:04Sen. Booker: Thank you very much. A simple yes would have sufficed, but I appreciate that. So this legislation is obviously misguided. I hope you will state -- take steps to ensure the atf is fully staffed, fully resourced, able to get its mission to protect the public from violent crime. Since 2007, when I first met with the acting head of the atf, they just told me the blunt truth about how much more they could do with more officers. I hope you will advocate for that.
▶ 1:45:35Sen. Booker: The diversion of agents to conduct immigration enforcement -- we know that trump authorized atf agents to arrest immigrants without permanent legal status. By september, about 80% of the atf's agents have been assigned to the immigration task force at some point. How many atf agents are currently assigned to the department of homeland security to conduct immigration enforcement?
▶ 1:46:03Mr. Cekada: Atf has never had more than about 75 to 100 agents on any given day working on immigration enforcement and support of ice.
▶ 1:46:17Sen. Booker: Currently?
▶ 1:46:18Mr. Cekada: No more than 100 at any given time.
▶ 1:46:23Sen. Booker: Has this impacted capacity to enforce national firearms laws?
▶ 1:46:26Mr. Cekada: Not from our perspective. Atf has focused on offenders that were illegally armed with firearms -- ms 13, illegal aliens that have purchased --
▶ 1:46:39Sen. Booker: I am well aware and frankly grateful for the work you do. It is just hard for me to believe that 100 plus agents taken out of that important work , going to arrest people with no criminal records, is not taking you away from your work. More agents doing that work. I find that would probably help keep us much safer from the violent crime that is most concerning to the american public.
▶ 1:47:02Sen. Booker: I would like to enter into the record of an article from the trace, which quotes david hamilton, a former senior special agent who retired in 2021. He said it is hugely disruptive. You work on a complex federal investigation for years, which includes covert gun buys and intercepts and wiretaps. Now they are being pulled you cannot work on that investigation for an indefinite time. Most of those leads are going to die on the vine.
▶ 1:47:29Sen. Booker: That is a former agent that has a lot of experience, that counters this testimony that taking that many agents away does not undermine your mission. I want to ask one last question.
▶ 1:47:44Sen. Kennedy: Without objection, the document submitted on the record.
▶ 1:47:48Sen. Booker: I'm grateful for you, sir.
▶ 1:47:50Sen. Kennedy: I'm grateful for you. I would be even more grateful if you wrap up.
▶ 1:47:55Sen. Booker: I will wrap up with this last question. You with the gavel is a terrifying thing.
▶ 1:48:01Sen. Kennedy: I got the gavel now.
▶ 1:48:03Sen. Booker: Please don't throw it at me, sir. I know you are armed. The last question, and I am done. Previous information about trafficking investigations issued by atf, we have received at regular intervals. None of that data has been released in the past year by this administration. Is that something you are willing to do under your leadership? How many dealer inspections has the adf conducted -- atf conducted since january 2025?
▶ 1:48:28Mr. Cekada: I don't have the number of inspections we have conducted with me. We can provide you with that answer after the hearing. We continue to do inspections uninhibited. I would like to put on the record I have no clue who Mr. hamilton is and I have been here for 21 years almost, and I go back to 1994, when I was a test officer working with the atf, so almost 32 years. I challenge his statement as to the work that atf is doing.
▶ 1:48:56Mr. Cekada: We do have about a hundred people working on immigration enforcement, but we are not impacting violent crime in a negative way as a result of that work that we are doing.
▶ 1:49:08Sen. Kennedy: Senator schmitt.
▶ 1:49:10Sen. Schmitt: During the biden administration, atf issued several administrative rules that violate statutory authorities that were enacted by congress. In a previous life, when I was attorney general of missouri, I helped to lead one of the lawsuits against one of those rules, the receiver rule. Eventually a different lawsuit came up against the rule and the supreme court sidestepped the ultimate issue on that.
▶ 1:49:36Sen. Schmitt: But there are similar rules such as the stabilizing race rule and the engaged in business rule that threatened to make responsible, law-abiding americans into criminals and left gun owners with vague, difficult to follow up mandates. Americans who want to exercise second amendment rights and follow the law in good faith lacked guidance and felt like the atf was trying to trap and punish them.
▶ 1:50:00Sen. Schmitt: The second amendment is a fundamental and inalienable right, so it is especially concerning when administrative state agencies like atf in french not only on the second amendment, but the separation of powers, by issuing rules that are illegal and impossible to comply with.
▶ 1:50:16Sen. Schmitt: I understand you want the atf to return to the true law enforcement mission rather than harassing law-abiding gun owners, so I want to ask you today, your commitment to repealing or otherwise fixing this nightmare scenario for gun owners by addressing the frame and receiver rule, the stabilizing grace rule, and the engaged business rule, and any other overreaching administrative rules, in a timely manner.
▶ 1:50:40Mr. Cekada: Thank you again for your question. I can assure you that atf, under my direction, is following president trump's second amendment executive order. We are currently undergoing the third year of all regulations. I can't speak to the specific regulations because of the guidance under apa.
▶ 1:51:03Mr. Cekada: In the future, when the president and the department of justice team say that our work is ready to be put out for a notice of proposed rulemaking, there will be a draft of all the rules for everyone to review. And we fully encourage everyone to please review those, to make sure that atf fully took those concerns.
▶ 1:51:29Sen. Schmitt: If you are reviewing all of the rules, the three I mentioned would be included in that?
▶ 1:51:33Mr. Cekada: Potentially, sir. I cannot.
▶ 1:51:39Sen. Schmitt: Let's lock that in.
▶ 1:51:40Mr. Cekada: I can't do that, sir, but I would be glad to tell you.
▶ 1:51:46Sen. Schmitt: I think the follow up on that particular point will be important. As relates to another issue, atf is the primary regulator of the commercial explosive industry, as you know. It has been more than two decades since the last comprehensive review of atf regulations for commercial explosives occurred. What is your plan to modernize these regulations that are at this point pretty outdated?
▶ 1:52:11Mr. Cekada: Those are part of our review as well, sir. Unfortunately, I can't give you any specificity, and I apologize. I think it would be challenging.
▶ 1:52:22Sen. Schmitt: We have time to follow up. I appreciate it. As for the judges, congratulations. In my time, I referenced my previous life. I found that perhaps the most important character traits in the legal profession these days is common sense and courage.
▶ 1:52:45Sen. Schmitt: You are endeavoring in an effort -- it is a lifetime appointment, which is very important, and for good reason. The tactics of intimidation at this point by the left principally are pretty intense. And so I want to ask -- some of the decisions may not be popular at cocktail parties or in social circles or with the washington press corps or whatever.
▶ 1:53:12Sen. Schmitt: But I think it is really important that judges that understand what the law is and are willing to uphold their convictions with those decisions that they are making that are really important for the future of our country -- I want to ask each of you. Can you give me an instance where you were confronted with a scenario that maybe was not the most popular thing in the world to do, but it was the right thing to do, and that you stuck to your guns even though there was a lot of pressure to do otherwise?
▶ 1:53:43Sen. Schmitt: >> senator, I am happy to start.
▶ 1:53:49Sen. Kennedy: Briefly, sir.
▶ 1:53:49Mr. Davis: Through my role in the texas attorney general's office and serving this body, I worked on many issues that had polarizing effects. People had thought very strongly one way or the other. I would advocate for the position I was supporting. So yes.
▶ 1:54:07Ms. St. John: Senator, in my work on class action fairness, I am often representing class members objecting to settlements where both the defendants and the plaintiffs want to have this settlement approved. So I am often very unpopular walking into the courtroom, and I have no problem standing up for the rule of law, because it is the right thing to do.
▶ 1:54:27Mr. Shepherd: Senator, as a sitting state court judge in a rural part of arkansas, small-town, pretty much any case I preside on, there are people that know people. There is a lot of ethical issues you have got to deal with. And frankly, any decision I make, there is a chance someone is going to be upset with me.
▶ 1:54:53Mr. Shepherd: I believe that my year on the bench that I have made decisions in accordance with the law without fear or favor.
▶ 1:54:59Mr. Wolfe: Senator, I would say that this comes up -- you have defendants before you who are real people. They are facing significant sentences. You also have victims, real people, who want their day in court. You have to listen to the arguments of both sides and be courageous and make the right decision.
▶ 1:55:22Sen. Kennedy: I have got to go vote. Senator schmitt is going to preside. Before I go, I want to do one thing. Is Mr. charles st. John here? Charles, do you have anything you want to add about your mom? [laughter] how about vote for her? Thanks, man. You are a good man, charles. Don't go into politics. Go to med school.
▶ 1:55:54Sen. Kennedy: Senator schmitt in the chair.
▶ 1:56:01Sen. Schmitt: Senator blumenthal.
▶ 1:56:06Sen. Blumenthal: Senator, I would be happy to yield to senator schiff.
▶ 1:56:10Sen. Schmitt: I was doing what I was told. I was told you were up. Senator schiff?
▶ 1:56:15Sen. Schiff: Thank you, senator blumenthal. I appreciate the courtesy. Thank you for taking the time to sit down with me yesterday. I want to follow up on senator booker's question. He mentioned at any time 100 agents could be essentially reassigned to work on immigration cases. That is 100 agents out of how many overall?
▶ 1:56:36Mr. Cekada: Good morning. That is 100 agents out of the total agent cardura, which is about 2400 agents.
▶ 1:56:51Sen. Schiff: You had to do considerable hiring to get up to what you need?
▶ 1:56:55Mr. Cekada: The administration has told us to increase our special agent numbers, actual special agents, up to 3000 agents, incorporating this additional 800 or so agents to get to that number.
▶ 1:57:08Sen. Schiff: What is the need for the additional 800 agents?
▶ 1:57:11Mr. Cekada: Completely to stay focused on violent crime throughout the united states and in our city's most impacted by violent crime.
▶ 1:57:19Sen. Schiff: And the additional increment of 800 agents would enable you to go after more violent crime?
▶ 1:57:23Mr. Cekada: Yes, sir.
▶ 1:57:27Sen. Schiff: Doesn't that indicate that taking 100 agents away from dealing with violent crime to focus on immigration, when you are already short 800 agents, is going to have an impact on the mission?
▶ 1:57:37Mr. Cekada: I think any time we work on the areas that we are responsible for, whether it is tobacco, arson, or explosives, all atf's purview -- title eight was assigned to us as a purview earlier, in 2025.
▶ 1:57:55Mr. Cekada: In support of the administration's mission and our partners at hsi, we have done our best to have that be the least impactful, especially while we stay focused on violent offenders that were illegal aliens -- gang members, as I mentioned to you in our conversation.
▶ 1:58:12Mr. Cekada: Just recently, just this week, we had in title eight operations a person that threatened federal law enforcement with a rifle and put on social media that they were going to empty a clip of 30 rounds into agents standing on the street. Atf agents promptly identified that person and removed that offender from the streets.
▶ 1:58:37Sen. Schiff: I appreciate that but I think it is incontestable that if you need more agents to go after violent criminals that are using guns in the commission of crimes, then diverting some of the agents you already have, 100 agents, to work on immigration enforcement, often generally involving people that have no criminal record apart from being undocumented, is going to dilute your effectiveness.
▶ 1:59:01Sen. Schiff: But let me turn to another topic, and that is we discussed the issue of these 3d printers and the printing of weapons. Are you seeing a trend here? Are we seeing more of these ghost guns show up in crime? Has it plateaued? What is the trend? How concerned are you about it and what do you think we can do about it?
▶ 1:59:24Mr. Cekada: Again, thank you. We are seeing a trend as it relates to ghost guns. That will include, in your definition of guns -- we also look at privately made firearms for 3d printed firearms, and conversion kits to shoot fully automatically. That is a trend we are seeing.
▶ 1:59:50Mr. Cekada: Some of these items are printed here within the united states printers that can be purchased for a few hundred dollars. Others are being brought into the united states from china. Atf is his seeing trends where these products are showing up primarily in jurisdictions that have very strict firearms regulations. In other areas of the country, we don't see much proliferation of these firearms.
▶ 2:00:21Mr. Cekada: Regardless, atf is focused on identifying those sources. I'm sorry to tell you again, but we use all the tools we have to try to identify who is manufacturing these 3d printed firearms. One of the greatest tools we have is our laboratory here in annandale, maryland.
▶ 2:00:38Mr. Cekada: They have the ability to identify the types of polymers that are used and understand where those polymers came from, so we can try to identify where that firearm was made, whether it traveled in interstate commerce. We also use dna to identify dna profiles that were present for the manufacture of that firearm as well.
▶ 2:01:00Sen. Schiff: One last quick question. Are you seeing a trend in what kinds of crimes are being perpetrated with these weapons?
▶ 2:01:05Mr. Cekada: Yes, sir, unfortunately. When prohibited persons find their way into receiving firearms, it is generally a gun crime of some sort, whether it is a shooting or a robbery or other criminal violence.
▶ 2:01:20Sen. Schiff: Thank you. I yelled back.
▶ 2:01:24Sen. Schmitt: Thank you. Senator hawley.
▶ 2:01:26Sen. Hawley: Thank you to the nominees for being here. Congratulations to each of you. Let's start with the second amendment. Missouri, I think we have got to be the strongest protector of the second amendment anywhere in the country. We are a constitutional carry state. We have no state-level permit requirements for concealed care rape.
▶ 2:01:47Sen. Hawley: Our state constitution inscribes the right to keep and bear arms, and designates it unalienable in our state constitution, and subjects any restriction on that right under our state constitution to strict scrutiny. We are very, very serious about it, and the state has repeatedly signaled -- I'm talking about voters who adopted this. This is not just the state legislature. Voters have put this into our state constitution.
▶ 2:02:13Sen. Hawley: We have repeatedly said we do not want the federal government encroaching on our right to keep and bear arms in the state of missouri. The last administration did this repeatedly. Back in 2022, the biden doj asked local sheriffs across missouri for records of concealed carry permits, which state law explicitly forbids sheriffs to turn over. You can imagine the conflict. You have doj saying give us your records, and they are saying state law criminalizes it.
▶ 2:02:41Sen. Hawley: You are asking me to turn over something illegal under state law. The bigger question is why do you need record lists of's -- of concealed permit holders in the state of missouri? Why would the federal government need to have this? They asked for it from multiple counties and pursued a zero-tolerance policy, all things that missourians have viewed as massive overreach.
▶ 2:03:05Sen. Hawley: Can you commit that under your leadership, atf will go in a different direction than the last administration and focus law enforcement resources on criminals as opposed to law-abiding citizens who have rights under both federal and state constitutions? What is your answer?
▶ 2:03:23Mr. Cekada: Thank you for your question. I can assure you with absolute certainty that atf under my watch as deputy director since april of last year has 1000% been focused on holding people accountable who have committed violent crimes. We are not here trying to board and unnecessarily the american citizen, who has a complete right to exercise their second amendment right to bear arms. We will not be doing that in the future if I am confirmed.
▶ 2:03:54Sen. Hawley: You have 20 years of experience at the atf and then a lot of experience in antigang enforcement with nypd. Give us a sense of how you will bring that experience to bear to ensure that the operational resources, should you be confirmed, of the agency will be prioritized toward dismantling violent criminal networks, illegal firearm trafficking networks, and the like. How are you going to ensure that this is the priority, not querying lists of permit holders in my state, for example.
▶ 2:04:25Mr. Cekada: First off, like some prior atf directors, I will still be a sworn law enforcement officer if I am confirmed. I have done this job from the ground level police officer, learning to be an investigator, a task force officers with atf, 34 years of experience. I am not telling people to go out and meet cases. I made the case is myself. I know what it takes. I know we cannot do it alone. We are a small agency.
▶ 2:04:55Mr. Cekada: I worked with practically every atf agent that is out here making cases. We all know each other. Here at atf, we respect federal law enforcement agents that do the job, not talk about doing the job. Those of us that have done the job, we know to stay focused on violent criminals. That is what you pay us for and we will continue to do that.
▶ 2:05:15Sen. Hawley: Put -- terrific. I look forward to working with you. Let's talk about nationwide injunctions. By the way, congratulations to all the judicial nominees. This is going well for you because there is nobody in the room. That is good to know. You are doing great. Let's talk a little bit about what you understand -- understand the scope of your equitable power to be when it comes to granting injunctive relief to nonparties who are in front of you.
▶ 2:05:43Sen. Hawley: This is something we have seen happen repeatedly over the years. We have seen republican appointed judges do it. We have seen democrat appointed judges do it. Give me your understanding of what it is, what kind of equitable injunctive relief you can grant to a nonparty, should you be confirmed. We will start with you, Mr. davis.
▶ 2:06:01Mr. Davis: Thank you. The governing case on this is the supreme court recent case on kasa, which made it clear the district court is limited to providing full relief to the parties before it. There is no ability to provide relief to parties not before the court simply because that is the policy view of the judge. It is to be limited to the parties, for relief.
▶ 2:06:23Ms. St. John: I concur with Mr. davis's response.
▶ 2:06:27Mr. Shepherd: Senator, I concur with my colleagues.
▶ 2:06:32Mr. Wolfe: Senator, under trumpv -- under trump v. Ckasa, judges lack the ability for relief of parties not before them when they are using equitable power.
▶ 2:06:52Sen. Hawley: As a district court judge, it would be your understanding that you are not able to use your equitable powers -- subjunctive relief is inherently equitable. You are not able to use those powers to bind nonparties who are not before you. We all agree on that?
▶ 2:07:05Mr. Davis: Yes.
▶ 2:07:07Ms. St. John: Yes, senator.
▶ 2:07:11Sen. Hawley: I have other questions I will give to you for the record. I just want to say in closing with regard to you in particular, Mr. davis, I'm sorry that senator cruz is not here. You served with senator cruz for a number of years. It is a little like the episode of the simpsons where lisa has a science project and it is great and the judges look at it, and then they go and meet homer and they come back to lisa and say, having met your father, we are awarding you bonus points.
▶ 2:07:38Sen. Hawley: Having served with your former boss, I am awarding you bonus points. You are all going to be tremendous. Congratulations. >> senator blumenthal.
▶ 2:07:49Sen. Blumenthal: Thank you, madam chair. Senator schmitt asked you about moments of your career where courage was demanded. And so I'm going to post to you some questions that may evoke that kind of moment. Let me ask each of you, beginning with Mr. davis -- who won the popular vote in 2020?
▶ 2:08:11Mr. Davis: In 2020, president biden was certified and served four years as president.
▶ 2:08:19Sen. Blumenthal: Who won the popular vote?
▶ 2:08:20Mr. Davis: The same answer. President biden was certified.
▶ 2:08:24Ms. St. John: Joe biden was certified the winner of the 2020 election and served four years.
▶ 2:08:29Mr. Shepherd: President biden was certified the winner and served four years.
▶ 2:08:35Mr. Wolfe: Same answer, senator.
▶ 2:08:39Sen. Blumenthal: Same answer once again, refusing to acknowledge who won the popular vote. I am insulted as a member of this body that you simply won't tell us the truth. And that speaks chillingly of what you will do as a united states district judge if you are confirmed. Let me ask each of you.
▶ 2:09:07Sen. Blumenthal: Who won the electoral college in the 2020 election?
▶ 2:09:11Mr. Davis: Senator, in 2020, president biden was certified and served four years as president.
▶ 2:09:18Ms. St. John: Same answer, senator.
▶ 2:09:21Mr. Shepherd: Senator, same answer.
▶ 2:09:24Mr. Wolfe: Same answer, senator.
▶ 2:09:28Sen. Blumenthal: Don't you feel kind of like monkeys or puppets here, having to give that answer, given by your minders, without standing up and speaking out to what the truth is? Let me ask you this question. Mr. davis, was the united states l attacked on january 6, 2021?
▶ 2:09:54Mr. Davis: Senator, any characterization of the events that occurred on january 6 would wade into political waters. As a sitting nominee for a federal judicial position, it would be inappropriate under the standards of judicial conduct for me to discuss anything that would characterize --
▶ 2:10:15Sen. Blumenthal: Have you seen video footage of the attack?
▶ 2:10:16Mr. Davis: Yes, senator.
▶ 2:10:20Sen. Blumenthal: What did you see in those videos?
▶ 2:10:21Mr. Davis: Describing that in ways -- I think the video speaks for itself and people can draw their own inferences. Anything more than that would be getting into characterizing.
▶ 2:10:33Sen. Blumenthal: You are not going to be sitting on a case involving the january 6 attack on the united states capitol. To tell us you won't answer this question is an insult to our intelligence. Ms. st. John? Was the united states capital attacked on january 6, 2021?
▶ 2:10:55Ms. St. John: Senator, as Mr. davis stated, I believe it would be inappropriate as a judicial nominee to weigh in on political controversies.
▶ 2:11:06Sen. Blumenthal: I'm not asking you to weigh in. I'm asking you to answer a question.
▶ 2:11:09Ms. St. John: It would be inappropriate for me to do so.
▶ 2:11:14Sen. Blumenthal: Which rule of the code of conduct?
▶ 2:11:17Ms. St. John: Canon five.
▶ 2:11:22Senator Blumenthal: Canon five bars you from answering a simple factual question? Have you seen a video of that attack?
▶ 2:11:28Ms. St. John: I have, sir.
▶ 2:11:31Sen. Blumenthal: And what did you see in the video?
▶ 2:11:33Ms. St. John: Multiple judicial nominees responded to this question.
▶ 2:11:39Sen. Blumenthal: If you are honest with this committee, what you saw is a bunch of insurrectionists attacking the capital, with all manner of weapons. Some of them lethal. Judge shepard, was the united states capital attacked on january 6, 2021?
▶ 2:11:59Mr. Shepherd: As a sitting judge and nominee, I would echo the comments of my colleagues.
▶ 2:12:06Sen. Blumenthal: A sitting state court judge. Do you have a case before you dealing with january 6?
▶ 2:12:10Mr. Shepherd: I do not, senator.
▶ 2:12:14Sen. Blumenthal: Was the united states capital attacked on january 6, 2021?
▶ 2:12:17Mr. Wolfe: I would give the same answer as my colleagues.
▶ 2:12:22Sen. Blumenthal: Same answer. You have all been carefully rehearsed. You are going to be on the bench, if you are confirmed, carefully rehearsed for what you will say about the constitution and the statutes. Without the kind of courage that you should be expected to show in that position.
▶ 2:12:47Sen. Blumenthal: A position of trust more serious than any other in our government, with a lifetime appointment. I think you failed the test. Thank you, madam chair. >> thank you all for being here, and congratulations to each of you on your nomination. How do you say it? Cicada, did I get that right?
▶ 2:13:19Sen. Blumenthal: Did iced -- I would like to start with you. Americans have been concerned with the atf history as relates to the second amendment, but based on your testimony today and your track record at the atf, I have full confidence that under your leadership the atf will not make the same mistakes we have seen them make in the past, particularly in the biden administration. With that being said, I want to ask about different areas in atf's jurisdiction.
▶ 2:13:47Sen. Blumenthal: I would like you to speak to some of atf's work on combating the constant flow of illicit chinese vapes that have been coming into our nation and truly putting our children at risk. I know atf was involved in a recent seizure of more than about -- I think 2 million illegal vapes, and baking products. I want to commend you on that great success. But can you speak to some of the work you have done to prevent those chinese vapes from harming american children?
▶ 2:14:20Sen. Blumenthal: How can you commit to moving that forward?
▶ 2:14:22Mr. Cekada: If confirmed, atf will continue to work with federal partners of the food and drug administration, customs and border protection, dea, the postal service. We will work tirelessly together to identify these importers that are undoubtedly coming from china, but very closely affiliated with the cartels in mexico, and the cartels are very much tied to the distributors that we find spread around the
▶ 2:14:53Mr. Cekada: Country that are selling these illicit vapes to our minors, to our children in school districts, and frankly, they have strategically place themselves around our military bases and are targeting our service members. These are chemicals that are unregulated, that are undoubtedly causing harm to our children and our youth. The same threat is being posed against our younger service members. We will continue doing that.
▶ 2:15:23Mr. Cekada: We have resources we are trying to balance across the country. In many of these cases, violent crime is tied to them. There are illegal firearms found that these distributors are retailers. There are gang members and illegal aliens involved in this distribution as well. We will stay focused on this as well if I am confirmed.
▶ 2:15:42Sen. Britt: I would like to work with you on that when you are confirmed. I think this is an area where we are just scratching the surface. You alluded to it in your answer. We know that not only is it harming children, not only are we looking at what is happening in our military bases, but often this unlocks a world of crime that unfortunately puts americans at risk. I think we need to do more to crack down on this. So I appreciate that. Additionally, I want to discuss some of the great work that the atf does in huntsville, alabama.
▶ 2:16:15Sen. Britt: As you know, atf's national center for explosive training and research is located in huntsville and is a national hub for life-saving explosives training. Can you highlight some of the important work the atf is doing at redstone arsenal in huntsville?
▶ 2:16:28Mr. Cekada: Sure, ma'am. It works primarily to ensure that our state and local law enforcement officers are prepared to handle some of the biggest threats that our country faces as relates to explosives. In particular, improvised explosive device's that are made from household chemicals and chemicals that are found at home depot and lowe's.
▶ 2:16:54Mr. Cekada: These are recipes, frankly, that have been compiled from international terrorist organizations, and have spread amongst the internet through social media outlets, and pose a definite threat to our country. We work very closely with the army, and have developed a program called the ravens challenge.
▶ 2:17:18Mr. Cekada: Ravens challenge is something that atf distributes on behalf of the army, with our partners with the fbi working alongside with us, to ensure that our state and local partners are trained on handling a mass casualty event that would be tied to homemade or improvised explosives incidents. It ensures that we all know how to work together, responding and working in our areas of expertise without unnecessarily hindering the other from being able to accomplish the mission.
▶ 2:17:50Sen. Britt: Thank you. I look forward to continuing the great work that is done there and partnering with you once confirmed to continue to elevate it. Last question for all of you, and I'm sure you are glad that all of my questions went to him. I will start with you, judge wolfe, and we will go down the line. Obviously, I believe that judges should apply the law faithfully, not legislate from the bench.
▶ 2:18:15Sen. Britt: I think as a district court judge, you must also abide by the precedent established by the supreme court. From time, you are going to face legal questions that may not have been addressed or fully addressed by the upper chamber.
▶ 2:18:30Sen. Britt: My question for you is, with that being the case, can you discuss, and we will go down the line, your general philosophy, and how you will approach those novel questions of law that come before you?
▶ 2:18:51Mr. Wolfe: I would say I am a textual list, and originalist. Textualism, you try to discern what exactly does the text say. Originalism is simply saying that the constitution and laws before us have to be interpreted by their original public meaning, in accord with what would have been understood at the time of their enactment.
▶ 2:19:14Mr. Wolfe: Another way to say that would be that the meaning remains unchanged, and until properly ratified or amended.
▶ 2:19:27Mr. Shepherd: I would echo many of the comments of judge wolfe. I would say if there is no binding precedent and it is a question of statutory law, I would look at the plain reading of the text. If there is no ambiguity, that should answer the question. If there is ambiguity, certainly considering the original public meaning, as judge wolfe mentioned, would be where I would look to inform that decision.
▶ 2:19:59Ms. St. John: I don't have much to add to my co-nominees descriptions. These are also what I would apply in that situation.
▶ 2:20:08Mr. Davis: I agree with my friends.
▶ 2:20:12Sen. Britt: On that note, I want to say thank you to all the nominees for your testimony today. Written questions for the record may be submitted up until february 11 at 5:00 p.m., and with that, this hearing is adjourned.