▶ 0:16:46>> the committee will come to order. Before us are five bipartisan individuals nominated to serve as commissioners at the U.S. international trade commission, known as the itc. They are david foley junior of virginia. Brett doyle of connecticut, also a republican nominee. Peter-anthony pappas of new jersey, our final republican nominee.
▶ 0:17:14Bart thanhauser, and finally samuel negatu, a democratic nominee. I want to thank all of you for appearing today. The important work of the itc requires a full complement of commissioners which we have not had for a long time and we are hoping to solve that and take a big step towards solving that today. The important work of the international trade commission requires the full complement of its commissioners.
▶ 0:17:45Filling these positions is long overdue. The itc serves a unique role as an independent, nonpartisan, quasijudicial federal agency. Specifically, the commission has three key trade related missions. First, the itc is central to trade enforcement. The commission's import, injury and unfair import investigations protect domestic industry by ensuring a level playing field.
▶ 0:18:17Second, the itc provides congress and the administration with independent, high quality analysis of trade issues, including tariffs, competitiveness, and the impacts of international trade agreements. Third, the itc maintains the harmonized tariff schedule of the united states which is critical to facilitating lawful trade and ensuring enforcement of customs duties.
▶ 0:18:42It's important to note the itc would be unable to meet this vital mission without it's incredibly dedicated and deeply knowledgeable career staff who continue to navigate sustained high levels of investigation. A full slate of commissioners will further support the itc's mission. I want to thank our nominees for their time today and for their willingness to commit to this important service. Senator wyden is not here at the moment.
▶ 0:19:12He has another engagement that is going to slow him down for 10, 15, 20 minutes. He has agreed that we could go ahead without him. We will proceed. We have another -- a number of introducers and witnesses. When senator wyden does arrive I will see if he wants to make his opening statement at that time or whether he wants to wait until other statements are finished before we proceed. On a housekeeping note, today's hearing order will go as follows.
▶ 0:19:44First, I have four obligatory questions we ask of all nominees appearing before the senate finance committee. We will then proceed to the introduction of the nominees and their opening statements. That will be a number of introductions and a number of opening statements. I will recognize ranking member wyden to deliver his opening remarks whenever he chooses to do so. If he happens to get here in the middle of that process.
▶ 0:20:14With that, I will turn to the four obligatory questions. I asked each of you provide a yes or no answer. We will go down the row and answer these questions. What I'm going to do is essentially ask the question and then each of you can respond. Is there any think you are aware of in your background that might present a conflict of interest with the duties of the office to which you have been nominated?
▶ 0:20:44>> no. >> no. >> no. >> no. >> no.
▶ 0:20:52Chair Crapo: Do you know of any reason that would in any way prevent you from fully and honorably discharging the responsibilities of the office to which you have been nominated. >> no. >> no. >> no. >> no. >> no.
▶ 0:21:14Chair Crapo: Number three, do you agree without reservation to respond to any reasonable summons to appear and testify before any duly constituted committee of congress if confirmed? >> yes. >> yes. >> yes. >> yes. >> yes.
▶ 0:21:28Chair Crapo: Finally, turning the page too quick here. Do you commit to provide a prompt response in writing to any question addressed to you by any senator of this committee? >>?. >> yes. >> yes. >> yes. >> yes.
▶ 0:21:48Chair Crapo: I recognize congressman darrell I said to introduce david foley after which I will continue. >> thank you, Mr. chairman. I'm sorry that ranking member wyden is not here right now but my opening statement addresses both of you, because as it is an honor to come before this committee with somebody who is so appropriate for a very
▶ 0:22:19Chair Crapo: Bipartisan, very much nonpartisan type position. David foley has worked for me in a number of roles since 2023. He came into the judiciary committee for intellectual property in the courts with a great deal of knowledge I did not know he had, including his ability to work with us on the emerging artificial intelligence problems, in addition to the plethora of international -- intellectual property
▶ 0:22:50Chair Crapo: Activities. He began as a senior advisor but today is in fact my chief consul. It's against my self-interest to be here today. I would rather keep him for the remainder of my time. However the work of the itc is well worthwhile for all of us who have worked on intellectual property work over the years.
▶ 0:23:12Chair Crapo: In his role as special counsel and now as our chief he has proven to be particularly effective when working across the aisle on complex intellectual property work, including something this committee and the congress on both sides are well aware of. He has been integral to our tackling a replacement for what was called sopa or pipa, or otherwise known as site blocking.
▶ 0:23:43Chair Crapo: Enforcing intellectual property. His talent in working both in a legislative process and a human process with members of committees on both the house and senate side has been critical to work that is now at the president -- precipice of in fact coming before the full house and senate. David understands the importance of our trade laws and the work he's about to do.
▶ 0:24:11Chair Crapo: His experience prepares him for many roles, including making a great article three-judge. I would love to have him running the pto. However, since the nomination came for the itc, I believe, although overqualified, he is in fact an excellent choice. One who will be able to work with his peers to my left and in fact be responsive to questions from the house and senate. Mr.
▶ 0:24:38Chair Crapo: Chairman, if you don't mind I look forward to taking your four questions back to my colleagues and suggest those are exactly the four questions, even though we don't confirm people, that we should in fact be asking and are -- on our side of the aisle.
▶ 0:24:56Chair Crapo: I ask all of you to consider david foley because he is exactly the right kind of person for a commission that has to work in a completely nonpartisan fashion and particularly on the technical issues of the itc. I thank you for including here today.
▶ 0:25:11Chair Crapo: Thank you, representative. You are welcome to use our questions as much as you would like. We appreciate you being here. Mr. doyle does not have a specific person here introducing him so I will introduce him right now. He currently serves as assistant U.S. trade representative for congressional affairs.
▶ 0:25:33Chair Crapo: His executive branch experience includes serving as senior director for congressional affairs of the ustr and as an associate administrator at the U.S. environmental protection agency. Mr. doyle's congressional experience includes serving as legislative staff for my former colleague and good friend senator pat toomey. Outside of the government, Mr. doyle served in government affairs roles at marqeta ks at george mason university.
▶ 0:26:03Chair Crapo: -- the marqeta center. He's a graduate of the U.S. naval war college and lafayette college. I would recognize senator tillis to introduce peter anthony pappas. Senator tillis is on his way. When he gets here we will introduce him. That gives senator cortez masto the opportunity to take the microphone next to introduce bart thanhauser.
▶ 0:26:34Sen. Cortez Masto: I am here today to introduce and ask for your support for bart thanhauser . He is one of the obvious nominees for the itc. Bart is a career civil servant who has served in both republican and democratic administrations, gaining a strong expertise in trade policy, including trade enforcement and remedies. He serves as the deputy assistant U.S.
▶ 0:27:02Sen. Cortez Masto: Trade representative for southeast asia and the pacific. In 2025, I was privileged to have bart join my office as a brookings legislative fellow. Needless to say, last year was an unprecedented year for global trade. Bart was absolutely critical for keeping me updated on trade development while continuing strong bipartisan support and work on issues as diverse as critical minerals and agriculture.
▶ 0:27:32Sen. Cortez Masto: I was particularly impressed with bart's immediate interest and dedication to nevada, a state he had not visited prior to working in my office. Despite this, bart cared deeply about nevadans and applied his expertise and professionalism to every interaction with the constituents in nevada. He was adamant about visiting the state. I think he knows more about nevada than most people in the audience and how trade policy impacts them.
▶ 0:28:00Sen. Cortez Masto: If bart is confirmed, I'm confident he will bring that same level of dedication to every stakeholder.before the commission throughout his time in my office bart approached each task with meticulous attention to detail, thoughtful examination of the evidence, and careful consideration of the impacts. I know his guidance, counsel, and professionalism will be appreciated at the itc at, as it was in my office.
▶ 0:28:26Sen. Cortez Masto: I look forward to considering all the nominees before us and I thank the chairman for the time to make this important introduction today.
▶ 0:28:32Chair Crapo: Thank you, senator. Now we will have senator tillis make the introduction of Mr. Mr. pappas.
▶ 0:28:40Sen. Tillis: Peter-anthony pappas it is the director of ip policy on my judiciary team. He came into my office back in 2022. I see this guy is a detail lead from uspto and introduces himself as peter pappas. I've already got a friend in peter pappas. We have to come up with a different name. You are greek, what do they call you in greek? Petro. Gas, energy.
▶ 0:29:12Sen. Tillis: Your new name is juice. He has been juice pappas and I and sure he will appreciate all of you calling him that. He came to my office and I had no idea even with the amount of time I've spent with him as the chair and ranking member on ip subcommittee, I had no idea about the depth of his experience. Going back to a career at the us pto. He graduated from georgia tech.
▶ 0:29:44Sen. Tillis: I think he thought he was going to be an engineer. Instead he went over and spent 20 years at the uspto, starting at as a patent examiner until rising to primary patent examiner, supervisory examiner, and branch chief at the patent trial and appeal board. Ptap.
▶ 0:30:07Sen. Tillis: My friend, director andre yanko. This capacity he helped manage the $4 billion agency and 15,000 employees. He did an amazing stuff while he was there. He developed the 2019 revised patent subject matter eligibility guidance.
▶ 0:30:33Sen. Tillis: He helped establish the agency's first working group on the interplay between ai and ip, creating a leverage. And designing a controlled trial that led to a pilot program for independent and mentors and small businesses. He served on spetco, the board of directors for over a decade, including five years as chairman.
▶ 0:31:03Sen. Tillis: This is truly an organization for ip geeks and he spent nearly 20 years on it. Another indication of his commitment to the profession. Mr. chairman, I thoroughly admire watchingi have seen him k admire watchingi have seen him o admire watchingi have seen him e each other's sentences. They have worked so much on a bipartisan basis. We are working on a bicameral basis.
▶ 0:31:28Sen. Tillis: When you look at the trade issues that come before the itc, I can't think of a better subject matter expert before the committee today. I strongly encourage his support. Thank you, Mr. chair.
▶ 0:31:39Chair Crapo: Thank you, senator tel teillis. We have representative matt cartwright to introduce samuel negatu. >> thank you for the battlefield commission.
▶ 0:32:03Chair Crapo: Chairman, ranking member wyden, members of the distinguished senate finance committee, I'm congressman matt cartwright from northeastern pennsylvania. I served for six terms in congress. I am here to raise my voice for samuel negatu, a nominee for the itc. This is a nominee that makes sense. I want to make sure you know about samuel and what I think of him.
▶ 0:32:31Chair Crapo: I hail from northeastern pennsylvania, which really suffered in the postindustrial period. Lost a lot of industry. It used to survive on coal and steel and iron. Those things drifted away. We were constantly working on how to increase manufacturing in our area and exports as well. Samuel dove right into that.
▶ 0:32:56Chair Crapo: He worked for me for two congresses, the 114th congress and the 115th congress. He holds a bachelors degree in political science from uc santa barbara, a law degree from washington university in st. Louis. He's a member in good standing of the california bar. We relied on him extensively for his interest and knowledge in commerce.
▶ 0:33:26Chair Crapo: I was on the commerce, justice, and science subcommittee for appropriations in the house. He dug into what we do about areas in america that are struggling in the postindustrial era. What do you do about international trade? The main message I want to convey is that when I got elected to congress, I meant to make a good account of myself legislatively. I meant to pass bills.
▶ 0:33:57Chair Crapo: I examined the political landscape and I read the constitution. I realized it wasn't just a matter of working across the aisle in the house. There was this other group of difficult people we had to get ideas past. Samuel negatu figured that out very quickly. One thing you pick up, and you may have met him already, and if you have you know this already, he's a person of abiding goodwill and friendship to everyone.
▶ 0:34:29Chair Crapo: Somebody who was a natural at bipartisan and in fact bicameral relationships. That is what he helped me with. He wrote the megabyte act, which we passed in 2016. That is helping the united states government save an enormous amount of money every year on the purchase of software by rationalizing the way we go about buying our software for the federal government.
▶ 0:35:01Chair Crapo: He was able to forge relationships across the aisle and across the congress -- across the capitol building so we were able to pass a lot of legislation. 12 years in congress I was able to pass fully 16 substantive bills in the law. That is what you have in samuel the got to --samuel negatu.
▶ 0:35:27Chair Crapo: He is here with his family and they are prouder of him than I am. I give him my fullest recommendation, Mr. chairman, and I yield back.
▶ 0:35:33Chair Crapo: Thank you, representative carter right. We have five highly qualified candidate here today and I appreciate the opportunity to have you here to discuss issues with our committee. For representative cartwright, if you choose to stay at the table, you might get some questions. Since you are done with your introductions and we are now focused on the panel, you are welcome to either take a seat in the audience or get on with the rest of your day. >> Mr.
▶ 0:36:02Chair Crapo: Chairman, I can take a hint. Thank you. [laughter] >> this is my lawyer. He told me not to answer any questions. [laughter]
▶ 0:36:14Chair Crapo: You better step out of the way then. Senator wyden has not yet arrived. We will go ahead and begin the questioning process until he arrives. What? I guess I should let you guys give opening statements. We will do that now. Mr. foley, would you start and we can go down the road with the opening statements.
▶ 0:36:41Mr. Foley: Thank you, chairman crapo, ranking member wyden, and members of the committee. Thank you for your kind words in my introduction. It's an honor to have been nominated by president trump to be a commissioner of the united states international trade commission. I'm humbled by the opportunity to continue serving the people of united states and return to the agency where I began nearly 15 years ago. I joined by my wife, our three children, and my parents.
▶ 0:37:11Mr. Foley: Their love, support, and understanding cap empowered me throughout my career. I'm grateful to have them with me today. My path to government service has not been conventional. I'm an electrical engineer by training. Having watched the tech bubble burst, I went to law school. I entered private practice expecting to continue working as an ip litigator for the entirety of my career. In 2012, I left private practice to join the commission for a two-year term of women as a clerk in the office of the alj.
▶ 0:37:43Mr. Foley: In private practice I represented clients in front of the commission. The clerkship seems like an opportunity to build on my expertise. I expected to complete the term and return once again to private practice. Life at other plants. As our family expanded from three to five during my clerkship, returning to private practice was overshadowed by a growing called to continue to serve the next generation. Over the years this led me to be a litigator at the U.S. department of justice, it led to policy roles at the white house, the U.S.
▶ 0:38:11Mr. Foley: Patent and trademark office and most regionally the house judiciary committee. The call to serve led to my commissioning in the U.S. air force reserve in july of 2019 why probably continued to serve in the jagged court -- jag c orps. As a military officer I have opened my eyes to the states of the role of which I have been nominated.
▶ 0:38:35Mr. Foley: Chairman crapo observed that trade is the centerpiece of our economic engagement and free trade must be reciprocal. We do not have it if others can impose barriers on -- on us unchallenged. I learned the importance of trade enforcement for U.S. competitiveness while at the white house and addressing illicit trade from p.r.c. While at the uspto.
▶ 0:39:02Mr. Foley: I studied the targeting of sectors by our adversaries and the importance of trade controls for national security while attending the national intelligence university. Having served alongside the women and men of the air force I understand the human stakes and impact our supply chains have on the military and its readiness. At the same time I work at the U.S. doj and my service as a jog U.S.
▶ 0:39:29Mr. Foley: Doj and my service as a joh -- jag -- it's based on clear evidence jerry record and sound legal reasoning. U.S. itc commissioners must understand the broader implications of their decisions, yet must also execute the role with temperament reflected the independence and impartiality required of an independent agency. Anything less is a disservice to the american public to rely on trade for necessities.
▶ 0:39:59Mr. Foley: I'm excited to return to the agency where I started my government service and serve the american people in a new role that fully leverages my education and experience. It's an honor to appear today and I look forward to your questions.
▶ 0:40:09Chair Crapo: Thank you very much. Now Mr. doyle.
▶ 0:40:14Mr. Doyle: Thank you, Mr. chairman. Chairman crapo, ranking member wyden, members of the committee, it's an honor to appear today as nominee for the international trade commission.
▶ 0:40:28Mr. Doyle: I would like to thank president trump for nominating me, ambassador greer for his friendship and for recommending me for the position, and the current and former members of the committee who gave me the opportunity to learn trade policy firsthand, particularly during the negotiation and passage of the bipartisan congressional trade priorities and accountability act, the trade preferences extension act, and the trade facilitation and trade enforcement act of 2015.
▶ 0:40:55Mr. Doyle: I would like to express my appreciation for my family, especially my wife who is sitting behind me today. Her love and support has been essential to my professional success and personal happiness. I would like to thank my son edmund, my parents daniel and charlotte, my brother andrew, my parents in law, and my sister and brother-in-law who are watching the webcast today. I grew up and attended public school in connecticut.
▶ 0:41:29Mr. Doyle: Throughout the 19th and 20th centuries this area was a powerhouse of american manufacturing, producing clocks, rubber, wire, and was especially notable for its dominance in brass and small arms production. In the past 50 years, the region's industrial base has declined precipitously and job opportunities are limited. Particularly for those not working and seasonal tourism or holding a college degree.
▶ 0:41:53Mr. Doyle: The population has followed the same trajectory with more people leaving at disproportional rates for opportunities elsewhere and communities are smaller and older than they were a generation ago. The trade is not an abstraction. The location and concentration of industry and employment shape our communities.
▶ 0:42:15Mr. Doyle: It is the duty of the government to defend american enterprise from unfair and illegal trade practices and promote a vibrant economy built on the innovation and opportunity america is known for. This is why I have spent so much time of my career focused on trade and manufacturing policy. It's why I take the responsibilities of the commission so seriously. The international trade commission plays a unique and consequential role in our trade and regulatory system.
▶ 0:42:41Mr. Doyle: It's the terminations affect american industries, workers, and consumers, and it depends on its rigorous and impartial analysis grounded in the law. If confirmed, I commit to applying that standard to every matter before me. I'm grateful for the committee's time and consideration and I welcome your questions. Thank you.
▶ 0:42:57Chair Crapo: Thank you very much. Mr. pappas.
▶ 0:43:04Mr. Pappas: As a third-generation to pursue public service it's a great honor to appear today thank I want to thank the committee for considering my nomination to the united states international trade commission and the and investor greer for placing the confidence to me. Joining me today, my girlfriend, close friends and colleagues. My family in new jersey cannot be here but I know they send their prayers and well wishes.
▶ 0:43:29Mr. Pappas: Without my family, particularly my parents and late maternal grandparents, I would not be sitting for you. As I have said many times and will again, success is rarely if ever achieved alone. It is the result of team efforts. Our country is unlike any other. Article one, section eight clause eight of the U.S.
▶ 0:43:50Mr. Pappas: Constitution grants congress the enumerated power to promote the proper -- progress of science and arts with the inclusive right to their respective writings and discoveries. Congress has acted under the powers since the earliest days of our nation and this led to american leadership in every innovative field. How many other countries have the foresight to invent intellectual property into the very founding? America has always set the global bar in terms of ipo rights and this must continue now and will into the future.
▶ 0:44:21Mr. Pappas: Strong, clear, predictable ip rights drive investments, innovative technologies, and this encourages the creation of content the world consumes. Innovation and creativity are critical to the economic and global competitiveness of U.S. and is national security. The U.S. must ensure a strong, clear, reliable, predicable ip rights remain front and center for inventors and creators large and small. Without these rights there would be no domestic industry to protect.
▶ 0:44:49Mr. Pappas: The itc is an independent neutral and fact-based agency that investigations and makes determinations in proceedings involving imports, claims or violate U.S. ip rights. It also provides independent analysis and information on tariffs, trade and competitiveness and maintains the U.S. tariff schedule.
▶ 0:45:09Mr. Pappas: The many roles provide a vital means by which to officially and effectively protect american industry from foreign bad actors and from ensuring american ip rights are enforced. If confirmed I look forward to working with the committee and congress at large, president trump and the administration, each of my fellow commissioners and all stakeholders to lead the itc into a stronger and more prosperous future. Thank you.
▶ 0:45:33Chair Crapo: Mr. thanhauser.
▶ 0:45:37Mr. Thanhauser: Members of the finance committee, I wanted to appear today as a nominee for the position of commissioner on the U.S. international trade commission. I would like to introduce members of my family who are here. I wife isabel, my mother-in-law, my mother and my twin brother will. I want to acknowledge members my family were not able to be here today, my three-year-old son santiago who will be graduating from daycare tomorrow.
▶ 0:46:10Mr. Thanhauser: My stepfather wes and center la erica who are watching this and younger brother graham who is watching virtually. And my father who is deceased but I'm sure would be exceedingly proud to see me here today. I'm grateful for all their love and support. I'm grateful for senator wyden for proposing my nomination and my former boss, senator cortez masto, for her kind introduction. I'm honored to be considered for commissioner on the U.S.
▶ 0:46:38Mr. Thanhauser: International trade commission because I believe the work of the itc is more important today than ever before. Congress created the itc over a century ago in the midst of the first world war with the united states on the precipice of entering the conflict. President woodrow wilson argued the commission was needed as another eye to see the facts.
▶ 0:47:09Mr. Thanhauser: Today we are again seeing significant and far-reaching changes to the economy and global trading order and it's crucial that there be another eye to provide nonpartisan analysis to inform policymakers as they consider and debate trade policy. I seek this position after spending the majority of my career working as a nonpartisan civil servant serving democratic and republican administrations alike. If confirmed, committee will be my highest priority to uphold the independence and objectivity of the commission.
▶ 0:47:40Mr. Thanhauser: The itc is responsible for administering U.S. trade remedy loss, including violations of international property rights, vigorous enforcement of our trade remedy loss provides the necessary relief to american workers and firms in the face of unfair trade. I understand the decisions the itc makes in such cases can be deeply personal, affecting the livelihoods of families and communities throughout the country stuff this is a significant responsibility and when I will take seriously should I be fortunate enough to be confirmed.
▶ 0:48:08Mr. Thanhauser: I have worked for nearly a decade and a half as a trade negotiator, a position in which I pressed trading partners to raise and buy mental standards so U.S. workers and firms can compete on a level playing field. I began at ustr helping develop cases of the wto -- world trade organization. It's been an honor to represent the united states in negotiations and trade disputes.
▶ 0:48:36Mr. Thanhauser: I look forward to serving as an independent decision-maker and source of information and analysis. If confirmed, I will administer trade laws fairly, objectively and as congress intended and I will work with my fellow commissioners to respond to them in a complete and expeditious manner to congressional and administrative requests. Thank you for the privilege of your consideration. I'm not happy to answer questions.
▶ 0:48:59Chair Crapo: Mr. negatu.
▶ 0:49:02Mr. Negatu: Chairman crapo, thank you for the opportunity to testify today. I am honored to be considered for service as the commissioner on united states international trade commission and grateful to those who supported my nomination and the committee for its consideration.
▶ 0:49:23Mr. Negatu: I would like to recognize my family, friends, mentors and colleagues, especially my ways and means colleagues who support and encouragement helped make this moment possible. With me today is my father and several members of my extended family. I come from anaheim, california.
▶ 0:49:52Mr. Negatu: I'm the son of two immigrants from ethiopia who came to the united states in pursuit of the american dream. They came seeking freedom, opportunity, and the chance to build a better life. They taught me the value of hard work, education, and service to something larger than oneself. For their son to sit before this committee today is beyond anything they could have imagined when they first arrived in the country.
▶ 0:50:22Mr. Negatu: It's a testament to the opportunities this country provides and to the enduring promise that through hard work and perseverance each generation can build a better future than the one before it. Those values have guided me throughout my career and let me do opportunities I never expected. Over the past decade I have the privilege of serving on capitol hill, at the office of the U.S. trade representative, and most recently in the private sector.
▶ 0:50:51Mr. Negatu: I served in the offices of representatives cartwright and gomez where I gained first-hand experience with the legislative process and the development of U.S. trade policy. I later served at ustr as a deputy assistant U.S. trade representative and then as assistant general counsel working on trade agreements, enforcement matters, and trade policy issues affecting workers, businesses and communities throughout the country.
▶ 0:51:20Mr. Negatu: Most recently I served as director of the consumer technology association where I have worked on issues involving international trade, innovation, and american competitiveness. Throughout my career I have worked with policymakers, stakeholders, and advocates representing a wide range of viewpoints.
▶ 0:51:41Mr. Negatu: Those experiences have reinforced my belief that effective public service requires careful attention to facts, respect for differing perspectives, and faithful application of the law. The itc plays a unique role in our system of government. As an independent and bipartisan agency it serves congress and the executive branch through objective analysis, rigorous fact-finding, and the administration of important U.S. trade laws.
▶ 0:52:11Mr. Negatu: The commission's work helps ensure those laws are applied fairly and consistently in support of american workers, farmers, manufacturers, and the domestic industries that drive our economy. It's credibility depends on the quality of its work and independence of his decision-making. I saw firsthand the value of the commission's work.
▶ 0:52:36Mr. Negatu: Whether providing objective analysis to policymakers or carrying out responsibilities under our trade laws the itc plays an important role in supporting a rules-based trading system and ensuring confidence and fair administration of laws. Its research and expertise helps inform decisions on some of the most consequential trade issues facing our country. If confirmed, I will approach this responsibility with humility, integrity, and open mind.
▶ 0:53:03Mr. Negatu: I understand the role of the commissioner is fundamental he different from the advocacy and policy roles it previously held -- I previously held. My duty would apply the law as enacted by congress. It would be the honor of a lifetime to serve on the international trade commission. I'm grateful to the committee for its consideration and look forward to answering your questions.
▶ 0:53:28Chair Crapo: Thank you, Mr. negatu. Senator wyden has timed his arrival perfectly. We just finished with witness testimony, statements, and we will now turn to ranking member, senator wyden.
▶ 0:53:44Sen. Wyden: Thank you for your courtesy. It's been a busy morning with lots of health care and economic activities already. This is an important hearing to be able to listen to five candidates. The international trade commission plays a central role in enforcing the trade laws.
▶ 0:54:06Sen. Wyden: That is more than anything how you hold trade sheets accountable -- cheats accountable. My home state of oregon depends on trade. The international trade commission's work helps farmers and small businesses so oregonians can benefit. With agriculture like onions and sugar beets, this means guarding against dumped imports.
▶ 0:54:39Sen. Wyden: For wood products means ensuring competition is fair. For solar, it's about stopping the chinese giants from undercutting hard-working americans. In the last year and a half most of the united states trade and tariff policy has been going on outside of the congress. My view is that the chairman and I are talking about all of these kinds of issues that congress ought to be playing a bigger role on setting trade and tariff policies for this country and the people we represent.
▶ 0:55:07Sen. Wyden: I will have more to say about that and I'm sure we will have a lively conversation in the future. Today we are on one aspect of our trade policy that is working the way it is supposed to. With the senate finance committee doing his job to advise and consent on the nominations to fill five of the commission's six seats. Trade commission is a key cog in trade enforcement.
▶ 0:55:31Sen. Wyden: It interprets trade laws, investigates the trade c heats, and make sure americans are not hurt by unfair practices. The work is so important for communities in the pacific northwest. I have testified at the commission more times and I can even remember, including about the need to protect U.S. sawmill workers and rural mill communities in oregon from unfair competition. I have waited several times on the agency's important intellectual property work.
▶ 0:56:02Sen. Wyden: The commission advises congress, providing analyses of how trade issues impact our constituents. These reports help ensure that congress rights laws based on facts that are the best appropriate for the country. We have relied on the itc's report on censorship as a barrier to digital trade time and time again. We worked to ensure U.S. trade policy exports american values and products.
▶ 0:56:35Sen. Wyden: The commission's operating lights half of it seats filled right now. In the spirit of the world cup, that's like starting a soccer game with six players on the field. Because the best trade policy is one that is durable and predicable, it's important the commission is fully staffed and members on both sides of the aisle -- with members on both sides of the aisle. I'm glad to see a bipartisan slate of nominees today.
▶ 0:57:01Sen. Wyden: Strong bipartisan itc is essential to the country's economy. Without strong enforcement, trade laws are not worth the paper they are written on. I look forward to hearing from the nominees. This is an important session. Thank you for having it.
▶ 0:57:17Chair Crapo: Thank you, senator wyden. We very much agree on this principle. This is a very critical commission that we rely on very heavily and provides significant service to our country as we engage in trade policy. It is a bipartisan commission as I indicated at the outset. Three republicans and three democrats.
▶ 0:57:44Chair Crapo: When we get them through quickly to be confirmed we will have the full contingency of six commissioners and we look forward to the work you provide and to help the work you will give us -- that help you will give us in doing our jobs. I have the same two questions for all of you. These are more requests to commitment so you can be brief in your answers but I would like to ask the question and have each of you answer each of these two questions in your own way.
▶ 0:58:17Chair Crapo: First, the itc is valued as an independent, nonpartisan agency. Please discuss your commitment to ensuring itc decisions and reports reflect objective factual analysis rather than any personal, political, or ideological persuasion. Mr. foley.
▶ 0:58:41Mr. Foley: Thank you for the question, senator. I think the itc has two key roles that you keyed in on. First the adjudicatory role in the adc context and the unfair trade or 337 context.
▶ 0:59:00Mr. Foley: In both areas the itc is subject to review either by the cit or by the federal circuit, ensuring all decisions coming out of the itc are complete based on that evidentiary record and apply the statutory language as interpreted by the courts with jurisdiction is absolutely vital to provide an efficient commission that operates in a way that allows petitioners to get the information they need and get the actions that they need.
▶ 0:59:31Mr. Foley: On the report side, it is certainly vital for the commission to provide reports that are thorough and allow both sides of the aisle and the executive branch to have the information they need and be able to trust the information.
▶ 0:59:45Chair Crapo: Mr. doyle.
▶ 0:59:46Mr. Doyle: Thank you, Mr. chairman. I don't need to tell members of this committee that trade can be an obtuse issue and difficult to understand. It is the duty of the international trade commission to provide accurate information and objective analysis and if I'm fortunate enough to be confirmed I commit to working with you and your staff and everyone on the committee to provide this committee the information it feels it needs.
▶ 1:00:09Chair Crapo: Mr. pappas.
▶ 1:00:11Mr. Pappas: The itc is an independent, neutral and fact-based agency and it's my goal to keep it that way. It's important to recognize I will not be on a policy-based roles I have been before. I will be following respective laws. There would be no domestic industry is not for ip rights and I think it's extremely important to protect both of those. That is what makes this country great. It makes our economy great and that leads to strong domestic security.
▶ 1:00:38Chair Crapo: Mr. thanhauser.
▶ 1:00:41Mr. Thanhauser: Thank you for that question. Yes, I can commit to that. Should I be fortunate enough to be confirmed, upholding objectivity the commission is my asperity.
▶ 1:00:54Chair Crapo: Mr. negatu.
▶ 1:00:56Mr. Negatu: One of the commission's greatest strength is its reputation for fact-based analysis. I will uphold the standards and provide the necessary reports and research to congress was the
▶ 1:01:09Chair Crapo: Thank you. In the context of the commitments and I'm running at a time so we can be brief, the itc may have a statutory rule and the ongoing united states mexico canada agreement, usmca. As we do the joint review. Please discuss your commitment to considering a broad range of stakeholder views and potential economic impact prior to advising the president on any proposed usmca modifications.
▶ 1:01:44Chair Crapo: You don't need to go into detail. I just need to commitment you will respond to this.
▶ 1:01:46Mr. Foley: Chairman, if I'm fortunate to be confirmed, I commit to providing the full range of stakeholder views for the usmca.
▶ 1:01:58Mr. Doyle: Yes, I commit to working with you and the committee to provide information on the entire trade program, including usmca if requested.
▶ 1:02:07Mr. Pappas: I do commit. Itc plays an essential role for usmca for analyzing the economic impact and policing --
▶ 1:02:22Mr. Thanhauser: Yes, I commit to that.
▶ 1:02:26Mr. Negatu: Yes, Mr. chairman. I commit to that.
▶ 1:02:34Chair Crapo: I wanted to raise the importance of the fact we are dealing with the usmca and we will be relying on you as you move forward in the process. Senator wyden.
▶ 1:02:39Sen. Wyden: Thank you, Mr. chairman. These questions are important ones and I appreciate them. Let me ask the question I hear about all the time at town hall meetings. 1167 of them now.
▶ 1:02:58Sen. Wyden: I hear that people who feel about trade as we do, that it's important and of value -- a value proposition, say the government usually gets there too late. They are basically turning out the lights and ready to close the place down. They don't get there when there is evidence of a threat.
▶ 1:03:23Sen. Wyden: I'm interested in going down the road getting eve to you to tell me that you will support in terms of getting there earlier as a preventative effort so we are not always playing catch-up ball people get wiped out in terms of trade. I have another question after that.
▶ 1:03:39Mr. Foley: Yes, I can confirm I will apply the statutes which do create possibility for threat of injury to be considered as one of the factors. Thank you.
▶ 1:03:53Mr. Doyle: The itc does have a statutory obligation to support small businesses and take specific and extra actions to support small businesses.
▶ 1:04:06Sen. Wyden: What would you do if you see the threat? It is not just hair on fire and running around the office.
▶ 1:04:17Mr. Doyle: I agree with my colleague, Mr. foley. The itc does have the ability to self initiate investigations. I would be happy if I am fortunate to be confirmed to work with you and your team who have an excellent to work on this.
▶ 1:04:32Sen. Wyden: Could you for example put on a press release saying this is something we are going to have to get serious about? How would you get the word out in terms of the threat?
▶ 1:04:48Mr. Doyle: I think I would want to work very closely with this committee and the trade committees to learn what your priorities are confirmed and we could explore all creative options to put out the appropriate signaling of what we are considering looking at.
▶ 1:05:04Sen. Wyden: An appropriate signal. Tell us more about that in the future.
▶ 1:05:10Mr. Pappas: You mentioned town halls. Engagement is extremely important. That's the only way to be proactive and not just reactive to situations. You have to engage with folks across the country. It is something I have done in the ip world and it's an important on the east coast and same issues on the west coast. I think engaging to stay ahead of things and knowing -- a finger on the pulse of society and what's going on and then being proactive.
▶ 1:05:42Mr. Thanhauser: Thank you for the question, senator. The statute is clear. We would be charged with investigating the threat of material injury. I would apply the statute as written, strictly and fairly. I would echo your opening remarks. Trade enforcement is essential.
▶ 1:06:12Mr. Thanhauser: The trade remedy laws or to protect U.S. workers in firms from unfair imports. I would take that duty seriously should I be confirmed. Thank you.
▶ 1:06:22Sen. Wyden: For the last witness, let's take this question. What ought to be done in terms of bad actors like china who give us problems and what would you do on that?
▶ 1:06:36Mr. Negatu: Thank you, senator. Congress provided the commission with the authority to address both material injury and the threat. With respect to china there is no question the scale industrial capacity in its role prevent unique issues and investigations. If confirmed, I would evaluate the record of each case and faithfully apply the statutory standards congress has enacted.
▶ 1:07:03Sen. Wyden: One last question. What do you see as the value of the itc trade enforcement effort? I'm asking is because those businesses, act, technology, or listening to this and they wanted know what you think the value of this is. Let's go back to the other end and see if we can get a couple of witnesses to respond.
▶ 1:07:31Mr. Foley: I think the most important work itc does is providing a definitive answer for industry. Being able to go before the itc, get an answer, get the answer quickly, and rely on the action the itc has done because the developed a complete factual record that will stay -- stand up on appeal.
▶ 1:07:53Sen. Wyden: That's a good answer and I think I should quit while I'm ahead. To the rest of the witnesses agree? There is affirmative nodding. I think the chairman. -- thank the chairman.
▶ 1:08:10Chair Crapo: Senator marshall.
▶ 1:08:12Sen. Marshall: We follow the ongoing antidumping and investigation into fiberglass door panels imported from china. The commission has reached a preliminary determination the domestic industry is being injured by unfairly traded imports. I recognize this matter will never come before the five of you but I hope the commission gives full and fair consideration to the arguments raised by the U.S.
▶ 1:08:38Sen. Marshall: Industry as it reaches its final determination. Now I will go to my questions. Mr. doyle, you were raised in small-town connecticut that saw significant industrial decline. And somewhat neutered trade policies. How does that excrete shape the way you think about what is at stake for manufacturing communities and how can the itc impact those communities positively?
▶ 1:09:05Mr. Doyle: Thank you for that question. I thank you for reading my testimony. I grew up in a relatively rural area right outside an old industrial core and work for the pennsylvania delegation for about eight years. My wife is from just outside of pittsburgh.
▶ 1:09:29Mr. Doyle: When factories and other industrial sectors and focal points of communities move away, reduce headcount or phase headwinds that have real consequences for american communities. That has real consequences for the workers and their families. I think it is the duty of the itc and the duty of our trade enforcement apparatus to defend those companies from unfair and illegal trade practices.
▶ 1:09:53Mr. Doyle: I would be happy to work with you to learn the industries of kansas and be educated on the industries of concern to you and do everything we can to support them.
▶ 1:10:03Sen. Marshall: Kansas is seeing a huge resurgence in manufacturing over the past year. Whether it is the aerospace industry, windows, tractors, trailers, manufacturing jobs coming back home. A lot of it is to the working family tax cuts bill and some of the tariffs. I hope you take note of what is working going forward. Mr. foley and Mr. pop is, the same question.
▶ 1:10:33Sen. Marshall: -- Mr. pappas. You stand up for your I.t. Expertise. Speak about how you will take that knowledge and bring that expertise to the commission. Mr. foley, you can go first.
▶ 1:10:45Mr. Foley: Thank you for the question. I think the itc has an exceptional group of alj and they do a wonderful job developing factual records for the 337 decisions before them. I think they are currently working very quickly and as quickly as they can, but we have seen a move rightwards for the time it takes to be decided.
▶ 1:11:19Mr. Foley: There's not a mandatory completion timeline. Bringing an understanding of how important the ip rights are of rights holders to the commission will allow me to understand how quickly the movement needs to happen. Technology moves on a one year to 1.5 year cycle. Get a decision from the itc closer to the speed of technology is vital.
▶ 1:11:45Sen. Marshall: Mr. pappas?
▶ 1:11:48Mr. Pappas: Education is extremely important and I have been lucky to serve in the ip world for over 20 years. I hope to bring that knowledge to the itc and trade community and to serve the public.
▶ 1:12:01Sen. Marshall: This question for the record. I would love to have input as we try to figure out why americans pay so much more for prescription drugs then are -- other economically developed countries across the pond. In the current trade agreements I know if ustr has tried to solve some of those riddles and issues.
▶ 1:12:26Sen. Marshall: If y'all have ideas or suggestions, I would love for you to reach out to my staff even after you are confirmed as say here are things you all can do. It might not be on your commission level. Maybe I have time for one question. Mr. doyle, trade enforcement lagged even as industrial capacity surged in countries like china. What would be more use of the commission's tools look like?
▶ 1:12:54Mr. Doyle: I think the important thing to note is that a lot of our competitors have extremely sophisticated understandings of the american judicial system and our trade laws. They are actively looking for ways to circumvent those in both illegal and legal ways and I think it is something that is deftly worth taking a hard look at what vulnerabilities potentially exist in the trade laws and servicing those for congress, particularly with this
▶ 1:13:26Mr. Doyle: Committee and have a conversation about if and when reports are needed.
▶ 1:13:28Sen. Marshall: Small company small-company shows me the one little pat and leon and how china has stolen that -- little patent. They don't have the time or money to solve that. Thank you, Mr. chairman.
▶ 1:13:42Chair Crapo: Senator tillis.
▶ 1:13:45Sen. Tillis: Those were great questions, senator marshall. First off, I asked consent that we had 34 letters of support from intellectual property organizations on Mr. pappas' past experience. This is for the nominee here.
▶ 1:14:11Chair Crapo: Without objection.
▶ 1:14:14Sen. Tillis: The reason is a gives you an idea -- you don't get that many letters of recommendation without having developed a relationship with them. We have really focused on stakeholder engagement and the intellectual property state -- space. That's a benefit for all of you as you go through your own engagement model. Senator wyden, and intend to support all of the nominees before us.
▶ 1:14:41Sen. Tillis: We have had questions about ensuring how these groups of gentlemen can be bipartisan and devoid of ideological considerations in their proceedings. I think we can lead by example, by all democrats and republicans supporting all five nominees when they move to the floor. First off, Mr. pappas, I think it's the first time I've ever called you that.
▶ 1:15:11Sen. Tillis: 20 2put the mic closer to your mouth. You're being too quiet. What more can we do -- when we think about china -- one of the bills we have moved other staff in the office, but we have tried to do is create a private rig ht of actions of people being cheated by china with counterfeit goods, with piracy, we were trying to create a
▶ 1:15:42Sen. Tillis: Private right of action. The cis has only so much capacity. China will just flood the zone. We see it every single day. We were thinking about a private right of action so that they can become an extended enforcement arm of cis.
▶ 1:16:09Sen. Tillis: How do we create more feedstock and opportunities to put bad actors on notice? It creates more of a workload for you all. We are producing more of an outcome for the U.S.. Unless you disagree.
▶ 1:16:41Sen. Tillis: >> vietnam was identified. Being proactive, not just reactive. I would say to your audience, you have to keep your finger on the pulse to figure out where is it being infringed, how is it being infringed, who is trying to undermine the system.
▶ 1:17:06Sen. Tillis: Whether it is legally or illegally, there is a lot of gamesmanship going on. It is the only way to be nimble enough, especially with the way technology is going forward -- with technology, being nimble and proactive. It is engaging with the stakeholders. We had multiple hearings on foreign ip threats, which is a huge issue.
▶ 1:17:34Sen. Tillis: When a stakeholder comes before the itc, it is important to do analysis, but also to recognize the U.S. is under siege by a lot of bad actors.
▶ 1:17:45Chair Crapo: You all have great academic credentials, great professional credentials. The last question -- did you consult with your spouse or significant other before you decided to take on a job that is a fraction of what you could make with your experience and expertise on the private market? >> yes, I did.
▶ 1:18:10Chair Crapo: >> yes, I did, and I appreciate the financial standard in my public sector ambitions. >> I'm not sure I should answer that. >> yes, senator, and my family is very proud.
▶ 1:18:30Chair Crapo: It is a sacrifice, and -- excuse me. I appreciate your willingness to serve. >> thank you, Mr. chair.
▶ 1:18:45Chair Crapo: There are not many senators here because we finished our final vote last night and most of left town.
▶ 1:18:55Sen. Tillis: Which makes this your lucky day.
▶ 1:18:56Chair Crapo: We can be grateful for that. We were here until 10:00 last night finishing up. Senator cortez masto is actually on her way down from another committee, and she did want to ask questions. We can take a pause unless you have other questions, senator tillis.
▶ 1:19:14Sen. Tillis: I will make a commitment to you all. I for the life of me -- one of the reasons why I like this subcommittee is you have to work really hard to come up with an ideological reason for your position, right? At least I have found that in my capacity here as ranking member, chair of the intellectual property subcommittee. I guess my commitment to you all in the remaining 192 days I have as a U.S.
▶ 1:19:43Sen. Tillis: Senator, or for as long as I am breathing -- if I ever see a with of ideological bias to any of your proceedings, you will be hearing from me. Let's make sure this is a good, functioning, bipartisan, or nonpartisan line going forward.
▶ 1:20:04Chair Crapo: Before we go to senator cortez masto, a final question or, I just want to follow-up on what senator tillis said. We really get great advice from the itc, and we have a high level of trust in you. I think that is what you are hearing from us, is we want that to continue. We need to be able to rely on your analytics and expertise.
▶ 1:20:31Chair Crapo: You are a tremendous help to america and to us, and I want you to know how much we do count on you. Senator cortez masto?
▶ 1:20:41Sen. Cortez Masto: I could not agree more with what you and senator tillis have just commented on. In my view, it is critical that we have that nonpartisan -- that independence, that fair referee for trade rules, and fair-minded enforcement. We have to have strong enforcement of trade laws. There also has to be some sense of continuity and rules for business and consumers as well.
▶ 1:21:11Sen. Cortez Masto: For the public at large. Let me ask all of you -- you all agree on the strong need for an independent and objective itc?
▶ 1:21:23Mr. Foley: Yes, senator. Thank you for the question. >> yes. >> yes.
▶ 1:21:34Sen. Cortez Masto: The itc completed a safeguards investigation into quartz surface, recommending a tariff system with high tariffs. I am concerned about the impact this ruling will have on the price of homes, as well is the impact on courts fabricating businesses in nevada and across the country. I am hearing this already from many in my state. I understand you were not involved in this ruling.
▶ 1:22:03Sen. Cortez Masto: I would like to ask that as you consider remedies in the future, that you listen to all stakeholders, and consider the impacts on downstream companies as well. Can you commit to that? Yes, or no?
▶ 1:22:18Mr. Negatu: Yes, senator. >> yes, senator. >> I think stakeholder engagement is extremely important. >> yes, senator.
▶ 1:22:33Sen. Cortez Masto: If the commission finds a violation, it can issue an exclusion order. You all know this. However, the commission can decline to do that if it finds that it is not in the public interest. I'm curious how each of you think about the public interest. What is your read of those statutory factors?
▶ 1:22:56Mr. Negatu: Senator, the 337, there are four factors -- welfare, conditions and the U.S. economy, the production of directly competitive articles, and U.S. consumers. These are the four factors that congress stated because decisions under 337 have larger impacts than the two parties involved in the dispute.
▶ 1:23:25Mr. Negatu: Congress directed us to consider that. And I will commit to upholding the law.
▶ 1:23:33Sen. Cortez Masto: Anyone else, anything else to add? >> I would reiterate my colleague's response. The statute is clear. Section 337 requires that the commission consider public interest. Should I be fortunate enough to be confirmed, I would apply the statute.
▶ 1:23:52Sen. Cortez Masto: All feel the same way, yes? Yes, for the record? >> yes.
▶ 1:24:01Sen. Cortez Masto: Let me finally say, depending on the statute the itc has enforced, there are often a range of views the commission has to consider. I'm curious how each of you plan to approach hearing different perspectives and understanding the impact on the ground of decisions that you will be making.
▶ 1:24:24Sen. Cortez Masto: I ask that because I am from nevada and the west, and quite often, I would prefer you coming out to the west, and get out of this little bubble we live in here in washington. I'm curious, if you are talking about engaging with stakeholders -- how do you intend to do that? Let me start with you, Mr. foley.
▶ 1:24:45Mr. Foley: I think that in the past, the itc has conducted hearings and field visits as part of its investigations. I think that is a vitally important aspect of what the itc does. The goal ultimately will be to develop a full factual record that can be put into a decision, and to be sure that in those field visits, factual information does end up in the factual record.
▶ 1:25:14Mr. Foley: Being able to see the impact decisions are having, seeing facilities being affected, is very, very important.
▶ 1:25:27Sen. Cortez Masto: Anything else to add? Mr. doyle; all of these investigations are different. They have different fact patterns and you don't know what you don't know. I would try to take that into it. I would try to reduce all the friction I could for anyone who wanted to come and be part of the record.
▶ 1:25:45Mr. Pappas: I know you have spoken to stakeholder engagement and the importance of it. I think you need to hear from all sides in the ip world. With the D.C. bubble -- I traveled across the country, and the issues in D.C. are not necessarily the issues of the west coast. That is extremely important. Even if you feel a certain way about something, you have to be open to hearing the other side of it because it is never just cut and dry.
▶ 1:26:18Mr. Pappas: I could not agree more to hearing all sides of the issue in engaging with stakeholders to hear what is bothering them.
▶ 1:26:26Sen. Cortez Masto: I know my time is up. Thank you, Mr. chairman.
▶ 1:26:29Chair Crapo: That concludes our questioning. With the witnesses -- I think we have five highly qualified candidates here. I intend to support all of your nominations. I intend to work with both sides the aisle here to move the nominations as quickly as we can . Thank you again for your willingness to serve. With that, I remind my colleagues that the deadline for submitting any questions for the record is 5:00 p.m. On tuesday, june 30.
▶ 1:26:58Chair Crapo: I encourage you if you do have questions for the record to respond to them quickly. The finance committee stands adjourned.