▶ 0:18:33Chair Tuberville: Might as well turn that on. Willingness to appear before the committee and discussed the priorities, challenges, and ongoing initiatives. I also want to welcome a shift back to ward fighting readiness standards and lethality across the force. Our military exists to deter conflict.
▶ 0:18:58Chair Tuberville: Strong leadership, discipline, and mission focus managed -- matter to the readiness of the joint force. I appreciate your leadership to reintroduce and reinforce those priorities. Personnel readiness issues -- significant changes in the senior leadership.
▶ 0:19:19Chair Tuberville: While recruiting has improved significantly over the last two years and retention remain strong across much of the force, we cannot afford to become complacent. We continue to face long-term demographic challenges, increasing competition from the private sector, and a shrinking pool of americans eligible for military service.
▶ 0:19:39Chair Tuberville: The strength of our military defense not only on the weapon systems we build or the operations we conduct, but on our ability to care for the men and women who serve this nation and the families who stand beside them. This subcommittee has spent years working on issues like military can't -- compensation, childcare, spouse employment, and professional development. Taking care of service members and their families directly impacts readiness and retention.
▶ 0:20:09Chair Tuberville: As the department continues to make significant investments across the defense enterprise, it is crucial that resources remain focused on quickly of life, health care, and personal readiness issues that most directly affect military families and overall force readiness.
▶ 0:20:28Chair Tuberville: Today, the military health system faces significant funding and readiness challenges that threaten access to care, strain military treatment facilities, and jeopardize the retention of highly skilled medical professionals.
▶ 0:20:41Chair Tuberville: At a time of increasing global threats and growing demands on our force, we cannot afford to underinvest in the health care infrastructure that underpins military readiness, ensuring stable and sufficient funding for the military health system is not simply a health care issue. It is a national security imperative.
▶ 0:21:05Chair Tuberville: Today's hearing also provides an important opportunity for the committee to hear directly from the department of civilian leadership on the policies and decisions shaping the force. Too often, military leaders appearing before congress are asked to explain policy decisions that ultimately originate elsewhere within the department. This hearing gives us the opportunity to discuss decisions directly with the officials responsible for developing and implementing.
▶ 0:21:33Chair Tuberville: I appreciate all of you being here today. I look forward to your testimony.
▶ 0:21:41Sen. Warren: Thank you to our witnesses for being with us today. Our annual posture hearing presents an opportunity for the department to discuss personnel priorities for the coming year. It is also an opportunity for this subcommittee to continue to focus specifically on the challenges that service members and their families are facing. That is our job.
▶ 0:22:06Sen. Warren: Since this subcommittee's hearing last april, secretary hegseth and president trump have asked our troops to risk their lives in an illegal war with iran at the same moment that the administration's actions make life harder for servicemembers and their families. President trump and secretary hegseth have badly mismanaged america's military budget.
▶ 0:22:33Sen. Warren: The army reportedly needs to make up for a shortfall of 4 billion to $6 billion. To fill that gap, the army is reportedly looking to slash training costs across the force, including by putting pilots at flight hours which could have serious safety consequences. We should ask ourselves, why is there such a huge gap?
▶ 0:23:00Sen. Warren: The answer is that the president's decisions to drag the military into a war with iran and at the same time to use the military to do dhs's job at the southern border. The gap is getting wider because the army still has not been reimbursed by the department of homeland security for its past support in border operations.
▶ 0:23:25Sen. Warren: Secretary hegseth has also continued to send chilling messages of who is and who is not welcome in america's military. So far, despite repeated questions from congress, there have been no explanations for multiple abrupt removals of top military officers.
▶ 0:23:49Sen. Warren: The secretary also reportedly blocked the promotion of four army officers to become one star generals, two of whom are black and two of whom were women. Secretary hegseth is also requiring a review of "effectiveness of having women in ground combat roles," despite senior enlisted leaders testifying before this subcommittee in february of this year that women in combat arms
▶ 0:24:22Sen. Warren: Units do not lower standards. And attacks on university partnerships will limit opportunities for troops to develop leadership skills, and risk gains in both recruitment and retention. Secretary hegseth has also continued to undermine military -- the military justice system.
▶ 0:24:46Sen. Warren: He fired the top military lawyers shortly after he was confirmed, to avoid "roadblocks" to president trump. Those roadblocks are known as the law. The secretary has sent a judge advocate general off to work as immigration judges or federal prosecutors in minneapolis and other cities.
▶ 0:25:11Sen. Warren: He said the iran war would have "no stupid rules of engagement." he also launched a "ruthless" review of the rules of jags that may simply be one new way to reduce accountability for illegal policies. The administration also continues to treat dod's civilian workforce with contempt.
▶ 0:25:42Sen. Warren: It is shameful that for the second year in a row, dod's budget request fails to include a dollar of pay raises for civilian employees. That is shameful. With trump policies driving up costs for all americans, this is a significant pay cut for dod civilians who play critical roles in our military. Critical roles.
▶ 0:26:10Sen. Warren: Service members and families, contracting and acquisition for weapons systems, engineering, holding together our health system, and much, much more. Secretary hegseth is taking other steps that endanger the health of our troops.
▶ 0:26:34Sen. Warren: Last month, he announced dod would end the mandatory flu vaccine, which has been in place since 1945. Keep in mind the flu vaccine was made mandatory after 24% of the U.S. army and navy -- navy personnel fell ill during world war I, resulting in more than 26,000 deaths and significant degradation in military readiness.
▶ 0:27:01Sen. Warren: Mandatory vaccines in the military date all the way back to when general george washington mandated that troops be vaccinated against smallpox back in 1777. Secretary hegseth is playing politics with the health and the readiness of our military, and that is wrong. There is much talk about, but I want to focus on two topics.
▶ 0:27:33Sen. Warren: First, we need to ensure that the contractors entrusted to administer tricare benefits are keeping our service members and their families healthy, not just using taxpayer dollars to boost their own bottom lines. Express scripts, the largest arms benefit manager in the united states, has held the tricare pharmacy contract for 20 years now.
▶ 0:28:00Sen. Warren: And over that time, express scripts has grossed -- has pushed thousands of pharmacies out of the tricare network, which makes it harder for service members to fill prescriptions, but likely boosts the orders and the profits for express scripts mail order pharmacy. For years, I have been calling for transparency into the tricare pharmacy contract.
▶ 0:28:29Sen. Warren: But dod has carefully protected the interests of express scripts at every single step. It is time for tricare to put the interests of our service members first. They should do it on their own. But if they don't, congress should force them to do so. Second, we need to have protections in place for service members to report serious concerns to protected channels without fear of reprisal.
▶ 0:29:00Sen. Warren: Military families have long dealt with terrible living conditions in housing that is owned by private military contractors. But those private companies have muzzled families by forcing them to sign nondisclosure agreements to get compensation for the damages that they suffer.
▶ 0:29:21Sen. Warren: I appreciate that one of the department's legislative proposals for this year's ndaa would be to make clear that tenants are protected from reprisals for reporting dangerous and disgusting housing conditions to an inspector general, to congress, or to the department of defense. But we should not stop there.
▶ 0:29:44Sen. Warren: We must make clear to service members, including in other contexts where they are forced to sign nda's, that they still have the right to report serious violations of the law, to report gross wastes of money, abuse, serious threats to public safety, and to do it all through protected channels.
▶ 0:30:08Sen. Warren: We also need to make sure that we are protecting service members who come forward to report serious concerns to troop safety and health, such as unsafe weapons or aircraft systems, so they can report to congress, to dod, and to the ig. The safety of our troops and the efficient operation of dod should be at the top of our list.
▶ 0:30:35Sen. Warren: That means protecting people who have the courage to call out problems and make us aware of them. I look forward to discussing this with all of you. Thank you, Mr. chairman.
▶ 0:30:47Chair Tuberville: We will turn to our opening statements. The honorable anthony tata, under secretary of defense for personnel and readiness.
▶ 0:30:57Mr. Tata: Good afternoon, chairman, ranking member, members of the personnel subcommittee. Thank you and your staff for the opportunity to testify today and for your shared resolve to care for our service members, their families, and the veterans, and to ensure that our military remains ready, lethal, and unmatched.
▶ 0:31:23Mr. Tata: When patriotic young americans answer the call to defend our nation, we have to look after them and the families who serve and sacrifice alongside them. His includes our fallen heroes and their loved ones. They will never be forgotten. President trump and secretary hegseth have prioritize the well-being and preparedness of our warriors from day one.
▶ 0:31:46Mr. Tata: Since last july, my team and I have focused on optimizing personnel and readiness with their guidance. We have taken swift action to deliver tangible outcomes that directly improve the lives of the people we serve. For example, we have enabled historic recruiting successes with strong retention rates through innovative initiatives.
▶ 0:32:09Mr. Tata: We have expanded our partnership with the department of veterans affairs, striving to expedite the transfer of electronic health records, created and an aviation mishap task force to address concerning trends in aviation, and more recently authorize the evacuation of military civilian families in bahrain, helping coordinate continuing access to education.
▶ 0:32:36Mr. Tata: Indeed, a service member who knows their family is well cared for is one who is focused on their mission. With this as a governing principle, we will continue to ensure that our warriors and their families have access to high-quality health care, sound education for their children, food security, and meaningful employment opportunities.
▶ 0:32:56Mr. Tata: Meanwhile, we are working to reassure the pharmaceutical supply chain for military ascension -- essential medications, better serve our students, revitalize professional military education, modernize the defense commissary , and establish project patriot pipeline to develop mission-critical skills for the department and the defense industrial base.
▶ 0:33:24Mr. Tata: The president's historic 1.5 trillion dollar budget enables further investments in these activities, allowing us to build on hard earned gains that will benefit our military community and our mission for years to come. Under the leadership of president trump and secretary hegseth, the department has made strong progress. With your support, we will keep advancing the policies and programs and enable our people to thrive in the force to remain ready. Thank you again for the opportunity to testify today.
▶ 0:33:55Mr. Tata: I look forward to answering your questions.
▶ 0:33:56Chair Tuberville: Next, the honorable tim diehl, assistant secretary of defense for manpower and reserve affairs.
▶ 0:34:07Mr. Dill: Distinguished members, thank you for the opportunity to speak about the heartbeat of the department of war. Our men and women in uniform, our civilian workforce, and their families. My team is guided by president trump's directive to achieve peace through strength and secretary hegseth's pillars, restoring the warrior ethos and reestablishing deterrence. I am grateful for the secretary and undersecretary's leadership.
▶ 0:34:37Mr. Dill: As a former green beret, I constantly remember the first -- humans are more important than hardware. The department must attract, deploy, and retain the finest talent by offering a meaningful mission, setting high, uncompromising standards, and taking care of our people. We are succeeding on that front. Military recruiting efforts broke records, with active-duty services leading recruiting and retention goals.
▶ 0:35:05Mr. Dill: That momentum continues in fiscal year 2026. We can never fully compensate our service members for their sacrifices. We must ensure they are financially secure. Total military compensation package was strongly competitive with the civilian labor market, and the department recently processed more than 90,000 cash awards.
▶ 0:35:27Mr. Dill: We are expanding spouse education and career development opportunities and removing unnecessary regulations to reduce military spouse unemployment, increasing childcare opportunities, and focusing on academic excellence and transparency. I have witnessed firsthand the bravery, sacrifice, and resilience of our men and women in uniform, our civilian personnel, and their families. I am privileged to serve them. They are the reason the american military is the most lethal fighting force in history.
▶ 0:35:58Mr. Dill: May god bless our troops and I look forward to your questions.
▶ 0:36:00Chair Tuberville: Thank you very much. Next, we have the honorable keith bass, a secret -- assistant secretary of defense for health affairs.
▶ 0:36:10Mr. Bass: Thank you for this opportunity to represent the 130,000 men and women of the military health system. The president's fiscal year budget is a direct investment in our most vital military asset -- our people. This budget equips the department to counter evolving threats, and most importantly, to safeguard the health and well-being of our service members. A medically ready force is a lethal force.
▶ 0:36:40Mr. Bass: To that end, our primary focus is insuring our personnel are strategically positioned to enhance force readiness and maintain the critical skills required for combat and casualty care. To further this objective, we are strengthening our strategic partnership with the department of veterans affairs. These collaborations are vital.
▶ 0:36:59Mr. Bass: They enable the delivery of joint health care services, optimizing use of taxpayer resources, and enhance the pace of access across both systems, ensuring seamless continuous care for our nation's heroes. The proposed budget funds combat requirements including joint trauma care and medical logistics. These investments allow for rapid deployment of lifesaving technologies to support our medical personnel in the most austere and remote locations.
▶ 0:37:29Mr. Bass: With continued and invaluable support of congress, we are making significant investments in military medical research and development. These efforts directly address the unique threats are war fighters face, with particular focus on advanced brain health and expanding access to mental health care services. Finally, we are taking decisive action to remedy the tricare transition issues.
▶ 0:37:52Mr. Bass: Our leadership team is aggressively focused on enhance contract oversight, process improvement, and accountability at all levels to ensure no member of our community faces unnecessary delays in receiving care. We are redoubling our efforts to ensure the fisheries are aware of resolution channels, including patient advocates to address any issues with billing and access to quality care.
▶ 0:38:18Mr. Bass: Our war fighters and their families deserve a healthy system they can depend on without reservation. I am grateful for the partnership and support of this committee, provided to the department in the military health system. Thank you and I look forward to your questions.
▶ 0:38:33Chair Tuberville: The next is the honorable marise todd, assistant secretary of defense for readiness.
▶ 0:38:47Mr. Todd: Thank you for the opportunity to testify. As we navigate a landscape defined by persistent competition and accelerating technological change, the department -- the partnership between the department and this committee has never been more vital to our national defense. We have a joint force that is agile and superior, ensuring our war fighters can deploy, fight, and win in any conflict.
▶ 0:39:14Mr. Todd: My office is committed to translating that imperative to reality. Over the past year, our direct partnership with this committee has yielded significant tangible wins for our readiness. By executing our strategic priorities and applying resources precisely to generate the greatest operational impact, we are maintaining a dominant proof -- dominant posture across the globe. The deliberate allocation of our forces does more than maximize our combat credibility and readiness.
▶ 0:39:44Mr. Todd: It takes care of our war fighters. We are seeing the results of this unified effort. In aviation and operational safety, we are aggressively protecting our recruits. To the aviation mishap task force, we are examining mishaps to identify critical safety issues and solutions to build aviation safety throughout the force.
▶ 0:40:07Mr. Todd: We have also refocused military education and training standards to restore the warrior ethos and the technical readiness of the entire force, recognizing our advantage to insulate the resilience of our war fighters. We are focused on mission relevant curricula and ensuring our war fighters have the dedicated time to master the skills required to out fight any adversary.
▶ 0:40:32Mr. Todd: And human performance and brain health -- brain health, we are aggressively mitigating risks. We have established cognitive baselines at all training sites and are modernizing how we attract lifetime exposures. Thanks to your partnership, we are developing blast-specific safety standards and providing -- and safety officials across the force. We are meeting systemic risks had on to protect our most valuable asset -- our people.
▶ 0:41:04Mr. Todd: This should focus guarantees that are force is ready to deter aggression and operate decisively with any threat to american interests. I am deeply committed to this mission and to our continued partnership to ensure the readiness of our war fighters. Thank you for your continued partnership. I look forward to your questions.
▶ 0:41:23Chair Tuberville: Thank you very much. To start, we will go through a round of questioning. Mr. tatum, -- Mr. tata, we heard about a project called patriot pipeline. Can you explain what that is?
▶ 0:41:40Mr. Tata: Thank you, Mr. chairman. Thank you for your commitment to our men and women in uniform. Project patriot pipeline is a direct result of the secretary's focus on the arsenal.
▶ 0:41:58Mr. Tata: As he has traveled around the country to bolster our defense industrial base, we and the -- in the personnel and readiness domain asked ourselves the questions, how are we going to resource this with the talent necessary to expand the arsenal of freedom and complete the mission, and indeed to align presidential priorities and personnel policy.
▶ 0:42:26Mr. Tata: What we have done is we have taken a look at several different work streams. You have active national guard reserve. You have spouses. You have civilian workforce that we are charged with managing. Within each one, we want to encourage reenlistment, and we want to encourage reenlistment into those high demand, low density military occupation skills, such as cyber, aviation maintainer.
▶ 0:42:57Mr. Tata: And we are aligning bonuses with the services to ensure that we are encouraging folks to reenlist within those key high demand, low density mos's.
▶ 0:43:13Mr. Tata: If they choose to leave service, we want to capture that training and investment we made in their training, so that we are able to keep that half million or million dollars that we put into that individual, and if they are out in aviation maintainer in the military, we want them to be a depot aviation maintainer.
▶ 0:43:35Mr. Tata: So we are tweaking skill bridge time to be able to incentivize folks that want to migrate into the defense industrial base, to try to incentivize them into those key skill sets. We have a real issue with our aviation depot maintainers. We are going to drop off the cliff pretty soon and demand is going to go way up, dependent upon the platform we are talking about.
▶ 0:44:01Mr. Tata: We are trying to get ahead of that by incentivizing people, if they are going to leave, to stay within the defense industrial base. And include health care and education in the defense industrial base as well. We are incentivizing people, through tuition assistance, through extra time. Military spouses -- we have a huge military spouse appointment effort going on. We are rebranding it.
▶ 0:44:29Mr. Tata: We have the skill bridge like program that they can do the internships and then begin to work. We have money. We can pay for scholarships. We are going to increase that to incentivize them to go into the defense industrial base -- whether that is health care aviation maintainer, welder, shipbuilder. All of that. Our spouses deserve these opportunities.
▶ 0:44:57Mr. Tata: We allow for direct hiring authority in many of these areas to help with the patriot pipeline, as we call it. Third, the civilian workforce. We want them to reenlist, so to speak, and react within the civilian domain, to go into things such as the golden dome, cyber, and these critical high demand, low density areas, where we need real talent. It is a holistic approach from when someone comes in.
▶ 0:45:27Mr. Tata: We are trying to incentivize them through bonuses into these critical high demand, low density areas. We are trying to keep them in, which we are doing. Recruiting and retention are going very well right now. To the very end, when they choose to get out, if it is three years or 40 years, we have invested a lot of money in that professional military education. We want them to stay.
▶ 0:45:50Mr. Tata: Or a spouse, we want that person to be able to work in the defense industrial base and make our country stronger, make that arsenal stronger. Likewise with our civilian workforce. That is it, in a nutshell. We are trying to complement the secretary's efforts and under secretary duffy's efforts in the arsenal of freedom, undergirded with the talent necessary to run the arsenal of freedom.
▶ 0:46:19Sen. Warren: The tri-care pharmacy benefit helps 9 million service members, veterans, and their families access prescription drugs. Tri-care's pharmacy contractor, express scripts, decides which pharmacies are included in the tri-care network, and decides what they will get paid.
▶ 0:46:46Sen. Warren: And of course, express scripts is supposed to work for the dod and for military families. That is what taxpayers pay express scripts to do. Except express scripts also runs its own pharmacy that participates in the tri-care network, a competitor to every other pharmacy.
▶ 0:47:09Sen. Warren: And that means that express scripts both provides pharmacy services to tri-care members directly and assess the reimbursement rates for its self and all of its competitors. The fact is, express scripts has an incentive to under reimburse all the competing pharmacies and inflate its own payments. So how is that deal working out for the taxpayers?
▶ 0:47:39Sen. Warren: Express scripts reportedly charged dod 480 four dollars more, on average, for generic drugs dispensed by the express scripts' own pharmacy. Meanwhile, express scripts has offered unaffiliated pharmacies such terrible terms that since 2022, nearly 13,000 retail pharmacies have just left the tri-care network.
▶ 0:48:10Sen. Warren: They have just said we cannot be part of this. Assistant secretary bass, you lead the defense health agency which oversees this contract that I am talking about. Are you concerned that express scripts appears to be steering service members to the pharmacies that it owns and overcharging american taxpayers?
▶ 0:48:34Mr. Bass: Thank you, ranking member warren. I appreciate your support and I understand that this is an important issue. The department continues to look at this and review. As you are aware, this pbm, the tri-care pbm, is different than a normal pbm. It provides administrative services only. It is a contract management mechanism for the department.
▶ 0:49:00Mr. Bass: It does claims, mail order pharmacy, and prescriptions. The department of war controls the pricing. We understand the concerns and we welcome the opportunity to work with you and your staff.
▶ 0:49:12Sen. Warren: I'm sorry, could I get an answer to my question? I am concerned that with the pharmacy benefit manager here that competes with a bunch of america' is pharmacies -- it is the one that is doing the pricing and it is the one deciding who the competition will be. That seems to me a perfect way to be able to advantage yourself , disadvantage everyone else. I'm not just making that up. I've got two pieces of evidence.
▶ 0:49:42Sen. Warren: $484 more per average that we are paying on these generic drugs, and 13,000 pharmacies across this country that have just said you won't pay me enough so I have got to leave the entire system, which cuts down on service for our military members. Are you telling me you are thinking about it? You have had 20 years to think about this.
▶ 0:50:05Mr. Bass: The department continues to evaluate this budget. It reviews and works with the contractor to ensure that it is within the guidelines of the contract.
▶ 0:50:20Sen. Warren: You are working with the contractor? How do you explain $484 on average more for prescription -- for generic drugs?
▶ 0:50:28Mr. Bass: Senator, I'm not aware of the cost discrepancy.
▶ 0:50:33Sen. Warren: Then how do you explain 13,000 pharmacies leaving the whole system, saying you won't even pay me enough to make it worthwhile?
▶ 0:50:41Mr. Bass: The contractor is meeting its contractual requirements.
▶ 0:50:48Sen. Warren: What are you saying about 13,000 pharmacies leaving the whole system, and they cannot fill prescriptions for our military and for our veterans. You are ok with that?
▶ 0:51:04Mr. Bass: Our priority is to make sure they get the benefits they deserve.
▶ 0:51:08Sen. Warren: I think they deserve more than you are delivering for them and I want to know when you are going to get better at this. What we are talking about here is a blatant conflict of interest. Our job in this senate subcommittee is oversight.
▶ 0:51:22Sen. Warren: That is why for years now I have been calling for more transparency to ensure that express scripts is not favoring its self and its own subsidiaries and under reimbursing independent pharmacies, in the hopes that it can drive them out of the tri-care business altogether and just have more of the business for themselves. I have been met with obstruction every step of the way from our own department of defense.
▶ 0:51:53Sen. Warren: Let me ask you another question, secretary bass. Will you disclose the differences between the care reimbursement rates and fees and other price concessions between what it is paying pharmacies and what it is paying itself?
▶ 0:52:10Mr. Bass: I commit to working with you and your staff in providing the data.
▶ 0:52:17Sen. Warren: Give me that data. I'm going to hold you to that. Express scripts' pattern of bad behavior speaks for itself. In addition to the news reports I have already mentioned, and audit by the office of inspector general for the office of personnel management found that express scripts overcharged american postal workers union and federal employees health benefits program by about $45
▶ 0:52:49Sen. Warren: Million. In the government accountability office found persistent inconsistencies in the data that express scripts provided to dod, which dod is supposed to be validating on its own but failed to catch.
▶ 0:53:04Sen. Warren: So, secretary bass, given the long history of infractions by express scripts that I just read to you, will you commit to annual audits of the tri-care pharmacy contract to ensure that taxpayer dollars are not being wasted?
▶ 0:53:24Mr. Bass: Yes. I commit to doing an annual review of the contract.
▶ 0:53:30Sen. Warren: And will you let us see those annual audits?
▶ 0:53:34Mr. Bass: I commit to working with you.
▶ 0:53:36Sen. Warren: I don't want to hear about them. I want to see the audits. Do I have your commitment?
▶ 0:53:42Mr. Bass: I will work with you and your staff.
▶ 0:53:45Sen. Warren: Will I see them?
▶ 0:53:48Mr. Bass: Yes. Simple warrant that was not so bad. -- Sen. warren: that was not so bad. The current contract with express scripts expires in 2029. The dod right now is in the acquisition planning phase for the next generation contract.
▶ 0:54:07Mr. Bass: As it builds the requirements for this new contract, dod cannot continue to ignore this conflict of interest that arises when a company owns both a pbm and a pharmacy. That has got to stop. In the meantime, existing contracts should be regularly audited and subjected to much higher transparency to try to beat this kind of conflict out of the system.
▶ 0:54:37Mr. Bass: I look forward to working with dod on this and serving the best interests of the 9 million american service members, veterans, and their families. Thank you. I appreciate it. Thank you, Mr. chairman. Thank you for the extra time.
▶ 0:54:53Chair Tuberville: Thank you, senator moran.
▶ 0:54:57Sen. Hirono: Secretary tata, the trumpet regime has repeatedly attempted to reshape our federal vaccine policies, in direct conflict with science and public health experts. Now, it seems those misguided policies are seeping into the military.
▶ 0:55:21Sen. Hirono: Secretary hegseth waved to the covid-19 vaccine requirements, he overturned the annual flu vaccine mandate which has been dod policies since the early 1950's, over 17 years. Of course, there is a reason for the flu vaccine requirement.
▶ 0:55:43Sen. Hirono: Military personnel frequently live and work in close quarters, particularly on ships, making them highly susceptible to rapid disease transmission. Do you know who funded the invention of the first flu vaccine?
▶ 0:55:58Mr. Tata: Senator, thank you for the question. Thank you for the concern for our soldiers. I believe world war I was when the U.S. army created the flu vaccine.
▶ 0:56:12Sen. Hirono: So the U.S. army in the 1930's and 1940's. Do you know why the army did this?
▶ 0:56:18Mr. Tata: Because they wanted to stop the spread of infectious disease.
▶ 0:56:25Sen. Hirono: Does that concern not still exist? What is going to happen when getting the flu vaccine becomes optional? What new peer-reviewed literature did the department rely on to support overturning the flu vaccine requirement?
▶ 0:56:44Sen. Hirono: And how many service members of the 1.8 million, 2.8 million active-duty, almost a million reserves, civilians within dod -- what new study led to this change in the vaccine and flu vaccine requirement? How many service members do you expect will now not get the flu vaccine as a result of this?
▶ 0:57:13Mr. Tata: Senator, thank you for the opportunity to comment on this. Under the secretary's guidance, we went to the services. We asked the service is to come back to us with a list of exceptions to the policy that they wished us to pursue. We are collecting those exceptions right now. As you might expect, the services have come back with a robust set of exceptions that we are still in the draft stage.
▶ 0:57:45Mr. Tata: We are talking about submarines, talking about ships, talking about basic training.
▶ 0:57:52Sen. Hirono: So these exceptions are the services saying they want to continue to recoup their people getting the flu vaccine? Is that the exceptions you are talking about?
▶ 0:58:01Mr. Tata: They have come back asking for these exceptions to the policy. We will then take that to the secretary for his final approval.
▶ 0:58:12Sen. Hirono: I'm going to have to ask you again. The exceptions are -- this is an optional vaccine. So the services are submitting exceptions that they want their submariners, for example, to have to get the flu vaccine? Are those the exceptions that are being gathered now?
▶ 0:58:36Mr. Tata: I can't list them all right now, but the exceptions are to be able to vaccinate for flu prior to deployment on a ship, for example. But there are several other exceptions that are being requested.
▶ 0:58:54Sen. Hirono: I understand. I want to make sure there are some services who have decided that this optional policy is going to probably affect readiness. You cannot have a flu outbreak -- outbreak on the submarine, for example. I think that is warranted. But you did not mention peer-reviewed literature that led to senator hegseth making this policy change. To begin with. Are you aware of any peer-reviewed studies that led to this change?
▶ 0:59:24Mr. Tata: Senator, what I am aware of is the troop morale and significant backlash from the imposition from the biden era on the covid vaccine and the mandatory covid vaccine, and the expulsion of lots of talent for refusing to take that vaccine, that experimental vaccine that
▶ 0:59:54Mr. Tata: Was unlawful as implemented. I think with the secretary is trying to get at is restoring trust and faith, restoring the warrior ethos within the force, by saying that --
▶ 1:00:07Sen. Hirono: So he has reasons but they are not based on peer-reviewed literature. It is based on -- there is such a thing of leadership, where you say to the service members, this is for your own protection. It is science-based. But that did not happen.
▶ 1:00:23Mr. Tata: He did it in full consultation with health affairs, with me, with the team, to make the best decision possible, to restore trust and faith in the wake of the covid vaccine.
▶ 1:00:36Sen. Hirono: So it was ideologically based, not peer-reviewed based. I cannot tell whether my time is up. Is it up? Could I just mention something about women in combat? As you know, secretary hegseth has asked for a review, a study, on the appropriateness of women in combat roles.
▶ 1:01:05Sen. Hirono: He recently issued a memo mandating the review of U.S. service members performance in combat arms units. As you know, women have served in combat and they meet the physical requirements everyone else has to meet. I want to ask you, should every service member, regardless of gender, be permitted to serve in any role, if they meet the established rules?
▶ 1:01:32Mr. Tata: Senator, what we are doing is reviewing the effectiveness of combat units that have been integrated, 10 years after integration, just like we did don't ask -- don't ask, don't tell and the blended retirement system. This is 10 years later.
▶ 1:01:50Sen. Hirono: Do you think that anyone who meets the physical requirements should be able to serve in any role to which they meet the physical requirements, whatever requirements there are? Yes or no?
▶ 1:02:00Mr. Tata: I'm not sure I understand your question, senator.
▶ 1:02:05Sen. Hirono: Let me repeat. Should every service member, regardless of gender, be permitted to serve in any role, including combat roles, if they meet the established standards?
▶ 1:02:17Mr. Tata: Yes.
▶ 1:02:21Sen. Hirono: Thank you.
▶ 1:02:23Chair Tuberville: Traumatic brain injuries continue to be a huge problem. Do you see anything that we are doing that is helping restore and just improve the identification, number one, of brain problems, because we have all seen that, and are we making any progress on getting the health recovery time faster than in the past?
▶ 1:02:53Mr. Todd: Yes, traumatic brain injury is a serious concern in the force, among military service members. It has long-lasting effects long after the initial concussion or injury.
▶ 1:03:09Mr. Todd: We are working diligently with the military services to ensure that we have guidelines out there concerning exposure, particularly blast explosion, but also other types of things that can cause traumatic brain injury. We put out guidelines.
▶ 1:03:27Mr. Todd: We have a reference and information guide that addresses specific weapons systems are service members are exposed to on a regular basis, outlining the area of the blast, the stand off distance required, the minimization of being close to weapon systems, minimizing what they have to do to maintain efficiency, emphasizing the use of simulators if possible, in order to ensure they are proficient.
▶ 1:03:55Mr. Todd: We are also looking and working with our acquisition folks to make sure that as we develop new weapons systems, the impact of blast overpressure on traumatic brain industry -- injury is considered when we develop systems. In addition, the secretary recently signed the war fighter performance authorization directive, which focused on the total readiness of our force.
▶ 1:04:22Mr. Todd: Part of this is brain trauma and traumatic brain injuries. We are working with all the services and working with units in the field. In fact, we just had a briefing where they were using their own local technical initiative to see what they could do to mitigate, for example, breaching operations or confined explosion of explosive operations. There were a number of ideas of how to do it.
▶ 1:04:53Mr. Todd: In addition -- as you know, we have airborne units. They have a mouthpiece that has a component in it. It can automatically record if there was some sort of traumatic injury, and it automatically starts broadcasting and they cannot hide it. Some troops do not want to report it.
▶ 1:05:22Mr. Todd: That is helping with some of the initiatives they are doing. We are taking that and looking at it to see if we can expand that across the force. The under secretary recently decided that we should work with our schools to use some of these mouth guards to see if we can identify the risk to children of service members who play sports.
▶ 1:05:48Mr. Todd: We are trying to work across the force to identify any of those things that would cause traumatic brain injury.
▶ 1:05:55Chair Tuberville: Mr. dill, only a small percentage of americans currently qualify for military service. Many of these young americans who are motivated and want to serve in counter, a lot of times, administrative hurdles and waiver decisions during the process. From your perspective, what are the biggest bottlenecks in the system today?
▶ 1:06:23Chair Tuberville: What more should the department do to be streamlined with medical evaluations and waiver processes, so we are not necessarily delaying or disqualifying otherwise capable applicants?
▶ 1:06:35Mr. Dill: I appreciate you highlighting that issue. It is a very concerning thing that so few young americans today are qualified to serve. It is something we need to be very careful about. We need to maintain high, uncompromising standards. We have a good reason to ensure that you meet a minimum qualification. We need to uphold that for the good of the service and the individual.
▶ 1:07:02Mr. Dill: We also need to make sure we do not have needless requirements because they are historical relics. So one of the things we must continue to do through our medical accession records highlight program is carefully review each of the medical requirements we enforce when a young american tries to join, and make sure that requirement makes sense, that it is connected to battlefield requirements, that it contributes to lethality. If it is a historic requirement that does not make an impact on the battlefield, we should get rid of it.
▶ 1:07:33Mr. Dill: We have had success reducing some of requirements letting people come in despite a pre-existing condition that in the past would not have been waivered, and we have seen strong results from that program. Even last year, we removed several of the existing conditions that were automatic disqualifications to ensure that if you are actually qualified to serve, we give you that opportunity. I can speak to personal experience.
▶ 1:08:01Mr. Dill: I had an acl reconstruction in college. I was automatically disqualified and needed a waiver coming in. I was grateful I was given the chance to serve and was able to serve in airborne special operations units for 10 years. That was the right decision, to make sure it was not a needless disqualification. We need to continue to do that, to carefully filter and take advantage of the talents willing to serve in our department.
▶ 1:08:26Chair Tuberville: How many evaluations did you have to have to be cleared?
▶ 1:08:30Mr. Dill: I had to go to two extra appointments. I sat -- I had to see a specialist and had to drive to a facility to have a specialized machine test flexibility and strength. It took months in that process. I was sweating bullets to see if I would have a chance to serve in the army. I'm grateful I had the chance. It was clearly the right decision.
▶ 1:08:58Mr. Dill: >> secretary tata, and want to ask about the decision to remove military fellowships and programs, professional military education programs, from yale and a number of other institutions.
▶ 1:09:19Mr. Dill: I question whether these decisions were driven by national security or or by political retaliation against universities that are perceived, I think wrongly, as ideologically disfavored.
▶ 1:09:39Mr. Dill: According to the pentagon's own memo, partner institutions are supposed to be evaluated based on factors like intellectual freedom, national security readiness, and I'm sure you know yale has a nationally renowned national security program, the jackson school. It has experts at the law school. Elsewhere in the university, it conducts extensive defense-related research.
▶ 1:10:10Mr. Dill: It has rotc programs which are very widely attended, and educates active duty service members and senior officers. My question is why was yale removed from these programs. And I assume the same answer would apply for the other institutions.
▶ 1:10:29Mr. Tata: Senator, thank you for that question and your interest in our professional military education. Certainly, all the schools that were adjusted from the current list of fellowships, we added new schools. We wanted to refresh.
▶ 1:10:51Mr. Tata: In particular, we were interested in schools that allow freedom of speech on the campus and other types of intellectual freedom. And the realignment --
▶ 1:11:04Sen. Blumenthal: You don't think yale provides freedom of speech and intellectual freedom?
▶ 1:11:08Mr. Tata: Senator, for yale and others, the secretary chose to realign so that we could involve other schools that were more aligned with the patriotic values and the values that we seek to instill --
▶ 1:11:24Sen. Blumenthal: I don't see how you could be more aligned with patriotic values than yale. If you come to yale and you talk to students and faculty, but also see the great tradition of yale as volunteers for our military, it's active-duty participation in educational programs and rotc, which has grown in magnitude -- I really
▶ 1:11:55Sen. Blumenthal: Question whether that is a fair assessment and whether in fact it is based on preconceived non-fact-based notions of an ivy league school. What would you say?
▶ 1:12:11Mr. Tata: Senator, I'd only it was based on any preconceived notion. The list of schools we have now are all very much aligned with establishing a strong professional development program for professional military education and getting our senior leaders focused on our foundational principles, back to the constitutional principles on which our great nation was founded. That is a goal of professional military education.
▶ 1:12:40Sen. Blumenthal: It is pretty clear the decision was made based on the secretary of defense or some other official feeling that these universities are quote unquote woke, which I think undermines our national security because it denies our service members the benefit of some of the best teachers, academicians, research, and frankly veterans at these schools.
▶ 1:13:09Sen. Blumenthal: Let me ask you about housing conditions at U.S. military installations. A comprehensive survey not long ago reported that 97% of service members and their families reported habitability issues with their military-provided home, like toxic mold and damage.
▶ 1:13:38Sen. Blumenthal: The survey also found that half of all requests to address dangerous conditions reportedly went unresolved. I don't have to tell you that that pattern is unacceptable. Along with some of my bipartisan colleagues, we let the military occupancy living defense act, the mold act which requires
▶ 1:14:09Sen. Blumenthal: Strict health and safety standards, independent inspections, financial accountability for contractors in privatized housing to ensure military families are protected. Given that these problems have continued, what are you doing, what reforms have you undertaken?
▶ 1:14:26Mr. Tata: Senator, thank you for your concern. I share your concern for military family housing. Certainly, it is something that is not under the personal readiness portfolio but we have a seat at the table at the barracks task force. We don't own facilities or military housing, but I'm concerned about it.
▶ 1:14:51Mr. Tata: I was just in the pacific last weekend we had mold in the housing and I talked about it with families. I held sessions with families and other folks, teachers and parents and those that were living in housing. It is a real concern. I support what it is that you are discussing and I'm happy to talk to my colleague, the undersecretary for acquisitions, that owns that portfolio.
▶ 1:15:15Sen. Blumenthal: It is a health problem and a readiness problem. It is a military family problem. It is an mold problem which potentially is fatal to children. And evidently, our leadership isn't doing much about it. In fairness I should tell you, this problem has spanned various administrations.
▶ 1:15:43Sen. Blumenthal: But now is the time to do something about it. I hope you will. I visited housing in new london and groton where mold has presented a health problem to military families. If you aren't the right person, I hope you will tell us who the right person is.
▶ 1:16:03Mr. Tata: I am the right person. I'm here before you. And I'm representing the department and I will tell you the secretary made an announcement not long ago that he is committing millions of dollars to remediation of mold across the force and all the housing. So I'm the right person because I'm sitting before you.
▶ 1:16:22Sen. Blumenthal: Let me just posit to you, we have now spent and acknowledged $29 billion on a war of choice. It is a war that this president said wouldn't become a forever war. It seems like now of whatever war.
▶ 1:16:49Sen. Blumenthal: It is consuming at least $1 billion per day. I suggest respectfully, some of that money should be devoted to military housing. It would be a fraction of that total. But it is vital to readiness and preparedness, not just morale but the health of our troops and their families. We know families serve along with our military men and women.
▶ 1:17:19Sen. Blumenthal: And I would also suggest, by the way, that maybe instead of $1 billion for a ballroom we could devote money to military housing.
▶ 1:17:27Mr. Tata: As I said, the secretary pledged money to remediation of mold throughout barracks housing.
▶ 1:17:35Sen. Blumenthal: Thank you. My time has expired. Thank you for your answers. >> do you think people are actually listening? I think every state is having this problem in the military. We can talk about it, but I know we are having a huge problem in alabama. If you aren't having the problem, you don't have humidity in your state. Any state with humidity has huge problems. What do we need to do?
▶ 1:18:03Sen. Blumenthal: Do we need to specifically put in the ndaa something about mold? Something about the treatment? We can't continue, it has been happening since I have been here for six years and we haven't made any progress. What is your thoughts? Are people listening?
▶ 1:18:24Mr. Tata: People are listening. The secretary has made a commitment of significant funds to remediation of mold. We can certainly circle back to the committee with exactly what that commitment is. But the secretary takes it seriously. He is all over the world. He is in the barracks, in the family housing and he noticed the problem. He talks to the troops and families routinely, as do I.
▶ 1:18:53Mr. Tata: We know this is an issue and we have committed funds to it and we are resolved to resolve the issue.
▶ 1:19:01Chair Tuberville: How much in funds have been committed?
▶ 1:19:08Sen. Blumenthal: How much in funds have actually been committed and spent?
▶ 1:19:13Mr. Tata: Senator, I need to get back with you on that number. I don't know the exact amount that has been committed to remediation of mold in family housing.
▶ 1:19:24Mr. Tata: The chairman is right. --
▶ 1:19:28Sen. Blumenthal: The chairman is right. I have been on this committee for 16 years. We talk about it endlessly. I visited bases and military family housing. It seems like the inaction is like the mold. It just keeps growing. It is there.
▶ 1:19:47Mr. Tata: As I said, senator, the secretary shares your passion and commitment to fixing the problem, as do I and my team. >> I want to follow-up up on this conversation if I can. It picks up on what the chairman said. Is anybody listening? I want to focus a little bit on that. You are the top advisor on quality-of-life issues.
▶ 1:20:19Mr. Tata: Do you support congress passing reforms in this year's ndaa that would protect service members and their families from retaliation for reporting housing companies that are forcing them to live with mold for months or even years on end?
▶ 1:20:36Mr. Tata: Absolutely without -- I support that.
▶ 1:20:41Sen. Warren: I want to triple underscore it is we go into negotiations on the ndaa. Housing companies have been using nondisclosure agreements to try to muzzle tenants to keep our service members being able to report what is going wrong. We don't want to see the same thing over and over.
▶ 1:21:06Sen. Warren: Where ndaa's are used in different parts of dod to keep those who are injured from being able to complain about their injury. And look. There might be a lot of different circumstances where people are being asked to sign nda; including people who have clearances.
▶ 1:21:30Sen. Warren: But those agreements should never preclude the ability of a servicemember to be able to complain to commanding officers of what is happening in housing, to complain to an inspector general or complain to congress, to point out wrongdoing.
▶ 1:21:46Sen. Warren: I think it is critical that we make sure whistleblowers of every kind, including spouses trying to protect their children in their house and all the way to people who see something wrong in the department they are in. So let me ask, secretary.
▶ 1:22:05Sen. Warren: Should dod be in forming service members of rights and responsibilities to report violations of the law and abuses, even if they have already signed an nda agreement?
▶ 1:22:20Mr. Tata: I support, ranking member, I support any action that protects a family member, a servicemember and their family, to have appropriate housing and large appropriate complaints regardless of the circumstances. They deserve the best. There sacrificing their lives for the country and there should be nothing in the way of having the best housing possible.
▶ 1:22:46Sen. Warren: I appreciate that. We have been trying to upgrade the housing for a long time. Basically it feels like ever since the private contractors took over and figured out they could make a profit by shortchanging our military families. Let me remind you, the question I was asking widened out the second time. This is true about housing but I'm asking the question up and down the line.
▶ 1:23:15Sen. Warren: The fact that people are being asked to sign nda's raises questions in other contexts about whether or not they have the right, for example, to report to win inspector general about something they have seen that is wrong. If they can't report or feel like they can't report to an inspector general, we don't get the information we need. We don't get the oversight. We can't expose the problems we have.
▶ 1:23:44Sen. Warren: I want to make sure your support is not only that families should be able to report about housing but anybody up and down the chain in the military should not be stopped by an nda from reporting when they see something that is wrong. Able to report when ig or commanding officer for somebody in congress. Are you in agreement?
▶ 1:24:08Mr. Tata: I know nothing that restricts anybody from reporting anything to the inspector general.
▶ 1:24:13Sen. Warren: If I can, one more turn on this. It is about the importance of making sure our war fighters are operating systems that don't unnecessarily endanger their health or safety. For example, in 2011 two f 22 pilots raised concerns about becoming disoriented because of oxygen problems with the f 22.
▶ 1:24:42Sen. Warren: Their commanders said, fly anyway. Both pilots went to congress. One went to the ig. The ig concluded that the pilot wasn't protected. The law protects troops who come forward to raise concerns about public safety, but it isn't explicit if they want to prevent their fellow servicemembers from being hurt or killed.
▶ 1:25:07Sen. Warren: I want to ask how much should we be alerting people to their rights to report and make sure service members can come forward with concerns about troop safety?
▶ 1:25:20Mr. Tata: Ranking member warren, broadly, any soldier, sailor, airman, marine or guardian that sees an issue with any defective equipment or safety issue should feel free to go to chain of command and inspector general, whoever that can help solve the problem until the problem is solved.
▶ 1:25:43Sen. Warren: I appreciate that. I support your conclusion here but I want to remind you the reason I'm asking these questions is because the problem is out there. There are people who feel they can't do that. I hope we can do everything possible at dod, we will get as much as we can in the nda to push in that direction. Thank you to secretary todd for your work on blast pressure. I appreciate the questions from the chairman on this.
▶ 1:26:12Sen. Warren: Thank to secretary bass for your point about supply chain. Other things I would've asked you about but I really appreciate it. Thank you for your work.
▶ 1:26:21Chair Tuberville: You can tell we are all concerned about the mold because we hear about it from our constituents. I am all for spending whatever we need on a trillion dollar business that is the military. We have to look at blocking and tackling. That is pay for service and taking care of servicemembers through health care, housing, or whatever.
▶ 1:26:49Chair Tuberville: I have people coming to my office all the time talking about mold and their families are sick. Whatever we do in the ndaa, if we add 1% to personnel readiness , it would help the military so much. Sometimes it gets overlooked, unfortunately. It's not your fault but we are charging you with getting --
▶ 1:27:13Mr. Tata: I'm sitting here, so it is in my rucksack. The secretary recognized this. He has committed funds to it and he has a team working on it and I have about 15 notetakers in here including myself. This is one issue we know we need to get back to you on asap.
▶ 1:27:36Sen. Blumenthal: Thank you for the blocking and tackling.
▶ 1:27:40Chair Tuberville: Wa
▶ 1:27:43Chair Tuberville: Wear your mouthpiece when you do it. Senator kenny.
▶ 1:27:49Sen. Kennedy: Thank you. I want to follow up on the point senator blumenthal was making. In early march when the pentagon canceled the senior service fellowship program at 13 colleges and pulled them and said it was because the colleges were weekend, one of them was the college of william and mary in virginia, the oldest public university in the united states.
▶ 1:28:20Sen. Kennedy: Thomas jefferson, important figure in our nations history, william and mary's key leadership position is the chancellor. Recently the chancellor was bob gates, former secretary of defense. It was almost comical that I think the announcement came out of the pentagon on march 3.
▶ 1:28:41Sen. Kennedy: On march 25 the military friendly.com named william and mary a gold level military friendly school, the highest honor a university can receive and also named the raymond a mason school of business as the top graduate school in the nation are military and veterans. William and mary, 1600 military connected students across campus, army and navy rotc.
▶ 1:29:12Sen. Kennedy: The office of student veteran engagement is the central hub for connecting military and veterans on campus since it opened six years ago. The graduation for military has exceeded the graduation rate for everybody else. But that is not all. William and mary has the veterans benefit clinic, where law students help veterans qualify for benefits.
▶ 1:29:34Sen. Kennedy: The center for military transition at the mason school of business to help veterans transition to high level civilian management positions. The school of education has a unique program called the clinical mental health and military veteran counseling program, which trains counselors to work with veterans and military families. There is a lot more I could say about military friendliness at william and mary.
▶ 1:30:05Sen. Kennedy: The announcement william and mary is one of 13 schools that is to woke to have a senior fellowship struck the campus almost like, is this april fools? There was only one such fellow at william and mary so it is not like this is a huge dent to the university, but for a college with such a prominent role in american military history and wins awards for being military and veteran friendly, it felt gratuitous.
▶ 1:30:34Sen. Kennedy: I wanted to ask, what is weak and woke about the college?
▶ 1:30:40Mr. Tata: I appreciate your support of our military and it has been 20 years since we bumped into each other in afghanistan when you were governor. Notably, everything you read except for the fellowship program stays with william and mary. The rotc and all of that stays. We are realigning the senior service college fellowship in a different direction for professional military education. George mason stays.
▶ 1:31:12Mr. Tata: And frankly the hayden center, they are not super supportive of the administration but they have stayed. They met the criteria. This was an objective assessment of educational institutions.
▶ 1:31:27Sen. Kaine: On the objective assessment, if the announcement was we are realigning and may be william and mary only has one of these fellows so it is not a core part of the william and mary mission, they have other things, or if the announcement was about some objective criteria, some universities meet it and some don't, that sounds like realignment.
▶ 1:31:54Sen. Kaine: The announcement that we are pulling 13 schools because they are weak and woke, that was the headline around the country. That is the headline, william and mary alumni and folks who work hard with veterans and military families had to be confronted with. When they are running the rotc program and benefit -- veterans and military family counseling program and winning awards, it seemed like a gratuitous, unnecessary insult.
▶ 1:32:25Sen. Kaine: I doubt you were the person who assigned the label to william and mary. You are a virginian and you know how important william and mary is. It was almost comical that this happened at the same time as william and mary being lauded for national publications for how much they do for our nation's military.
▶ 1:32:46Sen. Kaine: And the second question, this might be for you or somebody else, but this is something I may offer an amendment about in the ndaa process. The secretary of defense announced reforms to the chaplain corps that would remove visible officer rank insignia from chaplains. The argument this would reinforce the idea that chaplains are chaplains first and officers second.
▶ 1:33:15Sen. Kaine: I heard from a lot of people in the chaplains core and they argue that I earned my rank. Just like I can wear a chaplains insignia like someone else could wear and insignia that signals where they are, the chaplains as if I earned the rank, I should be able to carry the insignia on my unit. -- on my uniform. What is the problem that is trying to be solved?
▶ 1:33:43Sen. Kaine: I think a lot of chaplains feel like when you order me to take off my rank insignia, you are almost kind of devaluing the work I have done to get to the rank I have earned. Can you explain that? I may try to bring up an amendment about this. What is the justification?
▶ 1:34:03Mr. Tata: Thank you for the question. I will take a shot at answering it and turn it over to secretary bill. A former paratrooper but had -- battalion commander, deputy general, all of the troops in afghanistan, sometimes frequently perhaps, a young soldier sees a captain, major, lieutenant col.
▶ 1:34:29Mr. Tata: Rank and they are concerned about going to an officer versus a chaplain. I believe that was a large part of the aesthetic change the secretary directed to get back to ministerial duties, not counseling but ministering to our troops, faith-based groups that want to come to the chaplain.
▶ 1:34:54Mr. Tata: I don't care if it was the captain that was a chaplain for me as a battalion commander or the chief of chaplains of the army, I still call them a chaplain. I don't care what faith they were.
▶ 1:35:08Sen. Kaine: Does anyone else want to add to that? I have a follow-up response.
▶ 1:35:14Mr. Dill: We appreciate the chance to speak to this. Is a personal issue, my father is a pastor. I served for years and I'm grateful for chaplains. I would ask you that -- echo that point, young servicemembers are gun shy about coaching senior personnel in general. I would be disappointed to hear a chaplain expressed that type of reaction about the rank, a phrase like, I earned that rank.
▶ 1:35:45Mr. Dill: That is the case, but I absolutely say the role of a chaplain is being a servant of the troops. In fact, the fact they have the rank I think should not at all impact their primary concern, as the secretary said commit to care for the spiritual needs of service members. I often did not wear my rank. Never did I have a feeling that I was no longer a captain in the army or someone had disrespected me.
▶ 1:36:20Mr. Dill: They are often both a chaplain and an officer. How strong is it to see the symbol of their religious service and servant their chest to let service members know this is who you can talk to to have your spiritual needs addressed? This policy from the secretary is not stripping chaplains of their rank.
▶ 1:36:42Mr. Dill: It is not depriving them of the chance to where the rank on a uniform, but not on working and utility uniforms when they are ministering to troops.
▶ 1:36:50Sen. Kaine: Our troops go to a lot of folks for personal advice . They go to medical professionals. They go to lawyers for advice. We don't deprive somebody who is in the military medical of their ability to wear their rank when they provide service to troops.
▶ 1:37:15Sen. Kaine: We don't provide jag officers providing legal counsel on sensitive matters, the ability to wear their rank when they are providing service to troops. We don't provide mental health professionals a uniform. We don't provide mental health professionals, tell them you are not supposed to wear your rank when you provide services to troops.
▶ 1:37:46Sen. Kaine: There is a bit of a double standard here. I can understand the chaplains. Their sense of having earned the rank is not an entitlement mentality. They joined this all volunteer military and they are proud of their service. When they feel like they alone are being told you have to remove your rank insignia when you are interacting on the job you were doing for the U.S. military, they feel singled out.
▶ 1:38:16Sen. Kaine: It is helpful to hear you describe the rationale. This is something we can take up more as we go forward in the next month. The last thing I wanted to ask, I never assume budgetary decisions are made by the person that happens to be sitting across from me at the table. I get budget recommendations all the way up the chain. Usually it is someone on the president's team.
▶ 1:38:46Sen. Kaine: I mentioned armed services committee hearings that it seems odd that budgetary requests to increase the defense budget to one trillion doesn't include a pay raise for 800,000 civilians who work in the military. There is a bonus pool, I get that but there is a significant and well merited, well deserved pay raise for uniformed members of the dod family and that is good that we do that.
▶ 1:39:15Sen. Kaine: Do not include any pay raise -- 10 not include any pay raise for civilians, about 30% of the dod family come about strikes me as, if money was really tight, I get it. Jumping from 800 billion dollars to $1.5 trillion sends a signal that is a challenge. We have a lot of dod civilians working side-by-side with uniformed folks every day.
▶ 1:39:44Sen. Kaine: These guys get the raise and these guys won't get any raise. That has morale challenges when you consider the dod civilian workforce is heavily veteran. A lot of dod civilians are people who served. Then they move into a dod civilian position. It is my hope, and I'm not assuming any of this was your recommendation.
▶ 1:40:14Sen. Kaine: I suspect all of you would like to see a lot more done through a lot of areas. But I'm hopeful when we sit down and grapple with this significant request, our colleagues think about the fact that the 800,000 civilians of the dod do good work. We should be sending them a message that recommends that. I yield back.
▶ 1:40:38Chair Tuberville: Thank you. Oversight, getting ready to go and mark up the nda. Anything any of you want to say, anything we could think about going into the markup next month? We will start down here. If we miss something.
▶ 1:40:58Mr. Tata: Chairman, ranking member, senator kaine, I appreciate your comments on the civilian workforce. I talk about the professionalism of the career civilians. One thing we just did was rewarded the top 15% within pnr and I said make it gs 15 down below because they get a bonus up to $25,000.
▶ 1:41:24Mr. Tata: I was in korea last week with my good and general brunson and his team lined up the civilians they gave bonuses to and they said this was life-changing. This was a sea change in how we treat our civilians. The bonus pool you referenced is very important. And certainly, we appreciate your support of our civilians and we appreciate our career civilian workforce.
▶ 1:41:54Mr. Tata: To the chairman and ranking member, we appreciate having these conversations. We will answer all of the questions you might have for the record. I will turn over the rest of my time to my teammates here that I have worked closely with. >> can I say one thing about this guy? Before I knew him, I knew his dad. He was a beloved member of the virginia general assembly for a long time. His nickname was coach.
▶ 1:42:25Mr. Tata: Everybody called him coach. It was a member that was revered on both sides of the aisle. I first met the secretary when he was serving in afghanistan. When I was governor I visited guard troops, I think at bagram air force base.
▶ 1:42:41Mr. Tata: You stop when you saw my last name and said are you coach's son? I said of course. You are getting the misty eyed here.
▶ 1:42:53Chair Tuberville: Any follow-up?
▶ 1:42:55Mr. Dill: I appreciate the question on the opportunity to speak on the department's needs. The primary thing I would point to would be fully supporting the president's budget request. The request is how we get after so many quality-of-life concerns from the well deserved pay raise for the troops to funding childcare and helping spouses find employment and many other things in my colleagues portfolios as well. That would be ryan request.
▶ 1:43:24Mr. Dill: We appreciate the chance to work with your staff as we work on these issues. Thank you.
▶ 1:43:30Chair Tuberville: Secretary
▶ 1:43:32Bassi Echo Mr. Bass: I want to thank you for your continued support. Military health equals readiness. I have 20 years in the military, both my girls were born in the health care system. So this is a very important issue for our military members and I look forward to continuing to work with this committee.
▶ 1:43:55Chair Tuberville: Thank you. Secretary todd.
▶ 1:43:58Mr. Todd: Thank you very much. I look forward to moving ahead. One key thing we can look at is we work with the services on blast overpressure requirements. They identified many, but the only folks who put money on it was so con.
▶ 1:44:17Mr. Todd: We would like to ensure we emphasize the services, identify the requirements, put a number on it because looking at the numbers, estimated required for fy 27 is $85 million. Those will multiply. There is a requirement, we put money on it that is available to us. To emphasize to the services that if they do have the requirement come at please budget for it.
▶ 1:44:46Mr. Todd: As you look at aviation mishaps, responding as we have been to the tragedy of january 2025, we have been looking across the force. The availability of funds in a timely manner through a formal budget will help our commanders and leaders in the field of lament programs and -- implement programs and do maintenance and by the repair parts they need.
▶ 1:45:14Mr. Todd: We hope, we know the continuing resolutions happen a lot. They do limit folks in the field to implement the programs. Reducing flying hours programs, reducing safety and training undermines retention. Aviators want to fly. If they can't do it in the military they will do it somewhere else. We want to make sure they have dedicated funding and we are hoping to emphasize to the services not to reduce flying hours programs to meet other requirements.
▶ 1:45:46Mr. Todd: It undermines safety and readiness across the force. Thank you.
▶ 1:45:48Chair Tuberville: Thank you very much. This is been good. I hope somebody got something out of this. We appreciate all of your service. We went over a little bit but this was very informative and if we can help in any way, let us know. Thank you. Adjourned.